Topic: Fixed amount vs. infinite coins (Read 585 times)

I think we still need fiat for transactions, and regarding other things you say I agree, however the value of the currency every year will experience inflation not to mention the exchange rate of each country's currency against the USD, so saving our money in another form is true, such as crypto, stocks, real estate or any other asset that has increased in value.
I started to realize after reading some books on finance, economics, and some of them say your money will continue to decrease in value or other words, cash is a trash.
but still you need fiat for transactions, it's just that further understanding you are not advised to save large amounts of money for a long time.

i would prefer fixed amount because can make the price higher or you can pick the infinte coin with burning system

anyway whats going on with your signature

Inflation is not a beneficial thing for a currency, it is only good for the banks and governments.What stops bitcoin from being accepted as payment is its volatility that is merchants are afraid of accepting it and government also plays a huge role here because they didn't regulate bitcoin as currency anywhere in the world.There are lot of coins in the crypto as well but 99% of them will become a dead coin in the next year and the new coins will pop up, only few are going to stay here as payment.

The total supply of Bitcoin doesn't affect the total usage of it.
Speed of it and the fees are the ones affecting it.

Circulation of Bitcoin will not be affected as more and more people will accept Bitcoin but this will just happen if there are certain tweaks in it like the fees and the speed of it. See what is happening to the US Dollar right now. It's price is slowly withering already. I would probably like to say that I hate fiat but I can't since it is the most widely used payment system of the merchants and establishments. You can say that it will not be used as a payment system or not and that is ok.

Don't compare Gold and Bitcoin too because the 2 of them have lots of differences.

Actually, the speed is not the problem. Everyone can cope with it. Besides, Lightning Network is present which could fix the problem .

I think the main problem why bitcoin is still far away from the mainstream is because of technological illiteracy. Huge portion of our population are still mot aware about this so educating others would be very important factor to consider. Another reason is that people are into fiat, they feel contented with it already thus refuse to explore other means. Nonetheless, our community keeps on growing little by little and that's good.

In fact, you are probably very right in this, I am sure that Bitcoin itself will not be used to buy anything or make payments and this is because the Bitcoin blockchain is slow and that carries a large number of problems, it is not a secret for anyone , but that does not mean that a currency will be used as a form of payment in the near future.

The thing about being fixed is that bitcoin makes sense, something brand new may not. You could create a coin with just 200k tokens available and nothing more and that doesn't mean that it will be worth a lot of money, maybe one per token could worth a lot of money one day if it gets any attention but when we are talking about making a profit from trading it, that will not change a lot, 20 dollars to 22 dollars is the same amount of increase as 0.20 to 0.22 and that is why I do not get that talk.

Sure when we are talking about bitcoin it does make a lot of sense because bitcoin is the number one crypto and everyone wants it and when there is a limited supply it will make it go a lot higher, so I am not arguing against that, even any coin from top ten, but a brand new one doesn't make sense at all.

A lot of cryptocurrency holders, particularly those that have recently entered the industry, mistakenly believe that a coin with a fixed total and/or circulating supply stands a better chance of appreciating in value, due to nothing more than the potential for scarcity to occur.

However, they often neglect to consider that these coins usually lack any reason to be highly sought after, other than the fact that they might appreciate in value, such as due to real-world utility etc.

Some projects have tried to force scarcity by making people lock up their tokens in staking, thereby reducing the circulating supply and driving up the value. And while this has worked for many projects, it is false growth, and it will come crashing down when the market turns sour (and these PoS coins will be among the worst hit).

This is why Bitcoin's growth has been so slow and steady. Because it is gradually achieving adoption and being added to more exchanges, and accepted by more merchants and vendors. Few altcoins can boast such growth.

It is true that the adoption of Bitcoin as a means of payment is slow, due to many factors that ultimately many people still choose fiat for
make a payment. One of them Bitcoin is not yet legal in many countries, therefore there are makes many merchants do not accept Bitcoin
as a payment options. Even though the reality today is like that, I am still optimistic that Bitcoin can be used as a global currency in the future.

Some people wont consider it out thats  why they do really say such words that Bitcoin wont reach that thing on being used as a currency but rather as a store of value but they havent
realize that number of merchants that do accept bitcoin or other crypto is slowly rising up after the years which we can really say that it is really having that progress but of course
we cant really expect that it will really come to a point that it can tie up with fiat transactions.We know that it is nearly impossible for it to happen.
Just let adoption grow and sooner or later we would definitely see at least on how its being implied on daily living depending on which country you do live in.

are we talking conventional money vs bitcoin?

crypto still has a long way to go. still not comparable to paper currency.
but at least the many advantages of bitcoin. a fixed amount, transparent, no double bookkeeping, low shipping costs compared to banks, fast, very safe, and certainly no printing money in the name of a loan.

That's how it always goes. In February all the bulls were screaming for the moon, planning out their next Lambo purchases. Then the market crashed from the $10,000s to the $3,000s.

Now we go in reverse......


We don't have the greatest data on this stuff. We can see people transacting on the blockchain but it's difficult to distinguish between, for example, speculative investment usage and medium of exchange usage.

Companies like Bitpay occasionally publish data showing how much fiat money their merchants are accepting while using Bitpay to process payments, but I still don't think this tells us much about Bitcoin adoption. In my opinion, a lot of Bitpay's volume is from BTC investors taking profit on their investments (selling for goods) more so than people regularly using BTC as a currency.

Bitcoin is a very good digital asset that is profitable for a long-term investment. Already today, those owners who bought Bitcoin at the end of August 2018 or at the beginning of 2019 have received very good profits. It seems to me that in some cases it makes no sense to keep bitcoin for too long, and at the same time not to use it for its intended purpose, since our life is very fleeting and unpredictable. Therefore, I personally try to use Bitcoin to buy the valuable things that I need, because I am not sure if I can live up to the time when Bitcoin possibly reaches the price of a million dollars.  

Bitcoin has been used for payments, is used for payments and will be used for payments.
I have done it, others have done it and if you would really want to do it you could do that easily.


I understand your desire for inflationist coins, but I'm quite puzzled on the last part.
How can you say some coins in the chain ar "useless"?
This is not happening even in the inflationist fiat world, you don't burn old money that has been sitting in a bank for 20 years, the worst you can do is issue a demonetization of old coins and notes but nobody, no authority and no government will simply decide that one set of notes with a certain serial number will not be considered of any value from tomorrow.


Because....


You can start by distributing your coins for free to people that have got none. When do you plan to start?


Although I don't really agree with your vision, Phil, the author is not claiming anything related to your, he has simply decided that BTC is flawed and it will not go anywhere.
Not like a highway, nor like a truck, nothing, it will simply be useless because it has no inflation and no central authority.

it is funny how many topics like this are popping up these past couple of days that bitcoin price crushed the dreams of those who were waiting for its price to drop

and all of them are in the same theme, someone has put his head in the sand and is screaming it is night while the sun is up.
if you ever bothered to loo how many people are using bitcoin as payment and how merchants there are that have been accepting bitcoin as payment for years and how much money is transferred hand to hand using bitcoin then you would know that the adoption of bitcoin as a currency has been great even though it is still not mass adoption.

Its used to buy pizzas every day, depends what you mean but I presume convenience.   I think the spread, the price regularity and the fees vs speed is a possible issue but I dont see any of those are linked to a limited total of BTC.    We are still increasing BTC in circulation, it hasn't stopped just the schedule slowed the amount issued every day.     The limited supply is to oppose the price instability of Dollar from continual production in excess of GDP growth.   If BTC growth exceeds the number of new coins produced then it's likely to bring value, encourage holding the currency  (base demand) over just spending and hopefully will ensure stability in worth.   Since BTC isnt backed by any government this seems quite necessary.
  Gold wasn't dropped because there isnt enough of it, they are producing increasingly large amounts of gold via advances in mining technology similar to oil production.   The issue there is the GDP and population growth for usage of both those products, if demand is greater then supply then price of gold rises which creates a lower retail price when paying in gold not a negative.   Recently oil dropped quite alot as we have a natural drop in GDP and so to BTC price can drop as its not always going to be surging in usage but require further refinement and development of the economy.   There no real negative to less block reward except for miners perhaps who must calculate costs more carefully to accommodate both the lows and highs in price.  BTC as an economy is a benefactor of a tighter value then otherwise would be true with excessive supply.

I was thinking the same thing recently. Even tho bitcoin's limited supply makes each sat worth more - it immobilize it and won't let it be freely distributed and exchanged among people.
So the question is - is the mechanism of altcoin being harder to mine as we mine into the depth of it will be able to handle and cut the demand enough so it won't become worthless overtime?

Even thought i can't completely disagree with your point it makes certain sense but yeah inflation is not a monster eating anything even if there would be zero inflation there still would be the similar return you would be getting in real terms.

coming to second part there might not be hyperdeflation but have you heard of  the deflationary spiral theory? A person spends money because it's remaining the same tomorrow or even getting cheaper. But in case of bitcoin or any other deflationary currency. Why would someone spend a deflationary currency? A currency which would become more dearer to me tomorrow. Moreover, at time when credit availability is the basic requirement of certainly every business how will economies work in case of a deflationary currency? We already know how easily credit is generated today.

I would say fixed amount, infinite coins do not make any sense at all. If you think that it would never be used for payments you are quite wrong, people do not even have as much as printed, most of it is either frozen like you said or they are lost or even some other people froze it or even saved aside like you guessed. This means that there is still a ton of bitcoin left but not as much as 18 million which was mined.

Even with that little amount people are still trading it, using it and all around send and receive, because bitcoin is not something like gold, it is something like fiat but digital and more trustworthy. Bitcoin is not a commodity, it is a high tech currency and currency is there to use and spend it. However gold was used as well until fiat was discovered, gold coins were means to transactions, so I can't really guarantee my opinion neither.

Agree as only adoption will make bitcoin as a payment system more than an investment.


Most of them what? I thought we are just talking about bitcoin here, that's stated in the OP, let's not talk about altcoins as that is really true, most of them are a bad projects and that's the reason why bitcoin is dominating in the market.

As for me, I believe in bitcoin, there's nothing to change or to add in the system by making a fork, that's why I'm not a fan of the BTC forks.