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Topic: George Selgin advocates Bitcoin AGAIN (Read 6010 times)

legendary
Activity: 2030
Merit: 1000
My money; Our Bitcoin.
May 17, 2012, 03:02:54 PM
#75
What bitcoin is: Honest, strict, free of coercion, voluntary, regulated by market consumers (a free market), sovereign, without entitlement of equality between users ect.

@Portnoy:
Can you please point to an existing democracy that can by described by even one of these terms?


I can point to many. I will only choose one to make the point: My girlfriend's book club.
 
Do you and hazek think that "democratic" is a term that should only refer to the political governance of nation states?   lol

If the book club has a ruler(s) it can't be described by any of the adjectives I listed.

It has no ruler. No central authority. It is democratic like bitcoin.

legendary
Activity: 1078
Merit: 1003
What bitcoin is: Honest, strict, free of coercion, voluntary, regulated by market consumers (a free market), sovereign, without entitlement of equality between users ect.

@Portnoy:
Can you please point to an existing democracy that can by described by even one of these terms?


I can point to many. I will only choose one to make the point: My girlfriend's book club.
 
Do you and hazek think that "democratic" is a term that should only refer to the political governance of nation states?   lol

If the book club has a ruler(s) it can't be described by any of the adjectives I listed. And to answer your question: of course not.
legendary
Activity: 2030
Merit: 1000
My money; Our Bitcoin.
What bitcoin is: Honest, strict, free of coercion, voluntary, regulated by market consumers (a free market), sovereign, without entitlement of equality between users ect.

@Portnoy:
Can you please point to an existing democracy that can by described by even one of these terms?


I can point to many. I will only choose one to make the point: My girlfriend's book club.
 
Do you and hazek think that "democratic" is a term that should only refer to the political governance of nation states?   lol
legendary
Activity: 1078
Merit: 1003

We usually use words that describe what is to describe what is and not what isn't.

Miners have the ability to do so while casual users do not. Where in these facts do you see your eulogized democratic equality is my question..?

well you don't.

huh?
legendary
Activity: 1764
Merit: 1002

We usually use words that describe what is to describe what is and not what isn't.

Miners have the ability to do so while casual users do not. Where in these facts do you see your eulogized democratic equality is my question..?

well you don't.
legendary
Activity: 1078
Merit: 1003
What bitcoin is: Honest, strict, free of coercion, voluntary, regulated by market consumers (a free market), sovereign, without entitlement of equality between users ect.

@Portnoy:
Can you please point to an existing democracy that can by described by even one of these terms?

Precisely my point.

Oh so that's your big point?  Because a good real world example doesn't exist that nullifies the concept?    lol 

We usually use words that describe what is to describe what is and not what isn't.
legendary
Activity: 2030
Merit: 1000
My money; Our Bitcoin.
What bitcoin is: Honest, strict, free of coercion, voluntary, regulated by market consumers (a free market), sovereign, without entitlement of equality between users ect.

@Portnoy:
Can you please point to an existing democracy that can by described by even one of these terms?

Precisely my point.

Oh so that's your big point?  Because a good real world example doesn't exist that nullifies the concept?    lol 
legendary
Activity: 1078
Merit: 1003
What bitcoin is: Honest, strict, free of coercion, voluntary, regulated by market consumers (a free market), sovereign, without entitlement of equality between users ect.

@Portnoy:
Can you please point to an existing democracy that can by described by even one of these terms?

Precisely my point.
legendary
Activity: 1904
Merit: 1002
What bitcoin is: Honest, strict, free of coercion, voluntary, regulated by market consumers (a free market), sovereign, without entitlement of equality between users ect.

@Portnoy:
Can you please point to an existing democracy that can by described by even one of these terms?
legendary
Activity: 1764
Merit: 1002
Many of the words and concepts hazek uses to describe bitcoin are synonyms for "democratic".  

That is exactly what I'm trying to dispute and disagree with, do I need to paste dictionary definitions again?

those definitions were worthless as i've already said.  self referencing.
legendary
Activity: 1078
Merit: 1003
Many of the words and concepts hazek uses to describe bitcoin are synonyms for "democratic".  

That is exactly what I'm trying to dispute and disagree with, do I need to paste dictionary definitions again?
legendary
Activity: 2030
Merit: 1000
My money; Our Bitcoin.
I'm doing my damn best to avoid delusions being perpetuated in Bitcoin.

What bitcoin is: democratic

What bitcoin isn't: democratic

Blow job.    Grin

Look... I can edit your posts so they say something completely different too.

But can you read my edits to determine what point they are trying to get across?

Many of the words and concepts hazek uses to describe bitcoin are synonyms for "democratic". 
 

legendary
Activity: 1904
Merit: 1002
I'm doing my damn best to avoid delusions being perpetuated in Bitcoin.

What bitcoin is: democratic

What bitcoin isn't: democratic

Blow job.    Grin

Look... I can edit your posts so they say something completely different too.
legendary
Activity: 2030
Merit: 1000
My money; Our Bitcoin.
I'm doing my damn best to avoid delusions being perpetuated in Bitcoin.

What bitcoin is: democratic

What bitcoin isn't: democratic

Good job.    Grin
legendary
Activity: 1078
Merit: 1003
Actually you are right. But you are wrong asking the question "This is good in what way?"

It's irrelevant whether or not it's good, the original question was whether or not Bitcoin is or has a government and the ability to fork it, what ever this would actually mean for the value of the system, proves it does not. If I want to use Bitcoin, I can, however I cannot force others to use my version of Bitcoin even if I modify the original Bitcoin and have enough rule enforcement power which is something a government could do.

why are u getting so "hung up" on the definitions of what ppl are trying to say?  such as "democracy" or "government"?

such as, i know exactly what rjk is trying to say when he says the governing rules of Bitcoin are the source code and algorithm which govern the Bitcoin community and network.

i also am convinced that democratic principles apply to Bitcoin.  miners can try to subvert the system to their benefit if they want but if it violates the wants or desires of the majority of users, they will simply leave.  no users, no network, no miners.  period.

users are not "forced" to use Bitcoin.  they have a choice unlike USD's here in the US which have to be used for a variety of purposes, taxes being one.

Because people and their delusions are responsible for most of bad outcomes in the world and I'm doing my damn best to avoid delusions being perpetuated in Bitcoin.

What bitcoin is: Honest, strict, free of coercion, voluntary, regulated by market consumers (a free market), sovereign, without entitlement of equality between users ect.

What bitcoin isn't: democratic, a government, being governed by people, promoting equality of any kind
legendary
Activity: 1764
Merit: 1002
Actually you are right. But you are wrong asking the question "This is good in what way?"

It's irrelevant whether or not it's good, the original question was whether or not Bitcoin is or has a government and the ability to fork it, what ever this would actually mean for the value of the system, proves it does not. If I want to use Bitcoin, I can, however I cannot force others to use my version of Bitcoin even if I modify the original Bitcoin and have enough rule enforcement power which is something a government could do.

why are u getting so "hung up" on the definitions of what ppl are trying to say?  such as "democracy" or "government"?

such as, i know exactly what rjk is trying to say when he says the governing rules of Bitcoin are the source code and algorithm which govern the Bitcoin community and network.

i also am convinced that democratic principles apply to Bitcoin.  miners can try to subvert the system to their benefit if they want but if it violates the wants or desires of the majority of users, they will simply leave.  no users, no network, no miners.  period.

users are not "forced" to use Bitcoin.  they have a choice unlike USD's here in the US which have to be used for a variety of purposes, taxes being one.
legendary
Activity: 1078
Merit: 1003
Actually you are right. But you are wrong asking the question "This is good in what way?"

It's irrelevant whether or not it's good, the original question was whether or not Bitcoin is or has a government and the ability to fork it, what ever this would actually mean for the value of the system, proves it does not. If I want to use Bitcoin, I can, however I cannot force others to use my version of Bitcoin even if I modify the original Bitcoin and have enough rule enforcement power which is something a government could do.
rjk
sr. member
Activity: 448
Merit: 250
1ngldh
I'm sorry to squash your delusions, but what I am telling you is HOW THE SYSTEM ALREADY WORKS. Remember P2SH? Remember how NOT implementing it caused blocks to be rejected? That is because a MAJORITY of the miners changed their code to make it happen, and those that didn't lost out.

P2SH tightened the rules of what would be accepted.  You are right that a majority can enforce this.  If a majority wanted to loosen the rules, the more restrictive ruleset could continue on as a separate fork since the new transactions would be rejected by those miners who decided not to upgrade.

Precisely.
Forking is an unwanted byproduct that results in the ability to double-spend. This is a good thing in what way?

Making mere statements doesn't make a thing a thing. So before you ask silly questions make sure you got the facts right. Fact is forking isn't what you say it is.
Actually it is, because coins can be spent on both sides of a fork, unless the protocol change is so radical that it invalidates the coins themselves. And in that case, there is no reason to fork it, it would be simpler to start over on another blockchain.
legendary
Activity: 1078
Merit: 1003
I'm sorry to squash your delusions, but what I am telling you is HOW THE SYSTEM ALREADY WORKS. Remember P2SH? Remember how NOT implementing it caused blocks to be rejected? That is because a MAJORITY of the miners changed their code to make it happen, and those that didn't lost out.

P2SH tightened the rules of what would be accepted.  You are right that a majority can enforce this.  If a majority wanted to loosen the rules, the more restrictive ruleset could continue on as a separate fork since the new transactions would be rejected by those miners who decided not to upgrade.

Precisely.
Forking is an unwanted byproduct that results in the ability to double-spend. This is a good thing in what way?

Making mere statements doesn't make a thing a thing. So before you ask silly questions make sure you got the facts right. Fact is forking isn't what you say it is.
rjk
sr. member
Activity: 448
Merit: 250
1ngldh
I'm sorry to squash your delusions, but what I am telling you is HOW THE SYSTEM ALREADY WORKS. Remember P2SH? Remember how NOT implementing it caused blocks to be rejected? That is because a MAJORITY of the miners changed their code to make it happen, and those that didn't lost out.

P2SH tightened the rules of what would be accepted.  You are right that a majority can enforce this.  If a majority wanted to loosen the rules, the more restrictive ruleset could continue on as a separate fork since the new transactions would be rejected by those miners who decided not to upgrade.

Precisely.
Forking is an unwanted byproduct that results in the ability to double-spend. This is a good thing in what way?
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