Give an indication why an account was banned!

Kurapajajadi

member

Activity: 84

Merit: 10

Quote from: theymos on December 11, 2018, 05:29:53 PM

Quote from: o_e_l_e_o on December 11, 2018, 05:01:58 PM

"Bans for plagiarism will never be repealed. Do not bother trying"?

No, because mistakes are occasionally made. chimk was framed that one time, for example.

how to appeal and restore accounts due to spam not plagiarism, do you have a telegram because I just bought an account for a private chat with you so that I can restore my account, I ask you what are the requirements to return my account, and how much I pay I am ready to pay because I only made a one-time mistake and I beg you I only did 9 posts so I at the same time I was not careful when reading the rules and I will not repeat the error, with an account named Tzuan_bit : https://bitcointalksearch.org/user/tzuanbit-1194347

Pmalek

legendary

Activity: 2730

Merit: 7065

That is good news, that should now mean less topics in Meta with questions 'why was my account banned'...hopefully.
Unless they now turn into 'Email sent for banned account but no reply received, why'? Roll Eyes

Findingnemo

hero member

Activity: 2366

Merit: 793

Bitcoin = Financial freedom

Update: Someone complained that his account got received a message like

"Sorry XXXXX, you are banned from posting or sending personal messages on this forum.
You have been permanently banned by a forum moderator, probably due to spam or plagiarism. You may appeal here, but your chances are not good: [email protected]"

Theymos might implemented new autoban message since? Cheesy

o_e_l_e_o

legendary

Activity: 2268

Merit: 18771

Quote from: hilariousetc on December 12, 2018, 07:48:43 AM

-snip-

Agreed. This is the same state of affairs that is currently being discussed in the Altcoin Bumping thread. We can report posts all day every day, and completely overwhelm you and the others mods with work, and yet barely make a dent in the spam. We need some top level changes, which I'm pleased to see are now being discussed regarding the Altcoin boards.

In terms of limiting general spam, as you say we need to crack down on the campaigns/campaign managers. Something along the lines of having to submit a list of participants, and if these participants reach a set amount of reported posts which are marked as good, the campaign is shut down. I also think there should be some kind of actual punishment for serial spammers. Spammers don't care about 2 or 3 of their posts being deleted when they can churn out one a minute to hit their campaign requirements. X amount of posts being deleted within Y amount of time resulting in escalating lengths of bans, for example.

hilariousetc

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Quote from: Lafu on December 11, 2018, 04:31:57 PM

Quote from: theymos on December 11, 2018, 03:53:13 PM

and if it has any effect at all, it'll just turn fairly-easy-to-identify plagiarists into more ambiguous shitposters.

So it's a hell of a vicious circle!

But the last 2 month are more reporter show up and i have the feeling that every week come more and doing it !
This i guess is a result of the changes you have done with the merit system too , and its nice to see that we are on a good forward way !

I still keep "reporting" anyway how ever it will comes ! Grin

I think it's a sad state of affairs that if these people weren't plagiarising then they'd just be shitposting instead, but it's true. The people who plagiarise are only here to earn and not contribute and if it wasn't for copy and pasting then they'd just be forcing out their generic responses about something they know little about, and that's why the forum is in such a poor state. We really should be cracking down on the unsubstantial posts or more importantly those that are paying people to make them. If users are spotted making incredibly terrible posts then the person's signature they're wearing should face repressions because they're not doing their job properly. As long as we continue to do nothing about this then it will just continue to happen. Running a signature campaign is at least a part time job. Running a larger one would probably be a full time one, but these people are not going to willingly do work that they don't need to especially when there's no repercussions for doing a shoddy job or even none at all. Once it becomes unacceptable to run campaigns in such a way they will change or start hiring people who are willing to do the work and there's plenty of people who would do so.

darklus123

hero member

Activity: 1246

Merit: 588

Quote from: TheBeardedBaby on December 11, 2018, 06:02:37 AM

Instead of the reason, there should be a link to the rules, something like this >

"Sorry (username), you are banned from posting or sending personal messages on this forum.
You have been banned by a forum moderator. Read the rules and you will find out what you were banned for. You may appeal here: [email protected]""

That will make them read the rules and not abuse new account they open for appeal.

Good idea , but for instead of putting the rules after getting banned (that they might know in the first place. Well yeah that is not an excuse but when that rules were already given to them starting from their registration then it might lessen this problem.)

o_e_l_e_o

legendary

Activity: 2268

Merit: 18771

Yeah, fair enough. Is there some other better way we can clean up Meta from all this spam? A separate sub-board for account issue threads, such as ban appeals, hacked accounts, locked accounts, etc?

theymos

administrator

Activity: 5222

Merit: 13032

Quote from: o_e_l_e_o on December 11, 2018, 05:01:58 PM

"Bans for plagiarism will never be repealed. Do not bother trying"?

No, because mistakes are occasionally made. chimk was framed that one time, for example.

o_e_l_e_o

legendary

Activity: 2268

Merit: 18771

Quote from: theymos on December 11, 2018, 03:53:13 PM

-snip-

I agree with your point about additional warnings - these spammers don't read the rules, don't read the stickies, don't even read the posts in the thread they are replying to. They certainly won't bother to read any other warnings or rules, regardless of where you plaster them.

However, having 50% of the threads in Meta being ban appeals from plagiarizers is a real headache to sort through, not to mention a waste of everybody's time continually pointing out to them that they will not be unbanned. If we are saying it is too time consuming to state the exact reason for every ban, could we at least update the ban message to state something along the lines of "Bans for plagiarism will never be repealed. Do not bother trying"?

Lafu

legendary

Activity: 3178

Merit: 3295

Quote from: theymos on December 11, 2018, 03:53:13 PM

and if it has any effect at all, it'll just turn fairly-easy-to-identify plagiarists into more ambiguous shitposters.

So it's a hell of a vicious circle!

But the last 2 month are more reporter show up and i have the feeling that every week come more and doing it !
This i guess is a result of the changes you have done with the merit system too , and its nice to see that we are on a good forward way !

I still keep "reporting" anyway how ever it will comes ! Grin

r1s2g3

sr. member

Activity: 742

Merit: 395

I am alive but in hibernation.

Just started giving the copy of rules when everybody sign in this forum.
Just make the ban appeal paid because in 80% of ban appeal user already know they are banned for plagiarizing but they are just wasting the time of everybody. If you are wrongly banned then you will be refunded.
I do not know, is ban appeal is time boxed?

theymos

administrator

Activity: 5222

Merit: 13032

Quote from: suchmoon on December 11, 2018, 01:22:44 PM

So... this user claims to have been given a reason:

I only changed the message on autobans. ("Autoban" = lingo indicating a type of ban. They're usually not actually automatic.)

In most cases, the person's last PMs will be one or more "deleted post" PMs containing the messages that got them banned. If not, then the reason for their ban is more complicated, and certainly couldn't be automatically determined. Having moderators put a reason for every autoban is a waste of mods' time. Autobans are for obvious cases when appeals should only very rarely be accepted, which is why the appeal topics in Meta can be immediately rejected 99% of the time.

I have no respect for anyone who would even think of plagiarizing in the way that these people do. They don't belong here. Additional warnings will probably have nearly zero effect, and if it has any effect at all, it'll just turn fairly-easy-to-identify plagiarists into more ambiguous shitposters.

Hivalley

member

Activity: 210

Merit: 19

Quote from: Lafu on December 11, 2018, 02:34:40 PM

This would only be beneficial for the genuine noobs on the forum,who for one reason or the other missed reading the forum rules and could probably try to be of help by getting a text online or adding an excerpt to their own content,which could get them banned

But as for those who are simply here for their own benefits and wouldn't go about things the right way,they sure will click on that button and go right ahead to plagiarise and hope/pray they never get caught

Lafu

legendary

Activity: 3178

Merit: 3295

The main idea is from Veleor !

What would you think about this optimzed Version ?

Before they can post they have to click on the button and agree with that !

Can also reduce the Bot Spam ( I hope Cheesy

) !

Maybe this is an option , Rank based for Newbies to Full Member or Sr.Member !

All other higher Ranked Users should be ok as now and they know already the Rules and what they doing !

Is only a suggestion. Wink

hugeblack

legendary

Activity: 2702

Merit: 4002

Quote from: S_Therapist on December 11, 2018, 05:39:22 AM

Here is one- Account Ban Appeal can be reduced?

I think you refer to this topic[1].

Quote from: TheBeardedBaby on December 11, 2018, 06:02:37 AM

Instead of the reason, there should be a link to the rules, -snip- That will make them read the rules and not abuse new account they open for appeal.

So, people learn the rules after they are banned, I doubt that anyone will determine the reason why, but will try to ask again.

Also, we can not ignore that many do not know English, there are a lot of rules, some do not know what the meaning of plagiarism and other things.
The best suggestion is the welcome message "must be included in translated versions" or

Quote from: Veleor on October 21, 2018, 08:24:43 AM

[1] https://bitcointalksearch.org/topic/m.47106599

suchmoon

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So... this user claims to have been given a reason:

Quote from: windman8080 on December 11, 2018, 12:23:36 PM

"Sorry kabum21, you are banned from posting or sending personal messages on this forum.
You have been permanently banned by a forum moderator, probably due to spam or plagiarism. You may appeal here, but your chances are not good: [email protected]"

Not sure if that's a one-off or a permanent change by theymos. But guess what, still started an appeal asking which post they plagiarized.

The Sceptical Chymist

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Quote from: suchmoon on December 11, 2018, 12:22:45 PM

Mods make mistakes too. There is nothing wrong with genuine appeals.

No doubt. The problem is that Meta is being overrun with ban appeal threads. I don't see why a child board can't be created. It's not exactly like it would require more moderation--it's just like putting a partition in place where those members who don't feel like looking at plagiarist begging, lying, and general nonsense don't have to look at it.

Quote from: TheBeardedBaby on December 11, 2018, 12:48:54 PM

No, some cases need a bit more investigation. Lately there was one account banned by mistake.

Yep, I saw that and I've seen others, too. I wouldn't argue that people shouldn't be able to appeal their ban, just that such cases like the one you mentioned are the exception, not the rule, and that most ban appeal threads are just a bunch of excuses and pleading by people who know exactly what they've done wrong. If you create a child board, you can then put it on ignore if you want.

TheBeardedBaby

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Quote from: Gloverwrt on December 11, 2018, 08:57:01 AM

Quote from: TheBeardedBaby on December 11, 2018, 06:02:37 AM

That will make them read the rules and not abuse new account they open for appeal.

Or an alternative would be to stop ban appeals being made in META, and also remove the email address stated for appeals as it appears to not be functioning.
Then create a specific board for Ban appeals, where the community and mods can debate on appeal threads.
This would unclog Meta, and also remove the need to create new accounts to appeal bans

No, some cases need a bit more investigation. Lately there was one account banned by mistake. The user messed up the quotation tags and God banned for plagiarism, but actually was not a plagiarism case. He got his account back at the end.

suchmoon

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https://bpip.org

Quote from: tuthienloc92bk on December 11, 2018, 09:21:07 AM

I think almost permanent bans are caused by plagiarized behaviors. And if they are banned and receive announcement without any reasons, they should accept it because this decision is carefully considered by mods.

Mods make mistakes too. There is nothing wrong with genuine appeals. Unfortunately most of the appeals in Meta seem to be coming from shitposters who know exactly what they've done and/or don't think that rules apply to them. So even though it wouldn't hurt to have the ban message show the reason, it would probably not reduce the appeals. Keep in mind that only ~1-2% of permabanned users try to appeal.

tuthienloc92bk

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Quote from: Findingnemo on December 11, 2018, 05:26:45 AM

""Sorry (username), you are banned from posting or sending personal messages on this forum.
You have been banned by a forum moderator. You may appeal here: [email protected]""

It seems that announcement applying with permanent ban. I used to get banned due to joining giveaway. And this is announcement I got:

I think almost permanent bans are caused by plagiarized behaviors. And if they are banned and receive announcement without any reasons, they should accept it because this decision is carefully considered by mods.

Topic: Give an indication why an account was banned! (Read 697 times)