Topic: [GLBSE] PureMining: Infinite-term, deterministic mining bond - page 9. (Read 39708 times)

I wonder if you already paid your current bond holders enough on dividends, so they don't go into loss when you will be pushing market price down while issuing more of these bonds at lower price. I don't hold any of these bonds, just curious. 

I think there should be a required amount of time to hold the bonds if someone pre-orders them.  Otherwise they might just resell the at your IPO and you would then be in competition with the preordered bonds and the new ones you are releasing.

I've been asked about bulk/presale discounts. I'm not a fan of these things but I guess it couldn't hurt if done modestly and openly. So here are the terms:

1. Out of the 5000 bonds currently issued, up to 3000 are elligible for preordering.
2. Preorder must be at least 500 bonds.
3. Discount will be 2%. The actual price will be determined and disclosed when the bonds are offered publicly.
4. Preordered bonds will start to be delivered after bonds are publicly put on sale.
5. The preorder agreement isn't binding for either party. The buyer can cancel the order if he's unhappy with the price or for any other reason. I can also back out of the deal, but will only do that with a good reason.
6. If more bonds are preordered than available, buyers will be put on a waiting list. Bonds will be offered to buyers who are still interested in the order they requested the preorder.
7. Preordering is done under the understanding that the bonds will not be immediately resold.
8. Preorder request can be done by either posting in this thread or sending a PM.

I will issue 5000 more bonds early next week.

The price will be somewhat lower than the last issue, to account for hardware advances and the increase in the BTC exchange rate, both of which mean that more hashrate can be bought per bitcoin.

I agree but personally I don't feel the upside is worth the cost of less direct entanglement with the underlying hardware purchase. But I certainly don't deny that MOORE has a place catering to people for whom it is. In particular, it expands the space spanned by the available investment opportunities, giving sophisticated investors more flexibility in matching their portfolio to their future projections.

Regarding the psychological effect, it's mostly a product of what metric one is looking it. Currently GLBSE shows a graph of an asset price over time, and seeing a graph which is always in decline indeed looks bad. IMO the relevant metric is current price + coupons paid per unit so far. This gives a more accurate, intuitive picture of the viability of an asset, should look the same for functionally equivalent assets, and will show an upward trend for any successful investment.

I agree with most of your ideas. But as the issuer of MOORE, I have to make some comments.


Exactly. As I admitted in my main thread from the start, our bond is not fungible with deterministic bonds, so I have to do price discovery myself without the help of other people's prices. And I also admit that my pricing includes the compensation to many of my potential risks.

However, the strategy of MOORE is to make its price less prone to technology advances. For technology changes, there are gradual ones and disruptive ones. The policy of my current hard-code appreciation of hashrates aims to neutralize the first, and I will also cover the second with my new adjustments to the contract of my bonds.


The essence of MOORE is I do the re-investment for them. Even if in the end the investors just get the same as the scenario they do re-investments themselves, the psychological effect of "our bond is not losing value as much as others are" is an advantage both for me and for the investors.

PureMining is a deterministic bond, and it will continue to be 1 MH/s per bond. I don't increase it when something good happens any more than I decrease it when something bad happens, the contract is binding both ways.

Some issuers have offered to pass on gains from the BFL trade-in program. This makes sense given this disruptive event, I wish them the best of luck and investors who are confident in BFL's ability to deliver would do well to consider these offers. But that's not the market segment I'm in, I just want PureMining to continue faithfully filling its role of a deterministic bond long after the uncertainty of the current time is behind us.

BFL's announced specs are very impressive, but on the other hand they don't have a great track record of delivering what they promised on time. I will certainly take their announcement into consideration when deciding on the pricing of any future issued bonds, and investors should take it into account when deciding how much they are willing to pay.

I think it's very interesting but ultimately I don't see the point. The issuer of a bond with a hardcoded appreciation in hashrate is speculating on what the future cost of hashrate will be, and he will have to compensate for this risk in his pricing. In a fixed-hashrate bond the issuer can much better estimate his cost of covering the bond, and can thus offer it at a more affordable price. Also, since the chosen appreciation rate is arbitrary, it stands in the way of standardization and commoditization.

I prefer the scenario where the issuer just offers more bonds if he wishes to expand utilizing new hardware opportunities, and investors can buy them if they wish to maintain or increase the value of their investment.

How will puremining deal with the ASIC situation Meni?

I see NastyMining is going to change the value of their bonds to 20mh/s or something.

What are your thoughts on a MOORE type offering ?

I will issue 5000 new bonds tomorrow, at a price which is to be determined.

In other news, more or less all of the units from the first BFL shipment have arrived; I will post more pictures once Inaba finishes tidying them up.

Update: Bonds have been issued, and offered for 0.37 BTC.

Coupon payment summary for May 2012 (total 0.0186125703 BTC per bond):

Ok, it's going to be easier than I thought. I'll be at home for the next ~10 days, and even in camp I'll have some free time and internet access.

Anyway, I've been away for a week and they change everything. It'll take a while to catch up with everything that's been going on...

It's probably because I slipped you a roofie before I said it to you.

OT: damn, I'm dead certain that I heard that exact quote in your sig somewhere, but can't remember 

Damn... Good luck and stay safe.

Military reserve duty, also known here as "miluim".

Nickleback Concert?

Honeymoon? 

Oh, it's much worse than either. But probably not as bad as what may be your next guess.

Enjoy your holidays - or work. Whichever

I will have very limited availability between May 20, 2012 and June 17, 2012. I have arranged for coupons to continue to be paid on schedule (there could be some delays on weekends, especially the one on May 27); but I may not be able to offer support or handle any unexpected situations. Those will be sorted out when I get back.