Topic: Gold collapsing. Bitcoin UP. - page 320. (Read 2032265 times)

I didn't have a chance to look at this in detail, but if the sender knows the private key, then double spends are a concern and the incomplete mitigation (to spend asap) is a timing analysis vector and afaics brings the traceability right back onto the blockchain.

Edit: myself (and I assume smooth and others) have thought deeply about all these sort of schemes and dismissed them. There isn't likely anything new under the sun except for some exotic new crypto that improves upon the Zerocash, Zerocoin, or fully homomorphic schemes. I would like to see a quantum resistant reformulation of Cryptonote.

Untraceability (e.g. when merging change from prior txns) can only be secured mixing of txns on the blockchain. Mixing can be done on the blockchain using an orthogonal protocol such as CoinJoin, but as explained by myself and smooth upthread, CoinJoin is not autonomous, is not immune to being jammed by a determined attacker, and has a user simultaneity requirement that will prevent it from scaling. Darkcoin mitigated the jammability by implementing masternodes which compromise anonymity against a ubiquitous attacker such as the NSA and they were the last time I checked adding some pre-mixing scheme to mitigate the simultaneity issue but that pre-mixing comes at a cost (and I think also a cost to scalability as well). Afaics after much thought and study, onchain mixing such as Cryptonote's one-time ring sigs (or Zerocoin and Zerocash but we pointed out their vulnerabilities upthread) is the only way to achieve anonymity with ledger-based crypto-currency. Note I also pointed out upthread that one-time ring sigs are not sufficient, and we need IP obfuscation as well. I argue that Tor (and likely I2P as well) are not entirely reliable IP obfuscation (argue they are subject to various attacks on the anonymity).

This stance from you is  most welcome. I am pleasantly surprised and very much willing to prove to you in the market whether I am correct or not. I don't want to just blow air here. I want to make sure we have what we want, whether it is Bitcoin or otherwise.

And I feel now there is a slight possibility I am a marked man, so the sooner I release my ideas, the safer for me personally. I am in a mad rush to do so, not only for reasons of personal safety but moreso because the opportunity is so interesting.

I will be making a post later in my day (GMT+7) to make some counter points on this article:

On the Clothing of Emperors: A Rant about 21.co and the Future of Bitcoin Mining

My main points will be:

1. Marginal-cost of electricity and variable seasons of the Bitcoin price market vs. speed of deployment of fixed capital investment (Economics 101 lesson)

2. (Politically obfuscated) goal of >50% control of hashrate to increase profits in side-channels, including but not limited to a near monopoly on setting txn fees.

3. TDP is only limited on cell phones by the mass and/or extent of heat dissipation apparatus?

P.S. I made some comments about the recent downtime of bitcointalk, and I noticed the timing of the takedown was approximately immediately after I wrote my prior jaw-dropping post and my post which solidified some of the essential points of my allegations against 21 Inc.'s business model. I am not totally ruling out the possibility that the the-powers-that-be are scrambling to figure out how to squelch these revelations. A friend of mine has agreed to pass on these revelations to those who can publish them far and wide in the alternative media scene (think Alex Jones and spin offs). It is possible they wanted to view my private messages, if they don't already have them since I turned off email notification and assuming the elite aren't in control of the certificate issuer for the SSL certificate for this site. In any case, they won't learn much from my private messages. They would need to crack Bitmessage instead. OTOH, it is not likely that elite are concerned about the unproven capabilities of some nobody like myself. They have bigger fish to fry and the masses are probably going to fall into the NWO no matter what we all do here.

Also I should add the Larry Summers and Robert Rubin were instrumental in the repeal of Glass-Steagal during the Clinton administration.

Also note I emailed Martin Armstrong about these revelations and he did not print it, even though he is the one who has been harping on Larry Summers and the move to electronic cash. The only reason I can think of for him not writing about this, is because it is blatant evidence of a globalized plan towards a global Technocracy — something which he denies the elite are capable of planning or coordinating on a global scale. Martin claims the elite are fools who can't trade well and need a public backstop so they can gamble with other people's money. He doesn't agree that there is a global coordination amongst the elite with long-range plans for NWO control. Thus this is evidence that either Armstrong is disingenuous (censors to fit his irrational ego) or worse he is in bed with the elite helping to promote globalized "solutions" such as his calls for coordinate political and bond restructuring reforms harmonized with a move to a NWO one-world reserve currency.

Where is the problem then bro when you are stating this

" and that means, to me, that fixed supply type assets such as Bitcoin should rise as either a result of further QE, or simply as a safe haven."

should be pretty obvious to anyone paying attention we have a short term problem going on here.   thing is it's not just any 'ol problem, it's a Dow Theory non-confirmation that is beginning to drag down the $DJI.  given that we've had one of these at almost every mkt top in the last 100 yrs, it's worth paying attention to.  that's bad news but goes along with what' going on in the real economy:

HSBC fears world recession with no lifeboats left

http://www.telegraph.co.uk/finance/economics/11625098/HSBC-fears-world-recession-with-no-lifeboats-left.html

i have been warning of this for months as this has been telegraphed with the downturn in commodities (esp oil), mining companies, BDI, foreign stock mkts, junk, muni, and investment grade bonds, etc. over the last year.  this is also consistent with the principle of all mkts moving together as one as a secondary reaction to money printing, mainly by the Fed. it's all one big pump.  imo, given this weakness, there is no way they will raise rates as indicated in the above article.  and that means, to me, that fixed supply type assets such as Bitcoin should rise as either a result of further QE, or simply as a safe haven.

Reasonable analysis, and as you know I'm historically dubious about much of your analysis.  Thx.

What a pity, such offline keys exchange technique won't be open source
 

Closed source, non-auditable crypto it's not something I would trust enough to put any value into.

Hi all, long time no see. I've just discovered I developed a sort of addiction to btctalk :-)

I just found out an hidden "gem" in the development section:

"Off-chain anonymous transactions by secure transfer of private keys"


Here the link for the updated white paper:

http://www.othercoin.com/OtherCoin.pdf

The world needs a form of money that can resist corruption even by someone like Larry Summers.

It could be the case that we should interpret 21 as an attack on Bitcoin, in which case we'll find out of Bitcoin can be that money or not.

And then most of Russia's resources were handed out to a few oligarchs who are beholden to the cartel. And do you know who was over there organizing that?

Larry Summers.

The same former US Treasury and World Bank official (also was nominated to replace Bernanke) involved with 21 Inc, who first floated the idea of negative interest rates and eliminating cash.

Do some research folks.

The tell is not the behaviour of schoolchildren that matters - it's the behaviour of the apparatchik.

When they start to believe the remaining lifetime of the regime is less than the expected duration of their employment + pension, some of them start patiently waiting for their expected windfall to arrive over the course of decades of career and retirement and start taking what they can get while they can.

These acts of internal looting have an effect of shortening the remaining lifetime of the regime which means it's a positive feedback loop. As the expected lifetime (as perceived by the apparatchik) shortens, the amount of internal looting increases.

That positive feedback cycle is why the end of a regime can arrive faster than anyone thinks possible with little outside warning.

http://www.washingtonpost.com/politics/gsa-officials-wife-accompanied-him-on-trips-at-taxpayer-expense/2012/04/17/gIQAHdrEPT_story.html


We now know in retrospect that internal looting was extremely rampant in the months and years prior to the dissolution of the USSR.

Another interesting observation we can make in retrospect is a connection with German reunification. I was fairly young when the Berlin wall came down, but I do remember being shocked that Moscow would allow it to happen. According to everything I'd ever been taught, the Communist Party had absolute control over everything that happened in the Soviet empire. Looking back on the event, that was an obvious sign they had lost control.

In my estimation, recent state-level marijuana legalization events are of equivalent magnitude to the fall of the Berlin wall in terms of what it means about Washington DC's internal control over the US, and probably means the US empire is approximately at the same point it its life cycle as the Soviet empire was in 1989.

Since my last post on 21 Inc, other than posts from smooth and some of one of cypherdoc's post, all I read is delusional denial and irrational nonsense in the other comments about 21 Inc's business model.

You myopic idiots that are emphasizing that mining can't be profitable on phones, are entirely missing the point! The owners of the cell phone don't care about the electricity cost. They never pay attention to that. It is insignificant to them. All they care about is the discount on the device when they purchase it. And they are not going to throw away the phone after purchasing it. They will use it.

The point is that if you have a billion smartphones giving up $10+ a year in electricity to mining, then even if the phone ASIC is 10X or 100X less efficient as mining, the cartel's mining pool still has a huge hashrate.

One can assume phones will consume much more electricity than they do now while on the charger, because the phone discount has to be recovered by the electricity input (and efficiency of the mining ASIC in the phone) over the lifespan on the device. Bear in mind that phones are becoming more efficient over time, so the business model can cannibalize the user's expectation of electricity usage keeping that expectation constant. Yeah the developing world females (in fact most females every where) wouldn't know different. Many males also in the developing world.

Also smartphones are declining in cost (now $65 for basic Alcatel here in Philippines) thus the $10+ per year of unnoticed electricity usage, will become a greater proportion of the smartphone cost over time. The business model of 21 Inc is a 10 year plan.

The cartel isn't deprived of income if the phone is no longer profitable for mining, because they are getting the hashrate cycles for free after they recover the initial subsidy they provided for the discount on the purchase price of the phone.

And phones are upgraded often by users, so more opportunities to upgrade the efficiency of the ASICs in the mobile phones. (Add: and the used phones get handed down to relatives who don't have a smartphone so continue to generate mining for the cartel)

What they can also do is give some token amount of Bitcons to the user of the phone, to obtain ringtones and shit like that which girls love but doesn't really cost anything. Also they can do bundled deals with for example Facebook, Viber, and the telcom carriers giving free connectivity for basic low bandwidth services (e.g. messaging) in exchange for exclusivity and/or marketing access to this large base of users.

What you fail to understand is the cartel wants to own access to every person, so to gain access you have to be connected in the cartel. This is really about eliminating competition. And capturing holistic profit by controlling all access to markets.


Because the user might replace the charger and still use the phone. Chargers are lost all the time over here in the chaotic developing world with zillion people in and out of your house, but phones are guarded more carefully.

Also because you would have to duplicate all the radio, processing, etc that is  in the phone.

Duh!


Nonsense all those comments! Also the guy clearly says they will use sidechains to the micropayments, exactly as I warned you this is a centralization of mining in every facet!

You all can keep denying that Bitcon is the NWOcoin, but your delusion won't help you avoid the fate coming.

i don't want to get into it in detail here.  it's kinda complicated b/c everyone does it a little differently.  i'm a big believer in cycle theory as well and i use the weekly bottoms as a timing mechanism to help identify approximately where the secondary low points on the charts occur which are critical for Dow Theory.   that's what the "SL" stands for that i put up here.  these cycles are approximately 22 wks long.  once you can establish where the secondary low pts are, which tend to correlate with weekly cycle bottoms, you then look for both indices, the $DJI & $DJT, to make new secondary highs together compared to their previous secondary highs. if only one does, then you get the non-confirmation which is what we have now.  this all then gets mixed in with the 4yr cycles which typically represent major tops in the $DJI over the last 100 yrs.  this large, major long term cycle has been muddied greatly over the last 20 yrs b/c of central bank intervention which works to unpredictably prolong this mess.  however at these stretched 4 yr cycle tops a vast majority of them, like >90%, are associated with a Dow Theory non-conf.  this is why it can be a huge warning signing when it occurs.  like we have now. we are way overdue for a 4yr cycle top as this cycle has been way overstretched due to QE.  the payback should be devastating; perhaps even greater than 2008.  but then again, all this TA could be hogwash.  it's all pattern recognition and the human mind is great at fooling itself.  we'll just have to see.

I think you have that almost exactly backward.  There is a strong push toward indoctrinating U.S. public school kids from an early age to being conducive to 'global citizenship' as one example of the necessary requirements.  Efforts in this direction have been going on since I was a kid in the 1970's but in fits and starts, and things like genuine individuality, healthy skepticism, and some degree of self sufficiency were still at least tolerated.  When the generation who are now in grade school matures, look out.

USSR had very little in common with USA. US is very integrated, USSR was a quilt of very different cultures, especially on the periphery (-stans, etc.)
I don't think that what you suggest will happen in the foreseeable future.

Putting aside the question of monopoly power markets or other regulated markets that don't allow such promotions, or where the power supplier is bureaucratic and would take years to even negotiate such a deal, what would be the incentive of the power company to even do that?

I think you're reaching a bit to conclude the loss leader mining is obviously impractical.

Also, it isn't limited to phones. In their write up they mentioned internet-connected devices. That could include devices that don't normally include a paid service at all, for example dropcams, media players, wireless routers, WiFi-only tablets, really almost anything. The loss leader model where you pay back the up front cost with integrated mining still (possibly) makes sense.

Choose us as power supplier - get a free phone!

Would you care to specify the last 5 occurrences of this non-confirmation? This way we could compare current market breadth (which is quite strong now) and a couple other indicators with the others. I can tell the last one, in 2012, was present almost the whole year and was followed by 2013 being the best year for stocks in quite a while.

totally expected up day to test the underbelly of what has now become resistance.  you have to be worried that it didn't get back over the top today.  in fact, this sets up tomorrow as a big "watch out" day:

not exactly.  they will provide a hardware wallet as well for larger storage amts for larger tx's.

i agree that the above examples are kinda far out there.  activities we can only imagine.  but they are building off of Mike Hearn's original driverless car visions.  not that that is a measuring stick or anything but just shows ppl have been thinking about how to do this for quite a while now. 

i agree completely altho we shouldn't discount micropayments completely.  esp for developing nations. 

as for mining, they do have the stated objective of trying to drive more decentralization of mining.  if that requires subsidies or riding on the coat tails of other use cases for these devices, so be it.  i think it's a worthy goal.