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Topic: Gold collapsing. Bitcoin UP. - page 421. (Read 2032286 times)

legendary
Activity: 1153
Merit: 1000
April 14, 2015, 06:07:07 PM
$DJT *already* threatening to plunge below it's secondary low pt.  that would be bad and confirmation of the non-confirmation we already have in place.  look the hell out:

Unless we see a 500-600 point crash that still looks bullish.

None of that matters, not the fundamentals, not the chart, not anything.

The only thing that matters is if the FED starts to raise rates as promised this summer/fall. If yes then the chart goes down, if no then the chart goes up. Its that simple.

The truly scary aspect of this is most people who believe in free markets think this command and control economy is OK.

Noone thinks this economy is ok noone with 2 brain cells atleast.. it is what it is... it goes until it breaks. 0 or 1 binary. Raising rates will probably lead to a bullish run like no other btw quite opposite of what most ppl think.

unfortunately, you may be right.  

the only thing that might be able to crack their money printing scheme that is designed specifically to drive up the stock mkt is a real, good 'ol fashion domino debt default crisis like we had in 2008.  and in this case and time, that unfortunately would mean a true domino sovereign debt default starting with some place like Greece.  except that the ECB keeps doing whatever it takes to stop this from happening.  the key thing for you is that you believe that they can keep postponing reality.  and ppl like you have been right for longer than anyone can imagine having happened.  the problem i see is that your final blow off parabolic top seems to depend on the avg Joe piling on at the top.  i don't think they have the capability of doing so anymore therefore it will take continued CB pumping to keep everything afloat.  is there a breaking pt?  i think there is.  but it is difficult, if not impossible, to tell exactly when.  this Dow Theory non-conf is as good an indicator as any that there is unforeseen trouble ahead dead ahead.  but as i said in one post, the banks and CB's watch the charts like hawks as well and pump to prevent even a hint of trouble from emerging these days.  quite a clusterf*ck if you ask me.

i for one won't be investing in the stock mkt at this point in time.  only until a full on wash out crash has cleared out the speculation.

Im not basing it on postponing reality.. i see it in the charts... dont you think the smart money already knows when the endgame is near? They have to sell to someone.. and avg joe is the best bet as there is a ton of money on the sideline waiting for suckers to get in like musical chairs.

We see it in crypto land every day... except that its 1000000x faster. Each pump and cycle is doing the same thing.. accumulate and distribute to suckers. Some pumps end up happening on other pumps because of speculation and you have sustained rises.. however most alt's dont have a reason for a pump within a pump so they go back down to 0.

I still don't think you can see anything in the charts anymore (or in the fundamentals) because what the FED decides to do in regards to rates and Ctrl+P has a much bigger impact.

The 2008 crash happened simply because 1) they raised rates the year before, which stopped M2 and M3 money growth and 2) they let Bear go down which telegraphed the FED would not always function as a bailout entity for the credit market in all cases (which it had since LTCM blew up a decade earlier).

We can see the same situation emerging today. 1) The FED is talking about raising rates (I'm still 50/50 on if they have the courage) and 2) letting Greece go down seems more and more likely, which will have the same effect as BearStearns.  Bear caused the credit market to realize it was possible to lose money with bank credit, which caused a bank run and crashed the system. Greece will make the credit market realize it is possible to lose money with sovereign credit, which will cause a sovereign run. If you thought a bank credit run was ugly, wait till you see a sovereign credit run.

legendary
Activity: 2044
Merit: 1005
April 14, 2015, 05:02:11 PM
$DJT *already* threatening to plunge below it's secondary low pt.  that would be bad and confirmation of the non-confirmation we already have in place.  look the hell out:

Unless we see a 500-600 point crash that still looks bullish.

None of that matters, not the fundamentals, not the chart, not anything.

The only thing that matters is if the FED starts to raise rates as promised this summer/fall. If yes then the chart goes down, if no then the chart goes up. Its that simple.

The truly scary aspect of this is most people who believe in free markets think this command and control economy is OK.

Noone thinks this economy is ok noone with 2 brain cells atleast.. it is what it is... it goes until it breaks. 0 or 1 binary. Raising rates will probably lead to a bullish run like no other btw quite opposite of what most ppl think.

unfortunately, you may be right.  

the only thing that might be able to crack their money printing scheme that is designed specifically to drive up the stock mkt is a real, good 'ol fashion domino debt default crisis like we had in 2008.  and in this case and time, that unfortunately would mean a true domino sovereign debt default starting with some place like Greece.  except that the ECB keeps doing whatever it takes to stop this from happening.  the key thing for you is that you believe that they can keep postponing reality.  and ppl like you have been right for longer than anyone can imagine having happened.  the problem i see is that your final blow off parabolic top seems to depend on the avg Joe piling on at the top.  i don't think they have the capability of doing so anymore therefore it will take continued CB pumping to keep everything afloat.  is there a breaking pt?  i think there is.  but it is difficult, if not impossible, to tell exactly when.  this Dow Theory non-conf is as good an indicator as any that there is unforeseen trouble ahead dead ahead.  but as i said in one post, the banks and CB's watch the charts like hawks as well and pump to prevent even a hint of trouble from emerging these days.  quite a clusterf*ck if you ask me.

i for one won't be investing in the stock mkt at this point in time.  only until a full on wash out crash has cleared out the speculation.

Im not basing it on postponing reality.. i see it in the charts... dont you think the smart money already knows when the endgame is near? They have to sell to someone.. and avg joe is the best bet as there is a ton of money on the sideline waiting for suckers to get in like musical chairs.

We see it in crypto land every day... except that its 1000000x faster. Each pump and cycle is doing the same thing.. accumulate and distribute to suckers. Some pumps end up happening on other pumps because of speculation and you have sustained rises.. however most alt's dont have a reason for a pump within a pump so they go back down to 0.
legendary
Activity: 3794
Merit: 5474
April 14, 2015, 04:49:44 PM
i for one won't be investing in the stock mkt at this point in time.  only until a full on wash out crash has cleared out the speculation.

Only one problem though, Bitcoin (and all crypto) is still being treated like a stock.  So a stock market crash would instantly loot bitcoin as well (and it would not be pretty).

PM's and cash would be the only safe haven.

And in some weird way, I see an economic rise continuing for at least the next 2-3 years.  Not sure what will happen after that though, as it will likely be a lot of smoke.
legendary
Activity: 1764
Merit: 1002
April 14, 2015, 04:44:02 PM
$DJT *already* threatening to plunge below it's secondary low pt.  that would be bad and confirmation of the non-confirmation we already have in place.  look the hell out:

Unless we see a 500-600 point crash that still looks bullish.

None of that matters, not the fundamentals, not the chart, not anything.

The only thing that matters is if the FED starts to raise rates as promised this summer/fall. If yes then the chart goes down, if no then the chart goes up. Its that simple.

The truly scary aspect of this is most people who believe in free markets think this command and control economy is OK.

Noone thinks this economy is ok noone with 2 brain cells atleast.. it is what it is... it goes until it breaks. 0 or 1 binary. Raising rates will probably lead to a bullish run like no other btw quite opposite of what most ppl think.

unfortunately, you may be right. 

the only thing that might be able to crack their money printing scheme that is designed specifically to drive up the stock mkt is a real, good 'ol fashion domino debt default crisis like we had in 2008.  and in this case and time, that unfortunately would mean a true domino sovereign debt default starting with some place like Greece.  except that the ECB keeps doing whatever it takes to stop this from happening.  the key thing for you is that you believe that they can keep postponing reality.  and ppl like you have been right for longer than anyone can imagine having happened.  the problem i see is that your final blow off parabolic top seems to depend on the avg Joe piling on at the top.  i don't think they have the capability of doing so anymore therefore it will take continued CB pumping to keep everything afloat.  is there a breaking pt?  i think there is.  but it is difficult, if not impossible, to tell exactly when.  this Dow Theory non-conf is as good an indicator as any that there is unforeseen trouble ahead dead ahead.  but as i said in one post, the banks and CB's watch the charts like hawks as well and pump to prevent even a hint of trouble from emerging these days.  quite a clusterf*ck if you ask me.

i for one won't be investing in the stock mkt at this point in time.  only until a full on wash out crash has cleared out the speculation.
legendary
Activity: 2044
Merit: 1005
April 14, 2015, 04:19:32 PM
$DJT *already* threatening to plunge below it's secondary low pt.  that would be bad and confirmation of the non-confirmation we already have in place.  look the hell out:

Unless we see a 500-600 point crash that still looks bullish.

None of that matters, not the fundamentals, not the chart, not anything.

The only thing that matters is if the FED starts to raise rates as promised this summer/fall. If yes then the chart goes down, if no then the chart goes up. Its that simple.

The truly scary aspect of this is most people who believe in free markets think this command and control economy is OK.

Noone thinks this economy is ok noone with 2 brain cells atleast.. it is what it is... it goes until it breaks. 0 or 1 binary. Raising rates will probably lead to a bullish run like no other btw quite opposite of what most ppl think.
legendary
Activity: 1153
Merit: 1000
April 14, 2015, 04:09:21 PM
$DJT *already* threatening to plunge below it's secondary low pt.  that would be bad and confirmation of the non-confirmation we already have in place.  look the hell out:

Unless we see a 500-600 point crash that still looks bullish.

None of that matters, not the fundamentals, not the chart, not anything.

The only thing that matters is if the FED starts to raise rates as promised this summer/fall. If yes then the chart goes down, if no then the chart goes up. Its that simple.

The truly scary aspect of this is most people who believe in free markets think this command and control economy is OK.
legendary
Activity: 2044
Merit: 1005
April 14, 2015, 03:28:02 PM
$DJT *already* threatening to plunge below it's secondary low pt.  that would be bad and confirmation of the non-confirmation we already have in place.  look the hell out:



Unless we see a 500-600 point crash that still looks bullish.
full member
Activity: 660
Merit: 101
Colletrix - Bridging the Physical and Virtual Worl
April 14, 2015, 02:14:08 PM
Maybe yes, maybe no. I'll be content if 1% of the global economy is denominated in BTC before 2025.
this is the right attitude, altho highly conservative.

The world's current total wealth is ~ USD$263 trillion [1]. If one tenth of one percent of it were presently stored in the blockchain, BTC market cap would be USD$263 billion. Dividing that by 14 million BTC gives ~ USD$18,785/BTC.

Assuming only 1% compounded yearly growth, world's wealth in 2025 would be USD $290 trillion.  One percent of that is USD $2.9 trillion. Divided by 20 million BTC mined by 2025 gives ~ USD$1.45 million/BTC (supposing they were all for sale).

Conservative?

Quote
the beautiful thing is that Bitcoin has been powerful enough to get an IBM and the world's most powerful CB up in a tizzy.  not to mention headed off in the wrong direction.
Don't forget the commercial banks. They are feeling the heat too [2].


[1] https://publications.credit-suisse.com/tasks/render/file/?fileID=60931FDE-A2D2-F568-B041B58C5EA591A4
[2] http://files.shareholder.com/downloads/ONE/15660259x0x820077/8af78e45-1d81-4363-931c-439d04312ebc/JPMC-AR2014-LetterToShareholders.pdf , p.29
legendary
Activity: 1153
Merit: 1000
April 14, 2015, 01:40:45 PM


80% YoY growth in usage isn't too shabby, especially considering the starting point last year was coming off of a bubble.
legendary
Activity: 1764
Merit: 1002
April 14, 2015, 01:25:09 PM
legendary
Activity: 1764
Merit: 1002
April 14, 2015, 01:09:36 PM
keep focusing on the positives:

legendary
Activity: 1764
Merit: 1002
April 14, 2015, 12:51:16 PM
Maybe yes, maybe no. I'll be content if 1% of the global economy is denominated in BTC before 2025.

this is the right attitude, altho highly conservative.

the beautiful thing is that Bitcoin has been powerful enough to get an IBM and the world's most powerful CB up in a tizzy.  not to mention headed off in the wrong direction.
full member
Activity: 660
Merit: 101
Colletrix - Bridging the Physical and Virtual Worl
April 14, 2015, 12:19:10 PM
Maybe yes, maybe no. I'll be content if 1% of the global economy is denominated in BTC before 2025.
legendary
Activity: 1260
Merit: 1002
April 14, 2015, 12:14:19 PM
However an IBM-designed govcoin is implemented, its differences with bitcoin will be marked. The contrast will make bitcoin easier for the public to understand, and users will be able assess advantages and disadvantages of each option. Bitcoin will then (continue to) compete on its own merits. We could ask for no better.

+1 and then people will realize there is only one option: Bitcoin. Cool
legendary
Activity: 1764
Merit: 1002
April 14, 2015, 12:06:04 PM

Why should a govcoin bother with mining which is a waste of electricity if you're not using the distributed security mechanism. They will simply design it so only the FED or some other agency can create and sign blocks. Since there is a single centralized block generator they could also issue blocks faster (say every 5 seconds) without the risk of orphans, then claim how much better their implementation is because it has faster block confirmation times (plus is wrapped in the protective love of our betters).

My thoughts exactly, why not just use POS protocol?

exactly. IBM doesn't want to get into the biz of hashing with all the attendant ordering of multiple parts and accessories.  it's too risky.  they'll just do POS.
full member
Activity: 660
Merit: 101
Colletrix - Bridging the Physical and Virtual Worl
April 14, 2015, 11:59:22 AM
However an IBM-designed govcoin is implemented, its differences with bitcoin will be marked. The contrast will make bitcoin easier for the public to understand, and users will be able to assess advantages and disadvantages of each option. Bitcoin will then (continue to) compete on its own merits. We could ask for no better.
hero member
Activity: 715
Merit: 500
April 14, 2015, 11:13:57 AM

Why should a govcoin bother with mining which is a waste of electricity if you're not using the distributed security mechanism. They will simply design it so only the FED or some other agency can create and sign blocks. Since there is a single centralized block generator they could also issue blocks faster (say every 5 seconds) without the risk of orphans, then claim how much better their implementation is because it has faster block confirmation times (plus is wrapped in the protective love of our betters).

My thoughts exactly, why not just use POS protocol?
legendary
Activity: 1153
Merit: 1000
April 14, 2015, 11:00:26 AM
It begins

Exclusive: IBM looking at adopting bitcoin technology for major currencies
http://www.reuters.com/article/2015/03/12/us-bitcoin-ibm-idUSKBN0M82KB20150312

they're making a number of faulty assumptions.

I think we've been calling this "govcoin" on these forums since at least 2012.

They'll release open ledger SHA-256 implementation without block subsidy (money printed by a centralized source -- a special txn signed by a well known private key).  Nobody will mine it so the government will pay banks to do so and these banks will lease IBM "cloud" based hardware to mine for massive profits to IBM.  As part of the mining contract, banks will allow their mines to blacklist addresses and in an emergency be redirected to a shorter chain so txns can be unwound.   Currency may be 51%ed by hackers for the lulz but this is exactly what some planners are actually hoping for because it will require the network to be "temporarily" limited to trusted banking partners and require massive additional spending to build out the "good" miners so that they out hash the "bad".  If it doesn't catch on, 10s or 100s of millions will have already been spent (of taxpayer money), people will be distracted from Bitcoin, and CC providers will use its failure to justify the continuation of their own insecure and data-collection-intensive methodologies.

Its a win win situation -- the perfect way to continue the current system while co-opting blockchain technology and buzz. 


Why should a govcoin bother with mining which is a waste of electricity if you're not using the distributed security mechanism. They will simply design it so only the FED or some other agency can create and sign blocks. Since there is a single centralized block generator they could also issue blocks faster (say every 5 seconds) without the risk of orphans, then claim how much better their implementation is because it has faster block confirmation times (plus is wrapped in the protective love of our betters).
legendary
Activity: 1153
Merit: 1000
April 14, 2015, 10:56:29 AM
It begins

Exclusive: IBM looking at adopting bitcoin technology for major currencies
http://www.reuters.com/article/2015/03/12/us-bitcoin-ibm-idUSKBN0M82KB20150312

they're making a number of faulty assumptions.

Of course they are, this is the start of the real attack against bitcoin, they are not going to be honest about a thing either publicly or even to themselves for that matter.

This would be huge for bitcoin if it actually took place. Nothing like breaking down the conceptual barriers for people so they can more easily understand just how their fiat stacks up against a finite currency on a similar platform. Basically they are cementing Bitcoin's role as gold 2.0

That would be true if the conceptual barrier that mattered was using a digital protocol vs. using cash and bank accounts. But that is not the conceptual barrier that really matters.

The conceptual barrier that matters here is people trusting themselves vs. people relying on their betters (who promise to take care of them while robbing them blind). A Govcoin allows people to use the digital protocol, while still being wrapped in the protective love of the state, there is no tangible difference between that and what we have today.
legendary
Activity: 1764
Merit: 1002
April 14, 2015, 09:32:45 AM
who need copper when we just need tubes?

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