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Topic: Gold collapsing. Bitcoin UP. - page 971. (Read 2032272 times)

sr. member
Activity: 371
Merit: 250
September 08, 2014, 12:06:33 PM
It is probably becoming another good time to purchase precious metals.   In the long term, there is almost no logical way that precious metals will not appreciate.   As the USD (and other currencies) get further and further inflated, precious metals will have to go up (hopefully along with BTC)

Probably true. To me, gold bugs are mostly insignificant in terms of their influence on prices. The 4000 ton gorilla in the room is China and to a lesser extent India and Russia. China has been accumulating Gold and probably silver (the name for a bank in China is essentially Silver Company - 银行 yin hang) for several years. It will be China vs the Fed and fiat. If and when China decides it's time to flex its financial muscles, it will announce that its current reserves have increased by x000 tons and USD will begin its death rattle. I'm not sure i want to be around when it happens but at least we will be able to say we saw history in action. For me, gold and btc are complementary: PMs for the older generations and BTC for the more technically savvy. I went out for dinner with a chinese girl last night and talked about economics for a while. She said her mother (mega rich) had bought a stash of physical gold in the past few months. I asked her about bitcoins and she said her mother had heard of it but wouldn't trust it if she couldn't hold it.
legendary
Activity: 1162
Merit: 1007
September 08, 2014, 12:00:32 PM

This looks legit, but I'm in awe.  The video was uploaded by the official PayPal YouTube account, and it clearly says "we can spend bitcoin with a tap" at 0:09.    

I want to believe but I'm going to need confirmation.  This would be huge.  But perhaps everyone's positioning themselves to ride the coat tails of the media attention that mobile payments are going to receive when Apple unveils its new payment system.  Bitcoin adoption by PayPal is more edgy than an iWallet, so perhaps they hope to steal some of the spotlight.  
legendary
Activity: 1904
Merit: 1002
September 08, 2014, 11:58:00 AM
So, if we ignore for a minute, the properties of gold that make it less attractive than bitcoin, and purely focus on the limited nature of each one; Why isn't gold acting as a store of value in a QE economy? Why is it not guaranteed profit to take out a huge low interest loan, and buy gold?

If there is an answer to that, why doesn't it apply to bitcoin?

Gold truly is the barbarous relic. It can be shorted to hell with naked contracts (big banks can sell what they don't own) and it is very inefficient in the digital age. How can it compete with instant and cheap value transfers like bitcoin (for which naked short selling does not currently exist)?

As we've said before, bitcoin is assuming the position historically held by gold. Bitcoin is Gold's Black Swan. Just remember to take possession of your private keys.

Appreciate the response Steve. To delve a little deeper, I realize that gold is a "barbarous relic" and inconvenient to use, which is why I was ignoring those facets for this particular comparison. Surely a clumsy, less efficient, hassle of a commodity will still rise in value relative to a paper currency issued in unlimited supply?

If naked shorts really are the answer to what keeps gold value in check, then my next question would be what keeps bitcoin protected from entities offering naked short selling? I realize that if everyone acts responsibly, that won't be a possibility, but that's never happened before, so I'm not counting on it.

Also, just to clarify a bit, I wasn't trying to compare gold to bitcoin, I believe bitcoin is superior in this role. I was comparing each to dollars, and wondering how we can expect bitcoin to clear the hurdles that gold failed to do, when they are both using the same approach.

It is much easier to demand delivery of Bitcoin, or at least proof of reserves.
legendary
Activity: 1764
Merit: 1002
September 08, 2014, 11:46:20 AM
silver criticality incoming.

first critical breach is $19 for psychological reasons.  then 18.70, finally 18.17.

first breach accomplished
hero member
Activity: 614
Merit: 500
September 08, 2014, 11:43:08 AM

If I remember it right, Wordpress accepting bitcoin killed the decline around November 2012 and sparked a major rally. Are we seeing the same thing play out now but on a larger scale?

it's ludicrous for ppl to think merchant additions is bearish b/c of the immediate conversion to fiat.  yes, this "apparent" relationship is gonna flip in a vicious way for those banking on it.  the addition of Paypal will be huge for Bitcoin as it essentially integrates/envelops/takesover/gobbles its biggest pure digital currency competitor.

If COIN were to exist, we would've seen a guaranteed 10% jump up in price considering the current stock market. If the paypal news is true, this could be a buying opportunity of the decade.
legendary
Activity: 1764
Merit: 1002
September 08, 2014, 11:36:48 AM

If I remember it right, Wordpress accepting bitcoin killed the decline around November 2012 and sparked a major rally. Are we seeing the same thing play out now but on a larger scale?

it's ludicrous for ppl to think merchant additions is bearish b/c of the immediate conversion to fiat.  yes, this "apparent" relationship is gonna flip in a vicious way for those banking on it.  the addition of Paypal will be huge for Bitcoin as it essentially integrates/envelops/takesover/gobbles its biggest pure digital currency competitor.
legendary
Activity: 896
Merit: 1001
September 08, 2014, 11:35:22 AM
So, if we ignore for a minute, the properties of gold that make it less attractive than bitcoin, and purely focus on the limited nature of each one; Why isn't gold acting as a store of value in a QE economy? Why is it not guaranteed profit to take out a huge low interest loan, and buy gold?

If there is an answer to that, why doesn't it apply to bitcoin?

Gold truly is the barbarous relic. It can be shorted to hell with naked contracts (big banks can sell what they don't own) and it is very inefficient in the digital age. How can it compete with instant and cheap value transfers like bitcoin (for which naked short selling does not currently exist)?

As we've said before, bitcoin is assuming the position historically held by gold. Bitcoin is Gold's Black Swan. Just remember to take possession of your private keys.

Appreciate the response Steve. To delve a little deeper, I realize that gold is a "barbarous relic" and inconvenient to use, which is why I was ignoring those facets for this particular comparison. Surely a clumsy, less efficient, hassle of a commodity will still rise in value relative to a paper currency issued in unlimited supply?

If naked shorts really are the answer to what keeps gold value in check, then my next question would be what keeps bitcoin protected from entities offering naked short selling? I realize that if everyone acts responsibly, that won't be a possibility, but that's never happened before, so I'm not counting on it.

Also, just to clarify a bit, I wasn't trying to compare gold to bitcoin, I believe bitcoin is superior in this role. I was comparing each to dollars, and wondering how we can expect bitcoin to clear the hurdles that gold failed to do, when they are both using the same approach.
FNG
hero member
Activity: 588
Merit: 500
September 08, 2014, 11:35:02 AM
i'm convinced gold is heading lower.  this is why i have my Bitcoin longs hedged with gold and silver shorts.  this is taking the pain out of the current Bitcoin decline. 

if Bitcoin turns up, i'll be hitting on both cylinders.
All of it hedged? Scary thought. So much value will flow from the USD into un-printable assets (Gold and BTC)
hero member
Activity: 614
Merit: 500
September 08, 2014, 11:32:36 AM

If I remember it right, Wordpress accepting bitcoin killed the decline around November 2012 and sparked a major rally. Are we seeing the same thing play out now but on a larger scale?
legendary
Activity: 1764
Merit: 1002
September 08, 2014, 11:32:31 AM
silver back under 19
legendary
Activity: 1764
Merit: 1002
September 08, 2014, 11:32:06 AM
Hammer Time
legendary
Activity: 1764
Merit: 1002
September 08, 2014, 11:24:19 AM
legendary
Activity: 1764
Merit: 1002
September 08, 2014, 11:17:20 AM
i'm convinced gold is heading lower.  this is why i have my Bitcoin longs hedged with gold and silver shorts.  this is taking the pain out of the current Bitcoin decline. 

if Bitcoin turns up, i'll be hitting on both cylinders.
legendary
Activity: 1764
Merit: 1002
September 08, 2014, 11:12:37 AM
are we putting in a reversal candle today?

legendary
Activity: 1764
Merit: 1002
September 08, 2014, 11:10:40 AM
what we should see here first, before Wall St's arrival, is a RunToBitcoin from the goldbugs.  then the big Wall St rush will come.
legendary
Activity: 1764
Merit: 1002
legendary
Activity: 1764
Merit: 1002
September 08, 2014, 11:02:27 AM
It is probably becoming another good time to purchase precious metals.   In the long term, there is almost no logical way that precious metals will not appreciate.   As the USD (and other currencies) get further and further inflated, precious metals will have to go up (hopefully along with BTC)

here you go.  gold, no way:

legendary
Activity: 1764
Merit: 1002
September 08, 2014, 11:01:31 AM
It is probably becoming another good time to purchase precious metals.   In the long term, there is almost no logical way that precious metals will not appreciate.   As the USD (and other currencies) get further and further inflated, precious metals will have to go up (hopefully along with BTC)

gold can't go up while we're experiencing deflation and especially when the USD is ramping.
legendary
Activity: 1764
Merit: 1002
September 08, 2014, 11:00:28 AM
oh Lordy:

legendary
Activity: 1456
Merit: 1001
This is the land of wolves now & you're not a wolf
September 08, 2014, 10:59:04 AM
It is probably becoming another good time to purchase precious metals.   In the long term, there is almost no logical way that precious metals will not appreciate.   As the USD (and other currencies) get further and further inflated, precious metals will have to go up (hopefully along with BTC)
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