Topic: Goliath Miner - page 4. (Read 10813 times)

Well I can't argue with anything you said and it makes sense.

I wish you the best of luck!

The short answer is we don't have to be successful in selling kit as such our own mining activities with these products will make us much more than making and selling hardware. Bitcoin is also not our main business so also a reason not to offer silly prices. No point doing it if we don't make money or worse make a loss. Kit like this does cost more to make than simple small boards and you have the choice to go with what you think works best. What we are doing is simply opening what we are doing it up to other people.

You might disagree but there trends from both Avalon and BFL towards dearer hardware I might suggest that they don't make money making the hardware at the what I will call the silly prices they have been offering. On the surface they are both starting to look more like semiconductor manufacturers than equipment producers. The newer entrants to the market I might suggest that they have not costed things properly and will end up making a loss and ultimate will probably go out of business. It is easy to get caught in the glitz of Bitcoin and not base what you are doing as a business on hard logic and analysis.

You might also ask why Avalon is supposedly mining with equipment before shipping. I would suggest that is so they actual make money and not lose money on equipment sales. Same comment has been made about BFL in the past.

I suppose 1 H/s in August is worth 2-3 1 H/s in December... (Or March... Or whenever...)

He is up against the same challenges, all he has is a design, Without $360k worth of chips on order 2 months ago, this has no chance of getting anywhere.   You can't charge 250% more that the competition no matter what, you may be able to charge 150-200% if you could ship today

Incompetency of competition, I recon.

Ok I admire your honesty.

You also realize that apart from the USB Block Erupter things, your cost per GH is the highest of anyone per GH by a factor of more than double (closer to triple)?

BFL is $45 to $55 a GH
Terrahash is $50 to $55
KNC Miner is $20 to $35

So how do you expect to be successful?

That is a close enough number.

If the CM4 uses Avalon chips, counting the chips on the drawing I see 40Gh on the board.

Just for the board it is $4800 US which is $120 per GH not including other boards, fans, controllers etc.

So easily $130 per GH?

Is that a fair assessment?

Happy to see there will be a minimal build option @ ~$5200 for 1 CM3 board and 1 controller. Will wait for more details.

There are a few optional items that we have not costed as yet the main ones being add-on fans for single boards, water cooling options, small cases etc.

The slave Controller will have a small FPGA mainly used as buffering. The initial master controller will have a bought in ARM A9 module paired with a FPGA for buffering and functional acceleration. It is possible poth CM3/4 could be used as USB style boards if Controller firmware is suitable. We won't promise that as an initial function but it is on our list of features we want.

The number of CM4s in a rack is primarily set by the height of the Controller that sits in a vertical DIMM socket and the cooling solution. At the moment we are targeting 8 boards in a rack but 9 or 10 might be possible. More details on that as we get the design pulled together. The initial cooling design will use the same heatsinks found on CM1 but water cooling is the target for high density racks later on.

The connection of boards is a bit like what we did on CM1 except we have a lot more wires to play with and we can run LVDS as well. The daisy chain will really only be limited by the Controller processing power and as yet we don't have good enough numbers other than we think we are ok for 8 boards. Because the controller can be changed we have got a planned "upgrade" path where higher performance controllers could be designed and fitted later if needed. Obviously we could also use more master controllers as well if needed in a rack.

Ok minimum startup could be using a 1 x CM4 outside a rack like CM1. We might be even able to stack the same way. That is TBC. You will need a Controller and power supply. Almost certainly an ATX PSU as inital power budget per card is 60A at 12V. That may vary with the performance delivered so may be a little less or a little more. These numbers are interpolations from Cairnsmore2 testing. CM4 will have its 12V segmented into 2 or 3 sections to help with how PSU get wired up to the boards and shared between boards.

We are in negotiation for PSU supply but the option will be there for customers to reuse their own or buy locally to keep freight cost down. We may end up with a higher current PSU and less of them in a rack but that element is still in design so not finally fixed.

We will talk a bit more about the detail of CM4 nearer the release. The main thing is that we will guarantee the price per GH/s Bitcoin hashing delivered. That gives us some room to vary how we implement that hashing power. We know everyone wants to know the detail but we are still sorting out a number of things commercially and design wise so please bear with us on the CM4. CM3 is much more straight forward but we still have a little development there to get it all going. It obviously will only do Bitcoin mining and that is both a plus and a negative and hence a reason for doing CM4. Going beyond all of these we hope to expand what we do in these systems with CM5 and CM6 and so on but that is for after August.

Definitely good to see you Yohan come forward with this.

I'll look forward to see all your variants you end up doing (smaller ones?).
Then I'll probably become a repeat customer (still use 2 CM1's).

BTW, ATX power supply 80A 

Thats 17 kW using 220V

Does it really use so much power for 300 GH/s ?

spiccioli

+1 HERE HERE!

Can we direct ship you 10K in chips for discount runs?

BTW,

what kind of chip is used on a CM4?

spiccioli

Errhm... I'm having trouble understanding what I need. If I'd want to put together the smallest/cheapest
CM4-miner, what exactly would I need to order?

CM4 board obviously.
Master controller, I think.
Full rack , I think.
How many ATX power supplies and power distribution panels?

Then if I'd like to expand with one more CM4 board:
CM4 board (obviously)
Controller pass through and master-slave ribbon cable, I think.
How many ATX power supplies and power distribution panels?

Then how many times can I add one CM4 board until the rack is full?

How much power will one system with one CM4 board use?

So nice that whatever questions I want to ask has been asked!
Thanks everyone 

Afternoon yohan Can you tell me what the difference is for the CM 3 and CM4 boards please as theirs no price difference.

Q1  can you tell me what PSU is used for the £150 price  is this for an atx 80+ 1200w PSU?

Q2  can you tell me of what items I will need in order of have a system up and running. I am assuming that 1x Rack at 3k is the actual racks with the chips on that is the module that goes into the rack to mine with etc?

Q3 Can you tell me if I need both sub rack and full-rack to begin with?

Is the full rack to add 9 or more modules to it and the sub-rack an extinction of this to add even more later on details please as am confused  ?

Can you maybe brake down each item of what each one does and compares ie like CM 3 CM4

Sorry for all the questions the details are confusing to me.

There are rack prices and individual board prices. We annoucnced initially a whole rack price with 8 CM3s. Each CM3 has 144 Avalon chips which if Avalon datasheet is correct gives 40,608 MH/s per board. Until we have a full rack system up and running we won't have exact performance numbers.

Prices don't include VAT if that applies. VAT usually only applies to EU customers.

The CM3 will need a Controller fitted (DIMM socket - master or slave parts as appropriate) as well as 12V, 3.3V and 5V applied. Internet can plug in at Ethernet.

The complete price does include if we supply the Avalon chip. However we only have a very limited supply so it really needs customer supply in the short term unless we are able to buy any from people that have them. That is partly why CM4 is launching at the same time as we have a better chip supply for it.  

Hi,

CM3 Board = USD$3800

This price is BYO Avalon chips? or Chips included?

And this can hash on it's own (apart from PSU and Internet) and does not require additional items?

Thanks,
QG