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Topic: GREAT NEWS FOR VIRTUAL CURRENCIES from Liberty Reserve Press Conference (Read 9046 times)

legendary
Activity: 1736
Merit: 1006
In the future...pick a covenant and stick with it.  You're quoting from two different covenants as if they are one and the same.  You are either under the law or under Grace, but not both.  

"Think not that I am come to destroy the law, or the prophets: I am not come to destroy, but to fulfil."

- Mathew 5:17

legendary
Activity: 1148
Merit: 1018
Gotta love "It's about sharing". I'm feeling you, bro!  Wink

And I gotta say that I had pretty much the same experiences you are describing with many of my acquaintances. Give them some time, and you will see how they start flooding you with money to buy them BTC. I bet your lady friend it's going good to be the first one. 
legendary
Activity: 2156
Merit: 1393
You lead and I'll watch you walk away.
That's exactly who you want to be interested in it and who you can trust to be honest about their belief. You want the average citizen not the government workers that lie to the citizenry daily to serve their needs.
legendary
Activity: 1442
Merit: 1000
Antifragile
If Robert S. Mueller, Director of the FBI, and Secretary Janet Napolitano of Homeland Security made a statement claiming that they had no problem with Bitcoin specifically as a system then you could be excited. The term "Virtual Currency" is too generic. Having some little fudwinkle under secretary nobody claiming that they have no problem with a generic concept and supporting advances in consumer technology doesn't say much about the way the US government is really going to react.

Alcohol was illegal in the U.S., then it was illegal, then the people went apeshit and it became legal again. The way to get support for anything in the U.S. is to get overwhelming support of the people. It can be really difficult to do like the civil rights struggle or gay marriage but it can be done. The last thing you want to focus on is what some two faced double speak politician says about anything because his opinion and actions will spin around like a leaf in a river.

Come on. This is not a court of law, it was a press conference.
BTC is THE virtual currency. It is clear to anyone these days. Let's call a spade a spade here.

The ECB published this: http://www.ecb.europa.eu/pub/pdf/other/virtualcurrencyschemes201210en.pdf
It is a paper on Virtual Currencies that is 53 pages long. BTC is mentioned 185 times. Can we accept the The European Central Bank and the American FED are kind of seeing eye to eye? I mean is it fair to think they are mostly talking about Bitcoin? Or maybe they are talking about Amazon Coins?  Grin   Maybe an alternative Cryptocurrency? Litecoin, PPCoin, Huh?

Interesting anecdotal story: I met with an employer today regarding some work in a bank (she is not in that industry) and we got to talking about banking as I had some stock market trading experience on my resume. She goes on to ask me if I am still in the stock market. I said, "No, not really but I am am very interested in crypto currencies". I didn't want to say Bitcoin! eheheh. I wanted to see her reaction to that word. She is clearly not wise in the world of finance or internet. Anyway, she says "Oh, like Bitcoin?" and I just started laughing. Also was funny in that the moment I got a call from her last week or so, I was on my Computer and mentioned to her the Japanese Nikkei is down 7%. Well, meeting her today, when we got to talking about banking, I noted to her that it was down again by 5%". During my interview I spoke half about Bitcoin - because she was interested. She ended up maybe wanting to buy some. I have talked about Bitcoin to a few customers and one has already bought and a few others are thinking about it. Spread the word...

I then showed her what I carry around in my wallet, which I will be sure to use at the bank I will be doing some PT work at. It will make for great conversation, I promise - Get yourself one (They are also great gifts given along side a BTC paper wallet):





sr. member
Activity: 252
Merit: 250
Lol as long as you have to pay your debts and taxes in dollars it doesn't mean jackshit to them if you use buttcoins

Just as long as you pay taxes and debts.. if you don't.. you go jail Cheesy Cheesy
hero member
Activity: 577
Merit: 500
I don`t see any good new for Bitcoin  Huh
Only for the funny money printed by the Feds or Virtual Currencies backed by the FED Angry
legendary
Activity: 2156
Merit: 1393
You lead and I'll watch you walk away.
If Robert S. Mueller, Director of the FBI, and Secretary Janet Napolitano of Homeland Security made a statement claiming that they had no problem with Bitcoin specifically as a system then you could be excited. The term "Virtual Currency" is too generic. Having some little fudwinkle under secretary nobody claiming that they have no problem with a generic concept and supporting advances in consumer technology doesn't say much about the way the US government is really going to react.

Alcohol was illegal in the U.S., then it was illegal, then the people went apeshit and it became legal again. The way to get support for anything in the U.S. is to get overwhelming support of the people. It can be really difficult to do like the civil rights struggle or gay marriage but it can be done. The last thing you want to focus on is what some two faced double speak politician says about anything because his opinion and actions will spin around like a leaf in a river.
sr. member
Activity: 252
Merit: 250


Well said. It is being spelled out for us and even then, FUD'ers want to spin it negatively. "Maybe it was Amazon Coin or the like". (Not to pick on that one example). CoinFuder is the king of this. He wants to make money with BitCoin and cares less about the bigger implications. You reap what you sow... Blind trust? If they lie they lie, but we have to go forward. Don't live in fear people, that gives up your power.

We got a break guys, they want us to follow CURRENT regulations. This doesn't mean we are kissing AZZ. Anything new that comes up will have to be met from a position of power, which we are in.

Yeah, spin that SUBMISSION.   Grin  Glad to see you guys coming around to support and compliance of the law.  There's hope yet.  Wink
sr. member
Activity: 252
Merit: 250

Speaking of which...

"Each one must give as he has decided in his heart,
not reluctantly or under compulsion,
for God loves a cheerful giver."
2 Corinthians 9:7

Is it lawful to pay taxes to Caesar, or not? Should we pay them, or should we not?” 15 But, knowing their hypocrisy, he said to them, “Why put me to the test? Bring me a denarius[d] and let me look at it.” 16 And they brought one. And he said to them, “Whose likeness and inscription is this?” They said to him, “Caesar's.” 17 Jesus said to them, “Render to Caesar the things that are Caesar's, and to God the things that are God's.” -Mark 15-17

Quote
"Do not pervert justice;
do not show partiality to the poor
or favoritism to the strong,
but judge your neighbor fairly."
Leviticus 19:15

"Sell your possessions and give to those in need. This will store up treasure for you in heaven! And the purses of heaven never get old or develop holes. Your treasure will be safe; no thief can steal it and no moth can destroy it. -Luke 12:33

Quote
"You shall not go after the majority to do evil.
Neither shall you testify in a matter in court
to incline after the majority to pervert justice."
Exodus 23:2

But small is the gate and narrow the road that leads to life, and only a few find it. -Matt 4:17

In the future...pick a covenant and stick with it.  You're quoting from two different covenants as if they are one and the same.  You are either under the law or under Grace, but not both.  
full member
Activity: 182
Merit: 100
1Kgyk4nQSzb3Pm9E9vWiGVyJ6jpPwripKf
great news for bitcoin. they know going after bitcoin is a wast of time so they are just going to control money going in and out of it. this will be regulated like cash. Bitcoin is being excepted
sr. member
Activity: 658
Merit: 250
i am not giving to fear, i am in this , i just think there is a good chance one(some) of us will end up in jail or with $250,000 fine after being found guilty of something, like Jammie Thomas-Rasset (see link below)
jury's in the US do as they are told, they are made up of sheep and the government has trained US Citizens to believe they must convict people of whatever prosecutors put before them

it comes down to the almighty dollar, if the mega corporations think they will lose profits from this cryptocurrency, they will use their control of the governments to try and stop it

http://www.cnn.com/2009/CRIME/06/18/minnesota.music.download.fine/
legendary
Activity: 1442
Merit: 1000
Antifragile
Quote
Those offering virtual currencies must comply with these regulatory requirements and if they do so they have nothing to fear...

...and what are those regulatory requirements?

Quote
a person that creates units of convertible virtual currency and sells those units to another person for real currency or its equivalent is engaged in transmission to another location and is a money transmitter.

So hey, as long as all the miners register as money transmitters, they have nothing to fear!

and Fobot...

The regulatory requirements have BASICALLY been set by FinCen. No, they are not clear but it gives us something to work with. Current regulations, not future. Again, we are in a position of power. Don't give in to fear.

I don't think the miner thing is clear. That sure is bothersome. But we got to move forward. See good news as good news and don't lump it all as bad. That is unfair.
legendary
Activity: 1442
Merit: 1000
Antifragile
Listen from around the 27:30 minute on.

Some VERY notable extracts:

Quote
I want to make clear that today's actions does not mean that we are against virtual currencies
Quote
To the contrary, mobile and internet based financial technologies, including virtual currencies, have great promise to empower consumers, to encourage the development of innovative financial products and expand access to financial services. In fact FinCen issued guidance in March 2013 to bring clarity and regulatory certainty to businesses and individuals....

Quote
Those offering virtual currencies must comply with these regulatory requirements and if they do so they have nothing to fear...

This is pretty damn good news guys...

You've cherry picked. This is an ex-script from the same video...

...27:06 "[...] was used because of the anonymity it offers. Liberty Reserve thus threatens the financial system by facilitating anonymous transactions among cyber criminals ultimately involving more traditional financial institutions where so called Liberty Reserve dollars are converted into US Dollars. Liberty Reserve also threatens the US financial system by providing financial services to the developers and purchasers of financial malware [...]"

Replace "Liberty Reserve dollars" with "Bitcoins" and "traditional financial institutions" with "exchanges (Mt Gox et al)" and suddenly, the pictures not quite so rosy.  

Your experience may differ, but subjectively no where in that video does it hint at endorsement of Bitcoin. And if you were to take Liberty Reserve as the model and apply it to the current BTC world, most of the current Bitcoin businesses fall afoul of US (read: Western global) anti money laundering regulations.




Two points:

1.  Seem odd to suddenly be offering blind trust to a government after years of building an ideology on the basis the same government is untrustworthy.   Huh   I guess they are ok when they say what you want?  Not so good when they don't?  

2.  ...27:06 "[...] [Bitcoin]was used because of the anonymity it offers. Liberty Reserve [Bitcoin]thus threatens the financial system by facilitating anonymous transactions among cyber criminals ultimately involving more traditional financial institutions where so called Liberty Reserve dollars [Bitcoins] are converted into US Dollars. Liberty Reserve [Bitcoin] also threatens the US financial system by providing financial services to the developers and purchasers of financial malware [...]"

Not hard to swap the names and drop the hammer.  If anything, it's another telegraphed warning at Bitcoin.  Didn't see this part initially when the news broke.  Very telling IMO.  

FUD?  Maybe.

You don't "telegraph warnings" to a p2p protocol.

But there is a clear message to exchanges - they want their voice to be heard.

Everything else in your post is FUD of the dullest kind.

Well said. It is being spelled out for us and even then, FUD'ers want to spin it negatively. "Maybe it was Amazon Coin or the like". (Not to pick on that one example). CoinFuder is the king of this. He wants to make money with BitCoin and cares less about the bigger implications. You reap what you sow... Blind trust? If they lie they lie, but we have to go forward. Don't live in fear people, that gives up your power.

We got a break guys, they want us to follow CURRENT regulations. This doesn't mean we are kissing AZZ. Anything new that comes up will have to be met from a position of power, which we are in.
newbie
Activity: 46
Merit: 0
Yeah, but I think to them virtual currency means AmazonCoin and Terrance and Phillips MintChip not Bitcoin. They are looking for money laundering. Don't you suppose they are at least a little concerned with tumblers and that Bitcoin is the payment system of choice for SR.  Don't be naïve.

Read http://www.ieee-security.org/TC/SP2013/papers/4977a080.pdf -- if they wanted to shutdown SR they could tomorrow using vulns in Tor.
sr. member
Activity: 440
Merit: 251
If you think that taxes have anything to do with with being generous you're incredibly naive.

Oh spare me the libertarian bible thumping.   Roll Eyes

Speaking of which...

"Each one must give as he has decided in his heart,
not reluctantly or under compulsion,
for God loves a cheerful giver."
2 Corinthians 9:7

"Do not pervert justice;
do not show partiality to the poor
or favoritism to the strong,
but judge your neighbor fairly."
Leviticus 19:15

"You shall not go after the majority to do evil.
Neither shall you testify in a matter in court
to incline after the majority to pervert justice."
Exodus 23:2
hero member
Activity: 770
Merit: 566
fractally
Legally speaking, words mean nothing or anything depending on how you look at it.
legendary
Activity: 1736
Merit: 1006
Quote
Those offering virtual currencies must comply with these regulatory requirements and if they do so they have nothing to fear...

...and what are those regulatory requirements?

Quote
a person that creates units of convertible virtual currency and sells those units to another person for real currency or its equivalent is engaged in transmission to another location and is a money transmitter.

So hey, as long as all the miners register as money transmitters, they have nothing to fear!

Bitcoins are not created by miners. It is a lottery system. The winner gets bitcoins as a reward for solving the math problem. Am I wrong? Legally speaking, I mean.
legendary
Activity: 3038
Merit: 1032
RIP Mommy
"I, (insert practically any American politician's name here) fully support the 2nd Amendment."
/violates civil rights with impunity
sr. member
Activity: 658
Merit: 250
yay! great news! as long as bitcoin fully complies with any and all laws they feel like making up , taxes anyone? how about a nice 25% US National tax on each bitcoin transaction? yay! go government regulations!!
no worries mate! we just have to register all of our wallet addresses with the IRS and they will grant us permission from   Palpatine, Dark Lord of the Sith and Emperor of the Galactic Empire to continue using bitcoin


oh joyous news everyone!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!111111111111111
sr. member
Activity: 252
Merit: 250
When people don't want to use my money to blow giant craters in other peoples' countries for shits and giggles let me know and then I'll share Tongue

So you basically mean never.  Honestly, sounds like a really poor excuse to just be selfish.  Fine by me, but why not just own that without the excuses?   Huh

If you think that taxes have anything to do with with being generous you're incredibly naive.

Oh spare me the libertarian bible thumping.   Roll Eyes
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