Grin Observer - GRN/BTC - Price Movement and Discussion - page 12.

suchmoon

legendary

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https://bpip.org

Quote from: bbc.reporter on November 19, 2019, 09:38:19 PM

The Dragonfly research fellow might have gotten very excited on his research which was already well known from the beginning.

It's amazing how well clickbait works. I'm quite illiterate about Grin but I read a bit about it back in January when it launched and I remember the linkability issue being mentioned in a few places in the documentation. Even without that background knowledge you'd think people would be at least a little bit suspicious and curious if the sky is really falling. But no. Even though a simple google search would show that this was known pretty much since MW was "invented" in 2016.

The linkability of UTXOs (there are no addresses in Grin so "I was able to uncover the exact addresses of senders and recipients" is false right off the bat) doesn't disclose as much as the "researcher" seems to imply and there are ideas how to obfuscate the UTXOs even more. But that's not as exciting as "privacy coin broken".

bbc.reporter

legendary

Activity: 3122

Merit: 1492

Quote from: Hueristic on November 18, 2019, 09:17:40 PM

Quote from: ?? on ??

Just a heads up guys, it is not a good Idea to be Holding right now.

breaking-mimblewimble-privacy-model

Quote from: cAPSLOCK on November 18, 2019, 08:29:47 PM

This is the actual article by the researcher:

https://medium.com/dragonfly-research/breaking-mimblewimble-privacy-model-84bcd67bfe52

Just so you all know and don't get blind sided.

Added:

Here is the rebuttable Dev response.

https://medium.com/p/8063371839b9/responses/show

If I sold then I'm buying back.

However, it is fud. Here is a better article to read on why it is fud.

https://medium.com/grin-mimblewimble/factual-inaccuracies-of-breaking-mimblewimbles-privacy-model-8063371839b9

The Dragonfly research fellow might have gotten very excited on his research which was already well known from the beginning.

RivAngE

full member

Activity: 728

Merit: 169

What doesn't kill you, makes you stronger

Did it drop because people started hypothesizing on a possible tractability issue? I see a good opportunity to buy this dip!

First of all, it's easy to fix: BEAM has added dummy transactions of 0 value when a "block" has too few transactions, making this "attack" impossible. GRIN could implement it as well if needed, though I'm worried about how much larger the blockchain will get with dummy transactions.

Secondly, we're just talking about a user who has purchased GRIN from a KYC service and whom there's a reason to trace (for example because he used them in an illegal trade).
So I wonder... why would a criminal use a KYC service and give their real IDs (like it'd be hard to trick these systems)? If they did not give their real personal information, then the most this hard-to-achieve-attack would reveal would be where did the criminal bought their coins.

Hueristic

legendary

Activity: 3836

Merit: 4969

Doomed to see the future and unable to prevent it

Quote from: ?? on ??

Just a heads up guys, it is not a good Idea to be Holding right now.

breaking-mimblewimble-privacy-model

Quote from: cAPSLOCK on November 18, 2019, 08:29:47 PM

This is the actual article by the researcher:

https://medium.com/dragonfly-research/breaking-mimblewimble-privacy-model-84bcd67bfe52

Just so you all know and don't get blind sided.

Added:

Here is the rebuttable Dev response.

https://medium.com/p/8063371839b9/responses/show

If I sold then I'm buying back.

bbc.reporter

legendary

Activity: 3122

Merit: 1492

Quote from: Cryptotourist on November 17, 2019, 05:49:23 AM

I'm not sure I like the narrative that Satoshi supports or is behind Grin's development donations.

Although this makes sense:

Quote from: bbc.reporter on November 15, 2019, 10:12:29 PM

Transaction security depends on how much is received by miners in a block. When issuance has reached the limit, I reckon paying high fees for secure transactions will only encourage users to use an altcoin. This will also cause miners to leave because the people that pay them have gone and the issuance in the block as payment for them are gone.

This doesn't:

Quote from: bbc.reporter on November 15, 2019, 10:12:29 PM

However, it is a bitcoin replacement. It is a replacement for all cryptocoins that will become insecure when their coin issuances have reached their limit.

You are speculating that in a few years, when 95% of BTC has been mined, somehow Grin will replace it, and all alt coins including BTC will be pegged to Grin?
Or that Grin will be adjusted somehow to act as a 2nd layer solution to BTC?
What happens to BTC/BTC price then is my real question - since you mentioned the word, replacement.

Those quotes' arguments are similar.

It might take longer after all the bitcoins have been mined, however, yes I speculate that Grin will be seen as a replacement for bitcoin for cryptocoin storage and transactions. Grin's monetary policy assures that its security is sustainable.

rocku12345

hero member

Activity: 882

Merit: 518

Quote from: Cryptotourist on November 17, 2019, 05:49:23 AM

I'm not sure I like the narrative that Satoshi supports or is behind Grin's development donations.

Although this makes sense:

Quote from: bbc.reporter on November 15, 2019, 10:12:29 PM

Transaction security depends on how much is received by miners in a block. When issuance has reached the limit, I reckon paying high fees for secure transactions will only encourage users to use an altcoin. This will also cause miners to leave because the people that pay them have gone and the issuance in the block as payment for them are gone.

This doesn't:

Quote from: bbc.reporter on November 15, 2019, 10:12:29 PM

However, it is a bitcoin replacement. It is a replacement for all cryptocoins that will become insecure when their coin issuances have reached their limit.

You are speculating that in a few years, when 95% of BTC has been mined, somehow Grin will replace it, and all alt coins including BTC will be pegged to Grin?
Or that Grin will be adjusted somehow to act as a 2nd layer solution to BTC?
What happens to BTC/BTC price then is my real question - since you mentioned the word, replacement.

Quote from: bbc.reporter on November 16, 2019, 10:35:01 PM

Agreed. However, they also say that Satoshi's wallets hold millions of bitcoins. There will certainly be more 50 bitcoin donations going to Grin's development team hehehehe.

Well, Satoshi's computer mined the first 36k blocks/1.8M BTC, most of them never moved, as commonly accepted.
The donator's mined BTC was the reward for block #94894. Obviously an early miner is involved (01/12/2010), but Satoshi himself?

Strange, Last Active: December 13, 2010

Too many investors are discusing that 50btc donation, but it is not really valuable in a whole sitation of GRIN development.
I don`t know why but the overal quantity of dev`s commits are really poor this autumn.
Maybe right because of that the course of the GRIN coin is so low and not reacting in a big rise even after such news.

Cryptotourist

hero member

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Homo Sapiens Bitcoinerthalensis

I'm not sure I like the narrative that Satoshi supports or is behind Grin's development donations.

Although this makes sense:

Quote from: bbc.reporter on November 15, 2019, 10:12:29 PM

Transaction security depends on how much is received by miners in a block. When issuance has reached the limit, I reckon paying high fees for secure transactions will only encourage users to use an altcoin. This will also cause miners to leave because the people that pay them have gone and the issuance in the block as payment for them are gone.

This doesn't:

Quote from: bbc.reporter on November 15, 2019, 10:12:29 PM

However, it is a bitcoin replacement. It is a replacement for all cryptocoins that will become insecure when their coin issuances have reached their limit.

You are speculating that in a few years, when 95% of BTC has been mined, somehow Grin will replace it, and all alt coins including BTC will be pegged to Grin?
Or that Grin will be adjusted somehow to act as a 2nd layer solution to BTC?
What happens to BTC/BTC price then is my real question - since you mentioned the word, replacement.

Quote from: bbc.reporter on November 16, 2019, 10:35:01 PM

Agreed. However, they also say that Satoshi's wallets hold millions of bitcoins. There will certainly be more 50 bitcoin donations going to Grin's development team hehehehe.

Well, Satoshi's computer mined the first 36k blocks/1.8M BTC, most of them never moved, as commonly accepted.
The donator's mined BTC was the reward for block #94894. Obviously an early miner is involved (01/12/2010), but Satoshi himself?

Strange, Last Active: December 13, 2010

bbc.reporter

legendary

Activity: 3122

Merit: 1492

Quote from: Hueristic on November 16, 2019, 01:23:17 AM

Quote from: ePesoInitiative on November 15, 2019, 06:35:31 PM

The donation is almost half a million dollars in today's Bitcoin price. That is a large sum of money for a donation. Only a large holder of Bitcoin can easily give away anonymously. This tells me that the donor is a very early Bitcoin holder whom is hedging on Grin to be a possible Bitcoin replacement - not really sure though.

That's an extremely small sum for such an extended development timeline not to mention the goal. There will need to be more such infusions over the years.

Agreed. However, they also say that Satoshi's wallets hold millions of bitcoins. There will certainly be more 50 bitcoin donations going to Grin's development team hehehehe.

consideritdone

newbie

Activity: 602

Merit: 0

Grin price move last week has been good https://www.coingecko.com/en/coins/grin

Hueristic

legendary

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Doomed to see the future and unable to prevent it

Quote from: mindrust on November 15, 2019, 12:03:36 PM

Theymos likes the coin a lot. I would say it is theymos. Some people say theymos is satoshi too btw and that's not a far off possibility. We'll see how long it is going to hold its ground with this bandaid. There simply isn't much demand but everything can change so quickly once binance adds it.

Thats Ludicrous.

Quote from: ePesoInitiative on November 15, 2019, 06:35:31 PM

The donation is almost half a million dollars in today's Bitcoin price. That is a large sum of money for a donation. Only a large holder of Bitcoin can easily give away anonymously. This tells me that the donor is a very early Bitcoin holder whom is hedging on Grin to be a possible Bitcoin replacement - not really sure though.

That's an extremely small sum for such an extended development timeline not to mention the goal. There will need to be more such infusions over the years.

bbc.reporter

legendary

Activity: 3122

Merit: 1492

@ePesoInitiative. However, it is a bitcoin replacement. It is a replacement for all cryptocoins that will become insecure when their coin issuances have reached their limit.

Transaction security depends on how much is received by miners in a block. When issuance has reached the limit, I reckon paying high fees for secure transactions will only encourage users to use an altcoin. This will also cause miners to leave because the people that pay them have gone and the issuance in the block as payment for them are gone.

ePesoInitiative

sr. member

Activity: 924

Merit: 260

Quote from: bbc.reporter on November 14, 2019, 09:18:01 PM

Quote from: tyz on November 14, 2019, 07:52:17 AM

Quote from: mindrust on November 14, 2019, 12:49:17 AM

It is $1.56 (+10%) right now. Wasn't this $1 not long ago? Why is the pump? Looks like bulltrap to me tbh but who knows... Maybe grin will lead the next crypto bull run. Grin

The reason of this pump can be explained with a 50 BTC donation by an anonymous Bitcoin veteran. The Bitcoins donated where moved last time in 2010. Some even speculated that it could have been Satoshi, but to be honest, the 50 Bitcoins were send from Coinbase exchange to the address in 2010 and I doubt Satoshi even used Coinbase.

https://www.grin-forum.org/t/donation-to-the-grin-general-fund-nov-11/6446

He was not referring to Coinbase the exchange hehehe. He was saying that the donation came from a coinbase transaction. The 50 donation came directly from one of the early generated coins by an early bitcoin miner.

Charlie Lee is hyping this as a Satoshi donation hehe.

The donation is almost half a million dollars in today's Bitcoin price. That is a large sum of money for a donation. Only a large holder of Bitcoin can easily give away anonymously. This tells me that the donor is a very early Bitcoin holder whom is hedging on Grin to be a possible Bitcoin replacement - not really sure though.

Febo

legendary

Activity: 2744

Merit: 1288

It actually makes total sense for price to pump when donation is done. Donation was more then 1.5% of Grin marketcap. It added the value to the coin. It will help to pay development. All coins that base on donations to general found or have projects that crowdfund them self, should increase in price when such donations or a project gets fully founded. Coins that are founded by stealing from miners with some sort of a tax or premine can only be pumped by market manipulation.

mindrust

legendary

Activity: 3276

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Theymos likes the coin a lot. I would say it is theymos. Some people say theymos is satoshi too btw and that's not a far off possibility. We'll see how long it is going to hold its ground with this bandaid. There simply isn't much demand but everything can change so quickly once binance adds it.

bbc.reporter

legendary

Activity: 3122

Merit: 1492

Quote from: tyz on November 14, 2019, 07:52:17 AM

Quote from: mindrust on November 14, 2019, 12:49:17 AM

It is $1.56 (+10%) right now. Wasn't this $1 not long ago? Why is the pump? Looks like bulltrap to me tbh but who knows... Maybe grin will lead the next crypto bull run. Grin

The reason of this pump can be explained with a 50 BTC donation by an anonymous Bitcoin veteran. The Bitcoins donated where moved last time in 2010. Some even speculated that it could have been Satoshi, but to be honest, the 50 Bitcoins were send from Coinbase exchange to the address in 2010 and I doubt Satoshi even used Coinbase.

https://www.grin-forum.org/t/donation-to-the-grin-general-fund-nov-11/6446

He was not referring to Coinbase the exchange hehehe. He was saying that the donation came from a coinbase transaction. The 50 donation came directly from one of the early generated coins by an early bitcoin miner.

Charlie Lee is hyping this as a Satoshi donation hehe.

Hueristic

legendary

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Doomed to see the future and unable to prevent it

Quote from: RivAngE on November 14, 2019, 05:12:50 PM

Quote from: Hueristic on November 14, 2019, 03:57:36 PM

Quote from: mindrust on November 14, 2019, 12:49:17 AM

It is $1.56 (+10%) right now. Wasn't this $1 not long ago? Why is the pump? Looks like bulltrap to me tbh but who knows... Maybe grin will lead the next crypto bull run. Grin

Looks like its being spun to setup a P&D to me.

https://newslogical.com/charlie-lee-claims-satoshi-nakamoto-recently-donates-50-btc-to-grin/

Let the Devs work in peace and have patience.

It makes sense to see a pump though,
1) Some people are rushing to buy after learning of the support the devs have received,
2) The devs hopefully spend some of the BTC to buy their own coin

However even if they'd trade all 50 BTC to buy GRIN coins, that'd only add 1% to its total market cap!
Hopefully they'll use this donation to pay for personnel or other collaborations and create something awesome which will add value to the network, not just pump the coin. And I believe they won't just P&D the coin, they seem clever enough to know that won't do them any good in the long run.

No-one ever said it was the devs who would P&D, I doubt the devs even have enough coins to dent the market if they dumped. Stop thinking this is a pre mine scam coin guys.

I hope they don't do the bolded (well not until they are ready for prime time) and I don't think they will, as they know the policy better than us and know they can grab m0ar later and they will also know the timing better than any of us here.

BTW if they do they will post it in the spent funds git so we will know so there is that.

RivAngE

full member

Activity: 728

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What doesn't kill you, makes you stronger

Quote from: Hueristic on November 14, 2019, 03:57:36 PM

Quote from: mindrust on November 14, 2019, 12:49:17 AM

It is $1.56 (+10%) right now. Wasn't this $1 not long ago? Why is the pump? Looks like bulltrap to me tbh but who knows... Maybe grin will lead the next crypto bull run. Grin

Looks like its being spun to setup a P&D to me.

https://newslogical.com/charlie-lee-claims-satoshi-nakamoto-recently-donates-50-btc-to-grin/

Let the Devs work in peace and have patience.

It makes sense to see a pump though,
1) Some people are rushing to buy after learning of the support the devs have received,
2) The devs hopefully spend some of the BTC to buy their own coin

However even if they'd trade all 50 BTC to buy GRIN coins, that'd only add 1% to its total market cap!
Hopefully they'll use this donation to pay for personnel or other collaborations and create something awesome which will add value to the network, not just pump the coin. And I believe they won't just P&D the coin, they seem clever enough to know that won't do them any good in the long run.

Hueristic

legendary

Activity: 3836

Merit: 4969

Doomed to see the future and unable to prevent it

Quote from: mindrust on November 14, 2019, 12:49:17 AM

It is $1.56 (+10%) right now. Wasn't this $1 not long ago? Why is the pump? Looks like bulltrap to me tbh but who knows... Maybe grin will lead the next crypto bull run. Grin

Looks like its being spun to setup a P&D to me.

https://newslogical.com/charlie-lee-claims-satoshi-nakamoto-recently-donates-50-btc-to-grin/

Let the Devs work in peace and have patience.

tyz

legendary

Activity: 3360

Merit: 1533

Quote from: mindrust on November 14, 2019, 12:49:17 AM

It is $1.56 (+10%) right now. Wasn't this $1 not long ago? Why is the pump? Looks like bulltrap to me tbh but who knows... Maybe grin will lead the next crypto bull run. Grin

The reason of this pump can be explained with a 50 BTC donation by an anonymous Bitcoin veteran. The Bitcoins donated where moved last time in 2010. Some even speculated that it could have been Satoshi, but to be honest, the 50 Bitcoins were send from Coinbase exchange to the address in 2010 and I doubt Satoshi even used Coinbase.

https://www.grin-forum.org/t/donation-to-the-grin-general-fund-nov-11/6446

mindrust

legendary

Activity: 3276

Merit: 2442

It is $1.56 (+10%) right now. Wasn't this $1 not long ago? Why is the pump? Looks like bulltrap to me tbh but who knows... Maybe grin will lead the next crypto bull run. Grin

Topic: Grin Observer - GRN/BTC - Price Movement and Discussion - page 12. (Read 19746 times)