Having Trouble With Electrum Wallet Recovery

nc50lc

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Quote from: rocnogu on December 05, 2023, 04:08:06 PM

Quote from: nc50lc on November 05, 2023, 11:14:01 PM

-snip-

I tried changing the seed words a bit to see if I did a spelling mistake, but then I can't create a wallet.
I am guessing, after all, there is some brute force protection.

It's the computed invalid "seed version number" that's preventing you to create a wallet from an edited electrum seed phrase.
Electrum has an integrity check that the version number has to match any of the available reserved number for each Electrum wallet types (2FA, Standard, SegWit)

Since your unedited seed phrase is valid as "SegWit", you can rule-out the you've made a typo during backup.
(unless you're very unlucky that a mistyped seed phrase produced a valid version number)
The issue is could be for a different wallet file.

Quote from: rocnogu

And there is no way to reclame this funds back?
What happens to such lost coins?

Your seed or private keys aren't saved to any server so the only way to recover it is through the original wallet file or the correct seed phrase.

Lost coins on the other hand will stay in each node's blockchain unspent until someone with the correct private key spends it.
If you found out that it's spent, the actual issue may not be the seed phrase but a fake Electrum or malware.

rocnogu

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Quote from: Z-tight on November 05, 2023, 05:11:40 PM

Quote from: rocnogu on November 05, 2023, 04:16:43 PM

I think you have waaaaaay too good opinion about the community. This is why I said: OceanGate, FTX, Theranos, Wirecard and Enron.
The community thought that all of those are good ideas working perfectly, till... well, google it.

You are talking about centralized services, at least i know of ftx in that list. No member of the community who knows what they are doing would recommend that you store your funds in a centralized service. Electrum is different, it is open source and you run the software locally in your device, you can also verify your download and also verify everything locally if you run your own node, comparing Electrum with some failed centralized services makes zero sense.

Quote from: rocnogu on November 05, 2023, 04:16:43 PM

Again, since I can restore ANY seed, what stops some people from stealing funds?

I find it hard to understand you here, you cannot restore your wallet without the seed phrase, if you have the seed phrase to your wallet, you can always restore it. What stops people from stealing your funds is that it is not possible for them to get your seed phrase or keys, except you expose it, or you use your wallet in an online device and you get hacked and your keys stolen.

Quote from: rocnogu on November 05, 2023, 04:16:43 PM

And again, I do have the right seed. No idea what could go wrong.

Anyhow, I have the TxID, Address, basically all the info for the transaction. I manage to do some "watching only" wallet and I can see the funds.
Is there a way to restore wallet based on this data, assuming I have the wrong seed?
Way to get the right seed? Anything?

If you have the right seed and you have restored the wallet, but you cannot see your funds but a tx sending the funds out, then your funds has probably been sent out by an attacker, post the tx ID here. Some of what you say is hard to understand, it would be better if you can be much clearer, do you see a tx sending the funds to another address, a tx that was not made by you?

I don't really know what all of those things means. Found some info in google and follow the guide.
No idea where exactly are the funds. I can see it, but i don't know if it's I single wallet or part of something or.. Whatever options are possible there.

What is a centralized service? Something like Binance? I guess ill use this from now on.

From the wallet I restored, there are no transactions at all. In or out.

I checked the seed 3 times, saved 3 copies...I'm starting to accept the reality of losing my mind. I guess, I'm going crazy here.

rocnogu

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Quote from: nc50lc on November 05, 2023, 11:14:01 PM

Quote from: rocnogu on November 05, 2023, 04:16:43 PM

Anyhow, I have the TxID, Address, basically all the info for the transaction. I manage to do some "watching only" wallet and I can see the funds.
Is there a way to restore wallet based on this data, assuming I have the wrong seed?
Way to get the right seed? Anything?

Those are already public data stored in every Bitcoin node's blockchain.
If it's possible, then all Bitcoins including those owned by everyone can be "recovered" with that method.

Here's some basic information about how Bitcoin works: learnmeabitcoin.com/beginners/keys_addresses
(you can also go further to "technical" tab to get a deeper understanding on the inner workings of Bitcoin)

Basically,
The data that the wallet needs to own funds is to have the necessary private key(s) to be able to unlock the locking script of those unspent transaction outputs.

As for the seed phrase, the master key that's derived from it (where the private keys are derived from) is computed in a one-way function (HMAC SHA512).
Then from the master private key, the wallet derives the private keys at specific derivation paths (check in each address info in the addresses tab).
By having the wrong seed phrase, the wallet will derive an entirely different master key that'll derive a different set of private keys to addresses.

Then using the info in the link above, you can see that it's not possible to get the private key from the address or public key since it's the very nature why Bitcoin is secure.
And lastly, the transaction's data doesn't contain anything that'll reveal the private key.

Quote from: Z-tight on November 05, 2023, 05:11:40 PM

If you have the right seed and you have restored the wallet, but you cannot see your funds but a tx sending the funds out, then your funds has probably been sent out by an attacker

He said in first page that the restored wallet is empty.

Yeah. It did not make sense to me to be possible recovery, but had to ask.

Yes, the wallet from the seed I have is empty.
I still can't figure out what went wrong.

I tried changing the seed words a bit to see if I did a spelling mistake, but then I can't create a wallet.
I am guessing, after all, there is some brute force protection.
So, I track it all with the transfer ID, now I can watch the funds..... so far and yet so close....
Well, lesson learned

And there is no way to reclame this funds back?
What happens to such lost coins?

nc50lc

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Quote from: rocnogu on November 05, 2023, 04:16:43 PM

Anyhow, I have the TxID, Address, basically all the info for the transaction. I manage to do some "watching only" wallet and I can see the funds.
Is there a way to restore wallet based on this data, assuming I have the wrong seed?
Way to get the right seed? Anything?

Those are already public data stored in every Bitcoin node's blockchain.
If it's possible, then all Bitcoins including those owned by everyone can be "recovered" with that method.

Here's some basic information about how Bitcoin works: learnmeabitcoin.com/beginners/keys_addresses
(you can also go further to "technical" tab to get a deeper understanding on the inner workings of Bitcoin)

Basically,
The data that the wallet needs to own funds is to have the necessary private key(s) to be able to unlock the locking script of those unspent transaction outputs.

As for the seed phrase, the master key that's derived from it (where the private keys are derived from) is computed in a one-way function (HMAC SHA512).
Then from the master private key, the wallet derives the private keys at specific derivation paths (check in each address info in the addresses tab).
By having the wrong seed phrase, the wallet will derive an entirely different master key that'll derive a different set of private keys to addresses.

Then using the info in the link above, you can see that it's not possible to get the private key from the address or public key since it's the very nature why Bitcoin is secure.
And lastly, the transaction's data doesn't contain anything that'll reveal the private key.

Quote from: Z-tight on November 05, 2023, 05:11:40 PM

If you have the right seed and you have restored the wallet, but you cannot see your funds but a tx sending the funds out, then your funds has probably been sent out by an attacker

He said in first page that the restored wallet is empty.

Z-tight

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Quote from: rocnogu on November 05, 2023, 04:16:43 PM

I think you have waaaaaay too good opinion about the community. This is why I said: OceanGate, FTX, Theranos, Wirecard and Enron.
The community thought that all of those are good ideas working perfectly, till... well, google it.

You are talking about centralized services, at least i know of ftx in that list. No member of the community who knows what they are doing would recommend that you store your funds in a centralized service. Electrum is different, it is open source and you run the software locally in your device, you can also verify your download and also verify everything locally if you run your own node, comparing Electrum with some failed centralized services makes zero sense.

Quote from: rocnogu on November 05, 2023, 04:16:43 PM

Again, since I can restore ANY seed, what stops some people from stealing funds?

I find it hard to understand you here, you cannot restore your wallet without the seed phrase, if you have the seed phrase to your wallet, you can always restore it. What stops people from stealing your funds is that it is not possible for them to get your seed phrase or keys, except you expose it, or you use your wallet in an online device and you get hacked and your keys stolen.

Quote from: rocnogu on November 05, 2023, 04:16:43 PM

And again, I do have the right seed. No idea what could go wrong.

Anyhow, I have the TxID, Address, basically all the info for the transaction. I manage to do some "watching only" wallet and I can see the funds.
Is there a way to restore wallet based on this data, assuming I have the wrong seed?
Way to get the right seed? Anything?

If you have the right seed and you have restored the wallet, but you cannot see your funds but a tx sending the funds out, then your funds has probably been sent out by an attacker, post the tx ID here. Some of what you say is hard to understand, it would be better if you can be much clearer, do you see a tx sending the funds to another address, a tx that was not made by you?

rocnogu

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Quote from: Z-tight on November 01, 2023, 05:44:02 PM

Quote from: rocnogu on October 31, 2023, 10:07:52 AM

Blame it on the user.
...
Electrum is garbage. It doesn't do the one thing it is created to do.

Electrum is open source and you can review the code and verify how the keys were generated, if there was a vulnerability in Electrum, the community would know very quickly. Take note that when you use Electrum wallet, your keys and seed phrase is stored locally in your wallet file and encrypted with a password, if you use your device is an online and unsafe enviroment and lose your funds, it has nothing to do with Electrum, but your opsec. Electrum do not store users' keys or seed phrase.

There was a vulnerability that was exploited in Electrum in the past, but all of that has been patched, i believe that is what you are talking about. Being sour and trolling like you are doing now wouldn't help you recover your funds, it is better to learn about better security practices so that it won't happen again.

Well, yes. One of the new practices is not to use such craps as Electrum.
I think you have waaaaaay too good opinion about the community. This is why I said: OceanGate, FTX, Theranos, Wirecard and Enron.
The community thought that all of those are good ideas working perfectly, till... well, google it.
Again, since I can restore ANY seed, what stops some people from stealing funds?

And again, I do have the right seed. No idea what could go wrong.

Anyhow, I have the TxID, Address, basically all the info for the transaction. I manage to do some "watching only" wallet and I can see the funds.
Is there a way to restore wallet based on this data, assuming I have the wrong seed?
Way to get the right seed? Anything?

rocnogu

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Quote from: khaled0111 on November 04, 2023, 04:52:09 PM

Yeah, the way people react, then being cunts and get same behavior in return.
"Surprised Pikachu face"

Helping doesn't give the right to be a cunt.
Cockwomble i believe is the word.

My mistake is that I trust some retarded app.
Now, I am trying to fix that mistake.
The fact that you people expect everyone using electrum to be an expert in electrum is enough proof of the toxic autistic environment.

Now, it's a different question why some retarded cunt would get offended from criticizing some third side app.
This is some woke level of bullshit, that as a normal human I can't relate to.
So, KARENs, you either try to help because of some virtues, or you are just being a cunt.

If you are not a retarded autistic woke cockwomble idiot cunt, please do help me to understand and maybe restore the wallet.
If not, well, we know what you are. And I am obviously ignoring all of those in the future.

For fuck's sake, the very fact that I have to do this now, is something.

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Quote from: rocnogu on October 31, 2023, 10:07:52 AM

To all this, I can say just few words: OceanGate, FTX, Theranos, Wirecard and Enron
With just a bit googling I found out a lot of people having problem with Electrum and disappearing funds.

Listen, child, you either want to help or you are just babbling around for who knows what reason.
WTF is a block explorer?
Why would you assume everyone knows WTF is going on and how to work with these things.

He was trying to help. So, at least show some respect even he wasn't able to solve your problem.
Sorry, but if you are dealing with cryptocurrencies and you don't even know what a blockexplorers is then I don't know how we can help you!
Stop blaming Electrum for your own.. mistakes.

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Quote from: rocnogu on October 31, 2023, 10:07:52 AM

Listen, child, you either want to help or you are just babbling around for who knows what reason.
WTF is a block explorer?
Why would you assume everyone knows WTF is going on and how to work with these things.

Listen fuckface, no one here is obliged to help you in any way. They do it out of their own goodwill. If you can't respect that, take your problems elsewhere. If you show respect and humility, you get the same back. If you refer to people who are trying to help you as "child", then you should get shit.

You obviously have no idea what you are talking about or what you did, and that's why you are here. You don't know what a block explorer is, what a seed is, or how Electrum works. According to you, it's someone else's fault.

Z-tight

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Quote from: rocnogu on October 31, 2023, 10:07:52 AM

Blame it on the user.
...
Electrum is garbage. It doesn't do the one thing it is created to do.

Electrum is open source and you can review the code and verify how the keys were generated, if there was a vulnerability in Electrum, the community would know very quickly. Take note that when you use Electrum wallet, your keys and seed phrase is stored locally in your wallet file and encrypted with a password, if you use your device is an online and unsafe enviroment and lose your funds, it has nothing to do with Electrum, but your opsec. Electrum do not store users' keys or seed phrase.

Quote from: rocnogu on October 31, 2023, 10:07:52 AM

With just a bit googling I found out a lot of people having problem with Electrum and disappearing funds.

There was a vulnerability that was exploited in Electrum in the past, but all of that has been patched, i believe that is what you are talking about. Being sour and trolling like you are doing now wouldn't help you recover your funds, it is better to learn about better security practices so that it won't happen again.

rocnogu

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Quote from: Z-tight on October 29, 2023, 06:00:52 AM

Quote from: rocnogu on October 27, 2023, 10:28:37 AM

Electrum proves as garbage tho.

I don't know what exactly happened to your wallet, and it is normal when people lose funds because we cannot know how many means of possible attacks your device was exposed to. Take note that Electrum is a well reviewed and recommended wallet, but you also have to ensure you download the right Electrum, use it in a safe enviroment and store your backups safely, if you don't do that and lose your funds, it has nothing to do with Electrum. If you have other coins in different wallets, i believe now is the right time to start learning about opsec and how to keep your money in a very safe enviroment.

Electrum is a well reviewed and recommended wallet, loosing my funds.
Blame it on the user.
This sounds like a religion.
I suffer, because my faith is not strong enough!

Electrum is garbage. It doesn't do the one thing it is created to do.

Quote from: Zaguru12 on October 29, 2023, 06:22:27 AM

Quote from: Z-tight on October 29, 2023, 06:00:52 AM

Quote from: rocnogu on October 27, 2023, 10:28:37 AM

Electrum proves as garbage tho.

I don't know what exactly happened to your wallet, and it is normal when people lose funds because we cannot know how many means of possible attacks your device was exposed to. Take note that Electrum is a well reviewed and recommended wallet, but you also have to ensure you download the right Electrum, use it in a safe enviroment and store your backups safely, if you don't do that and lose your funds, it has nothing to do with Electrum. If you have other coins in different wallets, i believe now is the right time to start learning about opsec and how to keep your money in a very safe enviroment.

I don’t think this whole case of OP has actually anything to do with a restoration of a wrong wallet as we all are guessing, other members have even said he should present the old receiving address or check it using the explorer to check if there are funds actually there, although it would hamper his privacy but in cases like this you can later change your wallet. But OP keeps shying away from this and blames electrum. My biggest guess is the funds were moved to a different address and wallet, if at all the addresses of the wallet OP is get after restoration and the old addresses are the same. And if it is electrum that is not restoring the right wallet which I strongly doubt can ever happen then OP should confirm the details of that address on a block explorer. Although it is frustrating to lose one’s funds but you can’t blame a system that holds multiple of those funds for years with back door

To all this, I can say just few words: OceanGate, FTX, Theranos, Wirecard and Enron
With just a bit googling I found out a lot of people having problem with Electrum and disappearing funds.

Listen, child, you either want to help or you are just babbling around for who knows what reason.
WTF is a block explorer?
Why would you assume everyone knows WTF is going on and how to work with these things.

Zaguru12

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Quote from: Z-tight on October 29, 2023, 06:00:52 AM

Quote from: rocnogu on October 27, 2023, 10:28:37 AM

Electrum proves as garbage tho.

I don't know what exactly happened to your wallet, and it is normal when people lose funds because we cannot know how many means of possible attacks your device was exposed to. Take note that Electrum is a well reviewed and recommended wallet, but you also have to ensure you download the right Electrum, use it in a safe enviroment and store your backups safely, if you don't do that and lose your funds, it has nothing to do with Electrum. If you have other coins in different wallets, i believe now is the right time to start learning about opsec and how to keep your money in a very safe enviroment.

I don’t think this whole case of OP has actually anything to do with a restoration of a wrong wallet as we all are guessing, other members have even said he should present the old receiving address or check it using the explorer to check if there are funds actually there, although it would hamper his privacy but in cases like this you can later change your wallet. But OP keeps shying away from this and blames electrum. My biggest guess is the funds were moved to a different address and wallet, if at all the addresses of the wallet OP is get after restoration and the old addresses are the same. And if it is electrum that is not restoring the right wallet which I strongly doubt can ever happen then OP should confirm the details of that address on a block explorer. Although it is frustrating to lose one’s funds but you can’t blame a system that holds multiple of those funds for years with back door

Z-tight

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Quote from: rocnogu on October 27, 2023, 10:28:37 AM

Electrum proves as garbage tho.

I don't know what exactly happened to your wallet, and it is normal when people lose funds because we cannot know how many means of possible attacks your device was exposed to. Take note that Electrum is a well reviewed and recommended wallet, but you also have to ensure you download the right Electrum, use it in a safe enviroment and store your backups safely, if you don't do that and lose your funds, it has nothing to do with Electrum. If you have other coins in different wallets, i believe now is the right time to start learning about opsec and how to keep your money in a very safe enviroment.

Abdussamad

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Have you compared the addresses in the restored wallet with addresses from the original wallet? Do the addresses begin with the same letters?

You can see all the addresses by going to view menu > check addresses and switch to addresses tab.

nc50lc

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Quote from: rocnogu on October 27, 2023, 10:28:37 AM

Electrum proves as garbage tho.
I was thinking, I can't personally do it, but nothing stops a good programmer to automate wallet creations with random seeds and get random wallets till find one with something inside and just take it.
Since all he has to do is have a valid seed.

Yeah, so as all wallets that use mnemonic phrase backup, this isn't just a problem with Electrum. (Bitcoin Core doesn't use mnemonic)
All the programmer has to do is to wait for his script to find a hit within the 2048^12 range of word combinations, maybe after 5trillion years.

Quote from: rocnogu on October 27, 2023, 10:28:37 AM

There are no profiles in electrum, I assume and no way to get my coins back!

There are profiles (core developers) who are working on Electrum's development here: https://github.com/orgs/spesmilo/people
But they do not have access to every Electrum user's funds, users' master keys are locally saved in the individual's own drive.
There's source code that you may audit to see if it's really the case: https://github.com/spesmilo/electrum

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Quote from: rocnogu on October 27, 2023, 10:28:37 AM

So, I tried to restore the wallet file from the drive, but it's gone. It's nothing there.
I guess, this is it.

Do you mean you can't see the wallet file on the old hdd? If yes then maybe you have accedently deleted it! Try using a good file recovery software and maybe you will get lucky and recover it.

Quote

Electrum proves as garbage tho.

I beg to differ. Electrum is probably one of the most secure SPV wallets out there. Keeping the seed safe and secure is the responsibility of the user.

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Quote from: rocnogu on October 27, 2023, 10:28:37 AM

So, I tried to restore the wallet file from the drive, but it's gone. It's nothing there.

What do you mean by it's gone? Do you see any outgoing transaction?
If that's the case and you didn't make the outgoing transaction, it means that you used a fake version of electrum or your device was compromised. It's also possible that someone had access to your seed phrase. An electrum's seed phrase provides 132 bits of entropy and as mentioned above by satscraper, that's secure enough.

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Quote from: rocnogu on October 27, 2023, 10:28:37 AM

nothing stops a good programmer to automate wallet creations with random seeds and get random wallets till find one with something inside and just take it.

Nope, there is one factor that will stop him and this is a time. The number of guesses he should face to get the correct SEED (2048^12 for 12-words seed and 2048^24 for 24 words) is too big for any realistic computational power even if it were proceed with the task during the lifetime of the whole Universe.

rocnogu

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So, I tried to restore the wallet file from the drive, but it's gone. It's nothing there.
I guess, this is it.

Electrum proves as garbage tho.
I was thinking, I can't personally do it, but nothing stops a good programmer to automate wallet creations with random seeds and get random wallets till find one with something inside and just take it.
Since all he has to do is have a valid seed.

There are no profiles in electrum, I assume and no way to get my coins back!

rocnogu

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Quote from: satscraper on October 21, 2023, 04:11:36 AM

Quote from: rocnogu on October 20, 2023, 09:25:52 AM

I change my computer and tried to recover the electrum wallet with the seed, followed the instructions and.... the wallet is empty.
Any idea what's going on?

Just my guess.

The wallet you have tried to restore might be a 2FA type. If this is a case then restoring it just from SEED will result in getting completely different addresses.

Thus, try to restore your wallet by selecting "Wallet with two-factor authentication" and check the result:

Quote from: https://electrum.readthedocs.io/en/latest/2fa.html

https://www.talkimg.com/images/2023/10/21/TwDnD.png

Looks like you have entered a valid seed of type 'segwit' but this dialog does not support such seeds. If unsure, try restoring as 'Standard wallet'.

Topic: Having Trouble With Electrum Wallet Recovery (Read 517 times)