Topic: How bitcoins get confiscated? - page 2. (Read 3036 times)
It's becoming more and more common that police seizes all computer equipment. A quick check will reveal if there's some kind of BTC software in it (or frequent connections to blockchain.info), and if there's any, they will dig further.
A red-hot soldering bar in the ass of bitcoin holder makes miracles. )))
We are assuming that most modern governments (at least the US) wouldn't use violence/threat of violence to extract information.
At least from what we have heard until now, the seizure of bitcoins has been due to mistakes committed by the holders.
I don't think you know the history of currency confiscation... well, not in North America.
The only one ever in the USA was voluntary, there was no door-to-door confiscation.
It is estimated that only 10% of Americans handed in their gold.
IE: Only 10% of Americans were stupid compared to 40% today.
Confiscation was pitched to people who wanted to help in the war effort but were wealthy and had no offspring to send to war.
The wealthy, obviously, never turned theirs in.
In Cryptos, the same would have to apply; A person would have to willfully hand over their keys or coins.
This means, there wouldn't be cops going door-to-door to confiscate wealth, you'd hand it in yourself.
In other countries, I guess, they'd kill you and steal it or you're not even allowed to own any.
If someone is forced to hand them over, this person could technically never say anything and they'd never find anything.
It's not like a bank where if you don't pay they can garnish your wages and assets.
Also, Gold can be found if you hid it... Gold bullion and nuggets can be found rather easily.
That's why my precious wealth is in both virtual and metallic versions and both are impossible to find.
The only one ever in the USA was voluntary, there was no door-to-door confiscation.
It is estimated that only 10% of Americans handed in their gold.
IE: Only 10% of Americans were stupid compared to 40% today.
Confiscation was pitched to people who wanted to help in the war effort but were wealthy and had no offspring to send to war.
The wealthy, obviously, never turned theirs in.
In Cryptos, the same would have to apply; A person would have to willfully hand over their keys or coins.
This means, there wouldn't be cops going door-to-door to confiscate wealth, you'd hand it in yourself.
In other countries, I guess, they'd kill you and steal it or you're not even allowed to own any.
If someone is forced to hand them over, this person could technically never say anything and they'd never find anything.
It's not like a bank where if you don't pay they can garnish your wages and assets.
Also, Gold can be found if you hid it... Gold bullion and nuggets can be found rather easily.
That's why my precious wealth is in both virtual and metallic versions and both are impossible to find.
It's called asset seizure. The feds coming in and confiscate ALL of your possessions that they can link to your crime. They don't need much any evidence, just a feeling that the property was acquired through ill-gotten means and they take it from you. You do not have a choice. You don't get to "hide some for later". I've watched this happen first hand to a life-long family friend and it's not pretty. They say "You got XYZ by being a bad guy, so we're taking it from you." and there's not really anything you can do about it.
The beauty of blockchain is that no asset sezure gives them access to your bitcoins. They can't get them without your cooperation. If you are tough enough to keep saying "no", despite of threats, rapes and wrenches, you'll keep your bitcoins, all of them.
It all comes down to whether you think you can handle threats like a longer sentence (or maybe even torture). If you have nothing to lose (family etc.), then saying fuck off to the feds will work fine for you. However, if you think you would agree to give up your wallet to get a shorter sentence then a strong password really doesn't help.
The person might not have used a password on the wallet. Even if used, the person must not secure it with weak algorithm or guessable passwords like your cat's name or your mother's name. Usually, the person has to turn over the Bitcoins if not additional charges might get pressed.
Well a good password would help against hacking, but if the goverment forces want to get in and you don't tell your password I assume you would get into trouble anyway? 
It's called asset seizure. The feds coming in and confiscate ALL of your possessions that they can link to your crime. They don't need much any evidence, just a feeling that the property was acquired through ill-gotten means and they take it from you. You do not have a choice. You don't get to "hide some for later". I've watched this happen first hand to a life-long family friend and it's not pretty. They say "You got XYZ by being a bad guy, so we're taking it from you." and there's not really anything you can do about it.
That's just stupid, the burden of proof is on the side of the accusation, if you can prove your stuff was legitimately obtained, it will be returned.
It's called asset seizure. The feds coming in and confiscate ALL of your possessions that they can link to your crime. They don't need much any evidence, just a feeling that the property was acquired through ill-gotten means and they take it from you. You do not have a choice. You don't get to "hide some for later". I've watched this happen first hand to a life-long family friend and it's not pretty. They say "You got XYZ by being a bad guy, so we're taking it from you." and there's not really anything you can do about it.
The majority of cases from digital forensic, but other cases when it is known the individual has the coins I guess it's court mandated or something like that, because if no one knows you have the coins they cannot be confiscated.
Probably it is the best protection.
The majority of cases from digital forensic, but other cases when it is known the individual has the coins I guess it's court mandated or something like that, because if no one knows you have the coins they cannot be confiscated.
Well interesting question... I think it depends on the method you're e.g. arresting someone. If you plan on arresting a person and spy on them, you could just go and transfer the BTC before arresting them. Although I believe the 5 dollar wrench method is the easiest of all. Or just send them to jail... same result.
If a simple password was used to encrypt the wallet / keys then its easy to confiscate, takes a trivial amount of computing power in such case. Many human generated passwords are easy to crack. Also, there is the possibility of a wallet not being encrypted at all like a plain text paper wallet.
I love how some people are oblivious to to reality. Encryption and codes, passwords and secure words or other measures cryptographic tools are not gonna help you really when you will be arrested, dragged to secure location and tortured. And believe it will happen, people are usually think that tortures are something like in the movies, when man is beaten, burned, electrocuted etc. No, not really. Now we have more sophisticated methods of 'asking nicely". Psychological tortures, sleep deprivation, pharmacological agents... It is all our reality, and believe me government would do this to you just to know your passwords. They will also threaten you and your family, tell you that your imprisonment time will be hard like hell if you do not tell them and so on... If you have iron determination and will and you are unbreakable then you can put a passwords on your wallets, but if you think you will break - don't bother.
Is this a discussion about how bitcoin gets stolen or get confiscated? 
I suppose if it's the latter usually the prosecutor will strike a deal with the defendant in any way that if the guys given up his private key to his address, the charges will be lower. Or do it the hard way, make him talk.
I suppose if it's the latter usually the prosecutor will strike a deal with the defendant in any way that if the guys given up his private key to his address, the charges will be lower. Or do it the hard way, make him talk. We are assuming that most modern governments (at least the US) wouldn't use violence/threat of violence to extract information.
And this is wrong assumption. Torture is legally allowed to be used by law enforcement, at least in the US.
The person might not have used a password on the wallet. Even if used, the person must not secure it with weak algorithm or guessable passwords like your cat's name or your mother's name. Usually, the person has to turn over the Bitcoins if not additional charges might get pressed.
Well, it seems that the only secure way to keep your coin is to make them unavailable for yourself. Give the keys to somebody who is out of reach of police, or timelock them for several years time, or something like this.
This is how you confiscate bitcoins:
"You know you are facing 20-25 years, right?! If you co-operate and provide us with your bitcoins we will make sure you only see 5 years in prison. If you don't play ball, we will also charge you with obstruction of justice and that will get you another 10 years".
"You know you are facing 20-25 years, right?! If you co-operate and provide us with your bitcoins we will make sure you only see 5 years in prison. If you don't play ball, we will also charge you with obstruction of justice and that will get you another 10 years".
That is why people should opt for storing their coins in a more secure way. But I suppose its only people running an illegal operation or some big operation, who usually will have to do that.
I am sure Ross would have a lot of more coins stored away somewhere.
We are assuming that most modern governments (at least the US) wouldn't use violence/threat of violence to extract information.
Where did you get that idea from? The US is pretty big on torture all things considered.
simply because those who were arrested did not take all the necessary measure to prevent so, it's a security problem for sure
in some case they probably asked him(in a brutal way) to reveal where his bitcoin are stored
in some case they probably asked him(in a brutal way) to reveal where his bitcoin are stored
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