How Could Bitcoin Evolve? - page 3. | Bitcointalksearch.org

inBitweTrust

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Quote from: kokojie on October 04, 2014, 10:24:29 AM

Exposing how much PoW mining sucks is me taking action. If there's a leech on my leg, sucking my blood, I'm going to try to kill it. It's a difficult fight, because the leech (pow mining) have a numbing effect, so most people (bitcoin holders) are not yet aware their blood is being sucked.

I believe that your intentions are good from talking to you and you really do genuinely believe PoW is a complete waste, but there are other ways of encouraging change within Bitcoin without directly attacking the crucial aspect which defines it. You aren't doing anyone a favor and hurting everyone in doing so. It's one thing to analyze the positive and negative aspects of PoW but you only recognize the negative aspects. There are members who are starting to notice that many people who have moved on with their investments to DPoS /PoS and given up on PoW are now cannibalizing the parent that gave birth to their currency. All Cryptos are extremely fragile and we need to participate in more coopertition than simply making smear campaigns.

inBitweTrust

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Quote from: kokojie on October 04, 2014, 10:30:53 AM

That is fine, I can see very well in this thread, how angry the PoW miner shills get when I try to expose their leeching scheme.

This is absurd, miners aren't making much if any profits. Most miners are taking losses. You would be more honest to suggest that ASIC manufacturers and the clouds they sell, and both green power and dirty power sources are profiting.

kokojie

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Quote from: ?? on ??

Quote from: kokojie on October 04, 2014, 10:24:29 AM

Exposing how much PoW mining sucks is me taking action.

It's about as much action as me responding that you are wrong and that PoW is Bitcoin's best feature.

That is fine, I can see very well in this thread, how angry the PoW miner shills get when I try to expose their leeching scheme.

kokojie

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Quote from: ?? on ??

Quote from: kokojie on October 03, 2014, 06:11:04 PM

Quote from: ?? on ??

Quote from: kokojie on October 03, 2014, 02:23:37 PM

First end PoW mining, otherwise it might not even survive long enough to "evolve".

You certainly are on a mission, aren't you? Just fork it and let the better protocol win.

Why would I do that? I'm a stakeholder of the existing protocol, I am entitled to express my concern regarding the insane PoW expense, which is perpetually sucking value out of my stake in Bitcoin.

The change you are proposing (getting rid of PoW) is a hard fork. If the fork occurs, original stakeholders will have both original PoW bitcoins and new whatever-improvement-you-are-suggesting bitcoins. At that point, the market will most likely pick a winner. It's doubtful that both versions will coexist (although not impossible).

I know that I will be selling any new bitcoins I get from a fork and buying original PoW bitcoins with the proceeds. So, I personally can't wait for someone to fork the protocol for whatever whims strike their fancy (although I doubt the new forked coins will have much, if any, value).

So... express your concerns all you want, but I'd prefer you actually take some action other than posting in every thread about how much PoW sucks. I don't expect that, so I'll see you in the next thread which you hijack on your little crusade.

Exposing how much PoW mining sucks is me taking action. If there's a leech on my leg, sucking my blood, I'm going to try to kill it. It's a difficult fight, because the leech (pow mining) have a numbing effect, so most people (bitcoin holders) are not yet aware their blood is being sucked.

kokojie

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Quote from: jonald_fyookball on October 03, 2014, 08:26:24 PM

Quote from: kokojie on October 03, 2014, 06:45:28 PM

Quote from: jonald_fyookball on October 03, 2014, 06:27:49 PM

pretty sure the core devs all agree, pow is the only proven secure method to achieve distributed consensus.

How could they not? since they are entrenched in the PoW mindset, and is confrontational when even someone mentions PoS. But the reality has PROVEN, that PoS is more secure and more community friendly (due to not having to transfer value out of the eco-system).

what proof do you speak of?

1. Many PoW altcoin has been 51% attacked, to the point the Dev just given up fighting back. Zero PoS altcoin has been successfully attacked so far.

2. In the altcoin competition, the PoS eco-systems has naturally risen to the top, on coinmarketcap right now, #4,#6,#7 are PoS, and #10 is a subsidiary of #4.

#1 Bitcoin, #3 Litecoin has early mover advantage, #2 Ripple is a scam that is non-PoW and non-PoS. I expect Litecoin will soon lose to a PoS eco-system in less than a year.

If Bitcoin keeps PoW, it'll be next, in 3-4 years time probably. This is because PoS re-invest in the community and eco-system, PoW transfers value out of the community and eco-system, into the pockets of hardware vendor/electric company.

bitkilo

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https://www.bitcoin.com/

Reallisticlly i think bitcoin needs to work with current fiat money and not try to over take it like some members think will happen, maybe one day bitcoin could be world standard but not anytime soon.
Its the money of the internet just now and only used by some of us to buy goods at local shops.
Once price stability happens then it may be adopted by mainstream.

tss

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OP's posts are all a waste. bct NEEDS a VTD button.. PLEASE.. it would help SOOO MUCH!

vote for consensus

cbeast

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Let's talk governance, lipstick, and pigs.

Bitcoin is simple like the four chemicals (GTCA) in DNA. Nothing better has evolved even after major extinction events. Bitcoin may not need to evolve. Everything will just evolve around it.

johnyj

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Beyond Imagination

Money does not need to evolve, it just need time to gain people's trust, any major change in protocol will impact that trust, it must be solid robust and secure to gain more trust over time

Every thing that increase the ease of use and purchasing will help, if there are some high-end products exclusively sold with bitcoin, it will also help

Q7

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Quote from: bitcoinbot on October 03, 2014, 01:52:59 PM

Sorry if this has been discussed before but I was wondering how Bitcoin could evolve over the next 10 years or so.

I guess the best thing would be if shops would accept Bitcoin at the terminal as well as paying for things like flights online with it.
Aside from this though, what kind of things could happen to Bitcoin?

I saw that there is a 'new' wallet which is like a lite version that means you don't need to download the whole blockchain.

Thanks.

There is already such 'lite' wallet around ie. Multidoge, Electrum, android bitcoin wallet. Anyway quite difficult to imagine what would change in 10 years rather what can we see coming in the next 1 year. Probably more retail over the counter payment option

franky1

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Quote from: KentuckyFriedJesus on October 03, 2014, 07:43:50 PM

Arguably, mainstream adoption is pretty important but it's hard for something so decentralized and without a marketing campaign to ever get big.

seeing as your a noob to the forum, your solution is more noobs? who will then only want to see advertising as the solution to evolve bitcoin?

lack of people is not an issue. what is needed is more innovation, ease of use, more merchants. thus when the next onslaught of noobs come onboard. they are not simply looking at bitcoin charts looking for a quick profit to then exit. but thy are seeing bitcoins true use and using it regularly.

bitcoin is not about quick profits. bitcoin is about a new economy.

at the moment i see soo many noobs running towards bitcoin hoping for big 200% price jumps to then run away and fill up bank accounts. so i think that bitcoins usefulness as a long term constant economy needs to be solidified to give bitcoin greater potential PR, rather than shouting out about profits from deflation.

jonald_fyookball

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Core dev leaves me neg feedback #abuse #political

Quote from: kokojie on October 03, 2014, 06:45:28 PM

Quote from: jonald_fyookball on October 03, 2014, 06:27:49 PM

pretty sure the core devs all agree, pow is the only proven secure method to achieve distributed consensus.

How could they not? since they are entrenched in the PoW mindset, and is confrontational when even someone mentions PoS. But the reality has PROVEN, that PoS is more secure and more community friendly (due to not having to transfer value out of the eco-system).

what proof do you speak of?

franky1

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Quote from: jabo38 on October 03, 2014, 07:38:43 PM

Bitcoin is opening the door to crypto.

Crypto 2.0 is going to knock down the whole house.

Crypto 2.0 = Ripple/Stellar, Ethereum, NXT, and NEM
(there are some other honorable mentions but will need to be evaluated more later)

ripple, stellar are not even crypto's. they are mysql database entries. and the others.. well pfft.. they still lack the benefits bitcoin has even if people do orgasm over the stories they tell

franky1

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Quote from: kokojie on October 03, 2014, 06:21:22 PM

Because you have no clear argument for me to think about? because you are trying to spin the concept of transferring $500 million USD value out of the Bitcoin eco-system is something that doesn't matter?

you do realise that miners are not pushing $500million of coins through exchanges right???

90% of coin is traded privately away from exchanges and has no actual knock on effect of the bitcoin price.

the silly thing is that most naive people are valuing bitcoin not at the withdrawal or deposit of 3600 coins a day. as the reality is not the case.

exchanges such as btc-e and bitstamp actual bank account movements is far far far less.

the volumes to trade on an exchange are day traders moving back and forth on a mysql database, not bank account movements,. and if you have not learned yet, on places like btc-e and bitstamp it only needs 200 coins-300 coins. to make the price jump $75 (which correlates to a $5billion cap, to a $6billion cap).

so now you realise that such small amounts of 200 coins can make the naive belief that 13million coins has just jumped or dropped by $1bill cap. you will see why other people have said you need to think about it...

enjoy

KentuckyFriedJesus

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Arguably, mainstream adoption is pretty important but it's hard for something so decentralized and without a marketing campaign to ever get big.

jabo38

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mining is so 2012-2013

Bitcoin is opening the door to crypto.

Crypto 2.0 is going to knock down the whole house.

Crypto 2.0 = Ripple/Stellar, Ethereum, NXT, and NEM
(there are some other honorable mentions but will need to be evaluated more later)

kokojie

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Quote from: jonald_fyookball on October 03, 2014, 06:27:49 PM

pretty sure the core devs all agree, pow is the only proven secure method to achieve distributed consensus.

How could they not? since they are entrenched in the PoW mindset, and is confrontational when even someone mentions PoS. But the reality has PROVEN, that PoS is more secure and more community friendly (due to not having to transfer value out of the eco-system).

kokojie

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Quote from: seriouscoin on October 03, 2014, 06:33:02 PM

Quote from: kokojie on October 03, 2014, 06:30:21 PM

Quote from: Heutenamos on October 03, 2014, 06:28:09 PM

PoW means fair distribution.

In PoS only, you basically have to buy coins someone premined or created with his premined coins. What a joke! Yet some support this idea Cheesy

Yeah, Satoshi mined 50%+ of the coins in the first year, that's really fair? Most PoS has better distribution in the first year. Also if you really love PoW for distribution, you could use it for distribution, I'm not really against distribution via PoW. It's the PERPETUAL part that annoys me.

It annoys you because you dont understand shit.

Had bitcoin used POS, Satoshi's stash would be .....what? ah.... i guess you didnt think of that.

The inventer of blockchain had to mine to keep it useful for others to contribute. Not like your POS scam, dumbass.

Satoshi's stash in a PoS system would depend on how he decides to structure the distribution, just like he could structure the PoW distribution in his favor too, by mining 50%+ of all distribution in the first year (he could have just made the reward very high in the first year too, but he didn't, so there's no reason to think he would have given himself bigger stash in a PoS system).

kokojie

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Quote from: seriouscoin on October 03, 2014, 06:28:18 PM

Quote from: kokojie on October 03, 2014, 06:22:19 PM

Quote from: seriouscoin on October 03, 2014, 06:18:39 PM

Quote from: kokojie on October 03, 2014, 06:17:14 PM

Quote from: seriouscoin on October 03, 2014, 06:15:52 PM

Quote from: kokojie on October 03, 2014, 06:11:04 PM

Quote from: ?? on ??

Quote from: kokojie on October 03, 2014, 02:23:37 PM

First end PoW mining, otherwise it might not even survive long enough to "evolve".

You certainly are on a mission, aren't you? Just fork it and let the better protocol win.

Why would I do that? I'm a stakeholder of the existing protocol, I am entitled to express my concern regarding the insane PoW expense, which is perpetually sucking value out of my stake in Bitcoin.

like 0.1 btc?

Why does POW expense matter? Do you even know Economics?

If the money supply is cheap (lol) then so is the value of that money. If the supply rate is too high, then that means the adoption rate (velocity) is too low.

Now think about it for a second and see how dump you sound for thinking POW expense matters at all.

$500 million per year in PoW expense doesn't matter? it's value transferred out of the Bitcoin eco-system. It's dumb to think PoW expense doesn't matter

like i said, you didnt even spend a min to think huh?

you dont even know what you want is lowering money supply rate. It has nothing to do with ......POW expense retard.

Wow, how dumb can you be? do you think PoW expense magically goes away when money supply is gone? then who's going to secure the Bitcoin network at that point? Like I said PoW is a PERPETUAL expense, that has NOTHING to do with money supply.

Stupid fck with POS addiction i see.

You must have think POS has no expense..... lol. DUMBtard.... i wonder why your altcoins went down the drain.

PoW miner shill still have no real argument other than personal attacks I see.

seriouscoin

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Quote from: kokojie on October 03, 2014, 06:30:21 PM

Quote from: Heutenamos on October 03, 2014, 06:28:09 PM

PoW means fair distribution.

In PoS only, you basically have to buy coins someone premined or created with his premined coins. What a joke! Yet some support this idea Cheesy

Yeah, Satoshi mined 50%+ of the coins in the first year, that's really fair? Most PoS has better distribution in the first year. Also if you really love PoW for distribution, you could use it for distribution, I'm not really against distribution via PoW. It's the PERPETUAL part that annoys me.

It annoys you because you dont understand shit.

Had bitcoin used POS, Satoshi's stash would be .....what? ah.... i guess you didnt think of that.

The inventer of blockchain had to mine to keep it useful for others to contribute. Not like your POS scam, dumbass.

Topic: How Could Bitcoin Evolve? - page 3. (Read 3683 times)