Topic: How do we find Cas coin redeemers before they redeem? (Read 642 times)

That's why you pay to have them hand delivered using someone such as myself!! (plenty of good references)   Happy to help!

You might be able to distinguish a bad fake like we've seen on the market, but someone who has never seen a real one would have absolutely no idea.  Casascius originally used an extremely cheap manufacturing method, product material, and the designs are widely available.  He even shared the companies he used with several of us back in the day to where a good social engineer could potentially get their hands on the exact holograms.  It would be easier and cheaper than you think to make an indistinguishable fake.  It's quite possible they are already out there.  Maybe not being sold here on this forum, but in other less critical crypto communities.  

I mean, people have gone through the effort to counterfeit my 1g silver coins and I give those away for free...
https://www.dropbox.com/s/s2crm45mj55pa57/20190916_085913.mp4?dl=0

Fakes are harder than you think.  There are tells from the original dies used to mint Casascius coins that would be difficult to find and reproduce.  I would not detail them publicly but I am confident I could spot a fake as could several other users here based on die chips/marks.

Wrong. Buy from trusted buyers, sell to anyone. There is no such thing as an indistinguishable fake. If people really wanted to, this issue could be prevented before it even starts. However, I highly doubt anyone wants to maintain a database of anonymous ownership for free (I know how someone could make it: untraceable, unlinkable, private; don't waste your breath). In addition to, of course, people not wanting to cooperate/contribute for any reason (even if it is something idiotic such as laziness).

Indeed. Good collections held for a long time by reputable members will be extremely valuable to serious collectors in this scenario.

There is another factor - the arrival of the indistinguishable fake. There's been one rather crappy attempt complete with an unconvincing sticker on the back but a properly convincing one is not that hard to achieve so I'm surprised it hasn't happened yet.

Once it does that's going to be a huuuge problem. Not many coins will have unimpeachable provenance but even those that do may have buyers doubting in that scenario.

Another 3 got peeled yesterday including a 25btc coin. See here....https://casascius.ludvigart.com.
I think more need to be peeled and another bull run and we'll be off to the races. Could be a while but you're absolutely right OG in thinking the more that get peeled the better off the Casascius world will become.

iBHK8

Why would you peel if the value went down?  I had the opposite concern.  Would I be able to resist peeling them when they go up 1,000 times what they were worth when I bought them?  You make a good comment about their value increasing alongside their rarity (at some point).



Agreed.  With current premiums, it doesn't make a TON of sense to sell them online.  The risk/reward is clearly not worth it in most situations.  This means either the market is seriously undervaluing Casascius coins, or more people need to peel them until their rarity justifies a higher market premium. 

I wouldnt trust international postage with anything worth 10s of thousands of dollars to be sent to me either.
Either spend the extra money to get it courier shipped as they insurance it for its full price anyways or dont ship them out at all.
I have wanting to get into the entire buying physical bitcoin and cryptocurrency thing for a while now but still havent decided upon if I could resist peeling them if the value of what they hold ever drops to 50-70% of what they were worth when I bought them.
But this thread has got me doubting my first thoughts about it since the op said the more people peel them to redeem the more valuable they will become!

This is absolutely a good point. It's basically for now anyways in stuck in the middle of not dealing with the headaches of shipping and not quite worth it to fly out to do a P2P trade possibly even with legal representation etc... Sure there are some coins out there now that are absolutely worth the P2P and legal representation but for the most part those coins and trades/sales are few and far between. The average 1BTC error coin is stuck in that weird middle of I don't wanna rely/worry about shipping but I also don't want to fly out to pick it up in person, etc....Perhaps this changes but for now I feel like we're in this strange in-between. The good news is that this could change at anytime as everything in the crypto world is extremely fluid. Thanks for your feedback.

iBHK8

Indeed. Shipping disasters are a bigger concern to me than escrows and so on. I can't imagine you'd be able to get enough insurance for almost any coin any more, let alone the big ticket ones.

I presume the willingness to sell will continue to wilt because of factors like that.

Premiums aside, there’s a very large risk involved in letting a coin worth tens of thousands of dollars loose in the mail. Moreso for international transactions. Lots of things could go wrong!

The only situation in which I would ever sell another coin would be in person, with my lawyer present 

Even then — I’d probably just peel it, as the sale premium would likely not be worth the hassle.

This is also a great plan! Let them redeem and every Cas becomes more scarce by the peel no doubt!!

Let them redeem them to make he rest more scarce! Every time a coin gets peeled it makes me happy that mine become more rare.

Yeah honestly speaking here I can likely say I'm just about done collecting for the time being. This can always change in the future but deep down I'm not a hardcore collector. I'm a minimalist and the less I have to collect the happier I am. However I have always thought of the "tainted coins" issue soon after I began buying some Cas coins to complement my BTC holdings. It's fine in the end and where it stands today because I bought what I was willing to take a chance on and most importantly I wanted to own those specific coins. I'm still very happy I own what I own but I do worry about the tainted factor in the event I ever needed to peel and redeem etc....However the good news is BTC is just a portion of my portfolio. Granted it is the most fun, sexy and exciting portion of my portfolio... it is still just 1 slice of the overall pie for myself(this is just me personally). I believe we will be USD constrained for longer than most wish to believe and that's fine. To each their own. However it gives me great pause in wanting to dive much further into physicals than I am now just incase. Until BTC upends the financial system then the financial system will be in control(hence you cannot necessarily off ramp a large amount of BTC without the financial system saying you can for the time being). Granted there are ways around this but for now BTC is a nascent technology that has an enormous promise. I'm happy to take a chance on what I own both digitally and physically, however I have to say I'm pretty full and done buying for the time being sans a really good deal or something I personally wish to buy with little premium over peel value for this very concern JanEmil mentions above. Either way Im really glad to be having this conversation and appreciate every one of your individual input and thoughts as this reply is to all of your replies and not just JanEmil  ! Feel free to keep the thoughts and posts coming as I find it all helpful and informative.

iBHK8

Speaking as a Casascius owner the temptation to peel rather than sell is... compelling.

Premiums have reduced to a level where the risk in selling barely justifies the hit you take compared to peeling and flogging the shitforks. A few sale prices appeared to reach levels below that.

I know it's sacrilege but I'd favour that over the potential for things to go tits up either during payment, shipping or having to deal with quasi anon assholes.

At the same time it's surprising how little known this section is. Every thread in Reddit has to point here rather than the owner knowing about it. All the same I would not blame them at all for discarding the idea.

I don't disagree with you but good luck explaining it to the SWAT team that has just knocked down your door because you got paid in "tainted" coins and then sent them to an exchange.

BTC will get recycled so much with its limited supply that eventually all of it will be "tainted"

CAS coins are fine and validated by the community. Also the BTC on them.

But lets say I have to pay you 6BTC for a Cas coin. Do you validate the BTC are not from a exchange hack, mafia or Iran etc. Dirty BTC could can get blocked on some services later when you want to cash out.

Maybe search for "tainted Bitcoins"

The most clean BTC are newly mined ones.

Have no personal examples. Only know what I've read here on the forum.

Yeah I hear ya here. As I said I was just kinda drunk brainstorming. There is certain coins that have been redeemed lately that I'm sure would have sold for decent to good premium. Not all coins have a premium especially these days but there's plenty that do. Would just be amazing I guess if they all came here but I understand now that's just wishful/drunk thinking lol. All the best C!


iBHK8