Nobody is allowed to feel mortal fear of law enforcement officers, even if they don't know that the person with a gun is law enforcement officer and thinks they'll get shot by a criminal (or his accomplice) for not cooperating.
The gun didn't even necessarily have to be shown, if it "printed" (you could see the outline of the gun and/or holster through clothing).
Topic: How to NOT be a victim of a sting operation (Read 7545 times)
The US is really a third world police state. In most of the civilized world it's just illegal for the police to incite to commit a crime.
Plus, is all this a joke? So they arrested two guys because the cops told them "I will use this money to buy stolen goods"? An US judge will accept that BS? Really? Again, in a civilized country the judge would tell to those cops to gtfo and to stop harassing citizens.
Plus, is all this a joke? So they arrested two guys because the cops told them "I will use this money to buy stolen goods"? An US judge will accept that BS? Really? Again, in a civilized country the judge would tell to those cops to gtfo and to stop harassing citizens.
Unfortunately you are right.
The US is a great country with some amazing people but it is now a police state, and even law abiding citizens run the risk of being prosecuted and sent to jail for large parts of their lives for victimless crimes.
Consider that 1 out of every 18 men in the US are either in jail or on probation!
This is the highest number in the world, with Russia coming in 2nd and Rwanda 3rd. (Source: http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Incarceration_in_the_United_States )
It is sad that this great nation is being destroyed by a such a relatively small number of people.
what's a lymph? is it like a nymph?
Killing every human being on earth by massaging my lymph glands is impossible, but I can be charged with the attempt anyway according to the bolded part.
As I explained, massaging your lymph glands is not a crime. The crime you are worried about being charged with attempting is the murder of every human being on Earth (and no murder statute I know of says anything about lymph glands), which isn't at all impossible. It would be difficult to murder every human being on Earth, and even more difficult to prosecute (insert joke about lawyers not being human here), but it is by no means an impossible crime to commit. But even though the crime is not impossible, you still couldn't be charged because massaging your lymph glands isn't a proximate act to murdering every human being on Earth (and most acts that would be proximate to murdering every human being on Earth would probably qualify (at the very least) as some form of treason anyway). I'm attempting to exterminate the human race right now, by only massaging my lymph glands. Oh shit, now I'm going down for 7.143 billion counts of attempted murder!
Can't tell if trolling, but in case not, an attempted crime requires the act(s) committed to be proximate to the crime. Proximity is a matter for the jury to decide, but as a general rule, stabbing someone while they're lying in bed is attempted murder, even if (unbeknownst to you) they had already died in their sleep of unrelated causes, and therefore actually murdering them is impossible (you can't kill someone who's already dead, after all), while massaging your lymph glands is not attempted murder, or any other crime (usually).You think a crime is fake just because it was made up? A criminal act doesn't have to actually happen or even be physically possible for a crime to occur. You can be charged with conspiracy, solicitation, or facilitation of a crime even if the crime itself is never actually attempted, and you can be charged with attempt even if the crime attempted is impossible.
Killing every human being on earth by massaging my lymph glands is impossible, but I can be charged with the attempt anyway according to the bolded part.
global moderator
Activity: 3990
Merit: 2717
Join the world-leading crypto sportsbook NOW!
use encrypted email and dont be a jackass about who you do business with
Exactly. The government can't crack "Encrypted" communications.
They have to rely on noticing encrypted communications and hacking the computers at both ends, which they are almost 100% successful at.
How not to be a victim of a sting operation:
"Don't break the law or assist others in breaking the law"
Or just don't get caught
. I'm not sure the government are gonna waste time cracking encrypted communications to go after petty money launderers though. If you were smart enough I doubt they wouldn't even know about it in the first place. I'm attempting to exterminate the human race right now, by only massaging my lymph glands. Oh shit, now I'm going down for 7.143 billion counts of attempted murder!
Can't tell if trolling, but in case not, an attempted crime requires the act(s) committed to be proximate to the crime. Proximity is a matter for the jury to decide, but as a general rule, stabbing someone while they're lying in bed is attempted murder, even if (unbeknownst to you) they had already died in their sleep of unrelated causes, and therefore actually murdering them is impossible (you can't kill someone who's already dead, after all), while massaging your lymph glands is not attempted murder, or any other crime (usually).
I'm attempting to exterminate the human race right now, by only massaging my lymph glands. Oh shit, now I'm going down for 7.143 billion counts of attempted murder!
They made up a fake crime in order to bust someone for a victimless "crime".
You think a crime is fake just because it was made up? A criminal act doesn't have to actually happen or even be physically possible for a crime to occur. You can be charged with conspiracy, solicitation, or facilitation of a crime even if the crime itself is never actually attempted, and you can be charged with attempt even if the crime attempted is impossible. The solution is to not assist people who claim that your assistance will help them commit a crime (suppose they're telling the truth?) and not attempt to commit crimes yourself. Is that really too much to ask?
When every victimless action is made a "crime", anyone can be prosecuted for "money laundering". How to NOT be a victim of a sting operation? Commit suicide immediately, so that you cannot be prosecuted for victimless actions.
use encrypted email and dont be a jackass about who you do business with
Exactly. The government can't crack "Encrypted" communications.
They have to rely on noticing encrypted communications and hacking the computers at both ends, which they are almost 100% successful at.
How not to be a victim of a sting operation:
"Don't break the law or assist others in breaking the law"
Laundry may be a charge they attempt to tack on, but they never would have made the sting without the accessory to a crime part...
This is correct. And honestly should be obvious to everyone already.
They had to create a completely unrelated "crime" (going to use this for credit card theft) in order to "create a crime" in these purchases. Granted, they were above the $10,000 limit, but that wasn't sensationalistic enough. This is why many feel that this move on the part of the police was extremely lame. They intentionally sought out a Bitcoin scenario, found dumb people, and turned it into a money laundering situation. I lost a lot of respect for law enforcment in that regard, but it would only have worked with stupid people involved. You can be assured this is the one they succeedded with. There were plenty other people who probably said "Credit card theft? Sorry, I can't do this exchange". That part never gets reported of course...
-B-
use encrypted email and dont be a jackass about who you do business with
...court docs.
Businessinsider has provided a to the criminal complaints link, here.
http://www.businessinsider.com/localbitcoinscom-targeted-by-feds-2014-2
Ok, thanks, I believe it now.
Gotta say, this is some pretty over-the-top enforcement aggression.
Reading the above case screams entrapment to me.
"In criminal law, entrapment is when a law enforcement agent induces a person to commit an offense that the person would have otherwise been unlikely to commit"
- The undercover induced the seller to commit the offense by contacting him and baiting him with larger and larger amounts of money.
- The seller would have otherwise been unlikely to commit money laundering if he wasn't presented with a large amount of "dirty money" to launder
"In criminal law, entrapment is when a law enforcement agent induces a person to commit an offense that the person would have otherwise been unlikely to commit"
- The undercover induced the seller to commit the offense by contacting him and baiting him with larger and larger amounts of money.
- The seller would have otherwise been unlikely to commit money laundering if he wasn't presented with a large amount of "dirty money" to launder
Which is illegal in Europe and most (if not all) first world countries.
The USG seem to have different rules for entrapment. Didn't they do a similar thing with the SR case?
Yes, entrapment its a usual practice among US police forces - its kinda crazy, LE is commiting crimes while inciting US citizens to commit more crimes in order to throw them to jail.
"The land of the free"
Sure.
Reading the above case screams entrapment to me.
"In criminal law, entrapment is when a law enforcement agent induces a person to commit an offense that the person would have otherwise been unlikely to commit"
- The undercover induced the seller to commit the offense by contacting him and baiting him with larger and larger amounts of money.
- The seller would have otherwise been unlikely to commit money laundering if he wasn't presented with a large amount of "dirty money" to launder
"In criminal law, entrapment is when a law enforcement agent induces a person to commit an offense that the person would have otherwise been unlikely to commit"
- The undercover induced the seller to commit the offense by contacting him and baiting him with larger and larger amounts of money.
- The seller would have otherwise been unlikely to commit money laundering if he wasn't presented with a large amount of "dirty money" to launder
Which is illegal in Europe and most (if not all) first world countries.
The USG seem to have different rules for entrapment. Didn't they do a similar thing with the SR case?
Reading the above case screams entrapment to me.
"In criminal law, entrapment is when a law enforcement agent induces a person to commit an offense that the person would have otherwise been unlikely to commit"
- The undercover induced the seller to commit the offense by contacting him and baiting him with larger and larger amounts of money.
- The seller would have otherwise been unlikely to commit money laundering if he wasn't presented with a large amount of "dirty money" to launder
"In criminal law, entrapment is when a law enforcement agent induces a person to commit an offense that the person would have otherwise been unlikely to commit"
- The undercover induced the seller to commit the offense by contacting him and baiting him with larger and larger amounts of money.
- The seller would have otherwise been unlikely to commit money laundering if he wasn't presented with a large amount of "dirty money" to launder
Which is illegal in Europe and most (if not all) first world countries.
According to the documents, Michael doesn't seem entirely blameless here. 
...court docs.
Businessinsider has provided a to the criminal complaints link, here.
http://www.businessinsider.com/localbitcoinscom-targeted-by-feds-2014-2
The news piece has been all over the place
Um, no. The link has been reposted "all over" a bunch of blogs.
A full 48 hours after the story broke, Google News shows only six (count 'em, six) publications running this story. For comparison, there are 110 stories currently running about "mtgox withdrawals".
Try searching for the guy's names "Pascal Reid" or "Michell Abner Espinoza". Another dozen pages include a one-sentence mention of the event as part of a larger story on bitcoins in general.
https://www.google.com/search?pz=1&cf=all&ned=us&hl=en&tbm=nws&gl=us&as_q= Pascal+Reid&as_occt=any&as_qdr=a&authuser=0
https://www.google.com/search?pz=1&cf=all&ned=us&hl=en&tbm=nws&gl=us&as_q=Michell+Abner+Espinoza&as_occt=any&as_qdr=a&authuser=0
Remember to search google news, not google, so you get real news publications instead of just link-propagating blogs.
Still no court docs.
Jump to: