Topic: ICO's killing crypto - page 6. (Read 3638 times)

Fake ICOs kill cryptocurrencies slowly. That's will cause many government alert about ICOs. However it is a good news for investors when there are many government regulate ICOs there will be more trusted ICOs than now. Most ICOs now are worthless like shitcoin ICO, fuck coin, wha'ts for the coin. it is nothing for the development of the cryptoworld.

I think ICO is diffenrence with Crypto. they just use blockchain technology to fund money for their project. not related to this crypto world.

Junior FUD is warranted.
Notice the consensus in the scene ?
Which is ? That *YES* indeed MOST ICO's are scammy bullshit.
Hence the context and rightful use of "FUD"
When the scene is flooded with *mostly scam coins then yeah.. you SHOULD have FUD.

Comprende Junior ?

And cut the "investor" crap kid  ..you are no "investor"

Most of the ICO owners will respond until they get money. After getting the money they will start neglecting the investors and they will start crapping with the people. Most of the ICO owners are doing the same thing with the investors.

I can't think of any dot.com IPO bag that became anything significant?

The significant companies were created from the small and grew into the large, e.g. Friendster, MySpace, Facebook, Google.

I expect the same for ICOs. None of them will end up being anything but speculation pump and dumps. Including Ethereum, NEO, Qtum, EOS, etc..

It's so damn easy to raise funds, that none of these groups has any incentive to actually accomplish anything in terms of real world adoption. It's much more lucrative to go start a new ICO and raise more money. Daniel Larimer is for example on his 4th or 5th fund raising junket with EOS, after Steem, Bitshares, Protoshares, etc.. Come-from-beyond who admitted he was the creator of Next is repeating the ICO scam with IOTA (which can't even reach consensus if they remove the centralized servers) and I think I heard they have another fundraising scam coming.

The dot.com bubble didn't incriminate the public who speculated on the shares on the stock exchanges. Whereas, everyone who is trading ICOs now is incriminating themselves. It's quite an understatement to say that many more people are going to prison.

Many of you are going to be guilty of causing a public mania into ICOs, if the authorities don't crackdown soon enough.

You can see I'm making sure I will not be part of it. I only hold BTC, LTC, and BCH (and a tiny bit of STEEM so I can continue to blog there, but I have clearly articulated that I think Steem is a scam and I'm not promoting nor wishing to be part of any longer than I need to be until my project is launched to replace Steem for blogging and other use cases).

The dot.com analogy is interesting to me because I was offered $1 million in stock options by Homepage.com to buyout my coolpage.com in 2000 (figure roughly $3 million in 2017 dollars). I declined because I was prescient about the coming dot.com bust, so I negotiated a $205,000 non-exclusive license in cash instead. And I continued to milk the income from Coolpage for 7 more years even though I stopped working on it.

I also predicted in an emphatic Steemit blog this recent ICO crash 2 days before it occurred.

Am I going to be prescient again or on the wrong side of history?

I urge more of you to come out and emphatically denounce ICOs, so that newbies who are reading have some alternative perspectives to draw from.

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Publicity for creating a dot.com bubble in ICOs that leaves the general public holding useless bags and being very angry about it. The kind of publicity we need is an adoption killer app that the public loves and admires, e.g. Facebook, Google, MySpace, etc.. But the problem is that the public has no reason whatsoever to adopt decentralized ledger clones of those popular Internet sites, unless there is some killer features they need which can only be obtained on the decentralized ledger variants.

I already challenged one of your comradres upthread to name one single ICO project that has produced any real world adoption.

All I get is silence in response.

ICOs are going to destroy the reputation and potential of crypto, associating it with scams, speculation bubbles, coupled with the bad aspects of Bitcoin such ransomware, assassination bounties, etc..

What are we building that from the perspective of the mainstream is perceived to be good for society with real world adoption to counter act all the negatives? NOTHING!

So don't be surprised when later the nation-states are forced by public opinion to crackdown not just on ICOs but potentially decentralized ledgers in general.

Smart guys please wake up.


You presume that ICOs offer anything but destruction.

Until you have another solution for avoiding mass manias such as the dot.com bubble, the South Seas bubble, the Tulip bubble, etc., then I guess we are stuck with government regulation. Government regulation of speculation manias is a fact of existing law. Do you propose we popularize crypto by violating the law and promoting a mass mania that accomplishes nothing and leaves a wake of destruction?

The real use cases won't be built as long as everyone is more interested in selling empty bags to greater fools. No one has an incentive to actually do the hard work, when so much easy money is dangling in front of them for the taking. Selling empty bags to greater and greater fools is so much more attractive than the slog of repeated failure of trying to discover a killer app.

You may think for example that Ethereum has done useful R&D. But the reality is that in 3+ years they've never solved the consensus algorithm issue. Casper innovates nothing and just an obfuscation of all the drawbacks of Byzantine agreement and proof-of-stake. Whereas, I actually innovated the consensus algorithm to something that is not proof-of-work, not proof-of-stake, and I did it with less than $50,000 of funding over 2 years (just for personal expenses during that timeframe and it would not have taken that long had I not been morbidly ill). Ethereum had $18 million right?

Look what the Altcoin Discussion forum has become:

I don't think ICOs are killing crypto, ICOs can be a great way of generating publicity and new money and new entrants to cryptoworld. It is just that there are some bad ones and scam ones out there. So it is really a good thing that these will in time have regulations like other businesses. I am not worried at all and think it will be a positivie once the temporary panic calms down a bit.

So your solution is to bring regulators into the scene to keep an eye on the market?

ICO's are minuscule in the world of international finance, stop spreading FUD. More investors = more value, not every business can utilize Bitcoins infrastructure, there's more uses to blockchain technology than a single coin.
 

too many shit coins that just want to get the funds only, too much. The concept is vague and so forth and of course it harms the crypto currency.

No ICO dev "needs" money.
If they can't afford to pay for the coin to get launched etc they could simply post the idea for their coin here and someone who has the resources could do it.

Case in point..
The scam coin BLOCKNET

When it launched and the dev asked for a million dollars in Bitcoin i asked him why he needed so much.
He said, "to ensure it's a success"
A year or so later he let the hosting expire on the web site from lack of payments.

EDIT: and he had fuck all coded after getting his million dollar paycheck after a year too !

HAHAHHAHAHHA

Oh and here is the kicker..
He admitted to coding 75% of the coin before he posted his ANN topic which consisted of a little jpeg with a few bullet points.
(a clever way to re-write the topic with out it being saved)

And..
All the little chucklefucks and shitbirds were more than happy to buy the million dollar jpeg on Poloniex and Bittrex.

Because your scummy fucking pieces of shit supporting raw garbage
..for Bitcoin profits
...with stupid bullshit excuses defending ICO's  

I'm new so if there's a dynamic here that I'm unaware of am not adhering to, that's probably why. feel free to dm me if i violate some norms.

That said, @Spoetnik i understand your sentiment, but I'm not sure I agree with your assessments.

While the atmosphere around ICOs is erratic, that is the natural state of something as fundamentally innovation as the blockchain is technologically and by extension economically. The blockchain and smart contracts are potentially so deflationary that, within the broader contexts of machine learning and globalization, their impact over even the next 10 years is unforeseeable.

The ICO ecosystem is erratic because it's going to create a lot of winners and losers, in terms of incumbents vs. newcomers.

Are we in a cryptoassst bubble?
Yes.

Will it boom and bust many more time before global adoption stabilizes the cryptoassst ecosystem
You can bet on it.

Are smart contracts, and by extension ICO-created cryptoasssts going to achieve global ubiquity?
There's no doubt. It's infinitely better than the status quo for just about every type of transaction.

Are ICOs chock full of scammers?
Yes, but they are nothing more than background noise to folks who see the fundamental value in the blockchain and are building actual product on top of it to possibly make a dent in the world.

Shouldn't this all be illegal for the sake of the blockchain's reputation
It already is. There doesn't need to be any new laws for fraud and embezzlement. All crooks are doing is run-of-the-mill white-collar crime. The ICO is just a new canvas upon which the artist paints their con — it's still the same same painting (if you will).

Will the scammers bring us all down?
For a time, but this too will pass just like it did after the first dot com bubble. Many more people will go to prison this time though. Just like now, in the first dot com there were irrational valuations that baselessly spiraled higher and higher before burning out and going to zero. The difference is that the blatant SEC violations and fraud were no where near the levels they are currently in cryptoassets, at that time in the late-90's/early-2000's.

Anyway, sorry for the rant but I truly believe in cryptoassets. Do I want to do well in the ecosystem? — Yeah sure, but that's not the only reason and that doesn't negate all the other reason's why I or anyone else would be interested in ICOs and crypto more broadly.

My advice to anyone who believes like I do that crypto is going to change everything and is building that change...
Keep your head down on your projects and ignore the BS hype. Have a plan for reducing your burn rates because when the bottom falls out of the cryptoasset market, and it certainly will, your team is going to need to have a long enough runway to see your way to sustainability or a market turn around. Sadly, most projects will not make it through the coming storm. Plan for it.

I'm trying to understand why you ignore the fact that several nations have warned of a future crackdown coming for ICOs, including the USA, UK, Canada, Hong Kong, and Singapore.

It seems you're determined to promote illegal investment securities and MLM scams, because of your insatible desire for greed at the expense of luring ever more greater fools into the irresistible bubble (because no one wants to be left behind while everyone else is making oodles of money promoting empty bags to the next set of greater fools).

Because humanity can't resist greed and MLM scams. And this is why a world government will be imposed on you fools, because humans can't self-organize and control themselves as individuals. IOW, a tragedy-of-the-commons.

Nevertheless for those who are smart, we'll try to save crypto, offer a better and more sane direction, and try to bring real use cases to the masses while you fools go fall off a cliff into jail and destruction.

No. Thats such an overstatement!

China do not want their money to get away from country, thats it!
They are concerned for their economy.

Also I think that only country which can get away with this is China because of their strict other regulations. in other countries one would just go around this prohibition.

You all are ignoring what they are.
As in HOW THEY WORK and whether that is appropriate and.. fair.
Why did dev's drop mining coins and ramp up output (more coins) ?

You are all skipping over the ideology of crypto that was established many years before an ICO existed.

Lets recap.. when Ripple or Ethereum launched they were considered scammy..
Because they were an ICO.
That is history people.

Problem is the newer crowd joining in kept lowering the bar.. simply out of greed.
Don't kid yourselves this is not about "crypto currencies"
It is purely about profits.

Period.

So what do ICO's have to do with a crypto currency ?
Not a god damn fucking thing.
They are a scam vehicle.. a new age version of an old pyramid scheme scam design.
Can any of you with a straight face say the ICO distribution method is an improvement over a mined coin like Bitcoin ?
If Satoshi wanted to ICO Bitcoin he would have chucklefuck's.

All we have here is losers.. shitbirds and profiteers and investards.
The morality nose dived hard when mass SCRYPT cloning took hold and worthless garbage like Doge coin exploded in popularity.

The reality is crypto outgrew morality.. it has no need for it anymore and left it for dead.
And unlike all of you i will not contribute to this bullshit.
I quit.
I never have nor will i ever own or support an ICO coin in any way.
Apparently for a little Bitcoin "dust" many of you will.

Crypto is in fact being killed off.
It is now stained forever..

While this is completely true in regards to ICO, the title of the thread is ICO's is killing crypto. Now, 3-4 years ago, i would of 100% agreed with you, because that was a totally different time then for those of us who where involved then. The ideas, perspective and outlooks for digital currencies.

These days, ICO's is bringing crypto investments mainstream, with big publicity regarding currencies generating millions of dollars virtually over night.

There is a lot of positives that have come from ICO, but, the negatives is what kelsey mentioned above.

Hi
Indeed ICO amounts were (are?) trully amazing
People making a good pdf, a website, then people invest millions...
Good ideas and good teams are rare. But they exist.
Most of the ICO i don t participate, I wait coin to be traded on exchange to buy.

The more value is to invest in many small market caps and HODL almost forever...

The link of mine you quoted explains that the question of whether securities regulation is harmful or beneficial is irrelevant to the fact that it encumbers the ICO issued tokens with securities regulations that vary in every nation, means those tokens can become illegal to use in the future in different countries. It is multiple layers of legal jeopardy and legal uncertainty. Why would any group of developers that was serious about the long-term viability of the project and tokens they are working on, encumber their project and token with such legal jeopardy? I also explained in my posts over the past days that if instead they issued the tokens with proof-of-work or economic equivalent, the tokens would not be so encumbered and afflicted. I conclude because they do not care about the actual outcome and are unnecessarily just scamming to get money. I have explained how to raise money legally without afflicting and encumbering the tokens with liability of being securities.

I also explained upthread, that the problem is that serious developers such as myself, will not take on such legal risks when in fact I don't need to in order to raise money legally. Thus I conclude that those who risk incriminating themselves with ICO issues, either believe that with crypto they can destroy the nation-state (or that somehow nation-states will abrogate their duty to protect citizens from MLM scams and illegal securities issuance) or they have criminal mindset that does not calculate properly the long-term repercussions of their actions.

How will we ever move crypto into the mainstream of society with this sort of criminal and rebellious mindset? The world needs crypto solutions immediately, not after 20 years battle of daring the G20 to filter traffic on the trunk lines of the Internet and daring them to track down every ICO issuer in a Whac-A-Mole game.

A decentralized issuance such as proof-of-work entirely avoids the MLM scam and securities law. Satoshi designed it this way because he knew that ICOs would destroy everything else and then only Bitcoin would remain standing as the nation-states fight back. But 2016 research has shown that Bitcoin only remains incentives compatible with consensus as transaction fee revenue becomes significant relative to protocol block reward, if mining becomes controlled by a coordinated oligarchy (which appears to be the direction Bitcoin is headed with the Chinese controlling Bitcoin mining and only two 14nm ASIC fabs in the world in control of Bitcoin mining with surely the global elite controlling those fabs from behind the curtain). Also the block size issue has no possible solution (I analyzed this in great detail in an upcoming blog of mine which also described my decentralized ledger solution and compares it to all known designs such as PoW, PoS, DPoS, Byteball, SPECTRE, IOHK's Ourboros, IOTA, etc).

I'm idealistic but also pragmatic.

I want to move crypto to the mainstream immediately and legally. And health willing, I am going to organize that.

As for raising money from non-accredited investors without complying with individual nation state regulations (e.g. to do Regulation A+ or CF crowd equity fundraising to USA persons, the corporation must be a USA corporation), this is massive legal jeopardy. I will not accept funding this way without some entity indemnifying me. Ethereum went to Switzerland and I presume had layers of lawyers indemnifying them personally. I need to look into this more. But even if I did go that route, I would not issue tokens in exchange for investment, because I would not want to encumber the tokens with future illegality. Instead I would issue shares and pay dividends in tokens from the revenue earned from apps developed for the ecosystem.

In short, I want to do this in a smarter way.


Name one and their accomplishements?

Ethereum?

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Mainstreaming only greater fool speculation MLM bubble. There's no adoption at all for any real world use case. Zero. Zilch.

Thus ICOs are destroying crypto, by moving the focus away from real uses to pure greed.

I don't agree. There are a lot of successful ICOs. Only scam ICOs hurt cryptocurrency.

I dont like ICO, many of them just use a whitepaper to stolen our money.
Then gone.

All crypto currency is a dangerous investment. It does not depend on China or any other country has banned the use of cryptocurrencies. It seems to me that the main problem is the large number of speculative capital. Crypto currencies have no damper and is therefore a Paradise for speculators. As soon as speculators will withdraw their capital ordinary users will be ruined.

after so many emerging scammers and hackers that endanger ICO projects I think there must be special handling by the developer of a project. to overcome the losses to be received by investors.