"money laundering" statutes are just another way for the power elites to restrict others from engaging in the types of activities they do on a day to day basis. When I buy a priceless work of art for $120,000,000 cash, I just "laundered" my money into an item that will hold that value in a "legitimate" medium. This is just a simple example of this. The level of sophistication in legitimized money laundering is mind boggling.
Topic: Is "money laundering" really that big of a deal? - page 4. (Read 5176 times)
Trillions of dollars are "money laundered" every year. This argument is a red herring. It's far easier to form shell corporations and move millions through phoney business deals than to make untraceable Bitcoin transactions. Bitcoiners just need to ignore this nonsense, comply with whatever rules are imposed and move on. If someone really wants to launder money, they will use banks and fiat money anyway, not Bitcoin.
you can also tell its government property because of counterfeiting laws.
Quote from: franky1
the money in your pocket is not yours. it belongs to the government.
No, currency is the property of the Central Bank that issued it. This is not a trivial distinction, either.
So essentially, these are monetary crimes. And since the law enforcement cannot solve the crime or catch the "bad guys" they have to lock down the whole monetary system just in case "bad" money makes it through.
So because some people may use money for bad things and they are too incompetent to catch them, the government must know every transaction that anyone ever makes with money?
So because some people may use money for bad things and they are too incompetent to catch them, the government must know every transaction that anyone ever makes with money?
I couldn't agree more. When editorials and the press condemns bitcoin for drugs, they do not acknowledge that the drug trade would still exist regardless of the means of payment.... The drug business existed before bitcoin, and if bitcoin failed (i hope it doesn't), the drug trade would still exist.
you can also tell its government property because of counterfeiting laws.
unlike music. if you make a song, you can produce as many copies as you like and you get to say and be incontrol of who else can make copies or if you even allow them to make copies.. because its your property..
money is not your property.. you are just an entitled bearer(holder) of it. do something illegal, and you will lose your entitlements.
unlike music. if you make a song, you can produce as many copies as you like and you get to say and be incontrol of who else can make copies or if you even allow them to make copies.. because its your property..
money is not your property.. you are just an entitled bearer(holder) of it. do something illegal, and you will lose your entitlements.
fail
You don't make (print) the money, so how is it comparable to song that you made? You are not entitled to copy a song that someone else created, in the same way that you are not entitled to copy money someone else created.
clever boy.. now you see my point of my first post.. the money in your pocket is not yours. it belongs to the government. your just "entitled" to hold it. and using if for a crime loses you that entitlement.
now go back to my second post and read UNLIKE music.. and now you will see its not a comparison of 2 things owned by you, but a clarification on the differences.
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Why stop there? Why not have ID checks at every corner of every city of every country so that if a crime happens on one street they can trace the crime by knowing who was on that street at that time? Oh, but those of us who would be against that would be "supporting terrorists" or drug dealers and criminals.
It's already happening faster than u think. No need to physically stop you and check the ID (even so that did happen to me too) the street cameras installed through the city streets will recognise your face and know exactly where you have been. The last time i flew I had to but the ticket on a scanner and at the same time stand on a premarket spot on the floor to have a "picture" taken. The system does nothing else as measure the facial features which can then be used for recognition.
Bitcoin will never be outlawed so much is clear by now, but exchanges will be forced to be run like banks so that the digital trail can be followed. Cash will be outlawed as soon as practical possible.
you can also tell its government property because of counterfeiting laws.
unlike music. if you make a song, you can produce as many copies as you like and you get to say and be incontrol of who else can make copies or if you even allow them to make copies.. because its your property..
money is not your property.. you are just an entitled bearer(holder) of it. do something illegal, and you will lose your entitlements.
unlike music. if you make a song, you can produce as many copies as you like and you get to say and be incontrol of who else can make copies or if you even allow them to make copies.. because its your property..
money is not your property.. you are just an entitled bearer(holder) of it. do something illegal, and you will lose your entitlements.
fail
You don't make (print) the money, so how is it comparable to song that you made? You are not entitled to copy a song that someone else created, in the same way that you are not entitled to copy money someone else created.
It's kind of similar to tax evasion really.
In a way, it's the opposite. Tax evasion is about moving legitimate money out of of the system such that people can't find it, so you don't have to pay taxes on it.
Whereas "money laundering" is about moving illegitimate money into the system, such as through a car wash, and making it appear to be legitimate ("clean") money, so you can pay taxes on it, so that people don't suspect it of being drug proceeds.
Well one could argue that money laundering would not be even needed in a truly free society...
its not about getting their cut. fiat is owned by the governments. so its not a cut.. they own it all anyways.. all they want is to control who has it and how much those that have it use for crimes.
the fiat in your pocket is not yours.. it is the governments, they just have a free licence for citizens of that country to use, unless it is found to be used for crimes, where they can revoke your freedom to use their property (take your fiat off you).
That would be dubious even if they made that explicit claim. If anyone anywhere ever trades a thing they made for another thing then the original is no longer theirs. Even their own courts would not enforce the money printers taking back the money they paid for buying giant slabs of marble or cleaning their mansions.
read this
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In 1775, the Continental Congress authorized the issuance of currency to finance the Revolutionary War. The obligation printed on these notes read:
This bill entitles the BEARER to receive Three Spanish milled Dollars, or the Value thereof in Gold or Silver, according to a resolution of CONGRESS, passed at Philadelphia February 17, 1776.
This bill entitles the BEARER to receive Three Spanish milled Dollars, or the Value thereof in Gold or Silver, according to a resolution of CONGRESS, passed at Philadelphia February 17, 1776.
keyword entitles..
if you break the law your no longer entitled to the money. the government own the money and they choose who is entitled to it.
you can also tell its government property because of counterfeiting laws.
unlike music. if you make a song, you can produce as many copies as you like and you get to say and be incontrol of who else can make copies or if you even allow them to make copies.. because its your property..
money is not your property.. you are just an entitled bearer(holder) of it. do something illegal, and you will lose your entitlements.
maybe my last post should have used the word entitlement as oppose to licence to use
They will attack you wherever you have no means of self-defense.
So we need an anonymous, P2P trading platform, even just as a last resort. I disagree with the narrative in this community that we shouldn't expect to beat government to it, we can cooperate with them as long as it's reasonable and out of our self-interest, but not outright capitulation.
So we need an anonymous, P2P trading platform, even just as a last resort. I disagree with the narrative in this community that we shouldn't expect to beat government to it, we can cooperate with them as long as it's reasonable and out of our self-interest, but not outright capitulation.
I agree. We are in a conflict over "Control". It has already started. They have published their guidelines, and they have taken action against Bitcoin exchanges.
It is all about getting their cut.
its not about getting their cut. fiat is owned by the governments. so its not a cut.. they own it all anyways.. all they want is to control who has it and how much those that have it use for crimes.
the fiat in your pocket is not yours.. it is the governments, they just have a free licence for citizens of that country to use, unless it is found to be used for crimes, where they can revoke your freedom to use their property (take your fiat off you).
now your seeing the benefit of bitcoin.. its not theirs!!
Actually the money in our pockets are considered a debt.
They will attack you wherever you have no means of self-defense.
So we need an anonymous, P2P trading platform, even just as a last resort. I disagree with the narrative in this community that we shouldn't expect to beat government to it, we can cooperate with them as long as it's reasonable and out of our self-interest, but not outright capitulation.
So we need an anonymous, P2P trading platform, even just as a last resort. I disagree with the narrative in this community that we shouldn't expect to beat government to it, we can cooperate with them as long as it's reasonable and out of our self-interest, but not outright capitulation.
"money laundering" is an artificial, made-up crime.
It was created by the ability to track monetary transactions, not by any real evildoing.
People committed crimes since ages, but only at the point when it became possible, thinkable or feasible actually to track monetary transactions, such a thing like "money laundering" started to exist...
It was created by the ability to track monetary transactions, not by any real evildoing.
People committed crimes since ages, but only at the point when it became possible, thinkable or feasible actually to track monetary transactions, such a thing like "money laundering" started to exist...
Absolutely. It is a vast excuse to enable syping on the financial affairs of citizens, just as terrorism has became overblown in order to further the surveillance state.
AML is also lazy policing. Organized crime should be stopped on the streets while it is happening, not by behind-a-desk policing of the proceeds of crime afterwards.
its not about getting their cut. fiat is owned by the governments. so its not a cut.. they own it all anyways.. all they want is to control who has it and how much those that have it use for crimes.
the fiat in your pocket is not yours.. it is the governments, they just have a free licence for citizens of that country to use, unless it is found to be used for crimes, where they can revoke your freedom to use their property (take your fiat off you).
That would be dubious even if they made that explicit claim. If anyone anywhere ever trades a thing they made for another thing then the original is no longer theirs. Even their own courts would not enforce the money printers taking back the money they paid for buying giant slabs of marble or cleaning their mansions.
No. It's not.
Money Laundering is a made up crime
Money Laundering is a made up crime
There is nothing worse than smelly money, everyone should launder their money once in a while.
Money laundering is a heroic job.
If you are HSBC or the CIA you can launder money anytime you want, with no repercussions (unless you consider the following "repercussions:" a whole bunch of underfunded law enforcement and regulatory agencies bickering about who has jurisdiction, taking 5 years to build the case, and then forgetting about it.)
If you are a normal dude/chick you can't launder money, you are subject to all these AML regulations/laws. What gives? Why can't I launder money just like the big corporations and government agencies that helped write the anti-money laundering regulations?
If you are a normal dude/chick you can't launder money, you are subject to all these AML regulations/laws. What gives? Why can't I launder money just like the big corporations and government agencies that helped write the anti-money laundering regulations?
It depends how big you are. if you're as big and wealthy as HSBC then you can help out terrorists. if you're a small player then you better not get caught doing anything.
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