IS THE MERIT SYSTEM being used correctly by a small clique of individuals here - page 3.

DdmrDdmr

legendary

Activity: 2338

Merit: 10802

There are lies, damned lies and statistics. MTwain

And here I was trying to ease off the stats....

The Top 50 Receivers have received 26,38% of their sMerits on average from within the top 50 Receivers. That means 73,63% comes from outside of the top 50. Good enough for me ..

nMeritTop50: Merit Received from top 50 Receivers .
nMeritReceivedTotal: Total Merit Received.

Code:

nMeritTop50    nMeritReceivedTotal    %         user_id        name                               url
490            1172           41,81%         1582324        DdmrDdmr                           https://bitcointalk.org/index.php?action=profile;u=1582324
393            1203           32,67%         459836         LoyceV                             https://bitcointalk.org/index.php?action=profile;u=459836
387            1044           37,07%         397737         hilariousetc                       https://bitcointalk.org/index.php?action=profile;u=397737
338            779            43,39%         897509         xtraelv                            https://bitcointalk.org/index.php?action=profile;u=897509
307            991            30,98%         479624         Last of the V8s                    https://bitcointalk.org/index.php?action=profile;u=479624
302            817            36,96%         1067333        micgoossens                        https://bitcointalk.org/index.php?action=profile;u=1067333
299            869            34,41%         487418         The Pharmacist                     https://bitcointalk.org/index.php?action=profile;u=487418
297            2878           10,32%         35             theymos                            https://bitcointalk.org/index.php?action=profile;u=35
273            776            35,18%         698159         Jet Cash                           https://bitcointalk.org/index.php?action=profile;u=698159
250            643            38,88%         1188543        o_e_l_e_o                          https://bitcointalk.org/index.php?action=profile;u=1188543
247            602            41,03%         1291828        iasenko                            https://bitcointalk.org/index.php?action=profile;u=1291828
243            507            47,93%         787736         marlboroza                         https://bitcointalk.org/index.php?action=profile;u=787736
240            764            31,41%         976210         nullius                            https://bitcointalk.org/index.php?action=profile;u=976210
230            900            25,56%         234771         suchmoon                           https://bitcointalk.org/index.php?action=profile;u=234771
219            613            35,73%         120694         xhomerx10                          https://bitcointalk.org/index.php?action=profile;u=120694
215            427            50,35%         579628         bob123                             https://bitcointalk.org/index.php?action=profile;u=579628
207            585            35,38%         11425          gmaxwell                           https://bitcointalk.org/index.php?action=profile;u=11425
206            816            25,25%         30747          Vod                                https://bitcointalk.org/index.php?action=profile;u=30747
206            448            45,98%         867786         HCP                                https://bitcointalk.org/index.php?action=profile;u=867786
200            697            28,69%         98986          TMAN                               https://bitcointalk.org/index.php?action=profile;u=98986
195            709            27,50%         188198         Piggy                              https://bitcointalk.org/index.php?action=profile;u=188198
179            487            36,76%         1560793        sncc                               https://bitcointalk.org/index.php?action=profile;u=1560793
172            471            36,52%         557989         BTCforJoe                          https://bitcointalk.org/index.php?action=profile;u=557989
167            564            29,61%         569455         BobLawblaw                         https://bitcointalk.org/index.php?action=profile;u=569455
167            501            33,33%         181806         HairyMaclairy                      https://bitcointalk.org/index.php?action=profile;u=181806
158            555            28,47%         1180530        theyoungmillionaire                https://bitcointalk.org/index.php?action=profile;u=1180530
155            465            33,33%         1554927        bitmover                           https://bitcointalk.org/index.php?action=profile;u=1554927
150            420            35,71%         1424178        mole0815                           https://bitcointalk.org/index.php?action=profile;u=1424178
148            404            36,63%         881377         Hhampuz                            https://bitcointalk.org/index.php?action=profile;u=881377
147            733            20,05%         290195         achow101                           https://bitcointalk.org/index.php?action=profile;u=290195
142            447            31,77%         49008          jojo69                             https://bitcointalk.org/index.php?action=profile;u=49008
138            424            32,55%         143168         TheQuin                            https://bitcointalk.org/index.php?action=profile;u=143168
134            443            30,25%         41175          infofront                          https://bitcointalk.org/index.php?action=profile;u=41175
128            758            16,89%         520313         Lutpin                             https://bitcointalk.org/index.php?action=profile;u=520313
124            425            29,18%         252510         JayJuanGee                         https://bitcointalk.org/index.php?action=profile;u=252510
123            416            29,57%         1339716        coinlocket$                        https://bitcointalk.org/index.php?action=profile;u=1339716
118            402            29,35%         163318         Torque                             https://bitcointalk.org/index.php?action=profile;u=163318
110            641            17,16%         101872         Lauda                              https://bitcointalk.org/index.php?action=profile;u=101872
101            579            17,44%         1000199        krogothmanhattan                   https://bitcointalk.org/index.php?action=profile;u=1000199
90             422            21,33%         18321          OgNasty                            https://bitcointalk.org/index.php?action=profile;u=18321
77             442            17,42%         507936         DarkStar_                          https://bitcointalk.org/index.php?action=profile;u=507936
68             1263           05,38%         3              satoshi                            https://bitcointalk.org/index.php?action=profile;u=3
63             395            15,95%         64205          Carlton Banks                      https://bitcointalk.org/index.php?action=profile;u=64205
45             447            10,07%         1878246        abhiseshakana                      https://bitcointalk.org/index.php?action=profile;u=1878246
39             614            06,35%         1275282        joniboini                          https://bitcointalk.org/index.php?action=profile;u=1275282
36             465            07,74%         24140          qwk                                https://bitcointalk.org/index.php?action=profile;u=24140
14             426            03,29%         369212         zazarb                             https://bitcointalk.org/index.php?action=profile;u=369212
1              396            00,25%         1071136        PHI1618                            https://bitcointalk.org/index.php?action=profile;u=1071136
1              478            00,21%         1076869        pitipawn                           https://bitcointalk.org/index.php?action=profile;u=1076869
0              400            00,00%         1090672        Smart man                          https://bitcointalk.org/index.php?action=profile;u=1090672

seoincorporation

legendary

Activity: 3290

Merit: 3092

Hello cryptohunter, i understand your worries. Sometimes i see that Merit mafia too but is just paranoia.

Quote

That high merit receivers/givers are circle jerking and backslapping each other and not seeking out lower rank members

Some users roll that way, i mean, if you become a friend of merit sources that resumes in more chance to get merits. But the merit sources are working hard to make a fair distribution of merits, or at least is that way in the Spanish section with our great merit source JetCash. This guy is making weekly merits giveaways to give the chance to all users to get merits as you can see on this thread: https://bitcointalksearch.org/topic/concurso-semanal-de-merito-6-al-12-de-noviembre-cerrado-pronto-otro-5064480 and he even create a thread called 'The merit to become junior' (https://bitcointalksearch.org/topic/el-punto-para-ser-junior-para-newbies-solo-5030808) on that thread he offers one merit to newbies if they bring a good quality post.

So, as you say we see a lot of users making a merit circle, but a lot of them are helping newbies too. So, let's not be paranoids and if you see someone abusing the system, then report him.

Jet Cash

legendary

Activity: 2744

Merit: 2462

https://JetCash.com

I'm going to prove the theory if I'm not careful. I've given Loyce 2 merits each for two of his posts today. I guess I need to lock my merit bag.

LoyceV

legendary

Activity: 3290

Merit: 16489

Thick-Skinned Gang Leader and Golden Feather 2021

Quote from: cryptohunter on November 09, 2018, 09:43:02 AM

Who are the merit sources here btw? and what is a merit source exactly? I have previous not paid any notice of the kind of board metrics before since I am not a trader here. I am starting to take an interest in DT of late too I had not even known such a thing existed. I am interested to see how one is eligible and then who decides on DT. (that discussion is for another thread though).

You're asking many questions that have been discussed and answered in Meta many times. I recommend you read a bit more first in other threads.
I can also recommend checking the last topics started by Piggy and DdmrDdmr. I think you're going to love their work on Merit statistics (partially interactive).

Further reading: [TOP-200] Members who support newbies - Thanks!.

cryptohunter

legendary

Activity: 2100

Merit: 1167

MY RED TRUST LEFT BY SCUMBAGS - READ MY SIG

Quote from: suchmoon on November 09, 2018, 09:30:08 AM

Quote from: cryptohunter on November 09, 2018, 09:15:23 AM

The true telling point with be the amounts awarded. I think such a tool to analyse this very important (to those who want to level up ) would be of top priority.

I would love to know which boards have the most merit action also.

You have the data, get to work and let us know.

What no offer of help?

You could get some additional merit for such a useful tool.

@LoyceV

thank you very much for this

Total Merit   Non-Local board
2418   Meta
1263   Bitcoin Discussion
1067   Beginners & Help
951   Economics
692   Development & Technical Discussion
553   Marketplace
392
365   Announcements (Altcoins)
313   Bitcoin Technical Support
299   Off-topic
290   Trading Discussion
271   Mining (Altcoins)
247   Marketplace (Altcoins)
242   Mining
192   Altcoin Discussion

Meta - 247262 Posts - 2418 merit

Alt discussion board - 2564018 Posts - 192 merit

Bitcoin discussion board - 2038120 Posts - 1263 merit

These are quite interesting and confirm that meta although generally receiving 10x less traffic than the alt discussion board (where most new people are posting) still gets nearly 13x more merit activity. So that is quite alarming if you are going on a post to probability of merit ratio alone. 130x more likely to get merit for a post in meta- - Is that even vaguely correct?? Math is not my best thing actually so no shame in asking for assistance and confirmation.

Even bitcoins main forum that is far more moderated to raise the level of post quality.. is at 10x more posts and 2x less merit. So the ration there is better than the alt board but king of the hill by far and where you want be posting is meta, and you want to be in the top 50.

So in the most obscure board (for most) and be already one of the highest merit profiles is the quickest way to more merit it would seem.

However yes, if everyone was as helpfull as loyceV then perhaps they should be entitled to high merit.

I had suspected merit was introduced to enable only valid posters to level up so have often ignored very good posts from legends since I could not see any benefit to them to have extra when I could give lower level members that were trying hard a chance to level up.

LoyceV

legendary

Activity: 3290

Merit: 16489

Thick-Skinned Gang Leader and Golden Feather 2021

Quote from: Jet Cash on November 09, 2018, 09:37:17 AM

If it is any help, LoyceV provided a merit history for me. I haven't updated it since June, but the list is here -

Try http://loycevsbasement.privatedns.org/Merit/history/698159.html Tongue

I'll update it again in a few hours.

cryptohunter

legendary

Activity: 2100

Merit: 1167

MY RED TRUST LEFT BY SCUMBAGS - READ MY SIG

mainconcept

sr. member

Activity: 588

Merit: 422

Quote from: cryptohunter on November 09, 2018, 08:21:43 AM

I would also like to see which boards get the most merit action. This is very important too.

Edit: These are the top merit receivers by local section / non-local section:

For any local section:

Code:

Total Merit	Local board
574	Bahasa Indonesia (Indonesian)
420	Deutsch (German)
371	Pyccкий (Russian)
339	Türkçe (Turkish)
246	Português (Portuguese)
184	Français
153	Hrvatski (Croatian)
144	Español (Spanish)
137	Italiano (Italian)
132	Philippines
120	中文 (Chinese)
100	日本語 (Japanese)
77	Nederlands (Dutch)
75	العربية (Arabic)
66	한국어 (Korean)
63	Other languages/locations
42	Eλληνικά (Greek)
37	Română (Romanian)
34	Polski
30	India
2	Skandinavisk

For any non-local section:

Code:

Total Merit	Non-Local board
2418	Meta
1263	Bitcoin Discussion
1067	Beginners & Help
951	Economics
692	Development & Technical Discussion
553	Marketplace
392	
365	Announcements (Altcoins)
313	Bitcoin Technical Support
299	Off-topic
290	Trading Discussion
271	Mining (Altcoins)
247	Marketplace (Altcoins)
242	Mining
192	Altcoin Discussion
135	Project Development
132	Serious discussion
128	Politics & Society
125	Archival
123	Speculation (Altcoins)

Credits to Piggy for his SQL Merit search tool.

Query used for the non-local section:

Code:

SELECT MAX(result.total) as "Total Merit", result.SubBoard as "Non-Local board" FROM (
	SELECT toid, SubBoard, SUM(Merit) AS total
	FROM meritdata as m
	WHERE m.Board in (SELECT Board FROM meritdata Where Board not like "Local%" GROUP BY Board)
	GROUP BY toid, Board
	ORDER BY Board,total Desc) AS result
GROUP BY SubBoard
ORDER BY result.total Desc

Query used for the local section:

Quote from: Piggy on June 27, 2018, 03:31:57 AM

We can easily get the Top Receiver for any local section simply using this:

Code:

SELECT MAX(result.total) as "Total Merit", result.toid as "Top merit receiver", result.SubBoard as "Local board" FROM (
	SELECT toid, SubBoard, SUM(Merit) AS total
	FROM meritdata as m
	WHERE m.Board in (SELECT Board FROM meritdata Where Board like "Local%" GROUP BY Board)
	GROUP BY toid, Board
	ORDER BY Board,total Desc) AS result
GROUP BY SubBoard
ORDER BY result.total Desc

EDIT:
This seems to be the correct query, the queries above refer to the top merit receivers by subboard.

Code:

SELECT SUM(Merit) as "Total Merit", board, subboard from MeritData
Group by SubBoard
order by SUM(merit) desc

Code:

Total Merit	Board	SubBoard
31067	Local	Pyccкий (Russian)
30475	Alternate cryptocurrencies	Announcements (Altcoins)
26075	Other	Meta
20590	Economy	Economics
16800	Economy	Marketplace
14432	Local	Türkçe (Turkish)
12787	Alternate cryptocurrencies	Altcoin Discussion
12266	Bitcoin	Bitcoin Discussion
11083	Message DELETED!	
9769	Local	Bahasa Indonesia (Indonesian)
7905	Economy	Trading Discussion
7423	Local	Deutsch (German)
7110	Bitcoin	Development & Technical Discussion
6273	Alternate cryptocurrencies	Marketplace (Altcoins)
5275	Alternate cryptocurrencies	Mining (Altcoins)
4738	Other	Beginners & Help
3584	Local	Français
3283	Bitcoin	Mining
3065	Other	Off-topic
3016	Alternate cryptocurrencies	Speculation (Altcoins)
2677	Other	Politics & Society
2658	Other	Serious discussion
2624	Local	Italiano (Italian)
2381	Local	中文 (Chinese)
2197	Local	Español (Spanish)
2141	Local	Philippines
1826	Local	Português (Portuguese)
1757	Bitcoin	Bitcoin Technical Support
1727	Local	Hrvatski (Croatian)
954	Bitcoin	Project Development
660	Local	العربية (Arabic)
563	Local	Other languages/locations
544	Local	Eλληνικά (Greek)
512	Local	日本語 (Japanese)
349	Local	Nederlands (Dutch)
337	Local	Polski
247	Other	Archival
198	Local	India
139	Local	Română (Romanian)
100	Local	한국어 (Korean)
2	Local	Skandinavisk

Query for cross-checking with the total merit query:

Code:

SELECT SUM("Total Merit") from (
SELECT SUM(Merit) as "Total Merit", board, subboard from MeritData
Group by SubBoard
order by SUM(merit) desc)

--> Seems good now:

Code:

SUM("Total Merit")
261609

Code:

SELECT SUM(Merit) from MeritData

Total Merit:

Code:

SUM(Merit)
261609

Jet Cash

legendary

Activity: 2744

Merit: 2462

https://JetCash.com

If it is any help, LoyceV provided a merit history for me. I haven't updated it since June, but the list is here -
http://talkmerit.com/projects/merit-history.html

Maybe I should publish a second page. The comparison might be interesting.

suchmoon

legendary

Activity: 3654

Merit: 8909

https://bpip.org

Quote from: cryptohunter on November 09, 2018, 09:15:23 AM

The true telling point with be the amounts awarded. I think such a tool to analyse this very important (to those who want to level up ) would be of top priority.

I would love to know which boards have the most merit action also.

You have the data, get to work and let us know.

erikoy

full member

Activity: 686

Merit: 125

I see your point OP, getting 1 merit for newbie is a challenge and we must leave that way for the starters to earn recognition and acknowledgement from the merit source. However, once they earn merit it will just leave like that stuck up with the current rank. I have seen some Jr. member good posters in the forum and that are active in meta section that does always contribute their valuable ideas every time a newbie posted a thread to earn merit. Those users must be motivated to share more on their ideas by awarding merit probably or some sort of encouragement through replies.

Only 1 merit and 30 activity needed for a newbie to rank up to a jr. member rank. But, after ranking up to jr. member later on the problem in getting another 10 merit to rank up to member would be harder. I was just lucky that merit source has provided me enough merit to rank up to member. But then, I stuck in this rank. Anyway, being a member is already enough to be part of the forum but it is more good when I could wear that Avatar one day.

cryptohunter

legendary

Activity: 2100

Merit: 1167

MY RED TRUST LEFT BY SCUMBAGS - READ MY SIG

Quote from: Alex_Sr on November 09, 2018, 09:09:29 AM

Quote from: cryptohunter on November 09, 2018, 09:05:47 AM

Quote from: Alex_Sr on November 09, 2018, 08:55:41 AM

Quote from: cryptohunter on November 09, 2018, 08:53:04 AM

...

The percentage of matching lists - 42%

This is for the top 50 ?

Yes

The true telling point with be the amounts awarded. I think such a tool to analyse this very important (to those who want to level up ) would be of top priority.

I would love to know which boards have the most merit action also.

LoyceV

legendary

Activity: 3290

Merit: 16489

Thick-Skinned Gang Leader and Golden Feather 2021

Alex_Sr

hero member

Activity: 840

Merit: 962

HOLD BITCOIN! Fiat - SCAM!

Quote from: cryptohunter on November 09, 2018, 09:05:47 AM

Quote from: Alex_Sr on November 09, 2018, 08:55:41 AM

Quote from: cryptohunter on November 09, 2018, 08:53:04 AM

...

The percentage of matching lists - 42%

This is for the top 50 ?

Yes

cryptohunter

legendary

Activity: 2100

Merit: 1167

MY RED TRUST LEFT BY SCUMBAGS - READ MY SIG

Quote from: Alex_Sr on November 09, 2018, 08:55:41 AM

Quote from: cryptohunter on November 09, 2018, 08:53:04 AM

...

The percentage of matching lists - 42%

This is for the top 50 ?

cryptohunter

legendary

Activity: 2100

Merit: 1167

MY RED TRUST LEFT BY SCUMBAGS - READ MY SIG

Quote from: Jet Cash on November 09, 2018, 08:51:42 AM

Well the first thing to point out is that this forum is not a decentralised project. It has a standard hierarchy of officials and members. It may be that many members support decentralisation and are anti-globalisation ( but not all ). If this hierarchy did not exist, then it would be mayhem here, and the forum would be useless in my opinion.

Your other point that merit awarding may be abused is a topic that has been discussed in many threads. I'm sure there is a certain amount of abuse of the system, but Theymos has been fairly careful in his selection of merit sources, and their activities are under constant scrutiny by the forum statisticians.Your assumtion has a fairly obvious basis. Longer standing members will be more comfortable with their posting, and most will be able to contribute more to the forum based on their experience. It makes sense to draw merit sources from that pool as well.

Thanks for posting and there could be merit in what you have said.

However opinons are something I would care to avoid until the statistical analysis is provided to demonstrate how much merit to and fro is contained within the top 50.

The possible explanations of such activity (once determined) should only then be discussed because it may not be the case that the top 50 are circle jerking merit around at all and this notion is without foundation.

I see many posts of I have developed this analysis tool and that analysis tool. This one should be equally as simple to create could be magnitudes more important if you consider the implications.

Also where to find the metric for what boards demonstrate the most merit activity?

Is it an offense to offer merit here for things to be done for the good of the board? for instance if one was to offer 25 or 50 merit points for the first person to create such an analysis tool. To be applied say 5 per month as long as the application stays active and live?

Alex_Sr

hero member

Activity: 840

Merit: 962

HOLD BITCOIN! Fiat - SCAM!

Quote from: cryptohunter on November 09, 2018, 08:53:04 AM

...

The percentage of matching lists - 42%

cryptohunter

legendary

Activity: 2100

Merit: 1167

MY RED TRUST LEFT BY SCUMBAGS - READ MY SIG

Quote from: Alex_Sr on November 09, 2018, 08:34:07 AM

Quote from: cryptohunter on November 09, 2018, 08:29:02 AM

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Most generous merit senders, all time - https://bitcointalk.org/index.php?action=merit;stats=topsendat

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Thank you these are a good start.

I would certainly be willling to give merit to any person here developing a dynamic website that could evaluate this data and produce some tight stats and graphical presentations for it.

To do this manually and get it 100% correct would be quite a substantial task.

I'm sure many would be willing to merit such a worthy application that helps to ensure board does not become a centralised backslapping circle jerk of merit hogs. Not that I have any specific analysis that allows me to say that it has as yet.

Jet Cash

legendary

Activity: 2744

Merit: 2462

https://JetCash.com

Well the first thing to point out is that this forum is not a decentralised project. It has a standard hierarchy of officials and members. It may be that many members support decentralisation and are anti-globalisation ( but not all ). If this hierarchy did not exist, then it would be mayhem here, and the forum would be useless in my opinion.

Your other point that merit awarding may be abused is a topic that has been discussed in many threads. I'm sure there is a certain amount of abuse of the system, but Theymos has been fairly careful in his selection of merit sources, and their activities are under constant scrutiny by the forum statisticians.Your assumtion has a fairly obvious basis. Longer standing members will be more comfortable with their posting, and most will be able to contribute more to the forum based on their experience. It makes sense to draw merit sources from that pool as well.

Alex_Sr

hero member

Activity: 840

Merit: 962

HOLD BITCOIN! Fiat - SCAM!

Quote from: cryptohunter on November 09, 2018, 08:29:02 AM

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Most generous merit senders, all time - https://bitcointalk.org/index.php?action=merit;stats=topsendat

Can compare these lists by the number of matches...

Topic: IS THE MERIT SYSTEM being used correctly by a small clique of individuals here - page 3. (Read 1313 times)