Topic: KanoPool kano.is lowest 0.9% fee 🐈 since 2014 - Worldwide - 2432 blocks - page 2137. (Read 5352067 times)

So, I'm basically getting paid the same amount for a block that takes 225% vs one that takes 37%. Even though I stayed in the 225% one the whole time, while jumped out of the 105% one while messing with my miners.

I am completely misunderstanding this PPLNS , 500% thing.  *Sorry I'm a bit thick at this*. Usually I'm good at math, but this just doesn't jive with me. LOL

What's odd though, is that it still is a higher income than the Mining Earnings calculators I compared against, so I'm not concerned.

Weird

The block luck determines how often you are rewarded, not how much you are rewarded per block.
In the case of the last 225% block, how many times your shares get rewarded depends on the future blocks after it.
Once for the 225% block and then how many more times after that depending on the future blocks.

It is first easiest to explain what would happen if every block was average 100%
The N in PPLNS we use is 500%Diff, i.e. when we find a block we reward ALL shares BACK 500% before the block, not just the shares in the block.
Thus when a block is found, each share rewarded, gets ~1/5 PPS
If every block was 100% and you mine for a full block A, and the pool found 4 blocks after it B,C,D,E, all 100%, then each share in block A would be rewarded ~1/5 PPS, 5 times in block A, B, C, D and E.
Thus it would average out that each share would be expected to get ~PPS (actually it's average about 99.5% PPS since the fee is 0.9% but the 99.1% includes transaction fees)

However, luck means that each block found is some random % between 1 share and infinity.
The expected average over time is 100%, but as you can see on the web site, they jump all over the place.

It is important to see that it is the shares that get rewarded, not your hash rate.
Each share is rewarded 0, 1, 2, 3, 4, 5, or more times purely dependent upon the pool block finding luck.
It doesn't matter if you stop mining, or start mining, or hop in and out.
Each share will be rewarded depending purely on the pool block finding luck after the share is submitted.
That luck is random future luck, so you can't guess it before you submit a share.

What this means in terms of "reward per block" vs "your hash rate", is that it currently takes the pool roughly 60hrs to generate 500%Diff shares, so your reward, from when you start mining, will climb up each block found until you've been mining for ~60hrs.
If you stop mining, your reward will decrease down for any blocks found in the ~60hrs after you stop mining.

However, over time, the payout should average out, but over a short term the expected payout over time will jump up and down dependent upon block finding luck.

Nope... That's PPS.  In that payout scheme you are paid for every share you submit.

In PPLNS you get paid for N shares.  So if a block takes 10% or 1000% you get the same.

I believe your payout does not change, but means it took 2.25 times longer than normal to find the block.

Ok, so now that the block finished with 225% and I stayed in the whole time at or above the normal TH, does that mean the payout should be 225% of the normal @100% lock, right?

That 200% is gone! And yes, they only came back on sale this morning .....


Apparently, a major competitor is not afterall going to tape out their brand new chips, thus there will not be any spectacular increase in (more efficient) network hashing power thus no equally spectacular anticipated difficulty increases, which should make the factored price increase ROI'able ... (is there such a word?).

I was surprise to hear they were back on sale also. Not sure why the price increase? Also batch 6 states: Quantity limited units scheduled to be sold in the round and it's also the last round of production of S5.

And to somewhat stay on topic.... even at 200+% this pool is great. 

LOL... my mistake then.  When I checked yesterday/day before I swear they weren't on the site.  Carry on

And to keep this somewhat on topic... it's over 200% in here...

Where have you been? S5's are back in stock (shipping 30th March and 9th June), and had 2 price increases already!

Ahh... the beauty of hindsight .  Like Phil, I've made some good investment decisions and some spectacularly poor ones as well.  Hardware-wise, I've done well.  All of my gear has more than made back its cost.  Renting hash power, just as a pool's luck turns exceptionally poor... yup, managed to get right in on that.  Expect to find a block a day and only see 1 in 14 days will really burn through the BTC when you're renting loads of gear to try to make a bit of coin.  Sometimes you win... and others you don't.

Unfortunately for us home miners, the best current gear can only be found second hand.  SP20s and S5 are out of stock from the manufacturers.  Maybe you'll get lucky and find a good deal on some... or you can take your chances with the older stuff like the S3s.  Point is, we're kind of in a holding pattern.  The only reason I've still got my S3s plugged in is because the network difficulty has not really gone up too much since November.  Last summer, everyone was predicting constant huge spikes in difficulty... if you tried to give any ROI projections using a number under 10%, people just laughed at you.

I'd love to see some more gear made with the home miner in mind, but I don't know how much, if any, will be forthcoming.  Of course, I could be completely wrong and somebody's working on a nice, efficient miner for the home user right now... and that's part of the fun of this whole adventure

ah lots of ups and downs in this.  money can be made or lost.  I have had my share of bad moves and good moves.

Right now a few s-5's or a few sp20e's don't cost a lot have an upside if things move as they have been doing.

In the spec area I run a difficulty adjustment thread.  I make a new one every difficulty adjustment.  If you read them you can get an idea of what miners are up against in the quest to make a coin or two.

https://bitcointalksearch.org/topic/new-diff-thread-mar-8-to-mar-22-982118

You guys are blowing my mind. Why didn't I get into this 2 years ago. :Banghead:

also if you turn all gear off it takes time to wind back down to 0gh  about 60-65 hours at current pool hashrate.

so your 10th would be about 5th after 32 hours or so  then 0th after 60-65 hours.

conversely if you are at 10th power off for 32 hours and drop to 5th then power on it will take time to get back to 10th.

say

10
10
10
10
10
10
10
10
10
10
10
10
10
10
10
10  a full 10th average

each is 4 hours of work adding up to 64 hours total which is also 500%.  I round to this as I get to do 4 x 16 = 64 = 500%

so stop for 8 hours

0
0
10
10
10
10
10
10
10
10
10
10
10
10
10
10
 the average is down to 8.75 th


now mine for 16 hours

10
10
10
10
0
0
10
10
10
10
10
10
10
10
10
10

average is still 8.75th  and the empty 0 + 0 moved a bit but will not vanish for a while. 


mine 16 more hours

10
10
10
10
10
10
10
10
0
0
10
10
10
10
10
10
 still 8.75 th average  but those empty shifts are close to gone.

Glad to help.  Feel free to ask away... it's how you learn

Ohh ok. So it's residual. So if my TH fluctuates it will still stay at the high % but figured with the combined hash for I have put in.

Thank you

Sorry to keep asking these questions, but I'm learning about all of this.  

Your payouts are determined by the number of shares you submit, and how many you have in the current value of N when the block is found.  If your hash rate varies because some of your miners stop mining, your payouts reflect it.

Let's take an example.  Assume you've normally got 10TH/s mining on the pool.  Once you reach the 500% block time of mining (about 62 or so hours), and you maintain that constant hash rate, you'll receive 10TH/s worth of payouts per found block.  If you now drop to 5TH/s, you'll see your payouts become lower until such time that you start receiving 5TH/s worth of payouts per found block.

It's how PPLNS works - you ramp up and ramp down and your payouts reflect it.

Another question . 

If I have multiple miners working in the pool at different locations and one or some go down, while others stay up, does that reset my increased pay rate like you mentioned, up to 500% on long hashes, or as long as one or more are active, still maintain my level?

Thanks

Cheers!

Payout 346736 sent
c791b72bd34337a08e2eb64b0bc00f4a40ed3f535743372238a453f56b15dcc2
and confirmed

I'm staying this time to see how that works out. Hehe