Topic: looking for truth: if dash is scam, where are the victims? - page 3. (Read 3335 times)

Evan is a US/Arizona citizen, and if he is implicated in a state, fincen or SEC investigation, the price will likely suffer, so yes, what was done in the past can effect those investing today. Also, keep in mind the voting mechanism is being advertised as fair, which means because of the unfair distribution from the launch, that this statement probably is as much BS as the "fairly and transparently launched" statement from the dash ANN.

This all but ignores the insecurity of X11 and the less than optimal privacy of darksend, which from a tech perspective, seem  the greater tragedies of false advertising since they are undisputed by most experts, but not grasped by the layman who is more likely to chalk it up to FUD or technical debate than real threats to the coin's survival--but those fallacies will work themselves out eventually whether there's a securities investigation or not. You've been warned, take it for what's it worth--the onus is squarely on you and the research materials are mostly in this thread (though you may have to dig for the technical stuff to get a better grasp on the problems outlined).

The miners who were promised a fair share if they came to the party were the ones locked out. (As I said that analogy was not a perfect one for dash. Just to give you some idea)

Their stake was the same as at any party they attend. We are comparing one party with another party only. We must always compare the same thing.
At every party they attended before and after there was no lock door between them and the cake at other parties. Where they were promised a fair share of cake they got a fair(er) share of cake. You can't expect them to say this was a great party compared to the other parties they attended.

I think the masternodes iare yet but another way of getting unfair advantage once you are already ahead.  Either way I would prefer to stay away from that project now. You have probably read all the threads and done your research. So if you like it now then stick with it. Everyone must make their own choices I guess.

Never get attached to any one project. I have found only disappointment lies down that path. Eventually something always happens and you realise you simply became too fixated. I'm not saying dash is the worst. I think probably there are more sneaky tricks happening all the time but you just can't observe it.

Thanks cryptohunter for the considered reply.  I understand your analogy,  but I have to ask--and I'm trying not to come off as completely dense--who are the initial people locked out of the cake room and what was their initial stake in Dash? Are these miners you're talking about?

The other question I have is, does all this matter to people who buy dash now?  The devs can no longer victimize people, am I right?

A quick and easy illustration ....

This example is not a correct representation of xcoin/dash (this example is actually more fair) but this scenario has similarities that will help you get a general feel of situations in life where you have already been dashed....

Imagine you're at a party with around 99 other people and you're told soon there will be a giant cake. Everyone loves cake and wants a slice. You're told the cake will start to be divided up fairly in 2 hours. When you turn up in 2hours the cake has been hidden but you can hear scoffing sounds from behind the this door. The door is locked. Everyone looks at each other and starts knocking on the door and asking are you eating cake in there? "Yeah yeah" a handful of people say from the other side of the locked door..." don't worry you can have some soon. Sorry we started early and locked the door we'll leave you some we're not eating too much too fast. Plenty left for you guys".

The door eventually opens and the remaining 95 people can see the cake. Sadly a very large amount of the cake has been eaten so obviously the rest will have a far far smaller slice each than they should have done.  That seems pretty unfair does it not??? How did they eat so much cake so quickly. It's like they can eat cake 10x faster than other people.

But wait - - (the reduction part)

The five people in the room say to the other 95 people - - what do you need all that left over cake for?? they take away 75% of the remaining cake and throw it in the garbage.  Then they say... anyone got a problem with that ?(in between mouthfuls of cake they are still consuming from the tiny part of the cake left) are you trying to say you didn't get your fair share of this delicious cake? it's really really tasty here try some. For a while nobody says anything . Then all of a sudden one person says is this a really a slice of cake or a crumb....looks like a crumb to me? then others start to notice they only have crumbs too. This was a huge huge cake enough for us all to have had at least a little slice


So here in the above scenario you can see that although they greedy five ate way way way more than their share behind the locked door. It would not have been quite so bad (although very very unfair anyway) if they had allowed the other 95 people to share the reasonable chunk of cake which was left over. They still could have had a mini slice each. However, by taking 75% of that remaining cake away they reduced everyone else to having crumbs only.

I did admit my ignorance,  thank you very much.  Now I want to ask an honest question: There was a coin supply reduction,  was there not?  What was the significance of that?  I've read people complaining about that and I'm not sure what the issue is.  And I don't understand a lot of how crypto works (like masternodes).  I have used Dash and that's why I like it. 

to coin a phrase...

Beauty is in the eye of the bagholder.

Sometimes regardless of how many times the same observable evidence is analysed and the same reasonable conclusion is formed by the vast majority some people bagholding enough of x shitcoin will never accept that reasonable conclusion. Which is fine. All of us should be free to invest as we please.

It is when you try to tell persuade others that lack access to the facts that  your bags of dirt are bags of gold or continue to tell lies to stop others finding out the truth or from analysing these observable events for themselves.... that is when you are to be justly labelled untrustworthy.

You can not come up against hard observable evidence armed with excuses and foul language only. It serves no other purpose but to highlight those very things you wish to obscure from view.

Best to just hope people forget or at least forgive more over time.

the world may never know lol

I lost money on darkcoin (DASH). I bought a stack early on before I knew about the instamine. Once I realised the truth I sold for a loss and took the hit. I could have held onto my DASH in the hope of breaking even someday, but I just don't have enough time to follow threads and news for coins I KNOW will fail eventually. My most scarce resource is time! I did the exact same thing with bytecoin (BCN), once I knew it was a scam, I knew it would fail eventually, just not when, so I moved on to spend time resources looking for coins with better chances of mass adoption. I don't regret either decision.

Shitcoins that were fraudulently distributed and continue to be fraudulently distributed with a masternode scam that funnels coins to the insiders (who stole the instamine) perpetually while breaking the security of the anonymity are not bad coins by your illogic.

Nothing is bad. Just eat shit (feces) for breakfast please and report back on your health later.

When you don't understand, why can't you just admit to yourself that you don't understand.

Last time I checked, the colors black and white were distinct. Seems you live in a world with one color: grey. Fried eggs are grey, fried feces is grey, etc...

Well I will have to admit my own ignorance on a lot of things related to crypto.  But dash isn't a bad coin imo, as I said.  The greed and stupidity I was directing more toward the real shitcoins, i.e. the ones that don't even trade on all the exchanges and sell for single digit satoshis. 

Don't know about the dash ANN thread.  Much of what I learned about it was from related threads. 

I can somewhat understand that if we assume the date you registered here is when you got into crypto.

anyone who has been around since the xcoin/drk early days knows better.

I can relate to those who keep bringing up it's history over and over again. They don't want this instamined shitcoin to succeed just so a greedy and lying dev can get rich.


From wikipedia:
Within the first hour of launch, approximately 500,000 coins were mined, followed by another 1,000,000 coins in the next 7 hours and finally another 400,000 in 36 hours. All told 1.9 million coins were mined in 48 hours, or approximately 32% of a current supply (as of October 2015) of approximately 5.9 million,[28][29] generating controversy regarding the initial distribution of coins. According to Duffield, this was the result of an error in the code "which incorrectly converted the difficulty, then tried using a corrupt value to calculate the subsidy, causing the instamine".[30] At the time, Duffield was working a full-time job and coding for Dash on the side, so it's not surprising that there were errors in the initial code.[30] Duffield claims in the official bitcointalk.org thread (mirrored) that "Dash has no premine and was fairly and transparently launched".[31]

This should be warning enough for anyone with half a brain to stay away

So when you say, "I don't think there is any ongoing victimization. Initially with the lies and bs, yes, but anyone buying now I'd say has had fair warning" you believe that going onto the dash ANN and reading, "fairly and transparently launched" that that person has been fairly warned and is just a victim of their own greed or stupidity?

My point is that it takes time here and other places to learn the truth about dash (if at all, some seem to rationalize it away when finding out), and that blaming the victim for their ignorance is pretty absurd when the lie is being actively perpetrated by the developers and their community (though some in the community are just continuing the lie unwittingly).

Now if apply "Shitcoin buyers are victims of their own stupidity and greed" to "I don't think Dash is a bad coin by any means" it seems a fair assessment if someone has done the necessary due diligence in learning a bit about cryptosystems and concluded that they are all about equal and dash is as technically sound as another--though I would think ignorance (willful or not) would be the culprit of misdiagnosis in this case as much as stupidity or greed.

Shitcoin buyers are victims of their own stupidity and greed but in the case of Dash I don't think there's any ongoing victimization.   Initially with the lies and bs, yes, but anyone buying now I'd say has had fair warning.   I don't think Dash is a bad coin by any means.   Its future is uncertain,  but that's true of everything else in crypto up to and including bitcoin itself.

hehe



https://bitcointalksearch.org/topic/darkcoin-aka-dash-the-biggest-ongoing-scam-in-crypto-995710

https://bitcointalksearch.org/topic/scam-darkcoin-instamine-2-millions-drks-50-of-darkcoin-in-circulation-560138

https://bitcointalksearch.org/topic/darkcoin-now-known-as-dash-big-scam-lets-take-a-closer-look-559028


anyone who was told it was going to be a fair launch with no premine, no instamine and that you would have a fair chance to mine like every other launch - were scammed

they were then scammed harder when the minting was slashed to increase the instaminers swag bags.

If you don't see any scam then please go ahead and buy some over priced scam coins for 7 bucks that were being mined 1000s per min by the dev and his pals.

again read these threads - actually read them

https://bitcointalksearch.org/topic/darkcoin-aka-dash-the-biggest-ongoing-scam-in-crypto-995710

https://bitcointalksearch.org/topic/scam-darkcoin-instamine-2-millions-drks-50-of-darkcoin-in-circulation-560138

https://bitcointalksearch.org/topic/darkcoin-now-known-as-dash-big-scam-lets-take-a-closer-look-559028

get it those threads above???

again perhaps you didn't get the idea read those thread all the way through several times then come asking if anyone was scammed




https://bitcointalksearch.org/topic/darkcoin-aka-dash-the-biggest-ongoing-scam-in-crypto-995710

https://bitcointalksearch.org/topic/scam-darkcoin-instamine-2-millions-drks-50-of-darkcoin-in-circulation-560138

https://bitcointalksearch.org/topic/darkcoin-now-known-as-dash-big-scam-lets-take-a-closer-look-559028

those threads. Perhaps you are reading the wrong threads. I hope that now I have paste them 3x for you that you will start to notice those are the threads where your questions have been asked before and answered time and time again.


If you need directing to those threads again. Then ask and I will provide the links for you.

But smooth, "We're adults therefore any lies that we accept as true (even if advertised) are the fault of our not researching enough (even if developers are actively telling us otherwise), thus scams are impossible"--said the man before being convicted of securities fraud.

I recently answered on another thread:


Prime among those are the ones to whom the instaminers dumped their coins during the initial pump up to 0.0267, a price which has not be reached again in two years. That not only funded the project, it likely put a lot of money straight into insiders' pockets. Subsequent pumps and prices inflated by continued double-talk and spin from Evan and others have only added to their ranks.

Maybe your research should include the official announcement thread.

Look on page 6 for example:


Evan said he wouldn't launch after some hours... what happened? He launched after some hours...

1. I didn't ask about bitcoin or the 98% of alts that you claim equals none of them--I asked was dash's launch "fair," which is how it is advertised. A scam is advertising a known lie--most everyone else advertising a lie doesn't disqualify it as a scam.

2. No, that's incorrect. All coins have differing distributions. And based on the amount of coins concentrated in the top holder's hands and the rest of holder's hands, that coin can be qualified as having good or bad distribution, or at the very least better than other coins.

3. Running 11 chains together makes it 11 times as vulnerable as a single chain (a weakness in one is a weakess to them all), so when compared with a single algo that has been tested, you can say the single algorithm is more secure than running multiple hashes together because there is a bigger attack surface for an attacker. Broken isn't the point, the point is whether it is secure (when compared to available cryptosystems) or insecure.

4. Even Evan, the creator and lead developer of dash, has said that what you want in privacy is protocol-level anonymity. Who are you to disagree? I find this change in his stance laughable, because many in the cryptoworld have been saying it since he came out with the second rate privacy method that is darksend. Because he repeated the lie so long, many in the dash community are still defending what he has admitted unwanted and those defenders are using the same faulty arguments that he once endorsed--shadowcash enablers were tauting the same logic, "show me it's broken or STFU!" unitl someone broke it and shut them up. Theoretically it has been shown to be a suboptimal method for privacy--if you want to use it in the meantime, that's your prerogative, but don't expect any sympathy for using a system that even the developer of that system has acknowledged as second rate.

And yes, when I found out Bitcoin wasn't very casklike, I invested in coins claiming to be private and lost money on those coins when I sold them after researching enough to know the claims were bogus--dash (then darkcoin) was one of those coins.