Topic: Merit & new rank requirements - page 59. (Read 167726 times)

Yes, it looks very suspicious that maja39 received such a large number of merits for quite primitive and uninformative posts. Perhaps we are witnessing a merit trading case in the local branch. I think it`s necessary to report your distrust to the moderator.

Some users get it too easy, look at this:

https://bitcointalksearch.org/topic/meriti-i-pozicija-5031211

Post basically says "thank you friends for this and that"

and

https://bitcointalksearch.org/topic/annpredorodaja-leadrex-ai-platforma-za-kupovinu-sledbenika-4326270

this is question asking "what other platform integrations with Leadrexs you think of?"

The don’t really … It’s because there are different granularities in the timescale for the provided information. The rise on the 5,61% values is during the second week, thus accounting for 7 days in that percentage. The figures before that value in the table are on a daily scale (since I considered it more interesting to break down the first week by day granularity). The real rise is the 12,33% which agglutinates from the fourth week onwards (therefore a large interval of time potentially).

Yes, your statistics confirm my words. And if we look at "sMerit TXs merit posts after fourth weeks" we can see a fairly large percentage. Analyzing your data, the question may arise: why do the numbers go from larger to smaller and again to larger? I think this is due to the emergence of a huge number of new topics. Few people go further than the first page to participate in the discussion. Many folks open the newly created topic, in which there are still not many replies (thus increasing the chance that their message will be noticed) and discuss it there. After 2-3 days, and even more so a week, such “one-day threads” are lost and replaced with new ones.

But there`re also more serious discussions that last not a day or two, and in which you can find many worthy posts. Most often, such topics are joined by high rank members of the forum. Sometimes there`s a pause in such a discourse, but if the topic is relevant and of current interest, the dialogue continues, sowing the field to get more merits.

Just this week I was going over this question on a PM basis, and I drew up some summarized information from a global perspective on the gap between the moment you publish a post, and the moment it receives sMerit. This is a summary:

-   56% of sMerit TXs go to posts created within 24h (13,73% within the first hour, 10,05% within the second hour, and so on).
-   8,09% of sMerit TXs merit posts on the second day.
-   4,38% of sMerit TXs merit posts on the third day.
-   2,79% of sMerit TXs merit posts on the fourth day.
-   2,10% of sMerit TXs merit posts on the fifth day.
-   1,78% of sMerit TXs merit posts on the sixth day.
-   1,34% of sMerit TXs merit posts on the seventh day.
-   5,61% of sMerit TXs merit posts during the second week.
-   3,05% of sMerit TXs merit posts during the third week.
-   2,03% of sMerit TXs merit posts during the fourth week.
-   12,33% of sMerit TXs merit posts after fourth weeks (likely outliers related to posts by @Theymos, @Satoshi, merit abuse cover-ups, and so on).

The information above is derived from a post I created at the end of May 2018 (see Forum Merited Messages- Does size count?). Things may have shifted a bit since then, but it does give us a reference to what you were talking about.

When I hear someone declare that several good posts remain ignored and unrewarded, I immediately want to ask the question: what time frame are you talking about? If you`ve written a good post, it doesn`t mean it`ll immediately receive a merit. And don`t wait for it. Sometimes those posts are rewarded with merit, which, as it seems to you, have already been lost on the previous topic pages. But someone may notice and appreciate it. Don`t forget that merit is a completely subjective indicator. Your post can be differently evaluated by various people. And maybe it won`t receive merits immediately, but after some time. Every good statement deserves a merit. And your posts have no expiration date. Someone might like your other assertion and open your post history and stumble upon the observation you thought went unnoticed. Therefore, if someone hasn`t receive a merit within the first minutes after writing a comment, it doesn`t mean his post will never be rewarded.

Hey if they come here just to whine about the system then fk them! But if they Present ideas or solutions to the "problem" they think there is, I will gladly hear them out.


Exactly! People weren't making money back in the day through signature campaigns. I remember there was only one campaign of primedice. People used to spam more than 100 posts per week to get their 0.25 BTC. People hardly cared about the signature campaigns as there were far better ways to make money by offering different services. I don't know why people have this mindset of making "Ez" money by posting garbage which isn't true btw If you post garbage for a few weeks you won't get accepted into a decent campaign as far as I know. But these guys think its otherwise. I mean look at how many users got blacklisted in SMAS. Wish Lauda got back to the "managing" business. He was doing a fantastic job if you ask me.

---

Lol, Each time I read or type the word Legend wait for it "dary". This Dude comes to my mind.

---

Hmm interesting. It would be interesting to find out what is the average time for a post to get 'merited' and what's the chance of getting 'merited' after that average time has passed out. Obviously this stat will vary to different boards but still would be interesting. I hope DdmrDdmr can figure something out for this.

---

You got that wrong, that's not what he suggested. He is asking for sort of a small "div" to appear when he clicks the merit button and send merit directly from the same page, instead go going on a separate page to merit the user. Just imagine reddit opened a new tab each time a user had to upvote or downvote a post.

I don't think it's a good idea. Also, I think it was discussed previously. Initailly the system was that like you are asking.
Imagine, you are observing a thread and got one post to send merit and clicked. You are being left the thread. It's boring. It's better to open a new tab and merit them. You don't have to quit the thread. Isn't it better?

And here it is:

I don't feel very comfortable with this..yes, Satoshi is a recognized figure here and otherwise. His posts are historic and has some form of direction and inspiration but continual meriting such posts doesn't seem very ideal to me. Reflecting on the past is good not continual compensation rather that should be used to focus on the present. This doesn't mean value in satoshi's post or works will reduce neither will meriting it increase its value anymore than it is.



This is one of the reasons spamming/plagiarism/repetition is still a major issue the forum has to always combat. In as much as we all don't want to entirely admit it, we humans, always want recognition almost immediately at all point if possible. Yes, there are lazy users that has no interests in contributing positive but only after what the he/she can take from the system yet, there are still that few that don't mind contributing as long as the will get the recognition.

Now and then, I see posts of existing users on parma-ban for mostly plagiarism and I wonder if these long term users never read the rules or the chose to ignore and why... Some part of me feels this may be the reason coupled with other factors like the individual just being lazy. I know we can't go all a sore of meriting all quality posts and all that but we can always make efforts noticed even through our comments. I know alot of new users appreciates when hero/lengendary users comment and share ideas relating to the new user's quality post. It gives feelings that almost competes with the feeling that comes with a merit.

I get what you're saying and there's two sides to the argument with pros and cons each way, but this is a little different. I don't think you could ever make everyone happy, though. I'm with you that newcomers should probably just learn to deal with it, but that certainly is easier to say when we're already "legendary" -- uggh, does anyone else cringe typing that out or is it just me? I do think older users do have more of a right with where they are now compared to newbies who come here and just want to get paid so they should probably just learn to just accept with it, but that obviously isn't going to stop people from complaining about it.


Satoshi will certainly be the anomaly here, though. I'm sure other more active users and even some of the most prolific would have difficulty having their older posts merited to such an extent. Most will be long buried and forgotten, whereas satoshi's will always have a spotlight on them. Even theymos doesn't post that much compared to the rest of the community but he is the most merited user here according to the merit stats and that's probably because he gets a lot for stickies and announcements of rules changes and so forth -- or people just like to suck up to him lol.


Nobody is guaranteed any merits. You could write a thesis on bitcoin and it might not be merited for all sorts of reasons. The key is to keep making quality posts to increase your chances of receiving hallowed merit, but don't concern yourself with it too much and it will come to you over time I would think.

Unfortunately not each good post will bring you a merit, but if you wrote ten of them, the probability that you will be rewarded increases very much ...
This system isn't perfect... It isn't also always fair... sometimes poor posts receive many merits and great ones remain without any reward...
But as long the solution is based on people/users the system would be only as good as people involved in it...

as one said: "A chain is no stronger than its weakest link"



Yes, but it's very often true... ;-)
There will be always a spotlight on the Newbies but there's one solution - don't bother and do your job, when you wrote 5 - 10 - 15 good posts - I'm sure that other users stop comment your post that way...

In my observation, quality post doesn't entirely guarantee a merit at the end of the day especially for the new users. Why I say this is, I have seen good posts/topics that has no merit yet I and so many new users learnt alot from it. It becomes a problem when a new user struggles to contribute in a way and it passes by without any form of recognition (merit) but what hurts the most is when one reads comments that indirectly makes it look like you are try to give quality only because of the merits(of course, the merit is part of the reason) however, there was a good struggle and lots of reading and research in other to produce that quality post that is being tag as 'desperately looking for merits'. That hurts so much.

I have had friends here before me and I am the first that has some how gotten 1 merit. At the end, I look at the whole statement and ask if it is fair. I am beginning to believe that geo location can be an issue as well. As a nigerian, it is rare before you see someone here that has fair and credible knowledge in the cryto space despite the fact we already have investors in bitcoins and it's counterparts. The first day I created a topic, I got so many questions from my friends asking how I got so much information and able to comprehend this forum in general and I tell them to read and patiently observe. Yes, this seems to be the good thing this whole merit system has brought--patience and acquired knowledge over time.

Most of the issues new users have comes from other new users. my short time here, I have also seen shitposts and so many complains that already has a solution. As a newbie, which I am despite having Jr. Rank, i acknowledge that I previously came in here for the bounties/signature campaigns but alone the lines, I have dropped the idea for now because I subconsciously noticed that shouldn't be my focus and I had a long way to go here which is more than sign- campaigns right now.


My point is, I don't see much of an issue with the merit system rather the problem is with the users. I once read a thread that is asking for new merit source but I don't think that will take away the issue of meriting good posts. If we had a clean forum, less shit posts/spam/repetition/ and more innovative contents, meriting won't be so much of an issue because users with smerits will be able to quickly identify good posts and threads as well have the easy desire to go through the forum with being mentally harmed or annoyed by bad contents and overcrowding topics.

I don't know how it will impact the quality. Hope for the best but it will, at least, increase the productivity of sMerit. More people will be able to send sMerit. Thus, people complaining about the number of merit sources (some say we need more merit source) would be happy. Currently, most of the high ranked users don't give a fuck about merit. So, we are missing a lot of airdropped sMerit. If some people have the quality of gaining merit, s/he can probably have the ability to send Merit to qualitative posts. Thus, there will be more people for rewarding merits and as a result, the inequality for which some qualitative user may not get enough merit, will be fulfilled.

In another topic, theymos commented on Merit. It's relevant to this topic, so I'll quote it:
I've been ill for a few days, so my sMerit is piling up. Until now, the amount of Merit I gave for a post was more or less related to how much Merit I'd give to posts of similar quality. From now on, I'll give more if my supply is higher.

Note: suchmoon pointed out that theymos said this to a Merit source. I'm not sure if the same applies for other users.

I think that you are giving too much benefit of the doubt to true disgruntledness of whiners.  Just like the BIG blockers.  They whine for the mere sake of whining, and likely based on pretextualized exaggerations.  After one or two substantive responses in which you can point out logic or even that the new merit system is NOT as bad as it is made out to be, they keep up with their bullshit whining about unfairness... rather than figuring out some way to rank up, if their true intention was to rank up (and start to question intentions, too when there is so much whining accompanied by exaggerations).


Actually, there is likely little to no harm in giving a few charitable merits, here and there, and even making a few mistakes in giving merits when they were barely deserved because ultimately, the good posters are still going to shine through and the disingenuine posters are going to have difficulties keeping up appearances, even if they get a few charitable posts.  And, every once in a while some seemingly undeserving members will start to improve themselves (and they just get through the negative transition and start to meaningfully contribute to the forum by helping other members). 


Actually, there are some members who seem to take this whole ranking up system too personally.  A member can have all kinds of status in the real world and still be a very low ranking member in the forum.  Such discrepancy should not matter too much because forum rank does depend, in part, based on contributing to the forum rather than being a wonderful, credible and even powerful person IRL.  In any regard, sometimes the strength of actual IRL experiences will sometimes show through forum posts, too., and if forum members value those kinds of sharing of information, merits will likely follow.

I agree with you regarding the more elite of the signature campaigns, you cannot just rush and get into them, because the elite ones are at that status kind of by definition and their paying of higher rates allow them to be selective in their choice of new members (even existing members) because they either they pay above and beyond the rest or they have some real world status that also attracts more higher ranked members wanting to join.

That is why I said that we can't allow butthurt people to dictate terms but we as a community need to acknowledge that a system can be improved and we should be open to hearing everyone's thought. Just take your community suggestion thread as an example. 1 Merit rule came out of it and I am sure theymos will bring out another membership soon. We can't block out people who are genuinely interested in making the system better.

Keep making those posts and the merit will surely come.


But if this was the system theymos actually implemented then people would be crying about that and probably much more so than they do with the current system because it is incredibly more difficult to earn merit. People are so against this system they'll propose anything just so they can oppose it in some way.


He doesn't even need any additional merits to join the campaign he keeps trying to; all he needs is to make decent posts, but I'm not going to merit people just for complaining at the system, especially when they're suggesting something much worse, but wouldn't have an issue in meriting other posts of his. He's just needlessly whining because he's not automatically a Hero or Legendary and this prevents him earning maximum in most campaigns but is irrelevant to Chipmixer so if I was him I'd just concentrate on my posts rather than anything else.

Yes, I agree that merit cannot be universalized, and we shouldn`t evaluate only this indicator. But I think that of all the factors (activity, number of posts), the most significant is precisely the merit, since it demonstrates how much this member of the forum is valued by other users. The cons of merit - its subjectivity - becomes its pros, since the main goal of the forum is communication, and it`s never objective.

I don`t think that a significant amount of merit, sent for posts that were written a long time ago, is a shortcoming or flaw in the system (even if these users are no longer as active as they were before). After all, the quality of the written comment doesn`t depend on the activity / inactivity of a member of the forum during a given period of time. Merit`s designed to evaluate a specific post, and not the history of the user as a whole.

Quoting some posts is not a problem and in fact it is necessary sometimes, but doing it too often, or adding too many lengthy quotes into your posts will bore most of the users. You should also remember that there are many threads where most of posts haven't received good merits or any merits at all.

As JayJuanGee said, that you should give some time to research and learning here so you can contribute some good stuff to the forum that will probably be admired by the active and contributing users of forum. You should also read the posts that have been merited most of the time so you can see which posts can get you merits for your contributions.

You can check  LoyceV thread https://bitcointalksearch.org/topic/most-merited-topics-sum-of-op-posts-updated-5053587 where he listed most merited topics as it can give you some insight to posts topics that have been admired, and have gained the posters as well as other contributors some merit points.

You characterized your post history as "decent contributions," and personally, I would take issue with your characterization, even if you might well be capable of making decent contributions, you may need to study a bit more into how other members are receiving merits, because receiving merits does not seem to be beyond your abilities.. You just need to spend some time actually making decent contributions, and for members to get to know you and to appreciate your contributions... that recognition is generally not going to come through threads in which the vast majority of participants seem to be engaged in pump and dump get rich scheming - those folks may not even have any merits to give... so there are a lot of other threads in which you can actually participate - including reading some of the prior posts in order to engage with current and relevant topics of the thread.