MicroStrategy’s Bitcoin portfolio surpasses $20B, ROI now over 100%

Poker Player

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Quote from: ? on November 13, 2024, 02:27:52 AM

So he gets the funds from borrows and gets them into BTC straight up?
Smart guy Tongue

Well, actually what he is doing is kind of printing fiat money through derivative products and with that fiat money acquiring more bitcoin. I'm going to quote myself from another thread so that it is understood how he is increasing the amount of bitcoin per share for his shareholders every time he goes into debt.

Quote from: Poker Player on November 14, 2024, 12:03:26 AM

For example, convertible notes can be redeemed for shares (never for bitcoin) and are bought at a premium over shares. The shares also have a premium over the net asset value, which is basically the bitcoin owned by the company.

So, when they issue $1B of convertible notes, they do so on a Net Asset Value of say $0.5B, and what do they do with that $1B? They buy bitcoin. They are using the financial instrument to get fiat money to buy bitcoin.

Also convertible notes are not problematic at all because if people start exchanging them for shares you can always create more, similar to how a FED can print more fiat.

If anyone is concerned about this type of indebtedness I have to say that I, as a good shareholder, have looked at the fundamentals of the company and it has a debt to equity ratio of 1.13 which falls within a very reasonable range of indebtedness, and if we also take into account that the company is borrowing at laughable prices, clearly lower than the inflation rate, we will agree with Saylor that the debt they use to acquire bitcoin is issued and controlled in a smart way.

X-ray

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Quote from: dzungmobile on November 14, 2024, 06:48:21 AM

They actually started to DCA since the last market cycle, during its bull run, and continued DCAing in a bear market in 2022 and 2023 years. Now in 2024 they are enjoying sweet results but Michael Saylor said "Bitcoin is the end game" and they will not sell bitcoin for cash. Their DCA will continue in this market cycle and many more years, and I only wonder when they will sell part of their bitcoin.

I guess if they can find a way to make money by holding bitcoin they will never sell it at all and what I mean by that is not the capital gain from BTC but making side business sort of like lending or something.
I'd think that MSTR as a company already have a plan on their sleeve and at some point they will implement it, the fact that saylor is so confident and kept saying that they won't sell BTC maybe a signal that they gonna have something on the table.

dzungmobile

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Quote from: X-ray on November 13, 2024, 08:53:16 PM

can you imagine a company performs this good just because they hold BTC? best strategy ever in my opinion and I doubt any other companies could replicate the same thing.

I did imagine it because I as a Bitcoin investor and Bitcoiner, have very strong belief in future of Bitcoin.

About MicroStrategy, their success recent years not only comes from Bitcoin investment, it is a main contributor for their success, not there are other contributors for it too. Because MicroStrategy is a company with many products that all contribute to their company's revenue and success.

Quote

but the MSTR's holding of BTC and their style of keep doing DCA from bottom all the way to current ATH is a phenomenon that needs to be studied Grin

. they are confidence they'd be able to pull it off and indeed they are capable.

They actually started to DCA since the last market cycle, during its bull run, and continued DCAing in a bear market in 2022 and 2023 years. Now in 2024 they are enjoying sweet results but Michael Saylor said "Bitcoin is the end game" and they will not sell bitcoin for cash. Their DCA will continue in this market cycle and many more years, and I only wonder when they will sell part of their bitcoin.

X-ray

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I've seen before that there were so many doubters saying MSTR's strategy in holding BTC as reckless but now they come out on the top.

can you imagine a company performs this good just because they hold BTC? best strategy ever in my opinion and I doubt any other companies could replicate the same thing.

but the MSTR's holding of BTC and their style of keep doing DCA from bottom all the way to current ATH is a phenomenon that needs to be studied Grin

. they are confidence they'd be able to pull it off and indeed they are capable.

SquirrelJulietGarden

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Quote from: TravelMug on November 13, 2024, 05:19:03 AM

Saylor and his company right now are raking billions in profits because of their Bitcoin investment. And yeah, there have been attacks on him, mocking him in social media and even those who interview him. Now the tables are turn, and he is being look upon as some visionary. But for average joe investors like the rest of us, we have seen this from afar, that in his bull run, we will see 6 digits figure, it just a matter of time.

They are witnessing growth of their portfolio but they have yet harvesting it without any cash out. It's controversial that why they need to cash out to exchange bitcoin to cash, from a valuable asset to a decreasing value asset.

This market cycle is a second one for Saylor and Microstrategy and I wonder that will they miss another chance to take profit. In a first cycle, they would have not thought that Bitcoin will continue its 4-year market cycle with participation of Microstrategy, Tesla, El Salvador Bitcoin Legal Tender. Now, in this second market cycle they engage in, will they simply hold through this cycle when they know bear market will come.

Z-tight

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Quote from: TravelMug on November 13, 2024, 05:19:03 AM

But for average joe investors like the rest of us, we have seen this from afar, that in his bull run, we will see 6 digits figure, it just a matter of time.

That is certainly going to happen, right now the price is ~ $92k, so many of us didn't expect it to even go higher than $85k this year, but it has already smashed that and it is now on its way to $100k. If BTC breaks $100k this year, it is exciting to think about what could come next year, at the peak of this cycle, isn't it a good time to have some BTC in your wallet.

TravelMug

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Quote from: lovesmayfamilis on November 13, 2024, 03:00:32 AM

I wonder how many people who actively discouraged everyone from investing in Bitcoin are now scratching their heads and admitting to themselves their stupidity. And also how many of those who believed them and could not decide to save regularly, fearing losses and looking for insurance? These people will never decide to invest and are now tearing out the last hair on their heads, but one example of Michael Saylor and all those who stubbornly believed in the growth of Bitcoin can give a good motivation to other newcomers who are just learning about Bitcoin.

That will always happen and I doubt that they will change their stance. They might be hiding the rock right now just to avoid what they are seeing as the price reaches $90k already. And for those people who believed individuals that are anti-Bitcoin, it could really be hurtful on them and could be suffering "emotional damage",

.

Saylor and his company right now are raking billions in profits because of their Bitcoin investment. And yeah, there have been attacks on him, mocking him in social media and even those who interview him. Now the tables are turn, and he is being look upon as some visionary. But for average joe investors like the rest of us, we have seen this from afar, that in his bull run, we will see 6 digits figure, it just a matter of time.

?

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Quote from: lovesmayfamilis on November 13, 2024, 03:00:32 AM

I wonder how many people who actively discouraged everyone from investing in Bitcoin are now scratching their heads and admitting to themselves their stupidity. And also how many of those who believed them and could not decide to save regularly, fearing losses and looking for insurance? These people will never decide to invest and are now tearing out the last hair on their heads, but one example of Michael Saylor and all those who stubbornly believed in the growth of Bitcoin can give a good motivation to other newcomers who are just learning about Bitcoin.

They are an example for people to come - and it's great that somebody so high in perspective was so stubborn with BTC. It paid off for him and others - so it would for others too (no matter how small or big their deposits would be, it's all about scale).

lovesmayfamilis

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✿♥‿♥✿

I wonder how many people who actively discouraged everyone from investing in Bitcoin are now scratching their heads and admitting to themselves their stupidity. And also how many of those who believed them and could not decide to save regularly, fearing losses and looking for insurance? These people will never decide to invest and are now tearing out the last hair on their heads, but one example of Michael Saylor and all those who stubbornly believed in the growth of Bitcoin can give a good motivation to other newcomers who are just learning about Bitcoin.

OcTradism

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Quote from: aoluain on November 12, 2024, 06:42:51 PM

I think MS had a moment of realisation a few years ago which made him become
a doubter to an absolute 101% Bitcoin guru.

There are many reasons for him to change his mind because it's easily to look at Bitcoin designs, from decentralization, full control for owners, total supply, he can see lights of his investment career. He joined later than others but not too late, and in fact much sooner than many other people.

Bitcoin's controlled supply.
Bitcoin's Equivalent Network Time and its changes with time.

Two insightful articles about Bitcoin total supply that can change many people.
How is the 21 million bitcoin cap defined and enforced?
Can Bitcoin's hard cap of 21 millions be changed?

Quote

MS has been able to convey to anyone willing to listen what Bitcoin can offer
everyone from now into the future.

He does it because he loves to see Bitcoin adoption to rise, more capital flows into Bitcoin market, and he is smart enough to know great impact of Supply and Demand Principle. More demand from more new people on Bitcoin, Bitcoin price will consequently rise upwards to the moon.

_act_

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Quote from: adultcrypto on November 13, 2024, 12:52:09 AM

Now those who openly criticized bitcoin can hide their faces in shame because they have been wrong all along.

This is what I thought it would be but it is not. People like Peter Sheriff has continued to criticize bitcoin. When gold was rising before it fall recently, I saw him still continue to criticize bitcoin which I think he was motivated at the time by gold rising price. Now he has even gone more to the wrong way by not only criticizing bitcoin alone anymore but now criticizing bitcoin people like Michael Saylor. People like him let me understand that you can be rich and be fooling people.

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Quote from: Poker Player on November 13, 2024, 12:24:22 AM

Quote from: Smartprofit on November 11, 2024, 09:55:41 AM

Michael Saylor not only buys real bitcoins, his company also issues stocks and bonds. He is an experienced businessman from Wall Street and seeks to buy assets not with his own money, but by attracting funds from others.

Few people have understood the latest move he has made, which has turned his company from an intelligence business software company to a bitcoin derivative product development company, in the same way Rockefeller treated oil to obtain the derivatives gasoline, diesel or kerosene.

What he is doing is borrowing fiat, in a smart way with a good debt to equity ratio and at a very low interest rate of less than 1% (which in itself means making money on inflation) to generate yield on bitcoin.

If it succeeds, which everything looks like it will, this will be studied in economics and business schools.

So he gets the funds from borrows and gets them into BTC straight up?
Smart guy Tongue

betswift

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Quote from: dunfida on November 13, 2024, 12:50:31 AM

Quote from: _act_ on November 11, 2024, 05:19:11 AM

You can easily understand what this thread is about from the topic title. You can read it in details yourselves: https://cointelegraph.com/news/microstrategy-bitcoin-portfolio-surpass-20-billion

Bitcoin has disappointed bitcoin critics like Peter Sheriff and Warren Buffett. Those that hold their coins are not disappointed. I can remember Peter Sheriff saying bitcoin is backed by nothing that its price is going to zero. But bitcoin is over $80000 right now.

Bitcoin also helped Microstrategy Inc MSTR to increase in price and value. Micheal Saylor is a good business man.

Wont really be believing into those words specially negative ones with those billionaires on which we dont even know that they've been holding Bitcoin in silence and really just that pretending that they are against with it.

I wont really be that surprised that one day they will really be that become that pro-Bitcoin and admitted that they had bought tons of it and planning to hold for long term. One of the most common behavior of these billionaires or institutions is that they dont really like on getting caught on what they are doing but instead they do just accept that they might look bad in the eyes of public but secretly trying out to accumulate
not until on the moment that they had accumulated enough and then dump in one go.

The bad thing about having these institutions being accumulating tons of coins is that they can dump it anytime whenever the time is right.

Institutions will have regulations imposed on them, as far as I think and know. About the dumping of their coins.
About the rich people getting some BTC - they would be only a fracture and won't make that of a difference, in my opinion.
Tongue

FortuneFollower

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Quote from: adultcrypto on November 13, 2024, 12:52:09 AM

Quote from: _act_ on November 11, 2024, 05:19:11 AM

You can easily understand what this thread is about from the topic title. You can read it in details yourselves: https://cointelegraph.com/news/microstrategy-bitcoin-portfolio-surpass-20-billion

Bitcoin has disappointed bitcoin critics like Peter Sheriff and Warren Buffett. Those that hold their coins are not disappointed. I can remember Peter Sheriff saying bitcoin is backed by nothing that its price is going to zero. But bitcoin is over $80000 right now.

Bitcoin also helped Microstrategy Inc MSTR to increase in price and value. Micheal Saylor is a good business man.

Microstrategy deserve some applause because they surprised everyone with their unwavering faith in bitcoin. From no where they have come to dominate the bitcoin market, taking exemplary position in the affair of anything that represent bitcoin. They have shown people the art of wealth building their dogged and resilient investment in bitcoin. Now those who openly criticized bitcoin can hide their faces in shame because they have been wrong all along.

More big guys are coming to see the beauty of BTC and try to get a fish from the lake with it.
Alas, it's inevitable that with time going on, more and more funds from bigger entities and smaller ones will pour into BTC. And it will be done for long-term profits only.

adultcrypto

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Quote from: _act_ on November 11, 2024, 05:19:11 AM

You can easily understand what this thread is about from the topic title. You can read it in details yourselves: https://cointelegraph.com/news/microstrategy-bitcoin-portfolio-surpass-20-billion

Bitcoin has disappointed bitcoin critics like Peter Sheriff and Warren Buffett. Those that hold their coins are not disappointed. I can remember Peter Sheriff saying bitcoin is backed by nothing that its price is going to zero. But bitcoin is over $80000 right now.

Bitcoin also helped Microstrategy Inc MSTR to increase in price and value. Micheal Saylor is a good business man.

Microstrategy deserve some applause because they surprised everyone with their unwavering faith in bitcoin. From no where they have come to dominate the bitcoin market, taking exemplary position in the affair of anything that represent bitcoin. They have shown people the art of wealth building their dogged and resilient investment in bitcoin. Now those who openly criticized bitcoin can hide their faces in shame because they have been wrong all along.

dunfida

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Quote from: _act_ on November 11, 2024, 05:19:11 AM

You can easily understand what this thread is about from the topic title. You can read it in details yourselves: https://cointelegraph.com/news/microstrategy-bitcoin-portfolio-surpass-20-billion

Bitcoin has disappointed bitcoin critics like Peter Sheriff and Warren Buffett. Those that hold their coins are not disappointed. I can remember Peter Sheriff saying bitcoin is backed by nothing that its price is going to zero. But bitcoin is over $80000 right now.

Bitcoin also helped Microstrategy Inc MSTR to increase in price and value. Micheal Saylor is a good business man.

Wont really be believing into those words specially negative ones with those billionaires on which we dont even know that they've been holding Bitcoin in silence and really just that pretending that they are against with it.

I wont really be that surprised that one day they will really be that become that pro-Bitcoin and admitted that they had bought tons of it and planning to hold for long term. One of the most common behavior of these billionaires or institutions is that they dont really like on getting caught on what they are doing but instead they do just accept that they might look bad in the eyes of public but secretly trying out to accumulate
not until on the moment that they had accumulated enough and then dump in one go.

The bad thing about having these institutions being accumulating tons of coins is that they can dump it anytime whenever the time is right.

Poker Player

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Quote from: Smartprofit on November 11, 2024, 09:55:41 AM

Michael Saylor not only buys real bitcoins, his company also issues stocks and bonds. He is an experienced businessman from Wall Street and seeks to buy assets not with his own money, but by attracting funds from others.

Few people have understood the latest move he has made, which has turned his company from an intelligence business software company to a bitcoin derivative product development company, in the same way Rockefeller treated oil to obtain the derivatives gasoline, diesel or kerosene.

What he is doing is borrowing fiat, in a smart way with a good debt to equity ratio and at a very low interest rate of less than 1% (which in itself means making money on inflation) to generate yield on bitcoin.

If it succeeds, which everything looks like it will, this will be studied in economics and business schools.

aoluain

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Quote from: OcTradism on November 12, 2024, 02:20:18 AM

Quote from: davis196 on November 12, 2024, 02:04:37 AM

OK, Saylor has placed his bet on the best financial asset, but to be honest, I don't care.

Michael Saylor changed his mind on Bitcoin from against it to believe it and it takes him several years to realize good things and potentiality of Bitcoin. It's certainly that he did not change his mind because of a dream to be rich or whatever and he actually changed his mind after doing his due diligent research on Bitcoin and finding some great things in it.

This process does not make his investment in Bitcoin as a Bet, it's never a bet in Michael Saylor's thinking.

Quote

Even if the Bitcoin price hits 100K USD, there will still be Bitcoin haters complaining about "the Bitcoin price bubble" and spreading all kinds of FUD.

It will hit $100,000 and only time matters. From about $90,000 to $100,000, it's not too far to the target price, 10% rise and it will be easy reached if market has a short squeeze.

I think MS had a moment of realisation a few years ago which made him become
a doubter to an absolute 101% Bitcoin guru.

MS has been able to convey to anyone willing to listen what Bitcoin can offer
everyone from now into the future.

The best analogy he used was the Block of Ice melting in the back yard in terms
of FIAT.

In terms of other doubters, I believe that in time they will all come around and realise
they need to have Bitcoin.

Quote from: pakhitheboss on November 12, 2024, 05:04:54 AM

Quote from: FortuneFollower on November 12, 2024, 02:56:43 AM

Usually, bigger entities don't see BTC for what it is and don't wait for the situation to change - they cash it out just like they bought it Grin

Or due to regulations, they need to.
Those who dig deeper know what awaits them for holding.
And, as fruktik said - there may be a correction, a big one at that, that would swoop everybody in an instance.

I get your point but those who are into Bitcoin are now laughing on the action taken by Germany. Countries like El Salvador are enjoying the profits gained from thier Bitcoin holdings.

For everything that goes up it is certain at some point it will go down. A correction is coming but it won't be coming this year. I feel it will happen next year as it happened in 2018.

The German government by law are not allowed to make profits from the
proceeds of crime and that goes for the Bitcoin they sold - by law they had to
make that move.

Its only a matter of time before all countries start buying Bitcoin especially
if Trump starts doing it.

Z-tight

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Quote from: pakhitheboss on November 12, 2024, 02:26:00 PM

What are you drinking?

Water.

Quote from: pakhitheboss on November 12, 2024, 02:26:00 PM

The whole Europe is getting fucked up because of the Ukraine war. That is the only reason why they sold those Bitcoin on open market. They as in the German government never used secondary market to sell your BTC50K.

I never made any mention of the 'market' in which the coins were sold, that is not even the point here, that is if you read my post before this rant. The German government is bound by law to sell assets recovered in criminal cases, if the assets are volatile and can lose some of its value, BTC is volatile and that is why they sold. People are talking about how much they could have made if they were still holding, what if the price fell and then they still had to sell it at a loss.

Quote from: pakhitheboss on November 12, 2024, 02:26:00 PM

I am suprised to see support from guys like you. Earlier I saw another high ranking member going all about, the need for Germany to sell those BTC. Stop bugging me and understand the reason why Germany failed to nail it.

What support are you talking about, i am not from Germany, i don't care what their government does, i only care about BTC. Stop ranting and understand what my point is clearly.

Jegileman

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I could remember when Microstrategy where buying bitcoin in intervals and enriching their portfolio, they had a lot of critics and mocking them to risk losing a lot of money as bitcoin will become worthless in the future. Micheal Saylor still didn’t mind any of those critics and continued accumulating more and more bitcoin by taking advantage of the dips. This is just few years later and they are already in big profit in their investment in bitcoin. Only the patient and trustworthy ones can have a conviction on bitcoin to do well after so many bearish moments in the market before breaking the all time high and setting a new one now.

Topic: MicroStrategy’s Bitcoin portfolio surpasses $20B, ROI now over 100% (Read 505 times)