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Topic: Mooncoin taken over by the feds? - page 2. (Read 14994 times)

sr. member
Activity: 350
Merit: 250
September 30, 2011, 09:41:28 PM
Following up to my last post. Christian Verdun lurked in irc as 'upisdown' in #bitcoin-otc. His OTC rating is here.

awesome rating 'took BTC and ran'
whoever ran moonco.in did it out of their home thru http://www.netdorm.com/

don't know why anybody trusted that site.

 
sr. member
Activity: 574
Merit: 250
September 30, 2011, 09:11:38 PM
Federal rap happy campers:

The crime of wire fraud is codified at 18 U.S.C. § 1343, and reads as follows:

    Whoever, having devised or intending to devise any scheme or artifice to defraud, or for obtaining money or property by means of false or fraudulent pretenses, representations, or promises, transmits or causes to be transmitted by means of wire, radio, or television communication in interstate or foreign commerce, any writings, signs, signals, pictures, or sounds for the purpose of executing such scheme or artifice, shall be fined under this title or imprisoned not more than 20 years, or both. If the violation affects a financial institution, such person shall be fined not more than $1,000,000 or imprisoned not more than 30 years, or both.

But if you want to take your chances with California as the venue, perhaps a quick scan of the following sections is also in order:

With respect to actions taken involving financial instruments and agencies of transaction-

California Penal Code Sections 186.9 - 186.10

With respect to actions taken involving mining and the value of the product of mining-

California Penal Code Section 487d

NB- this is the State that had 49er's and mining as their economic mainstay long before football was invented, they take people screwing around with "mining" in any form very seriously indeed. Thou shalt not fuck with another man's mine, his mining equipment or tools.

With respect to larceny or embezzlement of articles of value and negotiable instruments-

California Penal Code Section 501

With respect to computer or internet based crimes-

California Penal Code Section 502

NB- oops, you picked a venue that actually knows a thing or two about hacking, jacking and wire fraud. They actually have more laws about computer crime in print than they do for prostitution, imagine that!

I'll save everyone the eyeball bandwidth repeating those sections here in toto, but whoever did this is looking at multiple felony counts, and at least $250,000 in fines per count. And every criminal diversion above $250 is a felony count for the fine. Hmm, $20,000 divided into $250 counts equals 80 felony counts, which at a cool quarter mil a pop will have you clipping coupons in the Grey Bar Hotel at San Quentin for probably the rest of your adult lifetime.
legendary
Activity: 1918
Merit: 1570
Bitcoin: An Idea Worth Spending
September 30, 2011, 08:33:45 PM
trollcrime lol




I'm sure we all have one of these in our closets:



Wow, so trolling is a misdemeanor? What happened with freedom of speech?

Trolling is a misdemeanor, and freedom of speech is a misnomer.
hero member
Activity: 868
Merit: 1000
September 30, 2011, 07:58:44 PM
Wow, so trolling is a misdemeanor? What happened with freedom of speech?

Never mind.  If Coin Hunter's worried about internet lawyers, he can always retain SomethingAwful's favourite counsel (god knows SA gets enough threats from internet lawyers, and even the occasional real one).

http://www.somethingawful.com/hosted/crabs/
sr. member
Activity: 350
Merit: 250
September 30, 2011, 07:52:15 PM
trollcrime lol


legendary
Activity: 1918
Merit: 1570
Bitcoin: An Idea Worth Spending
September 30, 2011, 07:50:39 PM
Quote
Christian Verdun advised me that the site is not his as I misunderstood rambling explanation.

Does his own brother have trouble understanding him?

hero member
Activity: 616
Merit: 500
Firstbits.com/1fg4i :)
September 30, 2011, 04:50:40 PM
Wow, so trolling is a misdemeanor? What happened with freedom of speech?
legendary
Activity: 1148
Merit: 1008
If you want to walk on water, get out of the boat
September 30, 2011, 12:16:28 PM
Lol, this is so scam  Cheesy
sr. member
Activity: 252
Merit: 251
September 30, 2011, 11:43:17 AM
Sorry Christian I've had to put you on ignore to avoid any contact with you going forward, not sure what you said this time.  Grin
member
Activity: 322
Merit: 10
September 30, 2011, 11:35:48 AM
He sent you the following message:

Quote
Christian Verdun advised me that the site is not his as I misunderstood rambling explanation. I do not do computer jargon and do not have a great grasp on what the situation is, but apparently he is being alleged to be connected to a site that he tells me he is not. Again, that is not my concern. I do, however, request that you discontinue all communications with him as I previously advised.

Please stop harassing me, I used the site but I was not involved in it. I spent the last summer busy with a field research (plant science) internship and working on art. I go to a school with the quarter system, I have no time for anything so accusing me makes no sense.

sr. member
Activity: 252
Merit: 251
September 30, 2011, 11:31:23 AM
Andre Verdun, Christian's brother? who by chance happens to be a lawyer replied to an email I sent requesting information.

Christian Verdun has now been verified as mr_moon. Christian's lies in this thread say a lot I think.

http://solidcointalk.org/topic/204-what-happen-to-mooncoin/page__view__findpost__p__2112
member
Activity: 322
Merit: 10
September 30, 2011, 11:14:23 AM
I would like to remind everyone of California Law

"California Penal Code Section 653m

(a) Every person who, with intent to annoy, telephones or
makes contact by means of an electronic communication device with
another and addresses to or about the other person any obscene
language or addresses to the other person any threat to inflict
injury to the person or property of the person addressed or any
member of his or her family, is guilty of a misdemeanor. Nothing in
this subdivision shall apply to telephone calls or electronic
contacts made in good faith.
   (b) Every person who, with intent to annoy or harass, makes
repeated telephone calls or makes repeated contact by means of an
electronic communication device, or makes any combination of calls or
contact, to another person is, whether or not conversation ensues
from making the telephone call or contact by means of an electronic
communication device, guilty of a misdemeanor. Nothing in this
subdivision shall apply to telephone calls or electronic contacts
made in good faith or during the ordinary course and scope of
business.
   (c) Any offense committed by use of a telephone may be deemed to
have been committed when and where the telephone call or calls were
made or received. Any offense committed by use of an electronic
communication device or medium, including the Internet, may be deemed
to have been committed when and where the electronic communication
or communications were originally sent or first viewed by the
recipient.
   (d) Subdivision (a) or (b) is violated when the person acting with
intent to annoy makes a telephone call or contact by means of an
electronic communication device requesting a return call and performs
the acts prohibited under subdivision (a) or (b) upon receiving the
return call.
   (e) Subdivision (a) or (b) is violated when a person knowingly
permits any telephone or electronic communication under the person's
control to be used for the purposes prohibited by those subdivisions.
   (f) If probation is granted, or the execution or imposition of
sentence is suspended, for any person convicted under this section,
the court may order as a condition of probation that the person
participate in counseling.
   (g) For purposes of this section, the term "electronic
communication device" includes, but is not limited to, telephones,
cellular phones, computers, video recorders, facsimile machines,
pagers, personal digital assistants, smartphones, and any other
device that transfers signs, signals, writing, images, sounds, or
data. "Electronic communication device" also includes, but is not
limited to, videophones, TTY/TDD devices, and all other devices used
to aid or assist communication to or from deaf or disabled persons.
"Electronic communication" has the same meaning as the term defined
in Subsection 12 of Section 2510 of Title 18 of the United States
Code."

This is not a warning. In our country you cannot harass someone based on the vague assumption they wronged you - if you have evidence take it to the authorities. I'm getting caught up in unfair vigilante justice, internet detectives have been wrong in the past and they are wrong now. This has gone beyond trolling, I'm being made a convenient scapegoat despite clear evidence of me being on a different IP as the same time as the supposed scammer.
hero member
Activity: 686
Merit: 500
Wat
September 29, 2011, 09:20:10 PM
#99
I am not involved in any of this. I do not appreciate the threats thrown around considering how flimsy the evidence is.

I do have shared internet in my apartment/dorm (It's included in the rent, like our water), and I think its far more plausible someone else in Davis knows about bitcoins rather then me being some mastermind computer scammer. I also don't know how to program (not unless you count html/css) so that makes it a rather odd accusation, I study plant sciences (breeding) and do design work (I'm an artist).

If you are still convinced it is me, I encourage you to use legal channels because I'm not guilty and have nothing to hide from the police.

I would not appreciate being harassed because I have the same IP as some reported scammer (when in college towns most internet arrangements are shared). Comcast gives out dynamic IP addresses. Isn't it possible too that some computer scientist here in Davis could have the ability to hack wireless signal of an apartment/dorm and use their internet?

Full disclosure: I had used mooncoin too because it is open source (I love the idea of open source anything see:artwork) and I had lost some print money (not much). I did speak with him when the site was just btc poker site posted on reddit, he was talkative and seemed nice. I hadn't talked to him since.

I have sold art work for bitcoins, a fair amount, and I believe everyone of my customers has only positive feedback.

Edit: The above post shows me logged into irc at the same time as mr_moon but with a different ip. We are clearly different people, this should be enough lay to rest any claims that I am mr_moon.


 





Christian Verdun (T) upisdown.809 [email protected]


Just admit it.
newbie
Activity: 56
Merit: 0
September 29, 2011, 11:58:44 AM
#98
Imagine your local square-jawed, earnest, clean-cut G-Man, taking that report and telling his boss that he has a crime to solve. Or, they can look for real bank robbers. Where do you think the energy is going to get spent?

 Undecided  That is a problem with notifying any law enforcement agency including local police and FBI.  I can't imagine trying to explain this to local police and expecting them to take action.  I doubt they know or care about what Bitcoin is, and the scammer probably isn't in this region.  At least the FBI has made attempts to learn about bitcoin, and has a mechanism for reporting such crimes.  If enough people report there, I'm sure they will take action.  The UC Davis police have other reasons to investigate.  Regarding the value of what was stolen, I'm pretty sure it was more than a typical bank robbery.
legendary
Activity: 1918
Merit: 1570
Bitcoin: An Idea Worth Spending
September 29, 2011, 11:51:21 AM
#97
Quote
This message comes up if you try to visit moonco.in in Chrome...
This is probably not the site you are looking for! You attempted to reach moonco.in, but instead you actually reached a server identifying itself as www.ice.gov. This may be caused by a misconfiguration on the server or by something more serious. An attacker on your network could be trying to get you to visit a fake (and potentially harmful) version of moonco.in. You should not proceed.
Help me understand When you connect to a secure website, the server hosting that site presents your browser with something called a "certificate" to verify its identity. This certificate contains identity information, such as the address of the website, which is verified by a third party that your computer trusts. By checking that the address in the certificate matches the address of the website, it is possible to verify that you are securely communicating with the website you intended, and not a third party (such as an attacker on your network).
In this case, the address listed in the certificate does not match the address of the website your browser tried to go to. One possible reason for this is that your communications are being intercepted by an attacker who is presenting a certificate for a different website, which would cause a mismatch. Another possible reason is that the server is set up to return the same certificate for multiple websites, including the one you are attempting to visit, even though that certificate is not valid for all of those websites. Google Chrome can say for sure that you reached www.ice.gov, but cannot verify that that is the same site as moonco.in which you intended to reach. If you proceed, Chrome will not check for any further name mismatches. In general, it is best not to proceed past this point.

So, ICE doesn't care the least that people can use their name whenever they want?

sr. member
Activity: 574
Merit: 250
September 29, 2011, 11:28:35 AM
#96
@Electric- I missed the IP hit on a campus computer, that makes the UCD police a much better resource, but the bottom line is the FBI, while they do maintain a reporting infrastructure, don't devote any appreciable resources to a crime counted in tens of thousands of dollars in a theoretical currency that has just popped up on their radar. Imagine the prosecutor trying to justify the charges to a US Attorney by explaining the the value stolen was based on hash function solutions in a distributed network, and that value established by pure market forces generated real time in a peer to peer virtual trading floor. That, coincidentally, they have no oversight on, has no regulatory authority, has no precedence in law, and is operated pretty much anonymously.

That is a giant can of caveat emptor that they will never trouble themselves with. They can't legislate it, they can't slap handcuffs on it, and they can't get media time telling the world how great of a job they did attacking it, let alone being able to explain it. You sent some funny crypto money analog off to an online thingy that sort of said you would get some sort of return back in more or other crypto money analog, and then the thingy disappeared, and the nicknamed people behind the thingy claim that somebody else stole their nicknames and turned off the gizmo that held all the crypto money analog. Imagine your local square-jawed, earnest, clean-cut G-Man, taking that report and telling his boss that he has a crime to solve. Or, they can look for real bank robbers. Where do you think the energy is going to get spent?

In terms of taking action, outing the alleged criminal in public discussion is probably the best path, tar and feather their activities with righteous fury. If you want to follow that up with action, filing a report with your local law enforcement will get you a lot further than doing it remotely with the cops where the perp lives. I propose civil actions because you can win by default, and then the system will work for you, albeit at a glacial pace. And one day, probably a couple of years from now, the sheriffs will seize his property, have a sheriff's auction and the proceeds will be split up by the creditors, and you might be able to implement a garnishment against his wages, assuming he has any non sub-rosa income.

My caution for non-Americans was just a sad statement that our law enforcement will do very little to resolve their claims, and if by some stretch of the imagination they actually were able to prevail against the scum who did this, any restitution would be treaty-bound to run through the fingers of their respective national taxing authorities before they ever saw the remaining crumbs.

And yes, I do tend to craft ridiculously meandering sentences. Editing out the snarky parenthetical asides makes my thoughts far more cogent, but far diminished in terms of the intellectually rich experience of enjoying them.
legendary
Activity: 1918
Merit: 1570
Bitcoin: An Idea Worth Spending
September 29, 2011, 11:23:49 AM
#95
I love the internet!

http://www.imdb.com/title/tt0737768/plotsummary

Quote
Plot Summary for
"The Untouchables" Mr. Moon (1961)

Melanthos Moon is a San Francisco art and antique dealer who manages to hijack a large supply of the special paper used to print U.S. Currency. He then arranges to spring from Leavenworth prison master counterfeiter Hans Dreiser to engrave the plates to produce the money. Eliot Ness and the Untouchables are soon on to him having followed Moon's henchman Benny Joplin back to his Oakland, California home. With the phony money available, Moon then approaches Chicago mobster Frank Nitti with an offer of $100 million split 50/50 with Nitti distributing the cash. Ness and his men are out to get one of the nearly perfect bills to get the serial number and stop the distribution of the cash before it starts. Written by garykmcd

Are you saying that Mr Verdun is actually Victor Buono?  Grin

Wow there, bud! I know where you're going with this. You think that all because Buono looks like Bruno, that I somehow have a part in all this. I'm done with Bitcoin!

legendary
Activity: 1190
Merit: 1000
September 29, 2011, 11:19:43 AM
#94
I love the internet!

http://www.imdb.com/title/tt0737768/plotsummary

Quote
Plot Summary for
"The Untouchables" Mr. Moon (1961)

Melanthos Moon is a San Francisco art and antique dealer who manages to hijack a large supply of the special paper used to print U.S. Currency. He then arranges to spring from Leavenworth prison master counterfeiter Hans Dreiser to engrave the plates to produce the money. Eliot Ness and the Untouchables are soon on to him having followed Moon's henchman Benny Joplin back to his Oakland, California home. With the phony money available, Moon then approaches Chicago mobster Frank Nitti with an offer of $100 million split 50/50 with Nitti distributing the cash. Ness and his men are out to get one of the nearly perfect bills to get the serial number and stop the distribution of the cash before it starts. Written by garykmcd

Are you saying that Mr Verdun is actually Victor Buono?  Grin
legendary
Activity: 1918
Merit: 1570
Bitcoin: An Idea Worth Spending
September 29, 2011, 11:12:19 AM
#93
I love the internet!

http://www.imdb.com/title/tt0737768/plotsummary

Quote
Plot Summary for
"The Untouchables" Mr. Moon (1961)

Melanthos Moon is a San Francisco art and antique dealer who manages to hijack a large supply of the special paper used to print U.S. Currency. He then arranges to spring from Leavenworth prison master counterfeiter Hans Dreiser to engrave the plates to produce the money. Eliot Ness and the Untouchables are soon on to him having followed Moon's henchman Benny Joplin back to his Oakland, California home. With the phony money available, Moon then approaches Chicago mobster Frank Nitti with an offer of $100 million split 50/50 with Nitti distributing the cash. Ness and his men are out to get one of the nearly perfect bills to get the serial number and stop the distribution of the cash before it starts. Written by garykmcd
newbie
Activity: 56
Merit: 0
September 29, 2011, 11:04:48 AM
#92
He was trying to say that upisdown resembles the classic Nigerian or Russian scammer archetype. When he says "I would expect", it means that if he had to guess (without foreknowledge of the where the IP address resolves to) he would guess Nigeria or Russia.

Ok, that makes sense.
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