Update
The asset is in verification. I made the contract more detailed and submitted again. I hope it will be listed on the IPO page soon.
Thanks for your patience.
Topic: MOORE: Mining Bond Beating the Moore's Law (Collecting Shareholder Data) - page 10. (Read 19155 times)
May 20, 2012, 06:35:44 AM
May 20, 2012, 06:34:24 AM
Well, as I said, you can also calculate how long it would take to be more profitable if you buy 1 MH/s MOORE right now at 0.50 BTC compared to 1 MH/s stable for 0.30 BTC...
What I was suggesting is that the pros and cons of our bonds, compared to normal ones, are multi-dimensional. Some will prefer growth, and some will prefer more immediate returns so they could use it elsewhere. The difficulty/price uncertainty of the future further complicates the choice.
But you are right. We could make the calculation to give buyers more indication. "How much time it would take to be more profitable" would make a good indicator, and I believe so as "How long it will break even" and "How long the total dividends will exceed 10x of normal mining bonds", etc.
Thank you very much.
May 19, 2012, 09:06:15 AM
Well, as I said, you can also calculate how long it would take to be more profitable if you buy 1 MH/s MOORE right now at 0.50 BTC compared to 1 MH/s stable for 0.30 BTC...
May 19, 2012, 05:03:38 AM
Are growth percentages (the 0.89%) compounded or not? Meaning: after 100 weeks, is the hash rate per bond 1.89 or higher?
Also 100 (percent) / 2 * 52 (weeks) != 0.89%... How did you come up with that number should you not plan to compound interest?
Also 100 (percent) / 2 * 52 (weeks) != 0.89%... How did you come up with that number should you not plan to compound interest?
It is compounded. Or it would have a chance to beat the Moore's Law, which itself implies exponential growth.
After 18 months, that is 1.5 year:
(1+0.89%)^(1.5*365/7)=1.99976, which is very close to 2.
After 100 weeks:
(1+0.89%)^100=2.43556.
Disadvantage 2 is easy, just think how long you want to hold a bond and then calculate how many hashes it would solve in that timeframe. I could try to put up a calculator/spreadsheet for that... Something along the lines of "I want to hold bond A or MOORE for X weeks - how long do I need to hold MOORE to be chaper per hashes solved than bond A?"
This is the easy part. The hard part is "how long you want to hold a bond", which is not pre-determined, but deeply affected by tons of other conditions, including the pricing of bonds themselves.
Thanks very much.
May 19, 2012, 05:02:22 AM
I guess on week x it will be 1.0089^x (or 1.0089^(x-1)) something like that
as for the 0.89% I think is 2^(1/(365*1.5))-1 for 1 day or (2^(1/(365*1.5)))^7-1 for 1 week
as for the 0.89% I think is 2^(1/(365*1.5))-1 for 1 day or (2^(1/(365*1.5)))^7-1 for 1 week
May 19, 2012, 03:00:46 AM
Are growth percentages (the 0.89%) compounded or not? Meaning: after 100 weeks, is the hash rate per bond 1.89 or higher?
Also 100 (percent) / 2 * 52 (weeks) != 0.89%... How did you come up with that number should you not plan to compound interest?
Disadvantage 2 is easy, just think how long you want to hold a bond and then calculate how many hashes it would solve in that timeframe. I could try to put up a calculator/spreadsheet for that... Something along the lines of "I want to hold bond A or MOORE for X weeks - how long do I need to hold MOORE to be chaper per hashes solved than bond A?"
Also 100 (percent) / 2 * 52 (weeks) != 0.89%... How did you come up with that number should you not plan to compound interest?
Disadvantage 2 is easy, just think how long you want to hold a bond and then calculate how many hashes it would solve in that timeframe. I could try to put up a calculator/spreadsheet for that... Something along the lines of "I want to hold bond A or MOORE for X weeks - how long do I need to hold MOORE to be chaper per hashes solved than bond A?"
May 19, 2012, 02:41:33 AM
When will you start offering them? I don't see them on GLBSE yet.
I've already created the asset with the date set as "3 days from now", but it doesn't show on the IPO page. Don't know if it's a feature of GLBSE or there's something I didn't do it right.
Which is the difficulty of that week? The difficulty at the start of that week, or at the end? Same goes for B.
It means the start of that (financial) week. That is, each payment on Wednesday will be calculated using the difficulty and block reward of last Wednesday.
Wouldn't it be better to calculate the dividend the way Puremining does, so that neither difficulty nor B can affect it? I like the look of these bonds, but would prefer dividends based on numbers of blocks solved rather than weeks.
We will surely consider, thanks for your advice.
May 18, 2012, 10:05:04 PM
Quite interested, depending on initial sale price.
May 18, 2012, 04:07:40 PM
If it doesn't follow Moore's law, shouldn't it be called NOT-MOORE? 
NO.MOORE
Yes.
May 18, 2012, 02:44:33 PM
If it doesn't follow Moore's law, shouldn't it be called NOT-MOORE?
NO.MOORE
May 18, 2012, 01:32:20 PM
interesting... what's the timeline for ipo?
May 18, 2012, 01:26:49 PM
If it doesn't follow Moore's law, shouldn't it be called NOT-MOORE?
May 18, 2012, 01:22:56 PM
If it doesn't follow Moore's law, shouldn't it be called NOT-MOORE?
May 18, 2012, 11:14:14 AM
When will you start offering them? I don't see them on GLBSE yet.
Which is the difficulty of that week? The difficulty at the start of that week, or at the end? Same goes for B.
Wouldn't it be better to calculate the dividend the way Puremining does, so that neither difficulty nor B can affect it? I like the look of these bonds, but would prefer dividends based on numbers of blocks solved rather than weeks.
Quote
Dividend Calculation
The formula of the dividends per share per week is:
R*(86400*7*B*10^6)/(D*2^32)
in which:
R is the hashrate of that week, which starts with 1, and grows by 0.89% each week.
B is the block reward, which is 50 now, and will become 25 in the next 4 years.
D is the difficulty of that week.
The formula of the dividends per share per week is:
R*(86400*7*B*10^6)/(D*2^32)
in which:
R is the hashrate of that week, which starts with 1, and grows by 0.89% each week.
B is the block reward, which is 50 now, and will become 25 in the next 4 years.
D is the difficulty of that week.
Which is the difficulty of that week? The difficulty at the start of that week, or at the end? Same goes for B.
Wouldn't it be better to calculate the dividend the way Puremining does, so that neither difficulty nor B can affect it? I like the look of these bonds, but would prefer dividends based on numbers of blocks solved rather than weeks.
May 18, 2012, 07:19:57 AM
Believe me, there has not been anything like this in the Bitcoin world yet.
I'm relatively active between 1:00AM to 3:00PM of forum time each day. Contacting me within this time interval could get quicker responses.
Announcement
In case of the possibility we could not receive the shareholders data, we begin collecting the claims ourselves.
Please send to ([email protected]) your number of shares and your Bitcoin address for receiving dividends. Please annotate that they are MOORE shares to avoid confusion with ASICMINER or MU shares. You could accompany them with any evidence you think is OK to provide. It is highly recommended that you use an address that you have its private key. By that, you may enjoy more facilities provided by our future automatic migrating platform.
The Liquid Helium Plan
If a catastrophe comes, we can save ourselves by soaking our body with liquid helium, and wake up in a brighter future.
To cope with the panic of mining bonds, I've decided to freeze the entire earth. Now it's already 17 weeks later. You don't feel anything, but it's indeed 17 weeks later. I can feel the soft and cool breeze of the late autumn, can't you?
Anyway our contract has to be accurately executed. So I have no choice but to re-calculate our hashrate from 1.03608 to 1.19388.
The similar plan will be launched in the future if similar disaster happens.
First launch: 17 weeks, 1.03608MH/s to 1.19388MH/s.
IPO and Bulk Purchase
You could buy shares of MOORE from GLBSE's open market: https://glbse.com/asset/view/MOORE, or you could do a bulk purchase directly from me.
Shares Left for Bulk Purchase: 0/9000
The price of IPO is set at 0.50 BTC/s.
The price of bulk purchase is set at 0.45 BTC/s(10.00% discount), but each trade has to involve larger than 500 shares(225 BTC). Please PM me for trades, and find witnesses/make records on replies if necessary.
Thanks to everyone who's interested.
Rolling display of the hashrate in next 5 weeks, updated each week
Brief Introduction
Moore is a perpetual mining bond. Each bond represents 1MH/s of hashrate from the start. What makes our bond different, is that the hashrate grows by 0.89% each week, which means that your hashrate will be doubled every 18 months. If you take the current other perpetual mining bonds as financial derivatives of the pro-payment model of normal mining stocks, then our bond is closest to the pro-reinvestment model of normal mining stocks.
Advantages
1. Compared to other mining bonds, the future price of Moore is less likely to drop.
2. We are essentially doing reinvestment job for you, saving you from the hassle of low liquidity, choice of new hardware, identifying good mining securities, etc.
Disadvantages
1. The initial price will be determined at a somehow high level.
2. Normal perpetual mining bonds will likely to become fungible, so you can easily figure out if a bond is mispriced by comparing it to others. But for Moore, it is not that easy to do a reasonable accurate valuation.
Risk Control
1. Initially, Moore will be backed by the bond issuer's current hardware and other mining equities.
2. More real hardware will gradually dominate the portfolio which backs Moore.
3. The bond issuer has the right to degenerate Moore into a normal mining bond by multiplying its hashrate at that time and 1.6. For example, after three years, each bond represents 4MH/s, if the issuer decides to degenerate it, it turns to a normal mining bond, which loses the power to grow 0.89% per week, but instantly becomes 6.4MH/s and doesn't change anymore.
4. The bond issuer has the right to buy Moore back at 105% of the weighted average market price of the last 5 days.
5. The bond issuer has the right to determine the price when he releases new bonds to the market.
Coupon Calculation
Definitions
Financial Week: Starting from 16:00:00(GMT Time) each Tuesday, ending at 16:00:00(GMT Time) the succeeding Tuesday.
Coupon Unit: The quantity of Bitcoins paid each share each financial week.
Payment Time
We assume T(0) is the IPO starting time, T(i) is the time of i-th coupon payment, and it should satisfy:
16:00:00(GMT Time) Tuesday of the i-th financial week <= T(i) < 16:00:00(GMT Time) Wednesday of the i-th financial week
The substraction on T(i) is defined in seconds, which means that (T(i)-T(i-1)) represents "how many seconds elapse between T(i) and T(i-1)".
Amount of Payments
The coupon unit of the i-th financial week is:
10^6 * (1.0089)^(i-1) * f(i) / 2^32
in which f(i) is calculated as follows:
f(i) = (t(1)-t(0))*B(0)/D(0) + ... + (t(n)-t(n-1))*B(n-1)/D(n-1)
where:
the number of the changes of difficulty and block reward between T(i-1) and T(i) is (n-1).
t(0) equals to T(i-1).
t(j) (when 01) means the time of the j-th change of either the difficulty or the block reward during T(i-1) and T(i).
t(n) equals to T(i).
B(j) means the last block reward before t(j+1).
D(j) means the last difficulty number before t(j+1).
The substraction on t(j) is also defined in seconds.
Estimated Returns vs Normal Mining Bonds
Normal Mining Bonds are assumed to have a price of 0.3BTC/share, plotted in blue.
Moore Bonds are assumed to have a price of 0.48BTC/share, plotted in red.
X-axis is the number of weeks, Y-axis is the expected total return rate from coupons.
The difficulty is set at 1,733,208.
The date when block reward reduces to 25 is set at 30 weeks later.
The first picture assumes that the difficulty does not change:
The second picture assumes that when the block rewards turns to 25, the difficulty also turns to a half, as some miners will close their operations:
The third picture assumes that the difficulty also always smoothly increases by 0.89% according to the Moore's Law:
The forth picture assumes the same as the third one, except that when the block rewards turns to 25, the difficulty also turns to a half, as some miners will close their operations:
(reserved)
I'm relatively active between 1:00AM to 3:00PM of forum time each day. Contacting me within this time interval could get quicker responses.
Announcement
In case of the possibility we could not receive the shareholders data, we begin collecting the claims ourselves.
Please send to ([email protected]) your number of shares and your Bitcoin address for receiving dividends. Please annotate that they are MOORE shares to avoid confusion with ASICMINER or MU shares. You could accompany them with any evidence you think is OK to provide. It is highly recommended that you use an address that you have its private key. By that, you may enjoy more facilities provided by our future automatic migrating platform.
The Liquid Helium Plan
If a catastrophe comes, we can save ourselves by soaking our body with liquid helium, and wake up in a brighter future.
To cope with the panic of mining bonds, I've decided to freeze the entire earth. Now it's already 17 weeks later. You don't feel anything, but it's indeed 17 weeks later. I can feel the soft and cool breeze of the late autumn, can't you?
Anyway our contract has to be accurately executed. So I have no choice but to re-calculate our hashrate from 1.03608 to 1.19388.
The similar plan will be launched in the future if similar disaster happens.
First launch: 17 weeks, 1.03608MH/s to 1.19388MH/s.
IPO and Bulk Purchase
You could buy shares of MOORE from GLBSE's open market: https://glbse.com/asset/view/MOORE, or you could do a bulk purchase directly from me.
Shares Left for Bulk Purchase: 0/9000
The price of IPO is set at 0.50 BTC/s.
The price of bulk purchase is set at 0.45 BTC/s(10.00% discount), but each trade has to involve larger than 500 shares(225 BTC). Please PM me for trades, and find witnesses/make records on replies if necessary.
Thanks to everyone who's interested.
Rolling display of the hashrate in next 5 weeks, updated each week
Payment date Hashrate(MH/s)
November 20 1.43805
November 27 1.45085
December 4 1.46376
December 11 1.47679
December 18 1.48993
Brief Introduction
Moore is a perpetual mining bond. Each bond represents 1MH/s of hashrate from the start. What makes our bond different, is that the hashrate grows by 0.89% each week, which means that your hashrate will be doubled every 18 months. If you take the current other perpetual mining bonds as financial derivatives of the pro-payment model of normal mining stocks, then our bond is closest to the pro-reinvestment model of normal mining stocks.
Advantages
1. Compared to other mining bonds, the future price of Moore is less likely to drop.
2. We are essentially doing reinvestment job for you, saving you from the hassle of low liquidity, choice of new hardware, identifying good mining securities, etc.
Disadvantages
1. The initial price will be determined at a somehow high level.
2. Normal perpetual mining bonds will likely to become fungible, so you can easily figure out if a bond is mispriced by comparing it to others. But for Moore, it is not that easy to do a reasonable accurate valuation.
Risk Control
1. Initially, Moore will be backed by the bond issuer's current hardware and other mining equities.
2. More real hardware will gradually dominate the portfolio which backs Moore.
3. The bond issuer has the right to degenerate Moore into a normal mining bond by multiplying its hashrate at that time and 1.6. For example, after three years, each bond represents 4MH/s, if the issuer decides to degenerate it, it turns to a normal mining bond, which loses the power to grow 0.89% per week, but instantly becomes 6.4MH/s and doesn't change anymore.
4. The bond issuer has the right to buy Moore back at 105% of the weighted average market price of the last 5 days.
5. The bond issuer has the right to determine the price when he releases new bonds to the market.
Coupon Calculation
Definitions
Financial Week: Starting from 16:00:00(GMT Time) each Tuesday, ending at 16:00:00(GMT Time) the succeeding Tuesday.
Coupon Unit: The quantity of Bitcoins paid each share each financial week.
Payment Time
We assume T(0) is the IPO starting time, T(i) is the time of i-th coupon payment, and it should satisfy:
16:00:00(GMT Time) Tuesday of the i-th financial week <= T(i) < 16:00:00(GMT Time) Wednesday of the i-th financial week
The substraction on T(i) is defined in seconds, which means that (T(i)-T(i-1)) represents "how many seconds elapse between T(i) and T(i-1)".
Amount of Payments
The coupon unit of the i-th financial week is:
10^6 * (1.0089)^(i-1) * f(i) / 2^32
in which f(i) is calculated as follows:
f(i) = (t(1)-t(0))*B(0)/D(0) + ... + (t(n)-t(n-1))*B(n-1)/D(n-1)
where:
the number of the changes of difficulty and block reward between T(i-1) and T(i) is (n-1).
t(0) equals to T(i-1).
t(j) (when 0
t(n) equals to T(i).
B(j) means the last block reward before t(j+1).
D(j) means the last difficulty number before t(j+1).
The substraction on t(j) is also defined in seconds.
Estimated Returns vs Normal Mining Bonds
Normal Mining Bonds are assumed to have a price of 0.3BTC/share, plotted in blue.
Moore Bonds are assumed to have a price of 0.48BTC/share, plotted in red.
X-axis is the number of weeks, Y-axis is the expected total return rate from coupons.
The difficulty is set at 1,733,208.
The date when block reward reduces to 25 is set at 30 weeks later.
The first picture assumes that the difficulty does not change:
The second picture assumes that when the block rewards turns to 25, the difficulty also turns to a half, as some miners will close their operations:
The third picture assumes that the difficulty also always smoothly increases by 0.89% according to the Moore's Law:
The forth picture assumes the same as the third one, except that when the block rewards turns to 25, the difficulty also turns to a half, as some miners will close their operations:
(reserved)
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