MtGox "Cooling Off" again. - page 2.

dave111223

legendary

Activity: 1190

Merit: 1001

Quote from: hobbes on April 13, 2013, 06:01:46 PM

How the heck can the engine be so slow? There is less than 11000 orders in the book! Do they match orders by hand?

also:

How to reduce the number of Gox orders by 29% in the blink of an eye? I took a look at the depth.

Code:

Number of asks: 3854
Number of bids: 7071
Number of orders: 10925
Total order volume: 54871573BTC
Number of orders less than 0.100000BTC: 3175 (0.29%)
Volume of these orders: 73.04821735

https://data.mtgox.com/api/1/BTCUSD/depth/full

I don't understand why Gox does not take any action on this; it would be so easy to temporarily block orders under .1BTC and it would pretty much solve all problems until they change their trading engine.

Why do they continue to allow these thousands of bot micro trades all the time?

MatTheCat

hero member

Activity: 840

Merit: 1000

Quote from: NamelessOne on April 13, 2013, 07:23:13 PM

It's funny how when anyone calls bitcoin a bubble, they all forgot about the 2011 'bubble' and the bubbles before it. In the media June 2011 became nothing more than a little speed bump and meant nothing to them. This correction to the trend line and eventuall higher prices will probably end up being treated the same in the future.

All the wishful thinking around here is proclaiming Bitcoin to find new highs tomorrow.

In 2011, it actually took quite a bit of time after the initial crash before Bitcoin bottomed in earnest. Since the bottom, Bitcoin took 18 months of mostly steadily (and then not so steadily) rising valuations before it hit the July 2011 high. If you are using history as your metric, then Bitcoin needs to drop to at least $20 and take at least 18 months to 'recover'. This is not what people here want to hear and so it is not going to form part of their beliefs.

NamelessOne

legendary

Activity: 840

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Quote from: MatTheCat on April 13, 2013, 07:20:25 PM

Quote from: bb113 on April 13, 2013, 06:34:48 PM

Quote from: MatTheCat on April 13, 2013, 06:32:08 PM

If he isn't right, then Bitcoin is destined to go up in a mushroom cloud.

why?

Bitcoiners tend to be enthusiasts who forget what a minority fringe phenomena that Bitcoin still is and tend to over estimate the present day significance of the coin. This is why so much drivel about the fundamentals pushing up the price during the recent bull run was disseminated and widely consumed on this forum and no doubt across the Bitcoin world.

Relatively few could recognise that a classic speculative bubble was what was actually happening, and quite probably, a bubble that was being manipulated into existence.

Yet that is what it was. If that is all that Bitcoin is to be in the future then Bitcoin will never develop any substance and will sooner rather than later, fail.

Mass investment psychology will ultimately be the kiss of death on any stock or intangible asset that isn't based on anything or forcibly held in place by some powerful third party.

Bitcoin needs real businesses and real people en masse, trading goods and services, and transferring wealth to each other, using Bitcoin. In recent times, Bitcoin couldnt be less appealing to anyone with anything other in mind than pure profit seeking speculation.

Too much speculation on any asset is a parasite on the organism which will ultimately kill it.

It's funny how when anyone calls bitcoin a bubble, they all forgot about the 2011 'bubble' and the bubbles before it. In the media June 2011 became nothing more than a little speed bump and meant nothing to them. This correction to the trend line and eventuall higher prices will probably end up being treated the same in the future.

MatTheCat

hero member

Activity: 840

Merit: 1000

Quote from: bb113 on April 13, 2013, 06:34:48 PM

Quote from: MatTheCat on April 13, 2013, 06:32:08 PM

If he isn't right, then Bitcoin is destined to go up in a mushroom cloud.

why?

Bitcoiners tend to be enthusiasts who forget what a minority fringe phenomena that Bitcoin still is and tend to over estimate the present day significance of the coin. This is why so much drivel about the fundamentals pushing up the price during the recent bull run was disseminated and widely consumed on this forum and no doubt across the Bitcoin world.

Relatively few could recognise that a classic speculative bubble was what was actually happening, and quite probably, a bubble that was being manipulated into existence.

Yet that is what it was. If that is all that Bitcoin is to be in the future then Bitcoin will never develop any substance and will sooner rather than later, fail.

Mass investment psychology will ultimately be the kiss of death on any stock or intangible asset that isn't based on anything or forcibly held in place by some powerful third party.

Bitcoin needs real businesses and real people en masse, trading goods and services, and transferring wealth to each other, using Bitcoin. In recent times, Bitcoin couldnt be less appealing to anyone with anything other in mind than pure profit seeking speculation.

Too much speculation on any asset is a parasite on the organism which will ultimately kill it.

bb113

hero member

Activity: 728

Merit: 500

Quote from: MatTheCat on April 13, 2013, 06:32:08 PM

Quote from: arepo on April 13, 2013, 06:28:46 PM

Quote from: NikolaTesla on April 13, 2013, 05:27:07 PM

Sucks for the people who fell for the bull trap and bought in at 110+. It's not like I didn't warn them...

it's not a bulltrap until the downtrend resumes. this is just trading between a range (support at high 90s, resistance at 120).

in other words, you're not right. yet.

If he isn't right, then Bitcoin is destined to go up in a mushroom cloud.

why?

MatTheCat

hero member

Activity: 840

Merit: 1000

Quote from: arepo on April 13, 2013, 06:28:46 PM

Quote from: NikolaTesla on April 13, 2013, 05:27:07 PM

Sucks for the people who fell for the bull trap and bought in at 110+. It's not like I didn't warn them...

it's not a bulltrap until the downtrend resumes. this is just trading between a range (support at high 90s, resistance at 120).

in other words, you're not right. yet.

If he isn't right, then Bitcoin is destined to go up in a mushroom cloud.

niko

hero member

Activity: 756

Merit: 501

There is more to Bitcoin than bitcoins.

Quote from: dbc_amp on April 13, 2013, 05:05:27 PM

Quote from: dontek on April 13, 2013, 05:03:18 PM

Quote from: Newscastix on April 13, 2013, 04:59:46 PM

2 trades in and already over 1 min lag Roll Eyes

I'm stupid...where are you monitoring lag at?

You can see it on most live charts like ClarkMoody's or Bitcoinity.
In addition, this is the call to check it yourself: https://data.mtgox.com/api/1/generic/order/lag

The lag info is lagging:

arepo

sr. member

Activity: 448

Merit: 250

this statement is false

Quote from: NikolaTesla on April 13, 2013, 05:27:07 PM

Sucks for the people who fell for the bull trap and bought in at 110+. It's not like I didn't warn them...

it's not a bulltrap until the downtrend resumes. this is just trading between a range (support at high 90s, resistance at 120).

in other words, you're not right. yet.

Scrat Acorns

sr. member

Activity: 293

Merit: 250

Quote from: elux on April 13, 2013, 05:26:57 PM

drivel

Yes, processing more than 1 order per second on an orderbook of 11k is truly beyond our technological limits.

/sarcasm off

zarl

member

Activity: 70

Merit: 10

Quote from: NikolaTesla on April 13, 2013, 05:27:07 PM

Sucks for the people who fell for the bull trap and bought in at 110+. It's not like I didn't warn them...

110 is a very good price.
in long/medium perspective will bring good profit

rpietila

donator

Activity: 1722

Merit: 1036

Quote from: NikolaTesla on April 13, 2013, 05:27:07 PM

Sucks for the people who fell for the bull trap and bought in at 110+. It's not like I didn't warn them...

Won't you please shut up or consider buying some cheap puts from me?? You could make a killing while Mt.Gox kills itself

hobbes

full member

Activity: 128

Merit: 107

How the heck can the engine be so slow? There is less than 11000 orders in the book! Do they match orders by hand?

also:

How to reduce the number of Gox orders by 29% in the blink of an eye? I took a look at the depth.

Code:

Number of asks: 3854
Number of bids: 7071
Number of orders: 10925
Total order volume: 54871573BTC
Number of orders less than 0.100000BTC: 3175 (0.29%)
Volume of these orders: 73.04821735

https://data.mtgox.com/api/1/BTCUSD/depth/full

MatTheCat

hero member

Activity: 840

Merit: 1000

Quote from: freethink2013 on April 13, 2013, 05:32:02 PM

way too easy to influence the market if yopu have a lot of coin you can drive down the market just to acquire more coin.

I think they should turn off the trading api or at least limit it.

Personally I think the actual valuation of 1 btc = $150. I know I could easily offload in person in cash at that price. greed is what will destroy bitcoin. people will hoover up more and more and eventually people will just move on.

Yeah, the Bitcoin price needs to stagnate and thus by necessity, trend downwards for an extended period of time.

Nobody who has the best interests of Bitcoin at heart (not many) as opposed to the best interests of their own personal wealth at heart (almost everyone), could disagree with this statement. At the moment, Bitcoin has a very unappealing and suspicious smell about it and the only people who want Bitcoin to shoot back up are speculators and people who have been financially crippled through conducting real economic business using Bitcoin when the crash occurred. For Bitcoin to grow into what it is meant to be, infinitely more newcomers need to get involved in Bitcoin, preferably newcomers who intend to actually use Bitcoin to conduct business as opposed to hoard it waiting for the next bubble to be manipulated into existence.

If Bitcoin rediscovers its previous highs anytime soon, then I don't trust it and wouldn't touch it with a ten foot long shitty bargepole.

If Bitcoin stagnates and stabilises in price over an extended period, due to its previous history, I still don't trust it but would feel a lot more comfortable about putting wealth into it and using it as a medium for economic exchange.

pyedpyper

full member

Activity: 172

Merit: 100

Quote from: elux on April 13, 2013, 05:26:57 PM

Some observations on the recent lag situation.

After ten minutes of trading since they dropped pending orders at UTC 21.00
(that's when lag went from 50 minutes to zero), lag was back up to 8 minutes 47 seconds.

From this, we can estimate that they are recieving around like 800% to 900% more orders than they can execute.

MtGox's trading engine is congested.

(This is a separate problem from the recent, ongoing DDOS attacks.)

Meanwhile, the surplus, "pending" orders get placed in a buffer.

This buffer has some finite capacity.

As long as incoming orders > 100% capacity, lag will increase without bound, tending to infinity.

This is what traffic congestion looks like, MtGox's current situation is somwhat similar.

They will have to clear the "pending orders" buffer periodically until things cool down.

Pending orders will get wiped.

Mt Gox is currently situated on the fourteenth floor of an office building, IIRC.

They need the entire building. They need something like this:

You cannot put MtGox in the cloud, for obvious reasons.

So, in a sense they're right. This "success" is killing them.

There are no easy solutions.

The situation is well and truly fucked up.

Actually I think there are easy solutions:

Gox has no shortage of cash - just look at their daily trading volume * Bitcoin price * 1% (trade has 2 sides).

In fact they have fucking truckloads of cash.

Um buy more fucking servers perhaps?

Pay someone good to set it up right?

Am I stating the fucking obvious here??

freethink2013

full member

Activity: 224

Merit: 100

way too easy to influence the market if yopu have a lot of coin you can drive down the market just to acquire more coin.

I think they should turn off the trading api or at least limit it.

Personally I think the actual valuation of 1 btc = $150. I know I could easily offload in person in cash at that price. greed is what will destroy bitcoin. people will hoover up more and more and eventually people will just move on.

NikolaTesla

newbie

Activity: 28

Merit: 0

Sucks for the people who fell for the bull trap and bought in at 110+. It's not like I didn't warn them...

elux

legendary

Activity: 1458

Merit: 1006

Some observations on the recent lag situation.

After ten minutes of trading since they dropped pending orders at UTC 21.00
(that's when lag went from 50 minutes to zero), lag was back up to 8 minutes 47 seconds.

From this, we can estimate that they are recieving around like 800% to 900% more orders than they can execute.

MtGox's trading engine is congested.

(This is a separate problem from the recent, ongoing DDOS attacks.)

Meanwhile, the surplus, "pending" orders get placed in a buffer.

This buffer has some finite capacity.

As long as incoming orders > 100% capacity, lag will increase without bound, tending to infinity.

This is what traffic congestion looks like, MtGox's current situation is somwhat similar.

They will have to clear the "pending orders" buffer periodically until things cool down.

Pending orders will get wiped.

Mt Gox is currently situated on the fourteenth floor of an office building, IIRC.

They need the entire building. They need something like this:

You cannot put MtGox in the cloud, for obvious reasons.

So, in a sense they're right. This "success" is killing them.

There are no easy solutions.

The situation is well and truly fucked up.

NamelessOne

legendary

Activity: 840

Merit: 1000

Quote from: NikolaTesla on April 13, 2013, 05:21:22 PM

Nice to see they are making up fake lasts during the cooldown. Real last was 89 and they are reporting 95 to try to boost price lol

That is nothing new, all kinds of criss cross info off of gox for years.

NikolaTesla

newbie

Activity: 28

Merit: 0

Nice to see they are making up fake lasts during the cooldown. Real last was 89 and they are reporting 95 to try to boost price lol

shkiser

sr. member

Activity: 350

Merit: 250

what a joke!! Undecided

Topic: MtGox "Cooling Off" again. - page 2. (Read 3990 times)