Topic: MTGOX whistleblower...the plot thickens. (Read 5398 times)

I hope this gets some media attention.

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You never know man. Your warnings maybe saved a handful of people. I for one thank you and everyone else who screamed from the rooftops.

I haven't had my posts censored, and I've been very negative on Mt. Gox.

My first post warning about Mt. Gox was on April 14, 2013: "That last strongly indicates that Mt. Gox doesn't have all the cash it should.  (Under Japanese money transfer law, they're required to have 100% of funds deposited with them in a bank account separate from their own funds.)".

When Mt. Gox said on June 23, 2013 that they'd "overloaded their bank", I wrote: "Mt. Gox claims they overloaded Mizuho Bank, the second largest bank in Japan, with 515 branches, 26 million customers, and revenue over one trillion yen. Yeah, right."

On June 29, 2013, I posted info on where to sue Mt. Gox in the US.

On July 2, 2013, when Mt. Gox's "2 week hiatus on withdrawals" expired and withdrawals didn't resume, I made a lot of posts. On July 3, I wrote "Mt. Gox missed the deadline. They are now in default. Time for their creditors to go to court in Delaware."

On July 4, 2013, I wrote "That's an indication that Mt. Gox is short of cash. They can keep their scheme going if they slow down withdrawals so that more money is coming in than is going out. This is exactly the kind of behavior seen just before Madoff's fund went under. If you have cash in Mt. Gox, get it out now. If they're legit, it won't hurt Mt. Gox. If they're not..."

On July 8, 2013, I wrote: "Many readers here don't realize how abnormal Mt. Gox's behavior is. With real-world brokerage accounts, when you order a withdrawal by wire transfer, it's in your bank account within two working days. Usually one. Often the same day.  A brokerage house that fails to deliver on a withdrawal is in trouble. Big trouble. If a firm has major problems servicing withdrawal orders, it's big news in the Wall Street Journal. Other firms refuse to deal with them. In the US, FINRA regulators ask hard questions. Lawyers and auditors descend on the firm. The firm may go under within days. That happened to Lehman Brothers, Drexel Burnham Lambert, MF Global... In each case, within days of default, the firm was out of business. Mt. Gox is trying to play in the big leagues now. They don't get to act like they're dealing in trading cards. "

On July 15, 2013, I wrote: "Someone needs to sue Mt. Gox.  Now. ... Pay attention, suckers. You don't have to put up with this shit. You really can take steps which will eventually either get you paid or Mt. Gox out of business."

Skipping ahead a few months...

On January 26, 2014, I wrote: "It's clear that Mt. Gox is near collapse. No USD withdrawals for eight months, delayed EUR withdrawals, delay on JPY withdrawals, delay on BTC withdrawals, and a 22% spread against other markets. How many red flags do you need? This isn't a "support ticket" issue. This is a "send lawyers, guns, and money" issue. Anybody with money stuck in Mt. Gox should be talking to a lawyer, the Japan Financial Services Agency, the US SEC (yes, they have jurisdiction because Mt. Gox registered with FinCen, sells to US persons, and has an office in Delaware), and suing in the Delaware Justice of the Peace court, the Delaware Chancery Court, or in Japan. It's important that some victim make this problem known to law enforcement in Japan. That will keep the principals of Mt. Gox from fleeing the country. "

I've been posting stronger and stronger warnings about Mt. Gox for months. Those are just samples. There are many more; see my posting history. As far as I know, none were censored.

We warned you. You didn't listen. Now suffer.

Four stages of grief. Whistleblowing and arguing are the permanent denial stage. People are more or less embarrassed and ashamed. Also they spent all their energy screaming at Gox support, they have none for the problem.

Do we actually know how many ordinary people were hit, how much money by the average Joe was lost?

I was expecting to find dozens, if not hundreds of threads and posts screaming about lost money. It is a shock how casual this lost money thing has been handled in terms of an out cry or stories.

Which makes me think maybe the actual numbers of average Joe's isn't as high as you'd expect. Are we dealing with a case where 80-90% of the money that disappeared was from big business or rich investors or what?

On the other hand stealing a small amount from thousands of average Joe's is perhaps smarter BUT again where is the real stories and out cry?

Here's a moral lesson: you want some official entity to do your job for you. It's ok when someone with a title or badge is extorting and blackmailing in your name under color of official procedure. Delusional.


Circular arguments. He knows that if he releases then it will be a long round of accusations and support trolls and all energies will be wasted chasing them one at a time. On the other hand, if they resign on their own, then other charlatans will see that as the ceiling and won't bother. More information is just to make us feel better.

They made themselves the root of the problem by appointing themselves to the position. Even James T. Kirk resigned.


No it means stop staring at the things you already know and do something about it. The Bitcoin Foundation is not a government body. They do not deserve our hesitation. They already failed to warn people about MtGox, just as rating agencies failed to downgrade banks.


I have a very low regard for sitting on your ass. The Magna Carta was produced under duress, look it up.

It's called playing chess when the people in charge are not doing anything. It's called amplifying your power to create change when as an individual you are powerless. The ONLY REASON anyone wants more information is so they can get their emotional kick without actually taking action. You don't want to hold anyone responsible, nor do you want to take action.

I think you are right there. This will be a trial followed world wide. Probably with televised witness statements and pleas ( if that's allowed in Japan?)

This is criminal.  He continued to state that nothing was wrong while unloading bitcoins onto unsuspecting buyers while him and his cronies made off with the loot.  All withdrawals will be made public during the bankruptcy proceedings.  Both USD and BTC withdrawals.  Mark is going to jail.

Ah, think is gonna be interesting .. 72 hours? lets see what happens after that ?
Basic point : Don't trust

Maybe TBI only has circumstantial evidence and is playing a bluff?  If he truly has evidence that will be damaging to the market, it seems he's trying to be a hero but protect his own interest at the same time.  Either way you have to question the integrity of this guy.

If you own the road you are drinking and driving on then yes it's perfectly acceptable, if you're driving on someone elses road where it is outlawed then it becomes immoral

Is drinking immoral? is driving immoral?

Lying is always immoral as it implies that you are acting against your own knowledge for the purpose of influencing others decisions. If you do it out of personal reasons it's even more immoral.

blackmail is immoral too, it's not a case of selling information to the highest bidder.

Whistle blowing is considered ethical because;
1. there is no personal gain, other than possible gratification to the whistle-blower.
2. The injustice / breach of contract he does to ones he blows about, is less than the injustice he exposes to public.

What is immoral about blackmail? Is it immoral to keep secrets? Is it immoral to accept money? What makes accepting money to keep a secret immoral? Do you not like black males?

+1

Also, there's a lot of ordinary people who have lost money in Gox and if this guy has info about what went on he shouldn't be playing games with it.

Your'e right, but not completely. If everybody only trusted them selves, we would just be a bunch of nerds with hundreds of thousands of Bitcoin in our wallets worth pennies.

For everyone screwing you over, there has been another two businesses that turned out to be legitimate, moving bitcoin forward. So rather, please consider us valuable slaughter pigs instead! If only security conscious bitcoiners were around, bitcoin would still be under ground.

and centralised bodies claiming to represent decentralised interests.

Blackmail and extortion are unethical, immoral, and for that matter, often felonious.  I need no moral lessons from those who use such tactics.


If this guy expects any support, he really needs to demonstrate specifically that Vessenes and Matonis specifically are the root of the problem and actually need to be removed rather than simply resolve their conflicts of interest.  I think if he could do that, he would have already.  He can't, so instead, he blusters.

"Obsession with information," basically meaning "don't bother me with facts," does not impress me much as an argument.

I have a very low regard for extortionists, and almost as low a regard for those who claim to have staggering revelations at their fingertips, but the dog ate their homework or they have some other bullshit excuse why they can't just say the truth they claim to have.

Whistleblowers get fame. Blackmailers get the job done. If the people who are poisoning the place are removed that's better than congratulating ourselves on how informed we are. He's going Taken and that's what's necessary now.

There's a bit too much hopeyshamey going on here. Exposure is nothing if you don't have power. I'd rather have a fire put out than be told up to the minute what the temperature is. What I find hilarious is that after exposing we would then have some long winded process in which people will be removed and some other charlatan take their place, when we can just have them remove themselves.

Blackmail is effective. Whistleblowing only gets half the job done. After the whistle is blown, someone still has to apply pressure or procedure. Why not cut to the chase?

Do you really need to know the gory details of what anyone with half a brain already knows? If you see someone harming someone else, do you A) shout and spend a long time trying to get the people in power to stop them, or do you B) stop them? This obsession with information is just delaying effective action. Removing two people directly beats months of trolling by supporters and accusers which only allows the next shyster to take over.

Do mods ever combine threads here, it might be a good idea.

Let's see if we can get 10 to 15 more MtGox and Satoshi threads going. We're running low on places to post meaningless horseshit about those two subjects.