Murat Scammed 62k Metropoly token | Bitcointalksearch.org

BitcoinGirl.Club

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Quote from: Rikafip on October 16, 2023, 12:03:23 PM

The only way bounty managers can sell this service is if they promise hundreds or thousands of participants and without those numbers I seriously doubt that anyone would hire them.

The whole thing created a good marketplace and everyone is trying their best to make their money. But ultimately bitcoin is receiving the exposure it needs.
[1.] Forum will always have alt accounts because it does not cost anyone a sat to have one
[2.] Projects are not spending a sat to pay the hunters, those shit tokens worth nothing even for them.
[3.] Hunters are always the fools who think they will make thousands of dollars from those worthless tokens but sometimes they do [I guess]
[4.] Maybe managers are making money.
[5.] Forum is increasing it's page view and visitors.
[6.] Every day new people are knowing about bitcoin.

I don't see anything is wasted.

Rikafip

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Quote from: DaveF on October 15, 2023, 10:00:58 AM

1) This is how you wind up with the spam farms and multi accouters, individually the tokens might not be worth much but if you get a large enough percentage of those tokens it can be a couple of hundred USD. Which in some poor countries can be a lot of money.

Speaking of alt farms, craziest thing is that there there would be no bounty campaigns without them, or there would be way less than it is now. I am pretty certain that if you remove all alt accounts, there would be no more than few a dozens of participants per bounty campaign and that would be fail in the eyes of the clients. Bounty managers know that and for that reason they allow newbies joining, perfectly knowing that majority of them are alts.

The only way bounty managers can sell this service is if they promise hundreds or thousands of participants and without those numbers I seriously doubt that anyone would hire them.

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Quote from: Stalker22 on October 15, 2023, 09:51:46 AM

Exactly! The token sale should not have been his decision. As for gas fees, Murat never mentioned that it was an issue. Perhaps this was agreed upon as part of the deal between him and Metropoly.

When shit tokens worth nothing then gas fees is a lot of money and I think when managers don't have the gas fees then they are stuck unless [1.] they pay out of their own or [2.] hunters volunteer.

DaveF

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Quote from: examplens on October 15, 2023, 09:46:03 AM

Quote from: DaveF on October 15, 2023, 09:34:24 AM

Hold them till fees drop (could be weeks / months)
Go out of pocket (might be well more then you charged them to run the campaign)
Ask for donations from the people who participated (and watch the screaming / scam complaints come flying in)
Send them with the fee that was agreed and hope for the best (and deal with those issues)
Other? Huh

Even if you go with a low cost chain, in the weeks & months between the start and end of the campaign and the distribution, who knows what can happen.

I wonder how many such tokens/projects and bounty campaigns are needed to make hunters think about participating in them. For a long time, all such campaigns have been worthless or at best a miserable value, but I still see that all campaigns are crowded with hunters.
Spending time on something that maybe, a big maybe, someday, in a year or two, will have value, in my opinion, is crazy. If we add to that, only a few projects (out of tens of thousands) have survived for more than two years, the matter seems even worse.

Drifting OT here but:

1) This is how you wind up with the spam farms and multi accouters, individually the tokens might not be worth much but if you get a large enough percentage of those tokens it can be a couple of hundred USD. Which in some poor countries can be a lot of money.

2) Out and out bot scamming. If you write or buy a program that tweets / re-posts / and does whatever else then it's a couple of hours work per campaign and you might get lucky. Think of it as sales, how many people do salespeople in some industries have to talk to before they make a sale and get paid?

3) Greed & not knowing better.

4) Sometimes you just don't care. As of now I'm in a signature campaign that pays well. If it all goes to crap and there are no more good ones, I might just sign up for whatever looks neat at the moment. If I get paid, great....if not great...I am here an posting anyway. Might as well get paid for it. Compared to what other places / boards pay or at least used to pay for posting here even in the best campaigns this is fairly low. The good posters on the motorcycle forums used to get $5 post + 3% of the sale if someone clicked and bought through their affiliate link and that was 15+ (ack I'm old) years ago.

-Dave

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Quote from: examplens on October 15, 2023, 09:46:03 AM

Quote from: DaveF on October 15, 2023, 09:34:24 AM

Hold them till fees drop (could be weeks / months)
Go out of pocket (might be well more then you charged them to run the campaign)
Ask for donations from the people who participated (and watch the screaming / scam complaints come flying in)
Send them with the fee that was agreed and hope for the best (and deal with those issues)
Other? Huh

Even if you go with a low cost chain, in the weeks & months between the start and end of the campaign and the distribution, who knows what can happen.

I wonder how many such tokens/projects and bounty campaigns are needed to make hunters think about participating in them. For a long time, all such campaigns have been worthless or at best a miserable value, but I still see that all campaigns are crowded with hunters.
Spending time on something that maybe, a big maybe, someday, in a year or two, will have value, in my opinion, is crazy. If we add to that, only a few projects (out of tens of thousands) have survived for more than two years, the matter seems even worse.

Yeah, there's a lot of precedent before, even at the height of ICO way back in 2017 wherein there were some bounty campaigns that turns out to be lucrative. But after that it all went downhill as 90% of the project turns out to be a scam and some bounty managers have been dragged about it.

But still though, even after that, the community has grown so much that those who join still believed that bounty hunting are considered a day job a regular 8 hours or more in this forum and then in the end, this bounty hunters end up with nothing.

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Quote from: Rikafip on October 15, 2023, 06:19:54 AM

Quote from: Stalker22 on October 14, 2023, 05:16:48 PM

Especially since this is not the first such case, as I understand it.

You mean his getting tokens and not sending to bounty hunters or saying that tokens were escrowed while they actually weren't? Or both?

No, I meant in the sense that this is not the first case of complaints about Murat's unprofessionalism in running bounty campaigns. Badly worded.

For example, there was this case when he deleted all participants from the signature campaign after 6 weeks of promotion. I do not recall following the case back then, and I only came across it now. But surprisingly, none of the DT members took any action, and Murat did not provide any explanation in that thread either. Imagine what would happen if that was a campaign in the Services board!

His response on TG was: "There is less than 3 legit participants and we decided to cancel the signature campaign" Huh

Then there was the case between him and bitbollo, when he left a retaliatory negative trust just because someone dared to question his managerial abilities.

Quote from: BitcoinGirl.Club on October 15, 2023, 08:33:53 AM

Planning to sell the token is a wrong decision. You do not decide the fate of the tokens that are not yours.

Calculate the percentage of taken from the given tokens. Ask the hunters to send the gas fees. Whoever will send the fees, give them their tokens. You need to be more active in threads like this to understand and receive suggestions from forum members.

Exactly! The token sale should not have been his decision. As for gas fees, Murat never mentioned that it was an issue. Perhaps this was agreed upon as part of the deal between him and Metropoly.

examplens

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Quote from: DaveF on October 15, 2023, 09:34:24 AM

Hold them till fees drop (could be weeks / months)
Go out of pocket (might be well more then you charged them to run the campaign)
Ask for donations from the people who participated (and watch the screaming / scam complaints come flying in)
Send them with the fee that was agreed and hope for the best (and deal with those issues)
Other? Huh

Even if you go with a low cost chain, in the weeks & months between the start and end of the campaign and the distribution, who knows what can happen.

I wonder how many such tokens/projects and bounty campaigns are needed to make hunters think about participating in them. For a long time, all such campaigns have been worthless or at best a miserable value, but I still see that all campaigns are crowded with hunters.
Spending time on something that maybe, a big maybe, someday, in a year or two, will have value, in my opinion, is crazy. If we add to that, only a few projects (out of tens of thousands) have survived for more than two years, the matter seems even worse.

DaveF

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Quote from: Little Mouse on October 09, 2023, 01:19:35 PM

Quote from: irfan_pak10 on October 09, 2023, 01:17:14 PM

This occurred to me, I think the only possibility him not paying to hunters he didn’t get transaction fees from client to distribute tokens. Usually in bounty campaign total addresses to distribute exceeds 10k if we include airdrop campaign too. It means client has to pay more than 10k usd in transaction fees to distribute tokens

So everyone faced this? That was a great lesson for me. Not going to escrow rewards without tx fee lol.

The problem will be the fees today may not be the fees when you distribute.
You do some math and come up with 2ETH as a max total.
Fees spike....what do you do?:

Hold them till fees drop (could be weeks / months)
Go out of pocket (might be well more then you charged them to run the campaign)
Ask for donations from the people who participated (and watch the screaming / scam complaints come flying in)
Send them with the fee that was agreed and hope for the best (and deal with those issues)
Other? Huh

Even if you go with a low cost chain, in the weeks & months between the start and end of the campaign and the distribution, who knows what can happen.

-Dave

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Quote from: nutildah on October 15, 2023, 06:36:14 AM

they are lazy, and opening a flag requires extra work that doesn't pay.

Do they even know how does a flag work or more basic, what is a flag? LOL

Quote from: Murat on October 10, 2023, 11:25:04 AM

I answered a few times in the past.

1. It's not worth it to send $2 to each person.

2. I plan to sell the tokens at a reasonable price and distribute everyone.

There is no other option because the team is not responding after raising a good chunk of money.

Thanks @Little Mouse

Planning to sell the token is a wrong decision. You do not decide the fate of the tokens that are not yours.

Calculate the percentage of taken from the given tokens. Ask the hunters to send the gas fees. Whoever will send the fees, give them their tokens. You need to be more active in threads like this to understand and receive suggestions from forum members.

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Quote from: Rikafip on October 15, 2023, 06:31:45 AM

Well, in flags Type 2 and 3 it is explicitely stated "This user violated a casual or implied agreement with me/This user violated a written contract with me" so its not correct to create one if you are not affected by it and flag Type 1 should be used in that case.

Lol. So I had it as easy as trying to create a flag, without finishing it, to know the answer. Grin

This could lead to a curious case analogous to when in a trial the accused is acquitted due to formal defects in the processing. If a DT created the flag without being affected, hypothetically he might not have enough support even if the flag was very well argued because he was not the right person to do it.

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OP has to be pretty happy now that his wants and desires have been fulfilled:

Quote from: AI detected on October 09, 2023, 09:56:04 AM

Any brave men who bring attention of Murat about distribution?

So what's the next heinous wrongdoing that you have for us to examine? Hopefully the activity in this thread demonstrates that DT (and others) will look into issues in a fair and unbiased manner.

If OP was part of the bounty, or knows anyone else who was and feels cheated, they should consider opening the flag, although I doubt that they will... Bounty hunters are bounty hunters because they are lazy, and opening a flag requires extra work that doesn't pay.

Rikafip

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Quote from: Poker Player on October 15, 2023, 06:25:25 AM

I imagine that the logical thing is that the flag is created by someone directly affected, but if it is created by a DT not directly affected, would it contravene any rule? I don't think so.

Well, in flags Type 2 and 3 it is explicitely stated "This user violated a casual or implied agreement with me/This user violated a written contract with me" so its not correct to create one if you are not affected by it and flag Type 1 should be used in that case.

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Quote from: Rikafip on October 15, 2023, 06:19:54 AM

Quote from: Poker Player on October 15, 2023, 06:14:19 AM

Technically, does it make sense for someone who has not been directly affected by that violation to create it? It is that I think that hypothetically if it was done it should be by someone affected, and then the supporting force to the flag would come from the votes of DTs if applicable.

I didn't think that Stalker22 meant him (or any of us here discussing it) making Type 2 flag but instead one of the bounty hunters as they were the ones affected with this.

That is what I have assumed, but I was also asking in a general way. I imagine that the logical thing is that the flag is created by someone directly affected, but if it is created by a DT not directly affected, would it contravene any rule? I don't think so.

Rikafip

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Quote from: Stalker22 on October 14, 2023, 05:16:48 PM

Especially since this is not the first such case, as I understand it.

You mean his getting tokens and not sending to bounty hunters or saying that tokens were escrowed while they actually weren't? Or both?

Quote from: Poker Player on October 15, 2023, 06:14:19 AM

Technically, does it make sense for someone who has not been directly affected by that violation to create it? It is that I think that hypothetically if it was done it should be by someone affected, and then the supporting force to the flag would come from the votes of DTs if applicable.

I didn't think that Stalker22 meant him (or any of us here discussing it) making Type 2 flag but instead one of the bounty hunters as they were the ones affected with this.

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Quote from: Stalker22 on October 14, 2023, 05:16:48 PM

Technically speaking, this even deserves a Type 2 Flag, since he violated the implied agreement. Least thats how I get it.

Technically, does it make sense for someone who has not been directly affected by that violation to create it? It is that I think that hypothetically if it was done it should be by someone affected, and then the supporting force to the flag would come from the votes of DTs if applicable.

Quote from: Stalker22 on October 14, 2023, 05:16:48 PM

Quote from: Rikafip on October 13, 2023, 11:08:40 AM

@Murat care to explain escrow situation?

He was active again today, but he is not really taking it seriously enough to provide an explanation.

That's what it looks like. I understand that according to him what he has already said on the subject is enough and he does not want to talk more.

Stalker22

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I hear what you are saying, Rikafip. Bounty hunters also responsible amd have their own their part in how busted altcoin bounty campaigns are nowadays. But seems to me Murat messed up here. Sure, he has status as a high-ranking member with serious trust points. If this was some noob without no rep, their profile would be red already. Especially since this is not the first such case, as I understand it.

Technically speaking, this even deserves a Type 2 Flag, since he violated the implied agreement. Least thats how I get it.

Quote from: Rikafip on October 13, 2023, 11:08:40 AM

@Murat care to explain escrow situation?

He was active again today, but he is not really taking it seriously enough to provide an explanation.

Rikafip

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Quote from: Stalker22 on October 12, 2023, 07:15:57 PM

Yes, exactly! This means that Murat changed the topic title sometime between December 24, 2022, and May 11, 2023, but definitely after he said the campaign was over on December 24.

Well, that sucks big time. As I said its one thing if he changed the title let's say few days after bounty started, but this way he obviously mislead bounty hunters by making them think bounty pool is secured while we now know it wasn't.

Quote from: Stalker22 on October 12, 2023, 07:15:57 PM

From my perspective, a major factor contributing to the mess in the altcoins bounty arena is the lack of responsibility and professionalism among bounty managers who neglect their essential due diligence. This seems to be just one example of that.

True, but bounty hunters should know better and not let to be exploited like that. For example, if that happened in bitcoin signature campaign (manager stating that funds are escrowed wiythout providing any evidence), the first thing someone would ask is "where is the proof of that, who is escrow and show us some txid" and from what I can see, no bounty hunter asked him that. Then again, bounty managers know that bounty hunters are gullible and without any influence here so they know that they can screw them without much (if any) consequence.

@Murat care to explain escrow situation?

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Quote from: Stalker22 on October 12, 2023, 07:15:57 PM

Yes, exactly! This means that Murat changed the topic title sometime between December 24, 2022, and May 11, 2023, but definitely after he said the campaign was over on December 24.

And this is what he posted to his followers in the Tokensfund.io TG group last year:

https://t.me/Tokensfund_io/21447

He should consider making a comment because of that revision to explain why he chose to change the title between those dates.

The image you posted explains his future plans about escrowing funds but he did not explain (in a post) the specific reason for not doing it with Metropoly and why he stated the funds were escrowed but later removed it

Quote from: Stalker22 on October 12, 2023, 07:15:57 PM

If he enticed bounty participants with a misleading promise about escrowed funds, it implies that he deceived them and shares some responsibility for them not getting paid for their efforts. An even bigger problem is that he had some tokens available in escrow, but for some reason, he chose not to distribute them to the bounty participants. Those tokens are currently worthless, but as Rikafip pointed out, at some point, they were valued at tens of thousands of dollars, which is not an insignificant sum.

This all points to deception but the onus is on him to explain for his perspective what happened. There should be transparency on his part then it will be down to others to assess. Maybe he will provide a rational explanation but he should address the issue in full.

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Quote from: JollyGood on October 12, 2023, 01:55:32 PM

Quote from: Rikafip on October 12, 2023, 11:36:26 AM

Quote from: JollyGood on October 12, 2023, 07:44:00 AM

Why would the bounty manager state escrow at the beginning and then change it later. Originally when the thread was created it was showing escrowed:

I was about to ask Stalker22 where he saw that part about bounty been escrowed as I couldn't find any traces of it in the bounty thread. Is it possible to see when exactly he changed the title? It is one thing if it was changed right after bounty campaign started and another if it was changed months later.

That will be difficult to know with certainty. Murat posted on 24th December 2022 with [Bounty] Metropoly.io Social Media Campaign [$100k Tokens] [ESCROWED] but the next post in that thread was a different member on 11th May 2023 with [Bounty] Metropoly.io Social Media Campaign [$100k Tokens]
~

Yes, exactly! This means that Murat changed the topic title sometime between December 24, 2022, and May 11, 2023, but definitely after he said the campaign was over on December 24.

And this is what he posted to his followers in the Tokensfund.io TG group last year:

https://t.me/Tokensfund_io/21447

If he enticed bounty participants with a misleading promise about escrowed funds, it implies that he deceived them and shares some responsibility for them not getting paid for their efforts. An even bigger problem is that he had some tokens available in escrow, but for some reason, he chose not to distribute them to the bounty participants. Those tokens are currently worthless, but as Rikafip pointed out, at some point, they were valued at tens of thousands of dollars, which is not an insignificant sum.

From my perspective, a major factor contributing to the mess in the altcoins bounty arena is the lack of responsibility and professionalism among bounty managers who neglect their essential due diligence. This seems to be just one example of that.

JollyGood

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I do not have an issue with what you have stated, I broadly agree with your comments. What I fail to understand is why there was no plan but the bounty manager to cover unforeseen circumstances (such as high transaction fees and/or loss of token value) because the participants would rightly expect to receive what they signed up for.

Quote from: UmerIdrees on October 12, 2023, 04:39:32 PM

Well, we can't make this excuse that since there were all newbies in that campiagn , doing the spamming, therefore they should not be paid the token or paid less than what was promised to them earlier. Also, this excuse may not work that most of the newbies might be alts of each other and hence do not deserve the tokens.

The right way to treat them was to exclude those whom they think are the alts of each other and never let them participate in the campiagn. If it was difficult to detect the alts, they should have made a rule of not accpeting the newbies in the campiagns at the start. Similiary if the posts done were spamming, why not excluded those particiapnts initially from the campiaign.

Get all the social meida activities and promotions and then making these spamming / alts excues, is just not right and shows the project does not want to pay for work.

Topic: Murat Scammed 62k Metropoly token (Read 769 times)