My betting strategies - page 5. | Bitcointalksearch.org

Viscore

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Quote from: paxmao on May 27, 2024, 02:42:55 PM

Quote from: Dunamisx on May 27, 2024, 10:46:05 AM

Quote from: Berry2d on May 25, 2024, 03:05:32 PM

As we all know there is nothing like sure game any longer. I always strategized my betting in two ways.
Firstly, I look for odds between 2 - 5 odds.
Secondly, I stake with #500 - #1000.
I do this because it's more easier for me to get odds between 2 - 5 then trying to get a bigger old to stake with low amount.

I think its even more helpful to concentrate more on the odds than the amount to use in staking, we need to apply wisdom from the strategy we will be using in placing bets especially when we are dealing with sport bets, this is how it has always appears that we sometimes see the odds being a deception on what we initially intend to play and the strategy to be used by us, which some have seen also as trick on it own.

Both go hand in hand when deciding a betting strategy. Is in a way like cooking you know, you can put it a high temperature of low temperature, but it will not work unless you also use the timer to decide how long. This is the same, you would not place the bets that are more risky regardless of the estimated upside versus downside independently of the mehtod used.

That's correct my friend because odds don't upset us when we lose, but it's the amount of money we are putting. That's why there's a saying, "Bet only what you can afford to lose," because it's very important to understand how to minimize the risk in gambling. Odds are set by experts and reflect the probability of winning. You can go with high odds or low odds, but what matters is winning most of the time so you'll end up profitable. However, if you are not disciplined with your bankroll management, even if you win 8 out of 10 bets, you can still end up wiping your bankroll if you get aggressive and go all-in after a loss.

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Quote from: Dunamisx on May 27, 2024, 10:46:05 AM

Quote from: Berry2d on May 25, 2024, 03:05:32 PM

As we all know there is nothing like sure game any longer. I always strategized my betting in two ways.
Firstly, I look for odds between 2 - 5 odds.
Secondly, I stake with #500 - #1000.
I do this because it's more easier for me to get odds between 2 - 5 then trying to get a bigger old to stake with low amount.

I think its even more helpful to concentrate more on the odds than the amount to use in staking, we need to apply wisdom from the strategy we will be using in placing bets especially when we are dealing with sport bets, this is how it has always appears that we sometimes see the odds being a deception on what we initially intend to play and the strategy to be used by us, which some have seen also as trick on it own.

Both go hand in hand when deciding a betting strategy. Is in a way like cooking you know, you can put it a high temperature of low temperature, but it will not work unless you also use the timer to decide how long. This is the same, you would not place the bets that are more risky regardless of the estimated upside versus downside independently of the mehtod used.

Dunamisx

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Quote from: Berry2d on May 25, 2024, 03:05:32 PM

As we all know there is nothing like sure game any longer. I always strategized my betting in two ways.
Firstly, I look for odds between 2 - 5 odds.
Secondly, I stake with #500 - #1000.
I do this because it's more easier for me to get odds between 2 - 5 then trying to get a bigger old to stake with low amount.

I think its even more helpful to concentrate more on the odds than the amount to use in staking, we need to apply wisdom from the strategy we will be using in placing bets especially when we are dealing with sport bets, this is how it has always appears that we sometimes see the odds being a deception on what we initially intend to play and the strategy to be used by us, which some have seen also as trick on it own.

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Quote from: LUCKMCFLY on May 21, 2024, 01:52:55 PM

Quote from: Dewi Aries on May 19, 2024, 10:11:52 AM

In this case in the end yes we agree that no matter what the name of gambling is and whatever type of game you play, luck will always be the most important point that all gamblers must have if they want to win, but yes in the end it is a fact that the name of luck can never be controlled which means that all gamblers can wait for luck to come by itself which can lead them to a real victory.

If for me things are better this way, personally I have always said that in casinos when we play slot machines or any game that has to do with the crash we have to surrender to luck, to what the future holds for us at a moment's notice. because basically there is no strategy that will make us win with certainty, there is not one that is with a single formula, there are many strategies that we can do under our responsibility, but in the end we will depend on the luck we have at that moment, a very different thing. When we make sports bets because sports betting is something else, we also need knowledge, and on certain occasions a little luck.

I agree with what you have said, @LUCKMCFLY, but I have seen some people who believe that their strategy can work effectively for them in the casino games and they can have sufficient winnings. Not that these people don't believe in luck, but they have said that their strategy can as well work so well in the casino. In terms of casino games, I believe it typically depends on luck, but at least the gambler must have knowledge on how to play the game; they need to understand the game and how it is played. If someone doesn't have an idea of how to do something, they will end up doing it blindly because they don't have knowledge of it and will end up with bad results even if they were not supposed to.

I gamble mostly on sports betting, and I know sports betting requires one to have proper knowledge about football, know some terms, and understand many things before the gambler can make good predictions.

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Quote from: Berry2d on May 25, 2024, 03:05:32 PM

As we all know there is nothing like sure game any longer. I always strategized my betting in two ways.
Firstly, I look for odds between 2 - 5 odds.
Secondly, I stake with #500 - #1000.
I do this because it's more easier for me to get odds between 2 - 5 then trying to get a bigger old to stake with low amount.

This is global board bud, not the local board where user can easily understand what you meant by #500 - #1000, most users here will assume this numbers to mean $500 - $1000 when what I understand you meant is 500 naira to 1000 naira (Nigerian fiat currency).

#500 is not up to $.50 (50 cent) while #1000 is not up to $1 (1 dollar), so, I personally will say this amounts are way too small to put in a bet as even if you win a 5 odds games, with #1000 bet, the win amount will not even be up to $5 when converted, since #1000 is not worth up to $1.

But all the same, I perfectly will understand if you say that you are betting with this amount because it's the amount you can comfortably lose just incase your prediction on the game is wrong, and you lost the bet.

But all the same, next time, understand you are not in the local board and use figures in a way others in the global board will totally understand you.

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Quote from: South Park on May 24, 2024, 02:22:59 PM

To me this depends very heavily on the sport we are talking about, as in the case of soccer teams, they can change lineups in such a drastic manner that what happened last season has nothing to do with what it may happen during the current one, however in individual matches in which athletes can face each other multiple times, I am way more willing to take into account their previous history and give it a very important weight when deciding which one of them to back with my bet.

Well, it's true, in team matches it will be different from individual matches, because a team will always make changes every season, so maybe that will affect their game too, whether it's better or not. On the other hand, if it is an individual, they will know each other what their opponent's strength is like and it will be deeper, and they only rely on themselves to be able to improve, in contrast to a team which can rely on the composition of players changing at any time.
However, if both are big teams that have the same strength, usually their status in the game can also have an influence, such as playing home or away. because when a team plays, the home team tends to win. Although not forever, if we look in that direction we will find facts like that. There are various reasons why this can happen, one of which is that support from supporters will make them even more motivated.

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Quote from: bitterguy28 on May 21, 2024, 01:20:57 AM

Quote from: carlfebz2 on May 18, 2024, 10:21:31 AM

Quote from: bitterguy28 on May 18, 2024, 06:27:04 AM

Quote from: Dunamisx on May 17, 2024, 01:16:27 PM

We have them in categories as to what determines our gambling experience, we may choose to have our own strategies and uses them effectively and they works at some point in time, while some other time they may be ineffective because of some other reasons, which are all part of the gambling challenges in which we may have, aside the gamblers personal experience in playing bets on a particular game.

because there are no effective strategies shared by others if we don't know them deeply instead best to use your own strategy and the major one that we need to use? that is the discipline to control our emotion .
because in the end of all the only thing that you will lose? that is greedy mate.

The good thing on using up your own strategy is that you wont really be able to make yourself having that kind of regret on the moment that your bet had lost on which you do know deep inside that it was your own call and selection on making up such bet, in comparing into those moments that you have tend to follow someone and end up on a loss then you would really be having that sense of regret on which this is something that you should really be able to consider out. If you would really be tending to bet out of others suggestions and recommendations then it would really be that something that will really be depending on you but make it sure that you wont really be that making yourself that having the regret. When it comes to strategies then it would really be that varying into each person.

of course because the saddest part of gambling is when you are looking for someone that you need to blame because you lose , that is justification of how stupid gambler you are so better to haveyour own strategy , try to make your own movement when betting so the result will only be on your own discretion .
that is gambling and that is what we must deal .

Then such a person is not a gambler, he is just trying to gamble one way or another. True gamblers will know the right thing to do at all times and do it even as they rely on luck as well because no matter what we do in gambling, the iota of luck will always be important and that is why no gambler can ever rely on what he knows, especially those playing the casino aspect of it. But for those who are gambling on sports, it is easier for them, and the more they are well-informed, use their instincts and apply wisdom, the better for them as they will continue to flourish in the field of gambling.

This is why, above all, we should make sure that we have our own experience to guide us and our own minds about it to preserve our views and picks, otherwise, it will be a serious issue. No independent gamblers will be able to flourish in the industry for long. And you could imagine, even if such is following the path or signal of another gambler, what if his source dies or something bad happens that doesn't allow the gambler to have access to the source anymore? Then, that comes the end of his gambling career, or should I say activity. This is sad.

Berry2d

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As we all know there is nothing like sure game any longer. I always strategized my betting in two ways.
Firstly, I look for odds between 2 - 5 odds.
Secondly, I stake with #500 - #1000.
I do this because it's more easier for me to get odds between 2 - 5 then trying to get a bigger old to stake with low amount.

South Park

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Quote from: Tmoonz on May 21, 2024, 09:50:08 AM

Quote from: sotelorene on January 27, 2024, 05:40:31 AM

3. Head to head: a club head to head (history) is very important because sometimes it could be that the people topping the league always loss or draw with the people fighting to go out of relegation. No matter how form the people topping the league is the possibility or chance of losing the match is 80% because of their history that's why sometimes you see a big club always losing to a small club.
These are mine strategies and there are some i can't remember for now, try this and thank me later.

I intentionally pick out the 3rd point, and am of the option that at most time history doesn't repeat itself but rather it only gives guide for a possible outcome and at such it still has no guarantee, and at most times games Plays on the opposite direction which can be least expected outcome, it is also important to consider how good the current players are before making much of the comparison of the the past history. winning a bet has also a lot to do with luck after maximizing all your strategies in ensuring that you win.

To me this depends very heavily on the sport we are talking about, as in the case of soccer teams, they can change lineups in such a drastic manner that what happened last season has nothing to do with what it may happen during the current one, however in individual matches in which athletes can face each other multiple times, I am way more willing to take into account their previous history and give it a very important weight when deciding which one of them to back with my bet.

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Quote from: Dewi Aries on May 19, 2024, 10:11:52 AM

In this case in the end yes we agree that no matter what the name of gambling is and whatever type of game you play, luck will always be the most important point that all gamblers must have if they want to win, but yes in the end it is a fact that the name of luck can never be controlled which means that all gamblers can wait for luck to come by itself which can lead them to a real victory.

If for me things are better this way, personally I have always said that in casinos when we play slot machines or any game that has to do with the crash we have to surrender to luck, to what the future holds for us at a moment's notice. because basically there is no strategy that will make us win with certainty, there is not one that is with a single formula, there are many strategies that we can do under our responsibility, but in the end we will depend on the luck we have at that moment, a very different thing. When we make sports bets because sports betting is something else, we also need knowledge, and on certain occasions a little luck.

Dunamisx

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We have to make use of whichever strategies we think could best serve for us, this is not what we can just use without having an understanding of how it works and how we could best make the applicable use of it, some have grown up their personal gambling strategies, also, some of our strategies works more effectively depending on the game and how we are being able to make use of it while some may not even achieve the required expectation for using them.

Tmoonz

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Quote from: sotelorene on January 27, 2024, 05:40:31 AM

3. Head to head: a club head to head (history) is very important because sometimes it could be that the people topping the league always loss or draw with the people fighting to go out of relegation. No matter how form the people topping the league is the possibility or chance of losing the match is 80% because of their history that's why sometimes you see a big club always losing to a small club.
These are mine strategies and there are some i can't remember for now, try this and thank me later.

I intentionally pick out the 3rd point, and am of the option that at most time history doesn't repeat itself but rather it only gives guide for a possible outcome and at such it still has no guarantee, and at most times games Plays on the opposite direction which can be least expected outcome, it is also important to consider how good the current players are before making much of the comparison of the the past history. winning a bet has also a lot to do with luck after maximizing all your strategies in ensuring that you win.

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Quote from: Agbe on January 27, 2024, 10:11:53 AM

Using the position of the team and it acquired points to determine the next game of the team might disappoint you though that what you used to play your gamble and win but if I will add one it will be the number not skillful players.in the team. The performance of each players in the team also speak good or bad about the team. Like there are some teams in the AFCON is playing shit. Therefore once those teams came to play you would know that there is nothing good would come out from them. Not all the teams that have high point are good in playing but they got the point as a result of luck. As for me and I have said it before the best way to know a best team is the performance level of the team. How many players are very good in the team. One good Player can't make a good team but five good players can make a good team.

True game are like to be bound with luck which why no betting is 100 % guaranteed
Also sometimes giving judgement through positions on the table will be a good idea to placing bet because gameplay sometimes depend on the positions on table especially at the end of the season.
Your point is valid..

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Quote from: danadc on May 21, 2024, 01:41:27 AM

If I wanted that, to control all those emotions, apparently adrenaline is the only thing that drives us to continue in this, that is why sometimes we, driven by those emotions, cannot do much, but we are looking for a way to do things better. things, for example if I'm playing with crash and I see that I win and win, as I happened, I was playing with small bets and I always hit 2x and 3x and after that I started to put more money and I lost them, then I feel that I I got out of control because I started making bets with more money but betting at 4x and 5x where I still lost them, then I didn't play the other round and I saw that it was won at 9x and I didn't bet.

With that kind of experienced I guess you'll think that if only you continue placing your bets you might hit that 9x, the problem begins when you making that kind of regrets as the next thing that you may do is follow your instinct and be dominated by your emotions, it's something that really hard to control when there's already a toxic adrenaline rush inside you,

something that will continue to push you to instead of resting nd quitting away there's something inside you that will keep whispreing to continue as you don't want to see yourself regretting if the bets wins.

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Quote from: Fredomago on May 20, 2024, 10:07:09 AM

Quote from: nimogsm on May 18, 2024, 09:34:06 AM

Quote from: Ever-young on May 17, 2024, 02:33:39 PM

We know it's very hard to adhere to our strategy when betting or gambling but some people try to use their strategy and it work for them but people who are addicts find it hard to adhere to their even if they try but they keep falling a victim but for me,each time I gamble or bet, I will divide the fund into three, which I will use to bet and once I exceed my limit, but before then, I'd tell the person placing the bet for me to restrict me from playing further once I've exceeded my limits, that is the only strategy I know that works for me and it's always helpful.

This is an excellent solution to divide your fund into parts; it will not allow you to lose everything at the same time. I have a similar strategy, only it is connected with winnings. I always put 10-15% into a separate account and it is untouchable and lies as a reserve for a rainy day.In the quarter I always allocate the same amount for games and bets and always stick to this budget.

If you have that kind of understanding and you wisely manage to divide your money either your actual bankroll or your winning money, that will gives you decent opportunities to avoid adrenaline rush, with good emotion control and good money management, it will give you a good chance not just earn decent amount but also the time that you will enjoy your stay, sometimes, it's not just for the money but also for the entertainment though more is for the money but it's going to depend from how you adopt and how you manage your finances.

If I wanted that, to control all those emotions, apparently adrenaline is the only thing that drives us to continue in this, that is why sometimes we, driven by those emotions, cannot do much, but we are looking for a way to do things better. things, for example if I'm playing with crash and I see that I win and win, as I happened, I was playing with small bets and I always hit 2x and 3x and after that I started to put more money and I lost them, then I feel that I I got out of control because I started making bets with more money but betting at 4x and 5x where I still lost them, then I didn't play the other round and I saw that it was won at 9x and I didn't bet.

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Quote from: carlfebz2 on May 18, 2024, 10:21:31 AM

Quote from: bitterguy28 on May 18, 2024, 06:27:04 AM

Quote from: Dunamisx on May 17, 2024, 01:16:27 PM

We have them in categories as to what determines our gambling experience, we may choose to have our own strategies and uses them effectively and they works at some point in time, while some other time they may be ineffective because of some other reasons, which are all part of the gambling challenges in which we may have, aside the gamblers personal experience in playing bets on a particular game.

because there are no effective strategies shared by others if we don't know them deeply instead best to use your own strategy and the major one that we need to use? that is the discipline to control our emotion .
because in the end of all the only thing that you will lose? that is greedy mate.

The good thing on using up your own strategy is that you wont really be able to make yourself having that kind of regret on the moment that your bet had lost on which you do know deep inside that it was your own call and selection on making up such bet, in comparing into those moments that you have tend to follow someone and end up on a loss then you would really be having that sense of regret on which this is something that you should really be able to consider out. If you would really be tending to bet out of others suggestions and recommendations then it would really be that something that will really be depending on you but make it sure that you wont really be that making yourself that having the regret. When it comes to strategies then it would really be that varying into each person.

of course because the saddest part of gambling is when you are looking for someone that you need to blame because you lose , that is justification of how stupid gambler you are so better to haveyour own strategy , try to make your own movement when betting so the result will only be on your own discretion .
that is gambling and that is what we must deal .

Fredomago

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Quote from: nimogsm on May 18, 2024, 09:34:06 AM

Quote from: Ever-young on May 17, 2024, 02:33:39 PM

We know it's very hard to adhere to our strategy when betting or gambling but some people try to use their strategy and it work for them but people who are addicts find it hard to adhere to their even if they try but they keep falling a victim but for me,each time I gamble or bet, I will divide the fund into three, which I will use to bet and once I exceed my limit, but before then, I'd tell the person placing the bet for me to restrict me from playing further once I've exceeded my limits, that is the only strategy I know that works for me and it's always helpful.

This is an excellent solution to divide your fund into parts; it will not allow you to lose everything at the same time. I have a similar strategy, only it is connected with winnings. I always put 10-15% into a separate account and it is untouchable and lies as a reserve for a rainy day.In the quarter I always allocate the same amount for games and bets and always stick to this budget.

If you have that kind of understanding and you wisely manage to divide your money either your actual bankroll or your winning money, that will gives you decent opportunities to avoid adrenaline rush, with good emotion control and good money management, it will give you a good chance not just earn decent amount but also the time that you will enjoy your stay, sometimes, it's not just for the money but also for the entertainment though more is for the money but it's going to depend from how you adopt and how you manage your finances.

Dr.Bitcoin_Strange

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Quote from: Dewi Aries on May 19, 2024, 10:11:52 AM

Quote from: LUCKMCFLY on May 18, 2024, 11:21:36 AM

Quote from: Dewi Aries on May 18, 2024, 09:23:10 AM

Yes it means that strategy is nothing more than "helping" and not "ensuring" that you will win, and if you are playing in a haphazard way in the type of game that requires skill such as sports betting then yes maybe you really need luck to be able to ensure victory, I can't say that you will definitely lose if you play without applying any strategy because obviously the key is always in luck, especially if you are playing in the type of game that really relies purely on luck such as slots or dice or something else.

As we understand and as I said above that strategy only helps increase the odds and not ensure that you will win, meaning that luck is much more important than strategy, and this is the reason why sometimes even though for example you have a very good strategy and skills but you lose at the end of the session, and this also reminds us that the name of the bet is still a bet that will always lead to one of two possibilities at the end of the session which is between winning or losing.

I think that something, if we are seeing things like that and that can help us, then it is not bad, because it is something that encourages us to improve but there are other things like the luck factor, no matter how good the strategies are, no matter how good they are. Whatever the case, we know very well that we are always depending on luck, that is something that cannot be Avoided , where luck can be helped the most is in sports betting, which already depends largely on the person's knowledge, So in that sense things can go very well, but this is something that we must be clear about, and there is no single strategy that will make us win.

In this case in the end yes we agree that no matter what the name of gambling is and whatever type of game you play, luck will always be the most important point that all gamblers must have if they want to win, but yes in the end it is a fact that the name of luck can never be controlled which means that all gamblers can wait for luck to come by itself which can lead them to a real victory.

Sometimes what is worrying is that those gamblers are too confident and make strategy a reference material to win the bet, or that means they think that only with a good strategy will they be able to win, but on the other hand it is a very wrong mindset and belief, because after all gambling will always be an activity that can never be known about the results that will occur at the end of the session. And the best approach to gambling is to understand that gambling is a risky activity and also understand that no matter how good a strategy you have it is nothing more than something useful to increase the odds, because only luck can ensure that you will win.

Well, yes, the chance of winning in gambling is strongly dependent on luck, no matter the game being played, but I still agree that a gambler needs to have experience and a derived strategy that can help them win the house most of the time. It's not that "gambling strategy" can actually work all the time or every day; it might work today and not work tomorrow, but it's very necessary for the gambler to know what he or she is doing and also to keep in mind that luck is the baseline, so they must not be bent to one strategy even when it's not working.

Dewi Aries

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Quote from: LUCKMCFLY on May 18, 2024, 11:21:36 AM

Quote from: Dewi Aries on May 18, 2024, 09:23:10 AM

Yes it means that strategy is nothing more than "helping" and not "ensuring" that you will win, and if you are playing in a haphazard way in the type of game that requires skill such as sports betting then yes maybe you really need luck to be able to ensure victory, I can't say that you will definitely lose if you play without applying any strategy because obviously the key is always in luck, especially if you are playing in the type of game that really relies purely on luck such as slots or dice or something else.

As we understand and as I said above that strategy only helps increase the odds and not ensure that you will win, meaning that luck is much more important than strategy, and this is the reason why sometimes even though for example you have a very good strategy and skills but you lose at the end of the session, and this also reminds us that the name of the bet is still a bet that will always lead to one of two possibilities at the end of the session which is between winning or losing.

I think that something, if we are seeing things like that and that can help us, then it is not bad, because it is something that encourages us to improve but there are other things like the luck factor, no matter how good the strategies are, no matter how good they are. Whatever the case, we know very well that we are always depending on luck, that is something that cannot be Avoided , where luck can be helped the most is in sports betting, which already depends largely on the person's knowledge, So in that sense things can go very well, but this is something that we must be clear about, and there is no single strategy that will make us win.

In this case in the end yes we agree that no matter what the name of gambling is and whatever type of game you play, luck will always be the most important point that all gamblers must have if they want to win, but yes in the end it is a fact that the name of luck can never be controlled which means that all gamblers can wait for luck to come by itself which can lead them to a real victory.

Sometimes what is worrying is that those gamblers are too confident and make strategy a reference material to win the bet, or that means they think that only with a good strategy will they be able to win, but on the other hand it is a very wrong mindset and belief, because after all gambling will always be an activity that can never be known about the results that will occur at the end of the session. And the best approach to gambling is to understand that gambling is a risky activity and also understand that no matter how good a strategy you have it is nothing more than something useful to increase the odds, because only luck can ensure that you will win.

LUCKMCFLY

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Quote from: Dewi Aries on May 18, 2024, 09:23:10 AM

Quote from: LUCKMCFLY on May 17, 2024, 01:35:40 PM

Quote from: Dewi Aries on May 16, 2024, 08:50:37 AM

On the other hand as you said about gamblers only having a 50: 50 between the chances of winning and the possibility of losing, and if you gamble by using a strategy then maybe your chances of winning are 70% but still the rest is luck, or that means 30% of the rest is luck which means that still if luck does not come at the right time then of course you will lose.

Yes, I support what you say, I have always said that strategies help in some way, those who are playing in a constant game if they do not vary their strategy and play in a very flat way they will surely lose, that should not be doubted, it can happen, However, I have to see something, we are generating more and more money and we like what we do because we try to see everything that can be won, some players somehow say that there is no possibility. It's worthless to earn more with strategies, in fact they say that strategies are useless, that is something I respect but I don't share, for me there are possibilities of doing things better with strategies.

Yes it means that strategy is nothing more than "helping" and not "ensuring" that you will win, and if you are playing in a haphazard way in the type of game that requires skill such as sports betting then yes maybe you really need luck to be able to ensure victory, I can't say that you will definitely lose if you play without applying any strategy because obviously the key is always in luck, especially if you are playing in the type of game that really relies purely on luck such as slots or dice or something else.

As we understand and as I said above that strategy only helps increase the odds and not ensure that you will win, meaning that luck is much more important than strategy, and this is the reason why sometimes even though for example you have a very good strategy and skills but you lose at the end of the session, and this also reminds us that the name of the bet is still a bet that will always lead to one of two possibilities at the end of the session which is between winning or losing.

I think that something, if we are seeing things like that and that can help us, then it is not bad, because it is something that encourages us to improve but there are other things like the luck factor, no matter how good the strategies are, no matter how good they are. Whatever the case, we know very well that we are always depending on luck, that is something that cannot be Avoided , where luck can be helped the most is in sports betting, which already depends largely on the person's knowledge, So in that sense things can go very well, but this is something that we must be clear about, and there is no single strategy that will make us win.

Topic: My betting strategies - page 5. (Read 6330 times)