Author

Topic: NXT :: descendant of Bitcoin - Updated Information - page 1488. (Read 2761645 times)

legendary
Activity: 1722
Merit: 1217
My basic argument is just that, With the idea of using tokens + a flat fee there is little to no risk and no need for the creator of the ballot to understand economic thought processes.

I like your thought process and this is somewhat where I am headed - I think if you ensure that what you are voting for itself is not easily gamed (and to my thinking the best approach would be to introduce a "random" aspect so say "A1..A5" instead of just A and "B1..B5" instead of just B where A and B are polemic ideas but 1..5 are different variations thereof) then people can just vote for A or B (not really caring whether 1..5 is implemented as long as it is an A or a B) then it becomes harder for each A and B *player* to game the system by spending more.


on second thought you would still need to craft the incentives right either way because a gamer could in theory purchase votes from stakeholders.
legendary
Activity: 1498
Merit: 1000
I think the real challenge hear is to find a protocol implementing what CIYAM suggests (AM - NXT infrastructure) while we keep Utopianfuture 100% happy.

Engineering challenge!
member
Activity: 72
Merit: 11
i strongly support this. best idea yet.

I support it also although I actually would like to see people have to *pay* to vote (as I don't this has really been tried before and could be an interesting experiment).


no need to pay.....many Nxters have only a few Nxt and we want every stakeholder to vote.

Could the account returns 2 / 3 nxt per vote?
It would be a way of distributing coins for participating
hero member
Activity: 840
Merit: 1002
Simcoin Developer
As soon as possible, coz otherwise people gonna put there time in it to create an alternative, while we can have it in NXT self.

when is this possible.

all please wait till answer from cfb.


Will it load the blockchain? Also, there are benefits in have one public site with all issues and votes.
newbie
Activity: 56
Merit: 0
We don't have a client is the code ready? API?

maybe wesley can create a workaround till the client is there.

No client. API contains only 3 requests.

I can code a client by the end of today for macs.
legendary
Activity: 1890
Merit: 1086
Ian Knowles - CIYAM Lead Developer
So you agree that my poll here https://bitcointalksearch.org/topic/nxt-voting-on-the-scope-of-authority-of-the-funding-committee-423241 actually work ? because it seems to me no one has a chance of winning anything in this vote.

Not quite the same point (but I do *get* your point) - if I were trying to "fuck things up" for Nxt my guess is that I'd get all my alts to vote for the last option (so let us see how that pans out).
legendary
Activity: 2142
Merit: 1010
Newbie
We don't have a client is the code ready? API?

maybe wesley can create a workaround till the client is there.

No client. API contains only 3 requests.
legendary
Activity: 1890
Merit: 1086
Ian Knowles - CIYAM Lead Developer
My basic argument is just that, With the idea of using tokens + a flat fee there is little to no risk and no need for the creator of the ballot to understand economic thought processes.

I like your thought process and this is somewhat where I am headed - I think if you ensure that what you are voting for itself is not easily gamed (and to my thinking the best approach would be to introduce a "random" aspect so say "A1..A5" instead of just A and "B1..B5" instead of just B where A and B are polemic ideas but 1..5 are different variations thereof) then people can just vote for A or B (not really caring whether 1..5 is implemented as long as it is an A or a B) then it becomes harder for each A and B *player* to game the system by spending more.
full member
Activity: 266
Merit: 100
NXT is the future

when do we get voting system NXT self?


Pin

When do u need it?

CfB,

As soon as possible, coz otherwise people gonna put there time in it to create an alternative, while we can have it in NXT self.

when is this possible.

all please wait till answer from cfb.

Pin

Voting System is quite simple. Interpretation is supposed to be done on client side. Talk to client developers and we will cooperate.

We don't have a client is the code ready? API?

maybe wesley can create a workaround till the client is there.

Pin
legendary
Activity: 1372
Merit: 1000
Quote from: bitcoinrocks
Are you guys planning to make decisions regarding the continued development of this software through a voting system?

Quote from: utopianfuture
BCNext, Luc, CfB make decision on technical developments. The urgent issue needs to be worked on is the deployment of the common fund and the funding committee . Go here to  read more https://bitcointalksearch.org/topic/nxt-voting-on-the-scope-of-authority-of-the-funding-committee-423241

I think this voting proposal is a slippery slope.  This (and any) software project should not be governed by a committee/foundation/community.  That concept has no place in software development.  Maybe voting is an OK way to decide how to split up money, but there will be temptation to take it further.  Why can't BCNext, Luc, CfB decide where the money goes?  It doesn't need to be a time-consuming set of decisions.  Linux, bittorrent, bitcoin, litecoin have all thrived without any of this crap.
hero member
Activity: 808
Merit: 1011
My idea of a voting system:

A simple Wordpress Voting Theme. Everyone has to register and has an account balance. You can send as many NXT to the "master account" as you want, but you only can vote one time per voting. After voting 1 NXT (or what ever) will be subtract from you account balance. That should be easy to create. The incoming NXT will be collected in the "master account" of the project and will be used for the projects, we voted for.
sr. member
Activity: 602
Merit: 268
Internet of Value
That is buying votes, imho.

Okay - I don't think it is exactly that (as generally buying votes is done because you are pretty sure you will recoup the cost from the outcome).

If you are voting on A vs. B then both A and B might try to "buy" votes (and each has a 50% chance of presumably recouping their costs) but if you are actually voting in a way that neither A nor B can have any more than a 10% chance of winning (no matter how much they spend) then they are far less likely to even bother.


So you agree that my poll here https://bitcointalksearch.org/topic/nxt-voting-on-the-scope-of-authority-of-the-funding-committee-423241 actually work ? because it seems to me no one has a chance of winning anything in this vote.
legendary
Activity: 2142
Merit: 1010
Newbie

when do we get voting system NXT self?


Pin

When do u need it?

CfB,

As soon as possible, coz otherwise people gonna put there time in it to create an alternative, while we can have it in NXT self.

when is this possible.

all please wait till answer from cfb.

Pin

Voting System is quite simple. Interpretation is supposed to be done on client side. Talk to client developers and we will cooperate.
sr. member
Activity: 897
Merit: 284

when do we get voting system NXT self?


Pin

When do u need it?

CfB,

As soon as possible, coz otherwise people gonna put there time in it to create an alternative, while we can have it in NXT self.

when is this possible.

all please wait till answer from cfb.

Pin

I agree. The sooner the better.

No pressure Smiley
full member
Activity: 266
Merit: 100
NXT is the future

when do we get voting system NXT self?


Pin

When do u need it?

CfB,

As soon as possible, coz otherwise people gonna put there time in it to create an alternative, while we can have it in NXT self.

when is this possible.

all please wait till answer from cfb.

Pin
legendary
Activity: 2184
Merit: 1000
nextcoin.org just crossed 4000 members (accounts)
legendary
Activity: 1722
Merit: 1217
There would be a trade off here. The more you try to mitigate ignorant voting the more risk you have of corruption. It would probably be best to set the fee pretty low because in most cases ignorance cancels with ignorance on the opposite side of the issue.

I agree that the amount to be paid should not need to be more than 1 NXT but I also think that if the total amounts are to be redistributed evenly then someone throwing in a bunch of NXT basically is redistributing their stake as much as influencing the outcome (and if the outcome has only a % chance of directly benefiting them then unlikely they are going to pump that much into it).


This would be a very good thing IF you could have some reasonable guarantee of this part

Quote
(and if the outcome has only a % chance of directly benefiting them then unlikely they are going to pump that much into it).

So take as an abstract example, just for the sake of thought experiment, this question up for voting. Should SuperScammer1337 be payed 1 million nxt out of the unclaimed 9million nxt fund for "promotional" use. Send nxt to address 1 to vote yes, and address 2 to vote no.  In this example its highly unlikely that the community would outvote SuperScammer1337 in this issue. In economics this is called the problem of "concentrated benefits and diffuse costs". http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Public_choice_theory

Now it would be wrong to say that this problem couldnt be avoided. If you have 10 different causes on the ballot than it is unlikely that someone would take the risk of trying to purchase his own victory. The point is that we would need someone with a solid understanding of economics, someone who knows how to think like an economist, to run the voting process.

My basic argument is just that, With the idea of using tokens + a flat fee there is little to no risk and no need for the creator of the ballot to understand economic thought processes.
hero member
Activity: 840
Merit: 1002
Simcoin Developer
If you have a valid account, you're a nexter by definition.

No need for any passwords. Authorization token covers everything.

I prefer a separate voting site to using AM function. No need to bloat the blockchain and we can incorporate the voting site into the clients.

Also, to protect from spam posts we can require the poster to use authorization token too and check his account for minimal age and balance.

This balance can be higher, like 10,000. If somebody doesn't have it, he can always present his idea on the forum and somebody will submit it.
full member
Activity: 196
Merit: 100
That's what I call marketing!

Jamaican team raises $25,000 in Dogecoin

We should be funding a Chinese moon mission.

IfYouKnowWhatIMean Cool
legendary
Activity: 1890
Merit: 1086
Ian Knowles - CIYAM Lead Developer
That is buying votes, imho.

Okay - I don't think it is exactly that (as generally buying votes is done because you are pretty sure you will recoup the cost from the outcome).

If you are voting on A vs. B then both A and B might try to "buy" votes (and each has a 50% chance of presumably recouping their costs) but if you are actually voting in a way that neither A nor B can have any more than a 10% chance of winning (no matter how much they spend) then they are far less likely to even bother.
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