OMG! Putin ready to negotiate?! - page 2.

o48o

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Quote from: Sexylizzy2813 on December 28, 2022, 01:31:30 AM

Days after the Russian president says he wanted an end to the war against Ukraine On Sunday, he repeatedly his claims that he was ready to negotiate with everyone involved in this process of accepting peace. All he said was rejected both by the Ukrainians and the US, but it doesn't mean Ukraine are against the peace talk. With the heat still up the Ukrainians are not letting there guards down to this whole peace talk. Dmytro Kuleba the foreign minister of Ukraine said (Monday) that Kyiv wants UN brokered discussion to start by February only for Russia to face war tribunal.

https://edition.cnn.com/2022/12/27/europe/ukraine-russia-negotiations-putin-unlikely-intl/index.html

Having this in mind with the peace talk, can all these come to a mutual understanding? Because if all goes down well, Ukraine will likely win the war which I doubt PUTIN will just let to happen.

Well you can't let bullies dictate the rules of negotiating.

If for example a criminal keeps shooting an innocent people and there's a long lasting man hunt but he keeps escaping from cops. Finally criminal gets tired of running and tries to negotiate with police his terms of surrendering:

His terms would be that he will keep shooting far less people if cops stop chasing him and a he gets a free pass from his crimes. After cops says that are you crazy we can't do that, he would call the press saying that police don't let him quit killing.

Then would that been a real "negotiation" in the first place?

Sexylizzy2813

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Days after the Russian president says he wanted an end to the war against Ukraine On Sunday, he repeatedly his claims that he was ready to negotiate with everyone involved in this process of accepting peace. All he said was rejected both by the Ukrainians and the US, but it doesn't mean Ukraine are against the peace talk. With the heat still up the Ukrainians are not letting there guards down to this whole peace talk. Dmytro Kuleba the foreign minister of Ukraine said (Monday) that Kyiv wants UN brokered discussion to start by February only for Russia to face war tribunal.

https://edition.cnn.com/2022/12/27/europe/ukraine-russia-negotiations-putin-unlikely-intl/index.html

Having this in mind with the peace talk, can all these come to a mutual understanding? Because if all goes down well, Ukraine will likely win the war which I doubt PUTIN will just let to happen.

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Quote from: LTU_btc on December 25, 2022, 05:01:06 PM

Quote from: Kavelj22 on December 25, 2022, 01:58:22 PM

In the speech declaring his willingness to negotiate, Putin made two important points. The first point about the Patriot system that will be supplied to Ukraine, where Putin confirmed that Russia is capable of destroying it and that it will actually destroy it as soon as it arrives.

It's easier said than done. You can tell many things, but turning it into reality is completely different thing. For example, how many HIMARS systems Russia had destroyed in all these months? I'll answer - 0. So, I'm not sure why he is so confident about destroying Patriot.

These statements were accompanied by an open call for negotiations with the countries that support Ukraine. This is confirmation that Putin really fears the development of Ukraine's military power. And in a statement by Minister Sergey Lavrov, threats were confirmed regarding fears of a military confrontation between the nuclear countries in the world.
Russia is losing the war militarily as it lost it economically and is now looking for a safe way out to avoid more losses.

Cryptodebjoe

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The Kremlin are putting him under scrutiny and internal pressure because of the impacts of the sanctions placed on the nation, looking at history Putin knows that he won't win the fight so he's gradually toning down and he has made his point... I believe that Ukraine will remain neutral and not join NATO after this negotiations....

BADecker

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Quote from: LTU_btc on December 26, 2022, 06:26:30 PM

Quote from: BADecker on December 25, 2022, 05:05:00 PM

Searches are contradictory about HIMARS being destroyed, and about the number of them in Ukraine. Sometimes the number claimed to having been destroyed, far exceeds the number claimed to exist in Ukraine.

Cool

I know it's pointless to ask you such questions, but could you give us links to these searches? But at one point you're probably right. Number of HIMARS that Russia is claiming to have destroyed probably exceeds number that was actually supplied to Ukraine. Reports about it from Russian Defense Ministry comes almost on daily basis, though, they never show any proffs.

Don't feel bad. There are lots of folks who don't know how to use a search engine. It ain't my job to be your teacher. But I might consider it for enough pay in bitcoins, in advance.

Quote from: LTU_btc on December 26, 2022, 06:26:30 PM

Quote

author=Alisha-k link=topic=5431420.msg61499179#msg61499179 date=1672041888]
I also believe their exclusion from the world cup must have also been one of the reasons for the Christmas decision to negotiate.

How they can be excluded from World Cup when they didn't even got qualified to it? And in general, that would be one of the most ridiculous reasons from all possible to start to negotiate.

Right. As far as setting records, Russia set all kinds of world records in 'cup stuff', back in the '70s and '80s. If they ever started an internal 'cup operation', many other nations would be dying to enter. In fact, that is what is happening to Ukraine right now... pun intended.

Quote from: o48o on December 26, 2022, 06:38:16 PM

Quote from: BADecker on December 25, 2022, 01:09:03 PM

Putin has wanted to negotiate for a long time.
-cut-

That's what he always SAYS, which is just ridiculous. If he really wanted to negotiate, he would start by withdrawing all the russian troops from Ukraine. There can be no negotiations as long as they get their way and keep invading sovereign countries. Again, if Putin gets to have his way, his genocide won't stop to Ukraine.

You are mixing up the idea of negotiating with the results of the negotiations. Negotiating doesn't mean Putin has to give up the war, pull out of Ukraine, and then we will negotiate. But that is what's being required of him for negotiations to even start... and other ridiculous stuff.

Negotiations means talk, right now. Zelensky is the one who won't negotiate until Putin does some things the Russians won't do, at least without negotiations. If Zelensky would talk with Putin, they might find a way to end the war that both could be acceptable with.

Cool

o48o

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Quote from: BADecker on December 25, 2022, 01:09:03 PM

Putin has wanted to negotiate for a long time.
-cut-

That's what he always SAYS, which is just ridiculous. If he really wanted to negotiate, he would start by withdrawing all the russian troops from Ukraine. There can be no negotiations as long as they get their way and keep invading sovereign countries. Again, if Putin gets to have his way, his genocide won't stop to Ukraine.

LTU_btc

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Slava Ukraini!

Quote from: BADecker on December 25, 2022, 05:05:00 PM

Searches are contradictory about HIMARS being destroyed, and about the number of them in Ukraine. Sometimes the number claimed to having been destroyed, far exceeds the number claimed to exist in Ukraine.

Cool

I know it's pointless to ask you such questions, but could you give us links to these searches? But at one point you're probably right. Number of HIMARS that Russia is claiming to have destroyed probably exceeds number that was actually supplied to Ukraine. Reports about it from Russian Defense Ministry comes almost on daily basis, though, they never show any proofs.

Quote from: Alisha-k on December 26, 2022, 03:04:48 AM

I also believe their exclusion from the world cup must have also been one of the reasons for the Christmas decision to negotiate.

How they can be excluded from World Cup when they didn't even got qualified to it? And in general, that would be one of the most ridiculous reasons from all possible to start to negotiate.

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Quote from: Alisha-k on December 26, 2022, 03:04:48 AM

I also believe their exclusion from the world cup must have also been one of the reasons for the Christmas decision to negotiate.

Exclusion from the World Cup?
I am not sure how important football is to the Russian people, but I doubt that exclusion played any significant influence over Putin to negotiate or announce his intentions to negotiate.

Economical sanctions and the military/technological support Ukraine is getting is more important than football, imo.

Alisha-k

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Putin has no other option left but to negotiate and it will definitely be a genuine move so he can have access to international businesses and Sanctions against him lifted. I also believe their exclusion from the world cup must have also been one of the reasons for the Christmas decision to negotiate. I think this negotiation should have held long ago but pride and sentiment has been the big factor hindering Putin

Die_empty

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Quote from: Sexylizzy2813 on December 25, 2022, 11:36:26 AM

I guess it's safe to say Christmas has a way of doing things and it has certainly done something to Putin.
News has it that the Russian president and instigator of the invasion to Ukraine has come out to declare his intentions of opening talks with Zelenksy and his Western backers, but they seem to be saying "not yet".

The Russian invasion to Ukraine is in its tenth month and this war is the biggest confrontation between Moscow and the West since the Missile Crisis of Cuba in 1962. [1]

Are his actions actually genuine or is he really running from something entirely? More on this news here

[1] https://www.google.com/search?q=missile+crisis+cuba+1962&oq=Missile+Crisis+of+Cuba+in+19&aqs=chrome.1.69i57j0l4.16329j0j7&client=ms-android-transsion-infinix-rev1&sourceid=chrome-mobile&ie=UTF-8

The challenge is not to come to the negotiation table but the main issues are the terms and conditions of both parties. Ukraine would want Russia to leave all its territory including Crimea. And Russia wants international organizations to declare all captured territories as part of Russia. Russia would also want to guarantee that Ukraine would never be a member of NATO and Ukraine might want to join this organization because it's the only protection It has against Russian aggression.

Both parties in the war underestimated each other and they have come to realize that the earlier they stop this war the better it would be for their economy and political influence. I want to deeply appreciate Vladimir Putin for putting aside pride and coming out to propose negotiations. I think the next move should be to propose and enforce a ceasefire so that negotiation can start immediately.

I support this move wholeheartedly because Ukrainian have suffered so much

BADecker

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Quote from: macson on December 25, 2022, 03:32:12 PM

Quote from: BADecker on December 25, 2022, 01:09:03 PM

Putin haws wanted to negotiate for a long time. But it's difficult to negotiate with anybody whose strings are being pulled by the conniving US, and the jokers who pull the strings of the US.

Cool

news about Putin being willing to negotiate again emerged after the US met with the Ukrainian president to discuss something. apart from that, from the news i have read, the strong reason for the tough negotiations so far is that NATO continues to interfere and influence the decisions that will occur in both countries. for humanitarian reasons, i support both countries ending their war.

Ending the war is a good idea. Ending all wars is a good idea. Let Russia pull out of Ukraine, let the US pull out of Ukraine, let Nato influences pull out of Ukraine, dissolve Nato.

Quote from: LTU_btc on December 25, 2022, 05:01:06 PM

...

Searches are contradictory about HIMARS being destroyed, and about the number of them in Ukraine. Sometimes the number claimed to having been destroyed, far exceeds the number claimed to exist in Ukraine.

Cool

LTU_btc

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Slava Ukraini!

It's not first time when Putin said that he is ready to negotiate. He told it multiple times during 10 months of war. But the problem that they're going to negotitate only with their own predefined positions, which isn't acceptable for anyone. For example, one of conditions is that currently occupied regions of Ukraine by RF is going to be subjects of Russia forever and status of it isn't considered in these negotiations.

Quote from: Sexylizzy2813 on December 25, 2022, 11:36:26 AM

I guess it's safe to say Christmas has a way of doing things and it has certainly done something to Putin.

Actually, Christmas haven't come to Russia yet, they celebrate it on 7th January.

Quote from: Kavelj22 on December 25, 2022, 01:58:22 PM

In the speech declaring his willingness to negotiate, Putin made two important points. The first point about the Patriot system that will be supplied to Ukraine, where Putin confirmed that Russia is capable of destroying it and that it will actually destroy it as soon as it arrives.

It's easier said than done. You can tell many things, but turning it into reality is completely different thing. For example, how many HIMARS systems Russia had destroyed in all these months? I'll answer - 0. So, I'm not sure why he is so confident about destroying Patriot.
BTW, so far they agreed about supplying just one Patriot system. I don't that it can be considered as game-changer.

teosanru

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Quote from: Sexylizzy2813 on December 25, 2022, 11:36:26 AM

I guess it's safe to say Christmas has a way of doing things and it has certainly done something to Putin.
News has it that the Russian president and instigator of the invasion to Ukraine has come out to declare his intentions of opening talks with Zelenksy and his Western backers, but they seem to be saying "not yet".

The Russian invasion to Ukraine is in its tenth month and this war is the biggest confrontation between Moscow and the West since the Missile Crisis of Cuba in 1962. [1]

Are his actions actually genuine or is he really running from something entirely? More on this news here

[1] https://www.google.com/search?q=missile+crisis+cuba+1962&oq=Missile+Crisis+of+Cuba+in+19&aqs=chrome.1.69i57j0l4.16329j0j7&client=ms-android-transsion-infinix-rev1&sourceid=chrome-mobile&ie=UTF-8

I very much sort of expected this. Putin wanted to put pressure on Ukraine and wanted to set an example of aggression to the world which was the only reason why Russia started the war in the first place. They never wanted to capture the complete Ukraine. They just wanted to make it enough afraid so that it doesn't tries to join NATO and even other countries should restrain from joining it. Eventually they will settle with peace and world trade will be back on track.

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Quote from: BADecker on December 25, 2022, 01:09:03 PM

Putin haws wanted to negotiate for a long time. But it's difficult to negotiate with anybody whose strings are being pulled by the conniving US, and the jokers who pull the strings of the US.

Cool

news about Putin being willing to negotiate again emerged after the US met with the Ukrainian president to discuss something. apart from that, from the news i have read, the strong reason for the tough negotiations so far is that NATO continues to interfere and influence the decisions that will occur in both countries. for humanitarian reasons, i support both countries ending their war.

Kavelj22

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In the speech declaring his willingness to negotiate, Putin made two important points. The first point about the Patriot system that will be supplied to Ukraine, where Putin confirmed that Russia is capable of destroying it and that it will actually destroy it as soon as it arrives. The second point is his declaration of his country's readiness to negotiate with those he called the parties to the conflict in Ukraine, and I think he meant the NATO countries and the countries that declared their military and economic support for Ukraine.

It seems that Putin is really suffering losses in his military operation, and the Patriot system will be very harsh because it will be able to target sites inside Russia. I doubt, frankly, that Western countries will accept sitting at the negotiating table without preconditions, as Putin called for

BADecker

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Putin has wanted to negotiate for a long time. But it's difficult to negotiate with anybody whose strings are being pulled by the conniving US, and the jokers who pull the strings of the US.

Cool

Sexylizzy2813

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I guess it's safe to say Christmas has a way of doing things and it has certainly done something to Putin.
News has it that the Russian president and instigator of the invasion to Ukraine has come out to declare his intentions of opening talks with Zelenksy and his Western backers, but they seem to be saying "not yet".

The Russian invasion to Ukraine is in its tenth month and this war is the biggest confrontation between Moscow and the West since the Missile Crisis of Cuba in 1962. [1]

Are his actions actually genuine or is he really running from something entirely? More on this news here

[1] https://www.google.com/search?q=missile+crisis+cuba+1962&oq=Missile+Crisis+of+Cuba+in+19&aqs=chrome.1.69i57j0l4.16329j0j7&client=ms-android-transsion-infinix-rev1&sourceid=chrome-mobile&ie=UTF-8

Topic: OMG! Putin ready to negotiate?! - page 2. (Read 396 times)