On Apple's $200 billion dump and US shooting itself in the foot

pooya87

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The interesting thing I learned about this "mess" is that apparently Chinese government never wanted to go down this path. They had drank the Kool-aid so to speak and were happy in the unipolar world order having to rely on importing technologies. The idiots in Washington on the other hand, specifically starting from Trump admin., thought bans work and like always they were wrong.
Now China is running its own massive chip industries that is growing much faster than its competitors and they are also entering the "high tech chips" territories and setting new records.

It's worth repeating what I said 6-7 months ago:

Quote from: pooya87 on September 28, 2023, 12:24:45 AM

The ban on semiconductor exports to China will damage China in short term and they will obviously suffer (as they've already been damaged). On the other hand, in the long term the China that could freely import semiconductors is different from China that can no longer import them. This new China was forced to manufacture them domestically and so far they have had great success in acquiring the technology and producing high end semiconductors.

That means in long term they have the potential of easily overtaking the global market for semiconductors and their products.

You have to understand that what we call "high tech" is not some alien technology that was acquired by a group of people in a one time only visit from the outer space aliens

If you dedicate funds and brainpower in any sector you can reach the same technology anywhere. It's not like China is a poor country with no money, we all know China has more than enough money to invest in these sectors and reach the same tech level.

Albarq

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Quote from: Iranus on September 28, 2023, 10:13:42 PM

Yes, the United States is still the world's number 1 power in many fields from economics to military, but look at how other countries are developing. It can be said that other countries are developing strongly while the US seems to be slowing down to let other countries catch up.

What is happening is similar to the Nokia empire, when Apple and Samsung were rising, they thought they were still kings until they were dethroned and withered away. Nothing is forever, the US has dominated the world for more than 100 years and it is time for them to cede it to others. Although America will not be dethroned any time soon, other countries are already taking action.

From this fact, many can certainly conclude that the US has always been ahead in terms of technology in the past, but with today's advances, China is starting to show rapid progress and this can be proven by their good technological innovation, of course they have not moved on from history, why should the US be worried? regarding this problem with super cheap global competition making companies unable to compete with the emphasis on sanctions "to China and vice versa to the US making the many losses suffered by China's nightmare even worse for Apple and the US technology market and the bad situation that will happen in the future.

WillyAp

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Quote from: pooya87 on January 12, 2024, 03:32:11 AM

I'll try to write some thoughts on the dangers of China's expansion. I'm investigating and researching some stuff for now.

Hopefully a little more balanced.

Quote from: pooya87 on September 24, 2023, 09:30:20 AM

Take dedollarisation for example. Something that people denied is happening 1-2 years ago and we only keep hearing about in the mainstream media recently has been happening for at least 15 years. It's easily seen on statistics too. 15-20 years ago US dollar was used in 75-85% of the entire international trades. Today that is barely reaching 50% and is dropping fast.

Let's put some details into perspective.

More balanced info is when you compare both articles:https://www.forbes.com/sites/katharinabuchholz/2023/08/31/us-dollar-defends-role-as-global-currency-infographic/?sh=395ec9585999

with
https://www.businessinsider.com/apple-200-billion-drop-sign-post-us-tech-future-near-2023-9

China benefited greatly with the technological transfer, or the sale of the century, many managers just sold out their country's tech.
Governments cannot be trusted.

pooya87

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Quote from: pooya87 on September 10, 2023, 02:23:47 PM

But that's not all China manufactures, in other fields and products you can find top quality competitive products too. Off the top of my head their car industry which is at this point manufacturing competitive vehicles which some speculate is going to put a lot of big names out of business in the near future.

I briefly talked about the Chinese car industry last year here and now the statistics say that China overtook Japan as the number one car exporter. This is with a whopping 62% increase in exports in 2023.
https://www.reuters.com/business/autos-transportation/china-likely-dethroned-japan-worlds-top-auto-exporter-2023-china-group-2024-01-09/

I'll try to write some thoughts on the dangers of China's expansion. I'm investigating and researching some stuff for now.

DrBeer

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Quote from: Ayers on September 30, 2023, 11:17:46 PM

....
The important thing is that they do not give specific figures about the number of iPhones sold. If Apple only provides 1,000 or 2,000 iPhones to the Chinese market in the first sale, selling them all is not enough to prove that people are still interested in Apple products.
In my country, the largest phone store chain announced that it had received 10k orders in the first sale. But meanwhile, some smaller store chains announced that they sold 18,000 iPhones in the first round of sales. Later, everyone realized that the news was a ridiculous exaggeration and a lie. Moreover, many retailers always affirm that it is difficult to buy a new iPhone in the first days of sale due to lack of goods and too many customers ordering. But I tried visiting some major stores in my area and discovered there was no shortage of iPhones for sale as many newspapers or dealers were spreading. In addition, the economic situation this year is difficult, the purchasing power of new iPhones in my country is not high, my friends buy Apple's latest iPhone models every year, they also have no intention of buying new iPhones this year. You need to determine the accuracy of articles before believing them to be true.
This is the news I just read today, the China nightmare is getting worse for Apple, and US technology. China is increasingly serious about gradually eliminating dependence on American and Western technology. I believe that things will get much worse in the future when this American technology company's revenue depends too much on the Chinese market.
https://www.businessinsider.com/china-could-ban-foreign-apps-apple-app-store-report-2023-9#:~:text=Apple's%20list%20of%20challenges%20in,revenue%20for%20Apple%20last%20year.

I don't have specific numbers, but I have "intermediate" : According to insiders, 253% more iPhone 15s were sold in China in the first two hours after launch than iPhone 14s were sold in the same time in 2022. Further you can do the math.

Tu the question is different really. Some people just took the news in the topic title as "that's it, Apple has collapsed, no one in China will buy an iPhone, Apple shot itself in the foot". Nothing like that

Yes, there is a confrontation at the state level, maybe the Chinese leadership thinks that iPhones can "spy" on civil servants, that's why they banned the use of "ON WORK" ! But not to own or use while on vacation. Yes, company stocks are affected by many news items, and this kind of news among others. But... Chinese consumers remained loyal to the brand, and massively buy their phones. And will continue to do so. Because Apple has created an illusion - "if you own an iPhone, you are above others, you are successful and rich"

PS Yes, let me clarify - not a fan of the iPhone, I think it's really overrated. Yes I had iPhones, no - didn't like them

pooya87

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Quote from: Ayers on September 30, 2023, 11:17:46 PM

This is the news I just read today, the China nightmare is getting worse for Apple, and US technology. China is increasingly serious about gradually eliminating dependence on American and Western technology. I believe that things will get much worse in the future when this American technology company's revenue depends too much on the Chinese market.

This is the whole point I've been making in this thread. Also keep in mind that the US dependence on others is not just their markets as export destinations, but also US depends on their resources to manufacture stuff they want to export.
For example we saw the significance of this in the sanction war between US and China where US started restricting export of chips to China and China started restricting export of materials used in manufacturing Chips to all those countries!

arabspaceship123

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The US hasn't lost power but it's losing it day by day. Other countries are getting bolder they're making alliances else where. They're getting stronger trading away but US gets weaker. If there's going to be trade wars it's going to hurt America because of retaliatory measures. It's going to get worse for Apple if there isn't a truce.

Quote from: Ayers on September 30, 2023, 11:17:46 PM

This is the news I just read today, the China nightmare is getting worse for Apple, and US technology. China is increasingly serious about gradually eliminating dependence on American and Western technology. I believe that things will get much worse in the future when this American technology company's revenue depends too much on the Chinese market.

https://www.businessinsider.com/china-could-ban-foreign-apps-apple-app-store-report-2023-9#:~:text=Apple's%20list%20of%20challenges%20in,revenue%20for%20Apple%20last%20year.

Ayers

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Quote from: DrBeer on September 29, 2023, 09:41:49 AM

The risks to Apple of imposing restrictions in China on government employees have been more than offset by the huge demand among Chinese people. Bottom line: Apple continues to make a super profit, while Chinese civil servants are simply left without an iPhone 15. That's the reality

So much for Chinese patriotism. All iPhones 15 were sold out in a minute on Tmall, the queue is lined up until November
Only a couple of models are promised to be delivered at the end of October
New iPhone 15 were sold out on Chinese platform Tmall within a minute after the start of pre-orders, as reported by Bloomberg.

At this point, the queue for some iPhone 15 models has stretched for a month and a half or more. Only a couple of sets are promised to be delivered at the end of October, the rest of the smartphones will have to wait until November.

Before the presentation of the iPhone 15 Chinese media and social networks of the country discussed a new smartphone Huawei Mate 60 Pro, which was called the next "killer" iPhone. In addition, just before the announcement there were reports that Beijing expanded the ban on the use of Apple products by officials. However, these steps had little effect on the enthusiasm of users.

https://www.ixbt.com/news/2023/09/19/iphone-15-tmall.html

PS Self-moderation is good, but why delete ordinary news on the topic ?

The important thing is that they do not give specific figures about the number of iPhones sold. If Apple only provides 1,000 or 2,000 iPhones to the Chinese market in the first sale, selling them all is not enough to prove that people are still interested in Apple products.

In my country, the largest phone store chain announced that it had received 10k orders in the first sale. But meanwhile, some smaller store chains announced that they sold 18,000 iPhones in the first round of sales. Later, everyone realized that the news was a ridiculous exaggeration and a lie. Moreover, many retailers always affirm that it is difficult to buy a new iPhone in the first days of sale due to lack of goods and too many customers ordering. But I tried visiting some major stores in my area and discovered there was no shortage of iPhones for sale as many newspapers or dealers were spreading. In addition, the economic situation this year is difficult, the purchasing power of new iPhones in my country is not high, my friends buy Apple's latest iPhone models every year, they also have no intention of buying new iPhones this year. You need to determine the accuracy of articles before believing them to be true.

This is the news I just read today, the China nightmare is getting worse for Apple, and US technology. China is increasingly serious about gradually eliminating dependence on American and Western technology. I believe that things will get much worse in the future when this American technology company's revenue depends too much on the Chinese market.

https://www.businessinsider.com/china-could-ban-foreign-apps-apple-app-store-report-2023-9#:~:text=Apple's%20list%20of%20challenges%20in,revenue%20for%20Apple%20last%20year.

pooya87

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Quote from: DrBeer on September 29, 2023, 09:41:49 AM

New iPhone 15 were sold out on Chinese platform Tmall within a minute after the start of pre-orders
PS Self-moderation is good, but why delete ordinary news on the topic ?

Just because some news has the word "Apple" or "iPhone" in it, doesn't mean it is on topic! Did you even bother reading the opening post or the ongoing discussion in this topic?
We aren't discussing iPhone 15 sale stats or speculating about Apple revenues here! At least read the article from BusinessInsider that I shared before spamming with irrelevant stuff...

Iranus

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Quote from: pooya87 on September 29, 2023, 07:48:37 AM

Quote from: Iranus on September 28, 2023, 10:13:42 PM

Yes, the United States is still the world's number 1 power in many fields from economics to military, but look at how other countries are developing. It can be said that other countries are developing strongly while the US seems to be slowing down to let other countries catch up.

What is happening is similar to the Nokia empire, when Apple and Samsung were rising, they thought they were still kings until they were dethroned and withered away. Nothing is forever, the US has dominated the world for more than 100 years and it is time for them to cede it to others. Although America will not be dethroned any time soon, other countries are already taking action.

Good examples but there is a fundamental difference here. In case of all these companies we are seeing pure competition and they all continue existing side by side offering their products in a tight competing market. For example in a phone shop you see Apple, Samsung, Nokia, ... all there and you choose between them. That competition is a good thing since it forces all of these companies to keep improving and keep their product prices low.

In case of US, it was not the competition that got US to the "number 1" position in different fields. Instead it was destruction of others, some of which caused directly by US. For example the biggest help to US was World War 2 which only had one winner and it was US because US mainland was completely intact while everywhere else from Europe and Russia to Africa and Asia were destroyed. This is also what shaped the US general policy over the past 80+ years, a "grease the pol behind you" kind of policy.
This also clarifies why US sees any country that improves as a "national security threat"! Because if for example Africa regains its independence and strength, West Asia gets rid of US backed terrorists, etc. that means they will all kick the colonizers out which means all the resources US has been stealing all these years to build that "empire" will no longer be accessible to the regime for free.

I agree with what you said, my comparison may not be entirely correct but I just want to say that many fans of the US still stubbornly refuse to accept the weakening of the US government and the rise of other countries, especially BRICS. Things gradually become clearer, but they still stubbornly believe that it doesn't work and won't change anything. As for the US Government, I believe they are aware of the challenges they are facing. They will use every trick to maintain their dominance, but I believe that history will repeat itself. They have overthrown other regimes to dominate the world, there will also be others who do the same thing as them, nothing lasts forever.

arabspaceship123

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Nokia phones were used by every body. If we didn't have one we knew ppl who used it. When competitors put their smart phones in shops Nokia lost it's market. It couldn't take on battles with expensive Apple or cheap Android phones. They pushed Nokia down. Now I don't know any ppl using Nokia phones. Nokia didn't dominate phone markets for long.

We don't know when it's going to happen but US isn't in a position to stop moves countries are making to push US influence away.

Quote from: Iranus on September 28, 2023, 10:13:42 PM

What is happening is similar to the Nokia empire, when Apple and Samsung were rising, they thought they were still kings until they were dethroned and withered away. Nothing is forever, the US has dominated the world for more than 100 years and it is time for them to cede it to others. Although America will not be dethroned any time soon, other countries are already taking action.

el kaka22

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Let's see how this new iphone 15 will do for them. I still think that they are a bit overestimated and shouldn't be this big. They make new laptops with new chips, it was m1, now m2, I am sure it will soon be m3, and so forth along with making new phones that were iphone 13 and then iphone 14 and now iphone 15, I bet next one will be iphone 16.

However, they have used this method for nearly 20 years and grew this big, I do not see why it would no longer be profitable, I bet that they are going to do fine. I just don't know if people will smarten up and maybe look for some other products, not looking like they would, but could still happen if they give it enough time. This is why it's quite important to make sure they will do fine.

DrBeer

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The risks to Apple of imposing restrictions in China on government employees have been more than offset by the huge demand among Chinese people. Bottom line: Apple continues to make a super profit, while Chinese civil servants are simply left without an iPhone 15. That's the reality

So much for Chinese patriotism. All iPhones 15 were sold out in a minute on Tmall, the queue is lined up until November
Only a couple of models are promised to be delivered at the end of October
New iPhone 15 were sold out on Chinese platform Tmall within a minute after the start of pre-orders, as reported by Bloomberg.

At this point, the queue for some iPhone 15 models has stretched for a month and a half or more. Only a couple of sets are promised to be delivered at the end of October, the rest of the smartphones will have to wait until November.

Before the presentation of the iPhone 15 Chinese media and social networks of the country discussed a new smartphone Huawei Mate 60 Pro, which was called the next "killer" iPhone. In addition, just before the announcement there were reports that Beijing expanded the ban on the use of Apple products by officials. However, these steps had little effect on the enthusiasm of users.

https://www.ixbt.com/news/2023/09/19/iphone-15-tmall.html

PS Self-moderation is good, but why delete ordinary news on the topic ?

pooya87

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Quote from: Iranus on September 28, 2023, 10:13:42 PM

Yes, the United States is still the world's number 1 power in many fields from economics to military, but look at how other countries are developing. It can be said that other countries are developing strongly while the US seems to be slowing down to let other countries catch up.

What is happening is similar to the Nokia empire, when Apple and Samsung were rising, they thought they were still kings until they were dethroned and withered away. Nothing is forever, the US has dominated the world for more than 100 years and it is time for them to cede it to others. Although America will not be dethroned any time soon, other countries are already taking action.

Good examples but there is a fundamental difference here. In case of all these companies we are seeing pure competition and they all continue existing side by side offering their products in a tight competing market. For example in a phone shop you see Apple, Samsung, Nokia, ... all there and you choose between them. That competition is a good thing since it forces all of these companies to keep improving and keep their product prices low.

In case of US, it was not the competition that got US to the "number 1" position in different fields. Instead it was destruction of others, some of which caused directly by US. For example the biggest help to US was World War 2 which only had one winner and it was US because US mainland was completely intact while everywhere else from Europe and Russia to Africa and Asia were destroyed. This is also what shaped the US general policy over the past 80+ years, a "grease the pol behind you" kind of policy.
This also clarifies why US sees any country that improves as a "national security threat"! Because if for example Africa regains its independence and strength, West Asia gets rid of US backed terrorists, etc. that means they will all kick the colonizers out which means all the resources US has been stealing all these years to build that "empire" will no longer be accessible to the regime for free.

Iranus

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Quote from: Bitstar_coin on September 28, 2023, 07:01:56 AM

Quote from: pooya87 on September 24, 2023, 09:30:20 AM

Quote from: Synchronice on September 19, 2023, 01:35:56 PM

You can't really easily say that US will lose power soon, it's too early to say that, especially when it has the best military, best weapons, has influence on the whole world and so on.

I'm not saying that "US will lose power soon", I say US has been losing power for years and it is now only speeding up.

Take dedollarisation for example. Something that people denied is happening 1-2 years ago and we only keep hearing about in the mainstream media recently has been happening for at least 15 years. It's easily seen on statistics too. 15-20 years ago US dollar was used in 75-85% of the entire international trades. Today that is barely reaching 50% and is dropping fast.
Not to mention that even Bitcoin falls under the category of dedollarisation and also was created 14-15 years ago.

Same with military, weapons, influence, etc. that you mentioned.

You see inflation and capitalism didn't just hurt regular people and industries. It's hurt everything. For example a simple UAV costs a shit ton of money to manufacture inside US, and the capitalist ridden companies have turned into the biggest scammers like Lockheed Martin that is more of a thief at this point rather than a solid aerospace company.
Off the top of my head I could mention the story of manufacturing The Beast aka RQ170 that you can read in books like Drone Wars. In short hundreds of billions of dollars were wasted Lockheed Martin for R&D on failed projects for years to lead to the final "successful" one that created what US considered to be the most advanced stealth aircraft. In its first attempt to spy on Iran back in 2011, not only it was easily detected by the Iranian defenses but also it took them seconds to hack it, take full control and land it safely inside Iranian soil. They then decrypted its data, reverse engineer its technology and mass produced it at ridiculously cheap prices!
This extends to the similar aircraft like B2 Bombers and of course the so called "stealth" fighters like F35. And US Airforce is supposed to be strong and advanced lol.

There are numerous examples I could give in other fields. Take influence for example. 5 years ago nobody could imagine Saudi regime (the 51st state) going against Petrodollar let alone threatening US with "economic devastation". Today they're doing it and worse!

Your points are very obvious, we can't ignore the fact that the US is gradually losing that position as the most powerful country in the world. But that does not mean it will happen tomorrow or sooner which I can see is the argument of most members here.
The fact that China is taking such measures against Apple and iPhone means there is a slight shift in the way things used to operate. And the question should be why is it happening now and not 15 years back?
Like it or not, the narrative is changing and it is no longer business as usual, boys are becoming men and so it will continue.

It's funny that until now, everything is as clear as day, but there are still many people who do not believe that America's power is gradually weakening and that de-dollarization is just a rumor Grin

.

Yes, the United States is still the world's number 1 power in many fields from economics to military, but look at how other countries are developing. It can be said that other countries are developing strongly while the US seems to be slowing down to let other countries catch up.

What is happening is similar to the Nokia empire, when Apple and Samsung were rising, they thought they were still kings until they were dethroned and withered away. Nothing is forever, the US has dominated the world for more than 100 years and it is time for them to cede it to others. Although America will not be dethroned any time soon, other countries are already taking action.

Bitstar_coin

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Quote from: pooya87 on September 24, 2023, 09:30:20 AM

Quote from: Synchronice on September 19, 2023, 01:35:56 PM

You can't really easily say that US will lose power soon, it's too early to say that, especially when it has the best military, best weapons, has influence on the whole world and so on.

I'm not saying that "US will lose power soon", I say US has been losing power for years and it is now only speeding up.

Take dedollarisation for example. Something that people denied is happening 1-2 years ago and we only keep hearing about in the mainstream media recently has been happening for at least 15 years. It's easily seen on statistics too. 15-20 years ago US dollar was used in 75-85% of the entire international trades. Today that is barely reaching 50% and is dropping fast.
Not to mention that even Bitcoin falls under the category of dedollarisation and also was created 14-15 years ago.

Same with military, weapons, influence, etc. that you mentioned.

You see inflation and capitalism didn't just hurt regular people and industries. It's hurt everything. For example a simple UAV costs a shit ton of money to manufacture inside US, and the capitalist ridden companies have turned into the biggest scammers like Lockheed Martin that is more of a thief at this point rather than a solid aerospace company.
Off the top of my head I could mention the story of manufacturing The Beast aka RQ170 that you can read in books like Drone Wars. In short hundreds of billions of dollars were wasted Lockheed Martin for R&D on failed projects for years to lead to the final "successful" one that created what US considered to be the most advanced stealth aircraft. In its first attempt to spy on Iran back in 2011, not only it was easily detected by the Iranian defenses but also it took them seconds to hack it, take full control and land it safely inside Iranian soil. They then decrypted its data, reverse engineer its technology and mass produced it at ridiculously cheap prices!
This extends to the similar aircraft like B2 Bombers and of course the so called "stealth" fighters like F35. And US Airforce is supposed to be strong and advanced lol.

There are numerous examples I could give in other fields. Take influence for example. 5 years ago nobody could imagine Saudi regime (the 51st state) going against Petrodollar let alone threatening US with "economic devastation". Today they're doing it and worse!

Your points are very obvious, we can't ignore the fact that the US is gradually losing that position as the most powerful country in the world. But that does not mean it will happen tomorrow or sooner which I can see is the argument of most members here.
The fact that China is taking such measures against Apple and iPhone means there is a slight shift in the way things used to operate. And the question should be why is it happening now and not 15 years back?
Like it or not, the narrative is changing and it is no longer business as usual, boys are becoming men and so it will continue.

pooya87

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Quote from: blckhawk on September 24, 2023, 09:24:42 PM

The ban on high end semiconductor and the following fabrication equipment for those semiconductor is going to damage China so even if there will be a rise in competition against American products, you have to understand that they're probably going to be competing against low class tech since there's still the ban on imports of high-end semiconductors which is pretty crucial if you want to make locally produced, cheaper and high-end tech then those high-end semiconductors are going to be a crucial part for that and all the countries that's producing this semiconductors are already in agreement with the US to not do any importations to China.

You are talking short term, I'm talking long term.
The ban on semiconductor exports to China will damage China in short term and they will obviously suffer (as they've already been damaged). On the other hand, in the long term the China that could freely import semiconductors is different from China that can no longer import them. This new China was forced to manufacture them domestically and so far they have had great success in acquiring the technology and producing high end semiconductors.

That means in long term they have the potential of easily overtaking the global market for semiconductors and their products.

You have to understand that what we call "high tech" is not some alien technology that was acquired by a group of people in a one time only visit from the outer space aliens

If you dedicate funds and brainpower in any sector you can reach the same technology anywhere. It's not like China is a poor country with no money, we all know China has more than enough money to invest in these sectors and reach the same tech level.

arabspaceship123

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It's speeding up because US isn't influencing other countries like it used to. Smaller economies are getting bigger so America can't dominate them if they're happy to trade with Brazil, Russia, India, China, South Africa and the other in the BRICS block. If they're really upset they'll buy weapons from other countries so US isn't automatic first choice for buyers now.

In 5 years entire international trade numbers for US dollar's going to drop below 50%. America can't do anything about it.

Quote from: pooya87 on September 24, 2023, 09:30:20 AM

I'm not saying that "US will lose power soon", I say US has been losing power for years and it is now only speeding up.

Take dedollarisation for example. Something that people denied is happening 1-2 years ago and we only keep hearing about in the mainstream media recently has been happening for at least 15 years. It's easily seen on statistics too. 15-20 years ago US dollar was used in 75-85% of the entire international trades. Today that is barely reaching 50% and is dropping fast.
Not to mention that even Bitcoin falls under the category of dedollarisation and also was created 14-15 years ago.

Same with military, weapons, influence, etc. that you mentioned.

DrBeer

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Quote from: blckhawk on September 24, 2023, 09:24:42 PM

How would you explain this article then? The ban on high end semiconductor and the following fabrication equipment for those semiconductor is going to damage China so even if there will be a rise in competition against American products, you have to understand that they're probably going to be competing against low class tech since there's still the ban on imports of high-end semiconductors which is pretty crucial if you want to make locally produced, cheaper and high-end tech then those high-end semiconductors are going to be a crucial part for that and all the countries that's producing this semiconductors are already in agreement with the US to not do any importations to China. That $200 billion loss that Apple has experienced, they will eventually gain it back even if China restricts Apple products because Apple is just so popular in the Chinese market, it will be difficult for the CCP to crackdown on the purchase of the Apple products.

As much as we want to hate on the USA and that we think that China and Russia is probably going to replace them, we have to first see what's also happening on the other countries that we think will replace USA in global market and influence. And if you were to check them out, that's when you can decide whether they're really going to be the contender that's going to dethrone USA.

Chips, it's part of the "game". China can produce, hard but can, chips from previous technological generations. It will have enough.
But, uh. There are a lot of areas that are not being talked about openly. Like medicine. European and American companies are the leaders there. And China can't survive by simply "copying" them. This is education. Most of today's specialists in China are former Chinese students in American universities. And at the moment, it has become almost unaffordable for Chinese people. Yes, the U.S. has imposed restrictions on Chinese students in technology departments....
The problem is that China, riding on the money, technology, investment of the West, has decided that it is "cooler" than them. But China is very wrong. Even China's economy depends on buyers in the DEVELOPED world. Reorientation to poor neighbors and developing regions will not help, China's economy is huge and it needs to sell a lot and earn a lot.... And with poor partners it is not realizable !
PS What does Russia have to do with it, I don't understand at all ? At the moment and in the near future - Russia is a resource, degrading, backward country, a terrorist, and a rogue country, nothing more

blckhawk

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How would you explain this article then? The ban on high end semiconductor and the following fabrication equipment for those semiconductor is going to damage China so even if there will be a rise in competition against American products, you have to understand that they're probably going to be competing against low class tech since there's still the ban on imports of high-end semiconductors which is pretty crucial if you want to make locally produced, cheaper and high-end tech then those high-end semiconductors are going to be a crucial part for that and all the countries that's producing this semiconductors are already in agreement with the US to not do any importations to China. That $200 billion loss that Apple has experienced, they will eventually gain it back even if China restricts Apple products because Apple is just so popular in the Chinese market, it will be difficult for the CCP to crackdown on the purchase of the Apple products.

As much as we want to hate on the USA and that we think that China and Russia is probably going to replace them, we have to first see what's also happening on the other countries that we think will replace USA in global market and influence. And if you were to check them out, that's when you can decide whether they're really going to be the contender that's going to dethrone USA.

Topic: On Apple's $200 billion dump and US shooting itself in the foot (Read 699 times)