On Bitcoin Cash (again) | Bitcointalksearch.org

Khaos77

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Quote from: deisik on March 16, 2019, 01:10:37 AM

Quote from: asdlolciterquit on March 15, 2019, 01:52:58 PM

really, can you post some numbers to prove your sentence

I think you may read more about Bitcoin Cash showdown in November 2018 (there you will find enough numbers)

Quote from: ?? on ??

Quote from: deisik on March 15, 2019, 02:50:59 PM

I see no reason why the status quo should change in the future

Bitcoin Cash and its copycats don't offer anything which would allow them to take over Bitcoin. Bigger blocks are irrelevant if no one uses these coins in real life. Further, miners themselves are pretty much irrelevant too, and if a coin dies a slow death due to lack of interest, it will be an exercise in futility and stupidity to pour resources into it just to keep it alive (I've seen such things and it was pathetic, to say the least). In simple terms, miners are mining because they love profits, not because they like Bitcoin or Bitcoin Cash

As they say, profits trump prophets

You see no reason the miners are keeping BCH around.
But they are the ones keeping it afloat, because they think the bigger blocks will mean more transactions and more fees in the future , which is why they are expending resources on it now

I'm not sure it is miners keeping BCash afloat

I'd rather say it is die-hard cultists who can't accept they had been fooled by fraudsters like Roger Ver and Craig Wright (when the latter hadn't yet forked off). Miners are Bitcoin agnostic, so to speak, and they mine the coin which is more profitable to mine at the moment. Personally, I don't think they have any delusions about "more transactions and more fees in the future"

Quote from: ?? on ??

You should ask yourself, the miners are the one refusing to let BCH die, they are taking a wait and see approach that is multiyear and willing to spend millions on it, so they are seeing something not apparent to the public. Which I believe is that LN will Devastate their fee business model with BTC and BCH will become their only option

Again, you make an erroneous assumption and then proceed to make erroneous conclusions.
If no one uses a coin, it is set to die, and miners couldn't and wouldn't do a thing to prevent this

Well BCH is still here , so it seems there are errors in your understanding of it's supporters motivations.

In my viewpoint the miners are taking a long term strategy because of a lack of faith in BTC long-term profitability.
The fact you are unable to accept this with you current mind set , is more your problem than mine.

When you take off those blinders, it is not hard to see what is going on.

Good Luck in removing them.

deisik

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Quote from: Red-Apple on March 17, 2019, 06:50:05 AM

17.98% is nothing in altcoin market! it is considered among the tiniest amounts of profit that traders won't even get out of bed for! the profits that we have our eyes on are at least 100% and more and any pump coin has that including BCH but the important part is that they only last for a short time. so you have to plan accordingly

Well, technically, Bitcoin Cash is not yet a downright shitcoin

As you can't call something a shitcoin which has a price tag of 150 dollars at the moment (we should be honest here). In this way, nearly 18% growth is not something to sneeze at. But I agree that this surge will likely be short-lived anyway, though we don't know at which exact level a pullback is going to occur. If you are lucky and short this coin at the right moment, you will be able to earn decent profits off those who fueled this rise with their money

Red-Apple

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Quote from: Kasabus on March 16, 2019, 02:37:16 AM

Quote from: Horas1976 on March 16, 2019, 01:35:48 AM

Today I see BCH running well and experiencing an increase even though many people don't like it. These developments have had a good impact on the community, they have survived and are looking for good opportunities to increase and remain popular.

It was not moving better than ETH but now it has try to break free.

Of the top 100 coins in the market, Bitcoin cash is the most profitable with 17.98% increase so far, there's something happening here, and I know
it's good for the entire market, we are seeing a usual price movement now when on increase.

17.98% is nothing in altcoin market! it is considered among the tiniest amounts of profit that traders won't even get out of bed for! the profits that we have our eyes on are at least 100% and more and any pump coin has that including BCH but the important part is that they only last for a short time. so you have to plan accordingly.

leea-1334

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Thanks guys. I actually learn a lot about Bitcoin Cash and the forks from this thread and this post than I knew in the whole time since last year when it happened. I never claimed my BCH fork from Bitcoin as it was worth too little, and left it all on some other exchange locked inside trades but I admit I should have because now you can see even the forks have some value. I do not care for the politics but people made free money and I should have too.

deisik

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Quote from: Khaos77 on March 16, 2019, 02:24:24 AM

Well BCH is still here , so it seems there are errors in your understanding of it's supporters motivations

I don't see how the latter follows from the former

BCash is still there because it is supported by some people (die-hard cultists as I call them, good luck to them), so I don't really see what you are trying to say here as I'm not very much into their motivations. To put it differently, as long as it has supporters (which I don't deny, mind you), it will drag on with likely occasional pumps followed by inevitable dumps as what we are witnessing right now (read, a good day to short hard)

Quote from: Khaos77 on March 16, 2019, 02:24:24 AM

In my viewpoint the miners are taking a long term strategy because of a lack of faith in BTC long-term profitability.
The fact you are unable to accept this with you current mind set , is more your problem than mine

This is not a fact, to begin with, as it is only your assumption which needs to be substantiated accordingly

Kasabus

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Quote from: Horas1976 on March 16, 2019, 01:35:48 AM

Today I see BCH running well and experiencing an increase even though many people don't like it. These developments have had a good impact on the community, they have survived and are looking for good opportunities to increase and remain popular.

It was not moving better than ETH but now it has try to break free.

Of the top 100 coins in the market, Bitcoin cash is the most profitable with 17.98% increase so far, there's something happening here, and I know
it's good for the entire market, we are seeing a usual price movement now when on increase.

Horas1976

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Today I see BCH running well and experiencing an increase even though many people don't like it. These developments have had a good impact on the community, they have survived and are looking for good opportunities to increase and remain popular.

deisik

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Quote from: asdlolciterquit on March 15, 2019, 01:52:58 PM

really, can you post some numbers to prove your sentence

I think you may read more about Bitcoin Cash showdown in November 2018 (there you will find enough numbers)

Quote from: ?? on ??

Quote from: deisik on March 15, 2019, 02:50:59 PM

I see no reason why the status quo should change in the future

Bitcoin Cash and its copycats don't offer anything which would allow them to take over Bitcoin. Bigger blocks are irrelevant if no one uses these coins in real life. Further, miners themselves are pretty much irrelevant too, and if a coin dies a slow death due to lack of interest, it will be an exercise in futility and stupidity to pour resources into it just to keep it alive (I've seen such things and it was pathetic, to say the least). In simple terms, miners are mining because they love profits, not because they like Bitcoin or Bitcoin Cash

As they say, profits trump prophets

You see no reason the miners are keeping BCH around.
But they are the ones keeping it afloat, because they think the bigger blocks will mean more transactions and more fees in the future , which is why they are expending resources on it now

I'm not sure it is miners keeping BCash afloat

I'd rather say it is die-hard cultists who can't accept they had been fooled by fraudsters like Roger Ver and Craig Wright (when the latter hadn't yet forked off). Miners are Bitcoin agnostic, so to speak, and they mine the coin which is more profitable to mine at the moment. Personally, I don't think they have any delusions about "more transactions and more fees in the future"

Quote from: ?? on ??

You should ask yourself, the miners are the one refusing to let BCH die, they are taking a wait and see approach that is multiyear and willing to spend millions on it, so they are seeing something not apparent to the public. Which I believe is that LN will Devastate their fee business model with BTC and BCH will become their only option

Again, you make an erroneous assumption and then proceed to make erroneous conclusions. If no one uses a coin, it is set to die, and miners couldn't and wouldn't do a thing to prevent this

deisik

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Quote from: ?? on ??

Quote from: deisik on March 15, 2019, 01:13:16 PM

Quote from: ?? on ??

Quote from: deisik on March 15, 2019, 10:24:55 AM

My "measure" of being Bitcoin is based entirely on economic factors

So by economic factors , you mean higher trade volume and price per coin, clarify if you mean something else.
It is most likely that the coin holding the higher hash rate will become the higher price and have a higher trade volume

Right now, yes, higher trading volumes and prices are pretty much it

Ok , no disagreement there.

The True Bitcoin is the one with the highest Economic value and trading volume and as a side effect higher hash rate.
At the moment BTC holds that mantle according to the above premise.

However, there are no guarantee BTC Maintains the above position ,
which is why the miners are playing both sides

I see no reason why the status quo should change in the future

Bitcoin Cash and its copycats don't offer anything which would allow them to take over Bitcoin. Bigger blocks are irrelevant if no one uses these coins in real life. Further, miners themselves are pretty much irrelevant too, and if a coin dies a slow death due to lack of interest, it will be an exercise in futility and stupidity to pour resources into it just to keep it alive (I've seen such things and it was pathetic, to say the least). In simple terms, miners are mining because they love profits, not because they like Bitcoin or Bitcoin Cash

As they say, profits trump prophets

bangjoe

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I don't really understand what the long-term impact is, but what I do know is that they have done something wrong and at the wrong time
they had destroyed their own foundation when the storm was happening and in the end they fell so fast and unfortunately they didn't collapse alone but they hit another building and the building I meant was bitcoin

asdlolciterquit

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i think it's funny (imho) read sentence like "It is obvious by now that people behind Bitcoin Cash have created a lot of pain in the ass for Bitcoin"

really, can you post some numbers to prove your sentence

deisik

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Quote from: ?? on ??

Quote from: deisik on March 15, 2019, 10:24:55 AM

My "measure" of being Bitcoin is based entirely on economic factors

So by economic factors , you mean higher trade volume and price per coin, clarify if you mean something else.
It is most likely that the coin holding the higher hash rate will become the higher price and have a higher trade volume

Right now, yes, higher trading volumes and prices are pretty much it

It is so because both Bitcoins are used primarily for speculation but if we cut the crap, the original Bitcoin's use in real life is a way greater than that of the wannabe Bitcoin. But technically, you are right - if we discard the fact that you are confusing cause and effect here. The higher hash rate would be the effect of higher prices, not the other way around as you erroneously assume (all other relevant conditions being the same, obviously)

Quote from: ?? on ??

If we are still derailed from your point, a more direct wording would be helpful

Common people don't particularly care if the dollar is backed up by anything. To them, it is six of one and half a dozen of the other (read, the same good old buck), at least as long as their purchasing power doesn't get stolen beyond their tolerance limits

deisik

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Quote from: ?? on ??

Quote from: deisik on March 15, 2019, 12:32:19 AM

Quote from: ?? on ??

Technically, BCH and BTC share the exact same genesis block.
If BCH hash rate ever exceeds BTC, then it by all standards would be the true bitcoin

I think this is a false premise

For example, if Bitcoin moves away from PoW consensus mechanism to something different (though not necessarily PoS), will it stop being Bitcoin (even regardless of Bitcoin Cash)? I think no, at least as long as its user base doesn't shrink dramatically. But then your whole point about hash rate becomes inconsequential

As an illustrative case, the US dollar was way different in the early 20th century from what it is now with the FED coming along at a certain point. What we have today is technically a Federal Reserve note (read, a fake dollar) not backed up by anything unlike the early dollar fully backed up gold. And so what?

It is the general premise , that higher hash rate in a PoW coin determines the true chain

But that alone doesn't make it valid (or more valid). For example, if Bitcoin's hash rate drops due to Lightning Network expansion, will Bitcoin Cash become more Bitcoin because of that?

Quote from: ?? on ??

However if you follow a different premise such as the dev team determines the true chain,
then hash rate means nothing to you, but you have accepted a centralized command structure and given up on decentralization by doing so, personal choice of the reader

My "measure" of being Bitcoin is based entirely on economic factors

Quote from: ?? on ??

On your US dollar thought, in early days, it was backed by gold & silver, being fully redeemable upon request for the precious metals. As a result , their was no insane inflation stealing the value of the US Dollar like their is now, that it is tied to nothing

You seem to miss my point

I'm not saying that a dollar backed by gold is worse than a dollar backed by nothing as this is not my point at all. Whether today's dollar is better or worse is irrelevant as it is still essentially the same dollar as long as its uses are concerned. In other words, you can buy with it the same things you would buy 100 years ago (allowing for technological progress, of course), so it is the same dollar even if technically it is not quite true

deisik

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Quote from: deisik on March 11, 2019, 04:37:25 AM

You seem to miss one important thing here

Neither Dash nor Litecoin (for example) never claimed to be the only true Bitcoin out there. So in this manner BCH is really the first coin which went so far and claimed just that. That's the difference which makes a difference, so to speak. The former may have claimed to be a "perfect replacement" for Bitcoin (or anything to that tune), but it is still a far cry from claiming to be Bitcoin, the one and only

Technically, BCH and BTC share the exact same genesis block.
If BCH hash rate ever exceeds BTC, then it by all standards would be the true bitcoin

I think this is a false premise

For example, if Bitcoin moves away from PoW consensus mechanism to something different (though not necessarily PoS), will it stop being Bitcoin (even regardless of Bitcoin Cash)? I think no, at least as long as its user base doesn't shrink dramatically. But then your whole point about hash rate becomes inconsequential

As an illustrative case, the US dollar was way different in the early 20th century from what it is now with the FED coming along at a certain point. What we have today is technically a Federal Reserve note (read, a fake dollar) not backed up by anything unlike the early dollar fully backed up gold. And so what?

Ranly123

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Quote from: taratorly on March 11, 2019, 03:37:55 AM

Quote from: deisik on January 24, 2019, 12:21:53 PM

This is a second installment in a series of posts about Bitcoin Cash and its fall. You can read the first part here

So my question is, how long will it take till this shitcoin bites the dust finally and stops being such pain in the ass?

We all have a set of expectations from the crypto market. And I think one of the biggest expectations is a cleaning process because the market includes too much coin. I think that Bitcoin Cash is not more than just a shitcoin too.

I also agree with this. When it comes to reliability on volume, Bitcoin cash has already been proven to a decent one. Though the price is not that appreciative, but at least we can see the volume that rank inside top 100 on the list.

beerlover

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Quote from: taratorly on March 11, 2019, 03:37:55 AM

Quote from: deisik on January 24, 2019, 12:21:53 PM

This is a second installment in a series of posts about Bitcoin Cash and its fall. You can read the first part here

So my question is, how long will it take till this shitcoin bites the dust finally and stops being such pain in the ass?

We all have a set of expectations from the crypto market. And I think one of the biggest expectations is a cleaning process because the market includes too much coin. I think that Bitcoin Cash is not more than just a shitcoin too.

What will then be the cleaning process now that lot of coins has infiltrate the market aside the shitcoins and the ones that are scams too, if everyone opening a project start relying on ICO to raise fund and also creating their own coin, how will the crypto market survive or even see anything called bull run, I really wish the market can be cleaned as quick as possible before other potential investors gets discouraged generally just like I and few other investors are already getting fed up.

deisik

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Quote from: talkbitcoin on March 11, 2019, 04:11:20 AM

Quote

as these bastards will never be part of Bitcoin again

they already are a big part of bitcoin and that is not going to change

I don't actually think so and you can easily see that for yourself if you take a look at the recent BCH trading volumes which are pathetic (not even speaking of BSV which fits the definition of a shitcoin perfectly)

Quote from: talkbitcoin on March 11, 2019, 04:11:20 AM

Quote

So my question is, how long will it take till this shitcoin bites the dust finally and stops being such pain in the ass?

why do you thin BCH is the first or only coin that is doing this?
have you forgotten how coins like Dash for example attacked bitcoin in 2017 during the spam attack? how they advertised themselves as "replacing bitcoin"? and how they pumped their shitcoin? and a lot more?

You seem to miss one important thing here

Neither Dash nor Litecoin (for example) never claimed to be the only true Bitcoin out there. So in this manner BCH is really the first coin which went so far and claimed just that. That's the difference which makes a difference, so to speak. The former may have claimed to be a "perfect replacement" for Bitcoin (or anything to that tune), but it is still a far cry from claiming to be Bitcoin, the one and only

talkbitcoin

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Quote

as these bastards will never be part of Bitcoin again

they already are a big part of bitcoin and that is not going to change. for instance Roger Ver is a whale who has a lot of bitcoin in his possession. and i believe that a big part of the reason why they even created BCH was to increase their bitcoin wealth!

Quote

So my question is, how long will it take till this shitcoin bites the dust finally and stops being such pain in the ass?

why do you thin BCH is the first or only coin that is doing this?
have you forgotten how coins like Dash for example attacked bitcoin in 2017 during the spam attack? how they advertised themselves as "replacing bitcoin"? and how they pumped their shitcoin? and a lot more?

things won't end with BCH since they didn't start with them. they may be making the most noise but there are a lot of shitcoins that have been using the same tricks but most of them don't carry the name "bitcoin" in their names.

taratorly

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Quote from: deisik on January 24, 2019, 12:21:53 PM

This is a second installment in a series of posts about Bitcoin Cash and its fall. You can read the first part here

So my question is, how long will it take till this shitcoin bites the dust finally and stops being such pain in the ass?

We all have a set of expectations from the crypto market. And I think one of the biggest expectations is a cleaning process because the market includes too much coin. I think that Bitcoin Cash is not more than just a shitcoin too.

Garry_1

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Very good speed and that is suitable for long-term use.
I also use HODL Bitcoin Cash so that if there is a price increase, I will get a profit.Bitcoin cash has managed to pass around 2.55 million transactions in 24 hours. BCH is gradually becoming an ideal medium of exchange that guarantees affordable payments.

There are several developers working on BCH projects like Bitcoin Unlimited, Bitprim, Nchain, Bitcrust, ElectrumX, Parity and Bitcoin XT. These projects will improve the performance of BCH.

BCH might go out for global adoption by mainstream users and provide a solid foundation that businesses can rely on.BCH is able to trade on bitcoin’s past successes and credibility in the cryptocurrency world. You can buy BCH with credit card from here at best rates.

In addition to the wallet support, the Bitcoin Cash community is also planning on testing a beta Telegram tipping bot — Tipmebchbot, which enables Telegram users to tip other users using BCH.

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