Rodeoclown what do you think the appropriate course of action is, exactly?
hello pb-we rarely get this chance to talk - your in a tough spot
well, of course return lost or stolen coin to victims- if this is impossible due to the amount stole devide it up proportionally ---- you can contact law enforcement - but that could in a way be victimizing to you (you like privacy), you should offer him the opportunity to contact law enforcement(but lets face it he wont chose this) - so here it is- you wait till you are sure all victims have been discovered and reimbursed then you take his initial investment lets say 5btc .......... 5btc - btc paid back to victims - btc earned mining = amount old man gets back (or equals the new value of contract just in case returning btc victimizes you more)... but i dont think you should keep btc for yourself that is a slippery slope and without a court award its theft.. if you ever are in a court case your integrity would be damaged or theft proven... thieving from a thief is wrong.. but with tx id it could shut some haters up ( same with contract equivalency-for this choice give him a choice - for btc sent back, no say so needed) you would be protected from any wrong doing... any effort lost is recompensable only if repoted to the legal system...
he is a thief but he is still a human being deserving of inalienable human rights...even after a crime... you may make a choice but it will reflect on all of us.. take a deep breath ... pat yourself on the back for job well done and make the right decision even if it isnt easy .......you can get co-signers to encourage you to do the wrong thing but it will reflect on you
i guess we will see what happens, i am curious to see what kind of person i lease gh from
This is the appropriate course of action, but please may I suggest a slightly alternative plan. Instead of canceling his contracts and paying the remaining back according to your formula, his bought contracts should be left as is, but all of his weekly earnings won't be paid out to him. Instead, the victims will get compensated according to the amount they lost, and PBMining will reimbruise these victims. OldMan is now in debt with PBMining, and the weekly earnings will be deducted from this debt until all of it is cleared.
I suggest this because if PBMinings adds a contract of the value he should be compensated by wouldn't be fair, since these contracts are supposed to expire in 5 years, so the date wouldn't be correct, and a bit extra would be paid back.
If you compensate him with BTC directly, it would be better for him since he can re-invest this BTC, and do the above.
you are the dumbest person i have ever met please ignore my posts.. i can ignore all of your posts that dont involve me.. i said to subtract what is owed already and you act like you came up with a new idea...its the same idea, if u assume all people are as dumb as you then you will always be making these retarted clarifications... i was nice about it the first time..so please add me to your ignore list byt411... u are a crazy person
I'm sorry, but my post clearly states that it is a slightly alternative plan, and if you read it you will understand why your plan has to be adjusted a little. Shouting insults without reasoning at people isn't a good idea. I did not act like I came up with a new idea, as I said, it is a slight change.
Returning any hash power to Oldman could be seen as cooperation with a criminal as well, since his referral credits were made with a very malicious intention. So far the best option I can see in the long-term is to store his payouts in a separate wallet until we are have a clearer answer on what to do with them, hopefully by someone with an understanding of the laws in his jurisdiction (Indonesia?). The amount owing to the victims is very small compared to what he had built up. It appears that his referrals amounted to about 2.6TH/s, which is significant amount.
More opinions are welcome.
The way I see it:- 1) Return the victim amounts to the victims and make sure their PB accounts are fine and their contacts are being fulfilled - they have done nothing wrong and paid for their contacts, they should be getting the service they contracted. You'll have to get these amounts from the perpetrator's balance - if he has stolen from them, this constitutes the returning of the stolen values.
- 2) Revisit your terms of agreement and contract and make sure there's something there that allows you to void it. If so, proceed accordingly. As long as the situation taken place constitutes a violation of the contract and, therefore, it is voided, you can do whatever is set forth under the contract clauses/terms of service for void.
If 1) and 2) are done, it's the end of the issue, no matter how much discussion it may still induce in this thread or elsewhere.
However, should there not be any provisioning for such situations in the terms/contact, you have the problem of jurisdiction - either your local laws' general provision for the situation apply or the perpetrator's do.
Either way, you can't be sure without proper juridic and law enforcement support, and even then, since you are not running a business that requires KYC procedures (assuming everything else is accordingly to the laws you're abiding) , it might be impossible to determine the perpetrator's identity ... and a complaint against John Doe will only become a nightmare from wich you will never get out from
In such case, after 1) is done and verified, you'll have to reactivate the perpetrator's account and provide him with the service he contracted, including all the payments withhold until then, or else, you'll be the one voiding the contract by not fulfilling it accordingly.
This, I know, really sucks and will probably get a lot of us wondering about PB, besides giving you a hell of a headache for sure :/ - but it's the only way for you to proceed, in such a setting.Anyway, afterwards, you must draw a new terms of service/contract for any future contracts, that include the necessary clauses to handle these type of situations - all new contracts will be protected from this ever happening again.
For the present and running contracts, however, you'll have to communicate the new terms and allow for contract owners to either accept the new terms or reject them.- In the first stance, their contracts go on as usual and the new terms apply, because they have willingly accepted the changes - it constitutes a revision of the terms accepted by both parties, so no issues derive from it.
- Should they not accept the new terms, you can terminate the contract, but only if the original terms of service provided a way to do so. If it doesn't, you're screwed, as you're obliged to keep fulfilling those contracts under the original terms, until they expire.
The way you go about this will be of the utmost importance for all of us, and, on my part, Ill be wiling to accept new revised terms to avoid any future theft like this one - but only if I think you're handling of these matters and your integrity are worthy of such, as up until now.
I'm sure each and every contract owner will also show you how they fell and are willing to act and support you - some will do it here, publicly, others will do it privately, but you'll get the feedback you need.
You should, however, use the website to convey the situation, as not every contract owner comes here
Best of luck and lots of calm and reflected thinking for this. It is a defining moment.That sounds really good, however, the biggest problem is 2). Why? Because there are no
Terms of Use/Terms of Service. This means that there actually aren't any agreements that allows PBMining to void the contract. Also, usually for businesses like these, the laws that apply are the local laws of the company, since customers are from all over the world, but then again, PBMining doesn't want to disclose its identity and might not tell us what country it is based in.
Actually, if you think about it properly, OldMan infecting people with Keyloggers has nothing to do with PBMining, and PBMining doesn't actually have to compensate anyone, but I think they froze the account because we all think it is immoral (obviously), since it is stealing, but it really doesn't have anything to do with them.
