Topic: Precious metals are not useful in a collapse scenario! - page 7. (Read 13372 times)

There weren't just 100 people buying, so you buying them didn't make a difference. 2 out of 100 is not about people, it's about ratio of delivered to what they keep in warehouses. They could deliver 1 of 100 sold contracts, they would have to settle in cash if 2 of 100 sold contracts were asked to be delivered.

I can buy Comex bars near spot at FidelityTrade. Was doing during the 2008/2009 price collapse.

No, you did not. In your imagination maybe.

At Comex they sell gold contracts backed at 1:100. If 2 out of 100 people ask for delivery, poof, Comex has a provision to settle them in cash. When the price rises, you can't swap these contracts for bullion unless you're one of the 1% with connections.

A backing store requires a deep liquid market maker. This can't exist when everyone is willing to kill him and take his gold.

In the MadMax scenario everything reverts to chaos and warlords. Money can't develop. That is why food becomes money. Sorry.

Shy of MadMax, the NWO will be in control and they will declare all your goldbugs to be terrorists and money launderers, and confiscate your profits when you show at the market makers which they allow. The black market won't exist because NWO is geographically global, i.e. there won't be any Byzantine Eastern Roman empire this time (the only frontier will be decentralization technology).

Correction of your incorrection, I already rebutted that illogic upthread. Why you repeat your same error is beyond me.

You can either buy Comex bars at spot then trade them for bullion later when the price rises, or you can buy a paper contract and then trade for bullion when it rises.

You tinfoil hats are so funny.

Correction: prices of paper promises of gold backed by nothing are down. Not gold, the metal, at retail stores.

Gold is a very problematic investment. You always buy it cheaper than we sell. In addition, the current price is very high. Most recently, gold was $ 10 per gram. This means that at any moment the price may return.

I don't think that the divisibility issue would last very long in a collapse scenario.  Basically any convenient item would take over the 'exchange' role and be priced against the 'backing store' naturally by market forces.  Gold would be the most likely 'backing store' in a situation where crypto were not sufficiently developed to work off-grid and/or under successful attack (technical and/or legal and/or sociological, etc.)

Here in the U.S. and in many other places I would expect that formerly fiat (but post-silver) coin would take on the 'exchange currency' role.  At least for a period of time.  There is enough kicking around to provide the necessary liquidity and not become so valuable that successful forgery were practical.

It is quite impractical for gold to become a day to day currency and the reason for the gold spike is people who have no knowledge of cryptocurrencies or just flat out gold bugs. They are probably brought up to believe that gold is the only stable thing in the world - it is not.

Just imagine how you would trade your gold for a loaf of bread in a collapse scenario... You'd have to have a tiny fraction of a gold bar to be able to do that - whilst it is easy-as with cryptocurrencies like BTC.

"Debasing" was more concise and clear than "Leeching". "Renting seeking" is definitely more general. I do state that in the text. I'll try to improve the wording.

I am not against gold and silver, because I do realize they have the quality of being entirely decentralized, but the problem is that no one wants to accept or use them as currency any more. And the people won't be going back because efficient money is preferred by the economy (nature will always choose the system that has more degrees-of-freedom, i.e. higher entropy future[1]). Either things don't get bad enough to require them to, or they get so MadMax that people won't accept anything that can't be traded for food.[2]

But I have a new design to offer that isn't PoW and isn't exactly DPoS.

My design is more like a hybrid of several different things. And in that way, it has new attributes, because the power of each is broken up into separations-of-concerns. Thus each part functions more freely but with less holistic power to do harm.

I am excited to see what the community thinks of my new technology.

My design depends on open source behavior  (not referring to the source code of the software). But open source has the opposite property from politics, in that politics requires all the people to be coordinated. Open source requires only that "given enough eyeballs, all flaws are revealed".

In my design, not everyone has to be coordinated on the same choices. The degrees-of-freedom are unbounded.

There are actual clever technological innovations in my design. It isn't just social engineering. The double-spend security does not depend on open source behavior (economically not any more than PoW does, i.e. that all miners have to validate that which they mine on, lest they may lose their block reward, which really isn't open source behavior because it requires the majority hashrate is monolithically coordinated on validation).


[1]: https://gist.github.com/shelby3/67111f328822a36beb4cad1a5220eb33 <---- Section 5.1 Dictatorship

[2]: Shelby Moore III. Value of currency has historically been public confidence in it as a reliable unit-of-exchange. Bitcointalk.org, “Precious metals are not useful in a collapse scenario!” thread, post #62, Nov 2, 2016

It would have been better to keep the gold standard. The increased money supply has only benefitted the banksters and the politicians. In fact, it has encouraged certain governments to borrow more and more money from the ultra-rich, thereby increasing the federal debt beyond sustainable limits. It is time to bring back the gold standard.

Linking money to gold, it was an attempt to limit the money supply. Since it ceased to do economic relations have moved into the political. The price of gold is inflated and at any time may fall.

Improve = destroy. Amazing logic.

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I do understand your arrogant misunderstanding is you do not understand what money is. You seem to confuse money with other things such as investments and speculations (which don't necessarily require ubiquitous public confidence).

Very few people correctly and fully wrap their mind around what money is. So you'll likely find a lot of sympathy/support for your blissful ignorance. I do realize that it appears to you that you are correct and smart, and illusions are often much more gratifying than education and admissions of ignorance:

https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Dunning%E2%80%93Kruger_effect

P.S. What you admitted you refused to read, is a summary of the historical evidence from beginning of the history record of human civilizations, backing the fact which I stated.

Exactly! What we have now are just speculations even if we are listening to so-called experts in the field. What will exactly happen in the future is something all of us may not be prepared of. Nothing wrong with speculating though as this can also drive many of our industries eventually helping the whole economy. In relation, stocking foods in a great quantity today may not be advisable as they can spoil. Maybe having a small farm can be the answer.

Gold is another bubble. After the real estate crisis will be a crisis of gold. Why is it necessary? Only for decoration. Sell it in Ethiopia. No one will buy it. They have nothing to eat. Soon it will fall in price.

I agree with you actually, i think that precious metals can help survive people in some cases, if they can travel across the globe with some of it,
and sell the gold in the other country, then he can get a full price right? This is pretty smart if you can have luck

Agreed and it will be used by the very wealthy for that purpose (in a weighted basket in the SDRs), but my point is precious metals won't be liquid as a daily unit-of-exchange in a Mad Max collapse scenario.

Precious metals can help you preserve wealth over long periods of time, but it is not a liquid asset when the people around you desperately need food, water, medicine, and guns. And the gold dealers have been basically shut down by the lack of a futures market makers and banking system. You won't have enough size to call up Rothschilds or other wealthy elite and negotiate a deal with your gold. Gold at our size of holdings is really only useful when the financial economy is functioning, not in a Mad Max collapse scenario.

iamnotback lives in his small nerd's world of coming Knowledge Age, he fails to see the big picture. He fails to see that half of India and half of the world population is illiterate, with no computers, mobile phones, bank accounts and without a single chance to join his Knowledge Age economy. These 3 billion people know gold, every single one of them. They will take gold when faces on their local variety of paper currency stop buying them stuff, which just happened to a big stock of paper currency in India.
9 out of 10 americans on the street will take a chocolate bar instead of a silver bar.