Topic: Proof that Ripple numbers are manipulated by Coinmarketcap, there is no boom! - page 2. (Read 11400 times)

Exactly, that's the only measure that matters - funded, of course, like what's shown on Bittrex. Think about it - do you really care what the current "market price" is or what you end up getting per coin on average if you sell or buy "x" amount? That's the only price that really matters to you - what you get on average per coin when you sell (or as a buyer, what you pay on average per coin that you buy). In many cases, after you buy or sell, the market price clearly turns out to be just a mirage.

In many low-liquidity coins, there is a massive difference between the market (initial) price and the order-queue-determined (average) price. Many dying coins still trading are effectively worthless - they're the walking dead.

Notice that this seems to be the focus of the whale pump-and-dumpers. They focus like a laser beam on the order book. Once buy orders get really fat at a high level at or near the market price, they dump to maximise their earnings. This is why you often see a massive BTC windfall even when the price chart doesn't show much of a drop off in price - yet (the sharp drop off is often revealed later on in the dump stage when others subsequently dump after the whale has into a devestated order book where pricing has been eaten up and destroyed by the whale).

That's why you see the massive excitement over relatively small % price changes in BTC - because those % changes actually mean something. There's a lot more BTC behind them. Back in the old days, DRK, VRC, etc., when they were high-liquditity coins, the market price was or was close to what you got on average per coin when you sold.

The current market price means nothing if there's less than a BTC of buy orders left behind it, sustaining it.

And that's the story of the current market collapse - it's worse than what it looks like if you look at prices alone. There's no real buy support, no real demand, for many of these coins.

There is, but above all a lot of ignorance and sheer hate. It is understandable, as a lot of people here have invested heavily in Bitcoin and quite a few have lost money. A competitor would be detrimental to any future gains.

It sounds like there is a lot of fear on this thread that Ripple might be able to deliver something that Bitcoin has not been able to.   

I would love to see more charting sites attempt to measure market liquidity (interesting problem), and then use those scores as weights in other measurements. I think it could help reduce ongoing market manipulation across all cryptocurrencies. Price + Market Cap + Volume as sole fixations, as currently calculated, almost promote manipulation.

CoinGecko is getting smart in that regard.

Any other sites using new interesting scoring approaches?

Edit: corrected link on measuring market liquidity - originally linked to a different paper

Hm, so in essence a metric for "price after selling 1/10/100/1000 BTC worth of $coin across all markets"? Potentially the opposite would also be interesting ("price after buying...")?

There is a problem though with exchanges that allow unfunded orders... Say I own 1 BTC on exchangeX and want to buy either 1 BTC worth of Acoin or Bcoin. I enter 2 positions: Limit buy 1 BTC worth of Acoin and limit buy 1 BTC worth of Bcoin. Whatever order gets fulfilled first, has won, the other order might be cancelled/not displayed as unfunded after that.
The question is now: Is the market depth for Acoin and Bcoin now 1 BTC each? 0.5 BTC each? 0 BTC, since we can't know what will happen? If exchanges don't report on the owners of positions (and they likely won't), this is quite difficult to decide.

So yes, this metric would be great to have, it could become manipulated easily though, but at least the manipulators also have some risk (once a trade actually happens, they lost all other positions in all other books).

I'd argue that the price, especially these days, is almost as worthless as marketcap. What matters is the order book - the depth of the order book.

The current "price" of many altcoins is held up by less than 1BTC worth of demand, with a huge drop off in buy order pricing after that. A lot of struggling coins desperately try to prop up the impression that demand is stronger than it is by making the price look higher than what it really is. But the depth of the buy order book tells the real story about what a coin is really worth (or isn't worth) - what people are willing (or unwilling) to pay for it.

If you mean "XRP" with "Ripple", yes, you can not freeze them.

https://wiki.ripple.com/Freeze#Individual_account_freezing

Freezing enables gateways to keep control over stuff they have issued on Ripple (e.g. Bitstamp can stop you from trading both on their exchange AND within Ripple if you deposited money with them).

XRP are a cryptocurrency, USD/BTC/EUR/... on Ripple are assets (these are not tracked on coinmarketcap atm.).

Maybe worth "zilch", the network would continue running though. Anyone (with certain ressources, hardware + bandwidth wise) can run a full node. Code is here, under a very(!) permissive license: https://github.com/ripple/rippled

I find the homophobic vibe from some "critics" here ("Ripple is gay", "faggy IPO", "faggotry", "shitty gay bullshit", "douches", "have a swing at the transgendered inmate") quite off-putting by the way.

Is it really that hard to provide criticism based upon facts ("Ripple is centralized because ... is in the code, see it here on github" or something along these lines) instead of just making blanket statements with 0 followup ("Wait no never mind Ripple is centralized.") and sprinkle on some insults ("your a bunch of sad pathetic scammy delusional stupid clowns"), threats ("I will message them or i will stop using coinmarketcap") or even just post with 0 content ("Who gives a shit about Ripple anyway? I certainly don't")?

The majority of XRP has always been in the hands of Ripple Labs and its developers. They can release their XRPs onto the market any time they want and instantly increase the market cap that way.

Nevertheless, Ripple is doing very well at the moment. Normally, an increase in supply would have boosted the market cap for a short while but I would have expected prices to eventually account for this and adjust downwards accordingly but instead, the price seems to be going the opposite way - i.e., up not down.

A lot of the people like to post the Wolf of Wallstreet movie photos and gifs, too bad half the shit here would get them locked up if this was anywhere near regulated like the stock exchange.

We know Ripple is going to be raided and shut down by the FBI once they get too big.  Lol what's the price of Ripple if the developers are in federal prison?  How much Ripple buys a prison cigarette, buy candy at the canteen or to have a swing at the transgendered inmate?  Wait no never mind Ripple is centralized.  At least Bitcoin would continue if the founders were all locked up but to shut down Ripple all you have to do is unplug a few mainframes at Ripple Labs' headquarters and poof - Ripple worth zilch.

Coinmarketcap have to remove ripple to assets, I will message them or i will stop using coinmarketcap.

Hmmm too bad this isn't a Stock Market smart ass LOLOLOOLOOLOLOLOLOLOLOLOLOL

This is an UN-Regulated NO rules FREE (For all) Scam Market

BIG FUCKING DIFFERENCE sweatheart    

I laugh at you douches that pretend this is the NY Stock exchange of Altcoin'ery.. your a bunch of sad pathetic scammy delusional stupid clowns !

STFU and go climb back in your little scam-coin clown-car now.. Hoooooooonk Hooooooooooooonk  

Then your deaf or a noob.. it was discussed like a year ago and they waited quietly for idiots *again.. and well here we are.. all over again.
And if this attempt fails they will go back into hiding and wait and do it all over again.

If you don't know why Ripple is gay then your ears are plugged.. go do your homework.. or clean your fucking ears LOL

Part of the problem is we have a new generation of scammy little pricks that decided IPO scams are legit.
Ripple started it all hahhaha

So yeah of course these idiots don't get it and dived on it.. they are morons who want Lambo's and no sleazy faggy IPO is going to get in their way.

So yeah a centralized non mined coin that is EVEN worse than a shitty IPO ICO ITO IPO ICO ITO IPO ITO ICO OIP C ITO IPC
IS THIS FAGGOTRY.. called Ripple

I hope you all get burned on this shitty gay bullshit hard.. many of you need to learn some lessons !

Marketcap is worthless.  What should be tracked is 1 year change in price.

Are you saying that increasing the supply of XRP increases the price? That seems to fly in the face of basic economics. Are you saying people are reliably fooled by big numbers on coinmarketcap into thinking the price is rising when it's not and that makes the price rise? That is, I guess, possible, but I certainly don't believe it's significant.

The short term price of XRP really is not that important to Ripple Labs. To some extent, it's seen as a measure of the health of the company and to some extent our success may depend on what people perceive our chances of major success are. But increases in price based on manipulation or misinformation are almost always going to be followed by comparable drops in price. If we like the message price increases signal, it follows that we don't like the message price drops signal. Ripple Labs is not a short term speculator in XRP.

There certainly are short term speculators in XRP who have an incentive to manipulate the price to buy low and sell high. But Ripple Labs is not one of them and their actions hurt us at least as much as they help us. We'd prefer a stable price to a sharp rise followed by a comparable drop.

I don't think there's any way to trick or manipulate the market into an increase in price that won't be followed by a similar decrease. And I don't think such increases or decreases are always due to manipulation because momentum trading alone can do it as well.

You're welcome to disagree with me, of course, but I share my views freely and openly and always try to explain why I hold these views. I don't appreciate unfounded accusations of dishonesty. I'm very open to contrary views and always willing to change my opinions based on evidence or argument. I fully recognize that I could be wrong about this and basically, my position is essentially that market prices in the absence of real changes to asset fundamentals are basically just chaos.

am I the only one who lulz at the idea a company who is working with the trillion dollar Royal Bank of Scotland cares enough to manipulate coinmarketcap to get all the crypto kids who don't have more than two nickels to rub together excited to pump it up?

Just because "we" don't like Ripple doesn't mean you have to go full retard.

Hello smarty?
Ever traded on a stock market?
Massive increase of supply will ALWAYS cause a sharp fallback. Need more buyers to eat them you know 

Issue has been addressed multiple times in other threads.

The price of Ripple is manipulated through massive increase of supply.
The coin supply has increased 4 times but its value has only increased by less than half.

You might not, but +3M$ seem to like Ripple, every day again ...