This position looks really great. It seems to play itself for Russia. Turkey just blundered badly
Topic: Putin orders sanctions against Turkey after downing of jet - page 2. (Read 1526 times)
There is much at stake here and the skirmishes are going to heat as as more information becomes public.
You mean information about these trucks heading from IS to Turkey? Hahaha, keep trying. 
Assad kills rebels, assad has oil, assad sells is one of russias oil allies. Since annexation of Crimea and more sanctions the rubble has halved in value vs USD. Russia is relying heavily on oil, and his strongest oil ally cannot fall. There is much at stake here and the skirmishes are going to heat as as more information becomes public.
Russia won't forget downed jet, Putin warns Turkey in annual address
Russian president says Ankara will not ‘get away with a tomato ban’ in response to ‘cynical war crime’
Vladimir Putin used his annual address to Russia’s political elite to warn Turkey’s leaders that Moscow would never forget last week’s downing of a Russian fighter jet.
The Russian president said he was still bemused by the Turkish decision to shoot down the Su-24. He said: “Perhaps only Allah knows why they did this. And it seems Allah decided to punish the ruling clique in Turkey by relieving them of their sense and judgment.”
Russia has implemented a series of economic sanctions against Turkey, including banning fruit and vegetable imports and ordering Russian tour operators not to send tourists to the country. Putin emphasised that this limited response was not an attempt to move on and start afresh, however.
“There will not be a nervous, hysterical reaction, that would be dangerous for us and for the whole world,” he said. “We will not engage in sabre rattling. But if people think that after carrying out a cynical war crime, killing our people, they’ll get away with a tomato ban or some limits in the construction sector, they’re very wrong. We will keep remembering what they did. And they will keep regretting it.”
The day before, Russia’s defence ministry had called journalists to a briefing at its command centre, showing slides and satellite imagery claiming to show proof that Turkey was profiting from the trade in Isis oil.
“A unified team of bandits and Turkish elites operates in the region to steal oil from their neighbours,” deputy defence minister Anatoly Antonov said on Wednesday. Erdoğan later dismissed the accusations as “slander”.
On Thursday, the Turkish leader made a mirror accusation, claiming Turkey had evidence of Russian involvement in oil trade with Isis.
Putin started his annual address by thanking Russian members of the forces “fighting international terrorism”. He said Russia had known what terrorism was over the years and said the current Russian campaign in Syria was “a fight for freedom, truth and justice”. The widows of the marine and pilot killed after Turkey shot the plane down were in the audience.
Also present in the lavish Kremlin hall were ministers, MPs, religious leaders and other pro-government figures such as the Surgeon, leader of the Night Wolves biker gang.
Read more: http://www.theguardian.com/world/2015/dec/03/turkey-will-keep-regretting-shooting-down-jet-vladimir-putin
Russian president says Ankara will not ‘get away with a tomato ban’ in response to ‘cynical war crime’
Vladimir Putin used his annual address to Russia’s political elite to warn Turkey’s leaders that Moscow would never forget last week’s downing of a Russian fighter jet.
The Russian president said he was still bemused by the Turkish decision to shoot down the Su-24. He said: “Perhaps only Allah knows why they did this. And it seems Allah decided to punish the ruling clique in Turkey by relieving them of their sense and judgment.”
Russia has implemented a series of economic sanctions against Turkey, including banning fruit and vegetable imports and ordering Russian tour operators not to send tourists to the country. Putin emphasised that this limited response was not an attempt to move on and start afresh, however.
“There will not be a nervous, hysterical reaction, that would be dangerous for us and for the whole world,” he said. “We will not engage in sabre rattling. But if people think that after carrying out a cynical war crime, killing our people, they’ll get away with a tomato ban or some limits in the construction sector, they’re very wrong. We will keep remembering what they did. And they will keep regretting it.”
The day before, Russia’s defence ministry had called journalists to a briefing at its command centre, showing slides and satellite imagery claiming to show proof that Turkey was profiting from the trade in Isis oil.
“A unified team of bandits and Turkish elites operates in the region to steal oil from their neighbours,” deputy defence minister Anatoly Antonov said on Wednesday. Erdoğan later dismissed the accusations as “slander”.
On Thursday, the Turkish leader made a mirror accusation, claiming Turkey had evidence of Russian involvement in oil trade with Isis.
Putin started his annual address by thanking Russian members of the forces “fighting international terrorism”. He said Russia had known what terrorism was over the years and said the current Russian campaign in Syria was “a fight for freedom, truth and justice”. The widows of the marine and pilot killed after Turkey shot the plane down were in the audience.
Also present in the lavish Kremlin hall were ministers, MPs, religious leaders and other pro-government figures such as the Surgeon, leader of the Night Wolves biker gang.
Read more: http://www.theguardian.com/world/2015/dec/03/turkey-will-keep-regretting-shooting-down-jet-vladimir-putin
Yeah, something definitely made them take leave of their senses, no doubt about that. But they are allied with people in NATO, whose psychiatric evaluations are state secrets until the 23rd century, which probably helped.
Those whom the gods wish to destroy they first make mad. That´s ancient proverb. It´s an idea.
Those whom the gods wish to destroy they first make mad. That´s ancient proverb. It´s an idea.
“We were prepared to cooperate with Turkey on most sensitive issues and go further than their allies. Allah knows why they did it. Apparently Allah decided to punish the ruling clique in Turkey by taking their sanity”
- Putin
- Putin
Isn´t it strange how all this uproar is going on in a tiny space in fringe territory on this huge land mass below. And some attention starved islanders off an insignificant peninsula are making noise just now. I must yawn.
Russia needs the roughly $4 billion worth of fruits and vegetables it has been buying in Turkey since the sanctions, but it will find such produce in other warm countries, just like it will find alternative clients for the $1.5 billion in grains that it sold Turkey last year.
Abkhazia will be happy.
This position looks really great. It seems to play itself for Russia. Turkey just blundered badly
----------------------------------------------------
Honor is priceless
The Russian vow to punish the Turkish economy has yet to be fully detailed, but at stake is a $30 billion trade relationship that, while also important to Russia, is existential for Turkey.
Russia needs the roughly $4 billion worth of fruits and vegetables it has been buying in Turkey since the sanctions, but it will find such produce in other warm countries, just like it will find alternative clients for the $1.5 billion in grains that it sold Turkey last year.
Turkey’s tourist resorts are certainly not crucial for Moscow, even though 3.3 million Russians vacationed there last year. To the Turks, however, the Russian tourists are crucial because they comprise a full one tenth of annual tourist arrivals.
Russia’s economic disruptions are doubly harmful because Turkey, unlike Russia, is socially restive, due to the Kurdish problem and the Syrian civil war. Farmers whose harvests will lose the Russian market, and employees of the hotels and restaurants that will soon lose their Russian clientele, will join those Turks who already grapple with more than a million Syrian refugees’ pressure on the Turkish labor market.
Meanwhile, Russia will assist and incite Turkey’s rebellious Kurds while also loudly backing the Cypriots in their conflict with Turkey, not to mention the Armenians, who have historically been the latter’s proxy and the former’s foe.
Things can get altogether nasty if Russia stops its gas supplies, which dominate the two countries’ trade.
Yes, $20 billion is a lot of money even for Russia, but it’s not the kind of sum it can’t afford to lose. Turkey, on the other hand, if deprived of Russia’s gas, will nearly come to a standstill. Not only does Russia supply more than half of Turkey’s fuel, Erdogan is at loggerheads with the main alternative suppliers: Egypt, Saudi Arabia and the rest of the Gulf states, since he supported the Egyptian Muslim Brotherhood; Iran, since he demanded its proxy Bashar Assad’s removal; and Israel, since the Mavi Marmara incident in 2010.
Russia’s sanctions for now exclude gas supplies, and also the four nuclear reactors it agreed to build in Turkey for $20 billion and the TurkStream pipeline project that is meant to lead Russian gas to Turkey across the Black Sea. Still, judging by his past conduct Putin will not hesitate to close the spigot, the way he did repeatedly to Ukraine since 2005.
Moreover, when Europe responded to his Crimean adventure with sanctions, Putin not only failed to back down, he fired sanctions of his own, banning some $12 billion worth of annual food imports from the countries sanctioning Russia.
In other words, when faced with a choice between national honor and financial loss, Putin chooses honor.
Turkey has therefore all the reason in the world to fear that Russia’s economic pressure has hardly begun, and will not abate until someone in Ankara does what neither Putin nor Erdogan has ever done: surrender.
http://www.marketwatch.com/story/why-russia-will-overpower-turkey-2015-12-02
----------------------------------------------------
Honor is priceless
The Russian vow to punish the Turkish economy has yet to be fully detailed, but at stake is a $30 billion trade relationship that, while also important to Russia, is existential for Turkey.
Russia needs the roughly $4 billion worth of fruits and vegetables it has been buying in Turkey since the sanctions, but it will find such produce in other warm countries, just like it will find alternative clients for the $1.5 billion in grains that it sold Turkey last year.
Turkey’s tourist resorts are certainly not crucial for Moscow, even though 3.3 million Russians vacationed there last year. To the Turks, however, the Russian tourists are crucial because they comprise a full one tenth of annual tourist arrivals.
Russia’s economic disruptions are doubly harmful because Turkey, unlike Russia, is socially restive, due to the Kurdish problem and the Syrian civil war. Farmers whose harvests will lose the Russian market, and employees of the hotels and restaurants that will soon lose their Russian clientele, will join those Turks who already grapple with more than a million Syrian refugees’ pressure on the Turkish labor market.
Meanwhile, Russia will assist and incite Turkey’s rebellious Kurds while also loudly backing the Cypriots in their conflict with Turkey, not to mention the Armenians, who have historically been the latter’s proxy and the former’s foe.
Things can get altogether nasty if Russia stops its gas supplies, which dominate the two countries’ trade.
Yes, $20 billion is a lot of money even for Russia, but it’s not the kind of sum it can’t afford to lose. Turkey, on the other hand, if deprived of Russia’s gas, will nearly come to a standstill. Not only does Russia supply more than half of Turkey’s fuel, Erdogan is at loggerheads with the main alternative suppliers: Egypt, Saudi Arabia and the rest of the Gulf states, since he supported the Egyptian Muslim Brotherhood; Iran, since he demanded its proxy Bashar Assad’s removal; and Israel, since the Mavi Marmara incident in 2010.
Russia’s sanctions for now exclude gas supplies, and also the four nuclear reactors it agreed to build in Turkey for $20 billion and the TurkStream pipeline project that is meant to lead Russian gas to Turkey across the Black Sea. Still, judging by his past conduct Putin will not hesitate to close the spigot, the way he did repeatedly to Ukraine since 2005.
Moreover, when Europe responded to his Crimean adventure with sanctions, Putin not only failed to back down, he fired sanctions of his own, banning some $12 billion worth of annual food imports from the countries sanctioning Russia.
In other words, when faced with a choice between national honor and financial loss, Putin chooses honor.
Turkey has therefore all the reason in the world to fear that Russia’s economic pressure has hardly begun, and will not abate until someone in Ankara does what neither Putin nor Erdogan has ever done: surrender.
http://www.marketwatch.com/story/why-russia-will-overpower-turkey-2015-12-02
Putin have right to do it not just cause that cowardly move of Turks, but cause Turks are helping ISIS all time. If USA cant control his dog, someone must at least teach him lesson in manners.
Those are some quite substantial swaths of green. Look how far into Turkey they stretch. Great opportunities wait to be exploited, will be interesting to follow in the next couple of years. The Kurds are a great enemy.
I do not usually agree with many of the political decisions of Putin, but this time I have to admit that doing the right thing by punishing.
The attack in France is nothing more than a warning, and tells us that they can kill innocent people anywhere in the world.
The attack in France is nothing more than a warning, and tells us that they can kill innocent people anywhere in the world.
I'm sorry I don't get your logic here. How come you compare "A ban on some goods and forbids extensions of labor contracts for Turks working in Russia" to terrorism in Paris from their own FRENCH citizens? I think you didn't read the thread or wrote to wrong thread.
I do not usually agree with many of the political decisions of Putin, but this time I have to admit that doing the right thing by punishing.
The attack in France is nothing more than a warning, and tells us that they can kill innocent people anywhere in the world.
The attack in France is nothing more than a warning, and tells us that they can kill innocent people anywhere in the world.
(CNN)Iraq says it has reached a deal to share intelligence with Russia, Iran and Syria in the fight against ISIS militants.
The announcement on Saturday from the Iraqi military cited "the increasing concern from Russia about thousands of Russian terrorists committing criminal acts within ISIS."
The news comes amid U.S. concerns about Russia's recent military buildup in Syria and would appear to confirm American suspicions of some kind of cooperation between Baghdad and Moscow.
A U.S.-led coalition has been carrying out an aerial bombing campaign against ISIS positions in Iraq and Syria since last year. But now Russia is upping its presence in the region.
U.S. President Barack Obama is scheduled to meet with Russian President Vladimir Putin on Monday for the first time in nearly a year to discuss Moscow's plans in Syria....
The announcement on Saturday from the Iraqi military cited "the increasing concern from Russia about thousands of Russian terrorists committing criminal acts within ISIS."
The news comes amid U.S. concerns about Russia's recent military buildup in Syria and would appear to confirm American suspicions of some kind of cooperation between Baghdad and Moscow.
A U.S.-led coalition has been carrying out an aerial bombing campaign against ISIS positions in Iraq and Syria since last year. But now Russia is upping its presence in the region.
U.S. President Barack Obama is scheduled to meet with Russian President Vladimir Putin on Monday for the first time in nearly a year to discuss Moscow's plans in Syria....
Hello :-)
Things are really heating up in this part of the world.
Putin does seem to be quite arrogant, but it is understanding as he wants to show the world he is a real tough guy. Turkey is still quite strong and i think they have much less to lose than Russia.
It will be really interesting to see what direction this regional conflict takes as more and more powers start to join in.
Cheers
Things are really heating up in this part of the world.
Putin does seem to be quite arrogant, but it is understanding as he wants to show the world he is a real tough guy. Turkey is still quite strong and i think they have much less to lose than Russia.
It will be really interesting to see what direction this regional conflict takes as more and more powers start to join in.
Cheers
This is very very alarming sitiation. The world is already in state of war. And now there is new conflict between Russia and Turkey ...
However the Turk President Mr. Tayyab said his condolences upon the plane crash but Russia count this incident against him. Now the economic sanctions on Turkey is not good the tense situation between the two.
Economic sanctions not only bad for Turkey but also for Russia too. The bilateral businesses is disturb now.
The current situation is only favorable for the common enemy that is obviously ISIS.
Both countries must show maturity not only for each other bit the stake of the world peace also.
However the Turk President Mr. Tayyab said his condolences upon the plane crash but Russia count this incident against him. Now the economic sanctions on Turkey is not good the tense situation between the two.
Economic sanctions not only bad for Turkey but also for Russia too. The bilateral businesses is disturb now.
The current situation is only favorable for the common enemy that is obviously ISIS.
Both countries must show maturity not only for each other bit the stake of the world peace also.
Russia & Putin has done a wonderful job, they know this is crocodile's tear & they will not fall for it.. & TURKEY's is great supporter of TERRORIST, it should not be tolerated.
If I were Putin, I'd just turn off the natural gas pipeline that runs into Turkey and let them freeze. But of course Turkey's got all that blackmarket oil coming out of Syria to keep them warm.
I don't think that is necessary. Already the drop in the tourist inflows and the banning of the Turkish fruit and vegetable products have made the position of Erdogan very weak. If the Russians cut off the gas supply, then in the long term their reputation will get tarnished. Also, gas prices are at 5-year lows, and without Turkey, Russia will be left with excess gas and less revenue.
If I were Putin, I'd just turn off the natural gas pipeline that runs into Turkey and let them freeze. But of course Turkey's got all that blackmarket oil coming out of Syria to keep them warm.
And here comes putin again..
Jump to: