Re: Butterfly Labs CEO 25 Million USD Mail Fraud — A Concise Summary of Evidence - page 41.

EhVedadoOAnonimato

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Hum, could it be that his only "crime" was defying the state monopoly on lotteries? (what is not a real crime at all)
If the letters sent didn't lie about how the prizes would be (amounts and everything), then there's no fraud actually.

EDIT: According to this, he was indeed a fraudster:

Quote

According to the indictment the victims were purchasing “positions” in tickets for lotteries that would be grouped together or “pooled” to buy larger blocks of tickets thereby increasing their chances of winning. Funds received from victims were not used to purchase tickets, but to pay “winnings” to other victims, to fund the scheme and to benefit the defendants.

END EDIT.

But anyways, even if there's no real crime, one may still question this guy's moral character. If he's not a fraudster, I'd still compare him with those religious leaders who collect tons of money "for God" to finance their yatchs and palaces. It's not a fraud - as you cannot prove that was not "God's will", but it's disgusting nevertheless.

I'm glad I didn't pre-order anything from BFL.

kiba

legendary

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When is the next delivery date for their ASCI miner?

Lethos

sr. member

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Keep it Simple. Every Bit Matters.

The drama continues...

anyone from BFL dare to confirm or deny?

maqifrnswa

sr. member

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Bitcoin Community. You will never find a more wretched hive of scum and villainy. We must be cautious.

paulie_w

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i love the bitcoin community.

WikileaksDude

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Here we go again. Even though I enjoy their story. Long and profitable lol

Bitcoin Oz

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Merit: 500

Wat

Quote from: maqifrnswa on September 20, 2012, 08:20:49 AM

This is amazing, how do you expect to raise investor capital when your director is a white collar felon?

Obvious difference from his previous case:
1) BFL is incorporated in the US (the scam was all international, central america, and accounts in Europe)
2) BFL accepted paypal/credit cards (the fraud was cash/check only)
3) the total dollar amount is <$20 million so far (ASICS are probably on the order of $3m at most)
4) The previous scam lasted a decade, this is only a few months.
5) if BFL is a scam, the "set-up" took a lot of work: starting a legitimate profitable business first then a fake product. The previous set-up was just "Give us money"

but still, wow

GPUMax...

Etlase2

hero member

Activity: 798

Merit: 1000

The title says Re:, was this split from another thread?

And didn't BFL encourage USD pre-orders instead of BTC, saying they would be easier to refund if the product didn't ship or something? I don't keep up with this stuff.

Sorry to hear this though, can't wait to see the response from BFL. Why would they put in a convicted felon as their CEO?

maqifrnswa

sr. member

Activity: 454

Merit: 252

This is amazing, how do you expect to raise investor capital when your director is a white collar felon?

Obvious difference from his previous case:
1) BFL is incorporated in the US (the scam was all international, central america, and accounts in Europe)
2) BFL accepted paypal/credit cards (the fraud was cash/check only)
3) the total dollar amount is <$20 million so far (ASICS are probably on the order of $3m at most)
4) The previous scam lasted a decade, this is only a few months.
5) if BFL is a scam, the "set-up" took a lot of work: starting a legitimate profitable business first then a fake product. The previous set-up was just "Give us money"

but still, wow

flower1024

legendary

Activity: 1428

Merit: 1000

Quote from: Bitcoin Oz on September 20, 2012, 08:16:57 AM

Quote from: flower1024 on September 20, 2012, 08:15:17 AM

Quote from: Gabi on September 20, 2012, 08:11:41 AM

Quote

the CEO of bfl has prooved he delivers (see their fpgas).

Are you seriously comparing the difficulty of delivering a fpga to the one of delivering an asic???
For the FPGA you just need to make a bitstream.
For the ASIC...you need to design the chip from scratch, you need to invest millions to make the masks and actually start producing it. Good luck.

no i dont compare the difficulty of producing asics to fpgas.
but if he wanted to run i suspect he had did it with their fpga preorders.

The long con is more profitable.

sure; but i still believe them.

i'll just leave this here: https://bitcointalksearch.org/topic/m.1176847
Wink

Gabi

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If you want to walk on water, get out of the boat

+1 to what bitcoin.me said

With this ASIC thing they received preorders for millions

Bitcoin Oz

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Merit: 500

Wat

Quote from: flower1024 on September 20, 2012, 08:15:17 AM

Quote from: Gabi on September 20, 2012, 08:11:41 AM

Quote

the CEO of bfl has prooved he delivers (see their fpgas).

Are you seriously comparing the difficulty of delivering a fpga to the one of delivering an asic???
For the FPGA you just need to make a bitstream.
For the ASIC...you need to design the chip from scratch, you need to invest millions to make the masks and actually start producing it. Good luck.

no i dont compare the difficulty of producing asics to fpgas.
but if he wanted to run i suspect he had did it with their fpga preorders.

The long con is more profitable.

flower1024

legendary

Activity: 1428

Merit: 1000

Quote from: Gabi on September 20, 2012, 08:11:41 AM

Quote

the CEO of bfl has prooved he delivers (see their fpgas).

Are you seriously comparing the difficulty of delivering a fpga to the one of delivering an asic???
For the FPGA you just need to make a bitstream.
For the ASIC...you need to design the chip from scratch, you need to invest millions to make the masks and actually start producing it. Good luck.

no i dont compare the difficulty of producing asics to fpgas.
but if he wanted to run i suspect he had did it with their fpga preorders.

Bitcoin Oz

hero member

Activity: 686

Merit: 500

Wat

What a joke.

Gabi

legendary

Activity: 1148

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If you want to walk on water, get out of the boat

Quote

the CEO of bfl has prooved he delivers (see their fpgas).

Are you seriously comparing the difficulty of delivering a fpga to the one of delivering an asic???
For the FPGA you just need to make a bitstream.
For the ASIC...you need to design the chip from scratch, you need to invest millions to make the masks and actually start producing it. Good luck.

Realpra

hero member

Activity: 815

Merit: 1000

I'm calling it: Next pirate.

FPGAs != ASICS

cbeast

donator

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Let's talk governance, lipstick, and pigs.

What's next, the entire bitcoin dev team are sino-russian-cia-nazi-alien-mobsters? JHC! There is no end to the scandals!

flower1024

legendary

Activity: 1428

Merit: 1000

the CEO of bfl has prooved he delivers (see their fpgas).
i dont care about his history. everybody has a chance to change himself.

i am still looking forward to my - really early ordered - bfl asic Cheesy

elux

legendary

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Merit: 1006

Topic: Re: Butterfly Labs CEO 25 Million USD Mail Fraud — A Concise Summary of Evidence - page 41. (Read 146793 times)