I should probably point out that it's not clear whether or not Patrick was ever one of the partners in Bitcoinica Consultancy Ltd (the general partner of Bitcoinica LP) or whether he was providing assistance purely as a favour (his posts suggest this is the case). Even prior to the MtGox intrusion, he expressed concern about the morality of the refund process as there were insufficient assets for everyone to receive 100% refunds (whereas people had been led to believe that Tihan was covering the losses from the Linode and Rackspace intrusions and that users would receive 100% of their funds back in two payments of 50%).
I suspect that everyone involved in this saga has revealed part of the truth but it will be some time until the whole truth is known. For instance, does the party which originally bought the Bitcoinica domain and the IP from Zhou still own it and if not which entity or person currently owns those things (the value of which has obviously been diminished by recent clusterfucks).
Topic: Resign from Bitcoinica (Read 3921 times)
I'm morbidly curious about who will be the next person to jump ship from Bitcoinica and/or the Consultancy. I sure as shit wouldn't want to be left as the last man standing in the general partnership.
Hehe, good question. I'm not following all the threads about this clusterfuck, but didn't Donald just leave or something?
According to Amir, Patrick has "walked away". No-one has clarified what that means, though. Has he resigned as one of the general partners? Refused to take any further part in the claims process? Leaving Intersango? It seems as though Amir has often been kept out of the loop so he may not even have that information.
For shit and giggles, here are the two threads announcing the changeover in Bitcoinica management. One of them only got two replies and the other got ten.
https://bitcointalksearch.org/topic/m.867445
https://bitcointalksearch.org/topic/m.867160
I am really suspicious of this. A week after it is announced that Bitcoinica is legally registered to do what it does (whatever that means), it goes under new direct management. Unless Zhou needs to focus more on his studies or there is some kind of plan to seriously compete against MtGox, this would suggest Bitcoinica is not as profitable as claimed. Of course losing 45,000 bitcoins would hurt anyone.
I am glad I followed my gut. I can see a train wreck coming. I have been on a few myself.
What if everyone resigns from bitcoinica ?
*mind fuck
*mind fuck
The situation would probably be the same as it is now?
What if everyone resigns from bitcoinica ?
*mind fuck
*mind fuck
I'm morbidly curious about who will be the next person to jump ship from Bitcoinica and/or the Consultancy. I sure as shit wouldn't want to be left as the last man standing in the general partnership.
Hehe, good question. I'm not following all the threads about this clusterfuck, but didn't Donald just leave or something?
According to Amir, Patrick has "walked away". No-one has clarified what that means, though. Has he resigned as one of the general partners? Refused to take any further part in the claims process? Leaving Intersango? It seems as though Amir has often been kept out of the loop so he may not even have that information.
For shit and giggles, here are the two threads announcing the changeover in Bitcoinica management. One of them only got two replies and the other got ten.
https://bitcointalksearch.org/topic/m.867445
https://bitcointalksearch.org/topic/m.867160
I'm morbidly curious about who will be the next person to jump ship from Bitcoinica and/or the Consultancy. I sure as shit wouldn't want to be left as the last man standing in the general partnership.
Hehe, good question. I'm not following all the threads about this clusterfuck, but didn't Donald just leave or something?
I'm morbidly curious about who will be the next person to jump ship from Bitcoinica and/or the Consultancy. I sure as shit wouldn't want to be left as the last man standing in the general partnership.
What makes you believe the police will investigate and care about a Bitcoin crime? Someone stole some hashes? Do hashes go with Bangers and Mash? Wouldn't that be more of an Interpol jurisdiction crime because it's multi-national? I must have missed that meeting.
Seriously, I don’t understand why the local police would do anything but stare blankly at the person telling the story. Now a civil suit is a different story….
Interpol is not a police force, it's more of a clearing house which facilitates co-operation between world-wide law enforcement agencies.
USD were stolen in the latest intrusion but even if they weren't, unauthorised intrusion and the destruction of critical data (the Rackspace) intrusion is a criminal offence in and of itself. BTC have value but even if they didn't, people have been prosecuted for stealing virtual furniture from Habbo Hotel in the past - it isn't required that something have intrinsic value in order for taking it to be a criminal offence. Nothing was stolen in the HB Gary hacks, but Anonymous members were prosecuted for those.
I don't believe for a minute that the failure to report previous thefts to law enforcement was based on the belief that criminal prosecution wasn't possible or that the police would not investigate. I believe that choice was based more on the knowledge that a comprehensive investigation of the thefts would reveal illegal activity on the part of users and open exchanges up to allegations of being complicit in avoiding tax/AML/KYC compliance.
You're right that the constable at your local police station might look at you strangely, but the computer crime units of state and federal police (Australia has these and I know that the US and UK do too) are perfectly capable of investigating computer crimes (jurisdiction is the bigger issue - where did the crime actually take place for the purposes of prosecution?).
Why is it highly doubtful? He knew all the passwords, he designed all the code. It's actually probable he stole the funds, with or without the knowledge of the rest of them.
And I'm quite sure that the possibility of this being an inside job is one of the first things the police will investigate. This time around, there's an independent entity which has some records of how the event went down. To our knowledge, Linode never involved law enforcement following the February intrusions and Bitcoinica didn't involve them following the Rackspace intrusion. We know that MtGox has some information about this latest intrusion and that they intend handing the information they have to law enforcement (something beyond Bitcoinica's control and something the intruder may not have counted on).
Could Zhou be the intruder? Of course he could. And because of that possibility he has more reason than anyone to demand Bitcoinica file a report with law enforcement. He can't be exonerated if there's no independent investigation.
Let's remember that the explanations about why Patrick's email was able to be used to reset the Rackspace password and why the LastPass master password wasn't changed are also inadequate.
What makes you believe the police will investigate and care about a Bitcoin crime? Someone stole some hashes? Do hashes go with Bangers and Mash? Wouldn't that be more of an Interpol jurisdiction crime because it's multi-national? I must have missed that meeting.
Seriously, I don’t understand why the local police would do anything but stare blankly at the person telling the story. Now a civil suit is a different story….
Why is it highly doubtful? He knew all the passwords, he designed all the code. It's actually probable he stole the funds, with or without the knowledge of the rest of them.
And I'm quite sure that the possibility of this being an inside job is one of the first things the police will investigate. This time around, there's an independent entity which has some records of how the event went down. To our knowledge, Linode never involved law enforcement following the February intrusions and Bitcoinica didn't involve them following the Rackspace intrusion. We know that MtGox has some information about this latest intrusion and that they intend handing the information they have to law enforcement (something beyond Bitcoinica's control and something the intruder may not have counted on).
Could Zhou be the intruder? Of course he could. And because of that possibility he has more reason than anyone to demand Bitcoinica file a report with law enforcement. He can't be exonerated if there's no independent investigation.
Let's remember that the explanations about why Patrick's email was able to be used to reset the Rackspace password and why the LastPass master password wasn't changed are also inadequate.
Smart thing to do, but of course it won't save you from any criminal or civil actions against the company...
His age and possibly location will protect him from any civil actions against him. The only way a criminal action against him would have any bearing is if he was directly involved in the thefts which is highly doubtful.
Why is it highly doubtful? He knew all the passwords, he designed all the code. It's actually probable he stole the funds, with or without the knowledge of the rest of them.
Smart thing to do, but of course it won't save you from any criminal or civil actions against the company...
His age and possibly location will protect him from any civil actions against him. The only way a criminal action against him would have any bearing is if he was directly involved in the thefts which is highly doubtful.
Oh, good to know.
I, Zhou Tong, hereby announce that I will resign from any position(s) in Bitcoinica LP, Bitcoinica Consultancy Ltd and/or Core Credit Ltd (whichever is applicable) effective from today, July 15, 2012.
[...]
Disclosure: The full content of this post will be sent as email to all relevant parties and all people related to Bitcoinica.
Meh [...]
Disclosure: The full content of this post will be sent as email to all relevant parties and all people related to Bitcoinica.
Smart thing to do, but of course it won't save you from any criminal or civil actions against the company...
I guess you got quite a lot of threats in your adress. That's probably a right decision.
I, Zhou Tong, hereby announce that I will resign from any position(s) in Bitcoinica LP, Bitcoinica Consultancy Ltd and/or Core Credit Ltd (whichever is applicable) effective from today, July 15, 2012.
Refunds
I have not been involved in refunding process for over 30 days. And Bitcoinica has refused my offer to take over. Here I officially withdraw my offer and relevant partner(s) in Bitcoinica LP will be fully responsible for customer refunds.
Personal Compensation
I have paid out 5,000 BTC to compensate for customers' losses. This compensation is entirely personal and voluntary. It does not affect my legal status, assumed responsibility and position with regards to Bitcoinica. No information from Bitcoinica apart from my memory (during my employment period) has been used.
Further Communication
I reserve the right to talk about Bitcoinica publicly, but I will not share any information that has been made known to me due to my employment or ownership. Any employee/officer from Bitcoinica should not communicate any confidential information with me, and any communication from this point, will be deemed as public knowledge unless stated otherwise.
Customer Documents
I promise not to access any documents owned by customers until I receive any official instruction from Bitcoinica. Up to that point, I have no secure and accountable means of transferring these documents to relevant parties.
Previous Positions
I was CEO & Lead Developer from September 4, 2011 to April 21, 2012. After that period, my position was unknown.
Expense Claims
I have attempted to cancel the accounts with recurring billing to my personal credit cards, however some accounts are no longer under my control. If there are continued expenses incurred by Bitcoinica, I reserve my right to request expense reimbursement from Bitcoinica.
Till date, Bitcoinica owes me S$990.04 (SGD) or $782.76 USD in hosting expenses, SaaS products and GitHub subscriptions since May 1, 2012.
Representation
I automatically give up my representation of Bitcoinica. My public communication will no longer represent the view of Bitcoinica.
Email Address
I will stop using [email protected] as my email address and all emails sent to that mailbox may be ignored. Bitcoinica can delete my email account any time.
Other Issues
Other issues can be discussed via this thread, or through email [email protected].
Disclosure: The full content of this post will be sent as email to all relevant parties and all people related to Bitcoinica.
Refunds
I have not been involved in refunding process for over 30 days. And Bitcoinica has refused my offer to take over. Here I officially withdraw my offer and relevant partner(s) in Bitcoinica LP will be fully responsible for customer refunds.
Personal Compensation
I have paid out 5,000 BTC to compensate for customers' losses. This compensation is entirely personal and voluntary. It does not affect my legal status, assumed responsibility and position with regards to Bitcoinica. No information from Bitcoinica apart from my memory (during my employment period) has been used.
Further Communication
I reserve the right to talk about Bitcoinica publicly, but I will not share any information that has been made known to me due to my employment or ownership. Any employee/officer from Bitcoinica should not communicate any confidential information with me, and any communication from this point, will be deemed as public knowledge unless stated otherwise.
Customer Documents
I promise not to access any documents owned by customers until I receive any official instruction from Bitcoinica. Up to that point, I have no secure and accountable means of transferring these documents to relevant parties.
Previous Positions
I was CEO & Lead Developer from September 4, 2011 to April 21, 2012. After that period, my position was unknown.
Expense Claims
I have attempted to cancel the accounts with recurring billing to my personal credit cards, however some accounts are no longer under my control. If there are continued expenses incurred by Bitcoinica, I reserve my right to request expense reimbursement from Bitcoinica.
Till date, Bitcoinica owes me S$990.04 (SGD) or $782.76 USD in hosting expenses, SaaS products and GitHub subscriptions since May 1, 2012.
Representation
I automatically give up my representation of Bitcoinica. My public communication will no longer represent the view of Bitcoinica.
Email Address
I will stop using [email protected] as my email address and all emails sent to that mailbox may be ignored. Bitcoinica can delete my email account any time.
Other Issues
Other issues can be discussed via this thread, or through email [email protected].
Disclosure: The full content of this post will be sent as email to all relevant parties and all people related to Bitcoinica.
cool story bro
can't you keep all the bitcoinica shenanigans in one single thread?
On an off-topic I see your new project is https://www.nameterrific.com
Care to explain why you are not accepting bitcoin for this service? Your service looked interesting enough for me to click on Pricing until I noticed the 4 same logos that I see everywhere else.
Explain?
Care to explain why you are not accepting bitcoin for this service? Your service looked interesting enough for me to click on Pricing until I noticed the 4 same logos that I see everywhere else.
Explain?
The service has not officially launched yet. The product is ready, but the billing system is not.
I will implement Bitcoin support after credit card support. And I will use a merchant solution, most likely.
With prices so small I am looking forward to checking it out once bitcoin is adopted.
BEST OF LUCK!
On an off-topic I see your new project is https://www.nameterrific.com
Care to explain why you are not accepting bitcoin for this service? Your service looked interesting enough for me to click on Pricing until I noticed the 4 same logos that I see everywhere else.
Explain?
Care to explain why you are not accepting bitcoin for this service? Your service looked interesting enough for me to click on Pricing until I noticed the 4 same logos that I see everywhere else.
Explain?
The service has not officially launched yet. The product is ready, but the billing system is not.
I will implement Bitcoin support after credit card support. And I will use a merchant solution, most likely.
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