Russia's Stock Market Amidst War Against Ukraine - page 2.

The Sceptical Chymist

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Quote from: jackg on February 24, 2022, 01:54:17 PM

I think profit from wars and winning a war is a long debated topic.

That's an understatement if I ever heard one.

I'd expect Russia's stock market to plummet at the beginning of...whatever this is they're doing. I would call it an invasion and I'm not sure what constitutes a war--but in any case, I think Putin isn't thinking about economics. So far I haven't heard on any news sites any word about what he's thinking about, except for vague speculation about bringing Ukraine back into the fold. What's to gain from doing that is beyond me.

There was just an announcement that Russia was going pro-bitcoin, and I kind of scratched my head when I read that since it came right when the pot was ready to boil over with respect to Putin's act of aggression. Sometimes I think leaders of countries are pure psychopaths--maybe 1% aren't, and some of them don't behave like Putin or Saddam Hussein or Pol Pot, but there's a strong stink of psychopathy nonetheless.

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Quote from: Fivestar4everMVP on February 24, 2022, 01:31:27 PM

The shot below is the current situation of Russia's stock market while the war against Ukraine is on.
My honest question is, what does it profit a country to rise up in war against another country?

The benefit is only on the leader who declares war to show his power and arrogance, unfortunately such a leader does not realize that his citizen also suffer not only the country he is fighting, his country will be very likely to experience bankruptcy and make his people suffer even more because there will be many investors who leave the country.

el kaka22

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Obviously Russia will suffer for this. However, the problem is that Putin will not suffer because of it, Russians will but Putin will not. We have seen Russian people on the streets condemning the war even against a dictator, they know they will be jailed or killed and yet they still got out and protested the war. Because, they know that this war will only bring death and destruction and chaos to their nation as well.

So, the only reason for this war is Putin, nobody else, no other person is responsible for this, maybe some high ranked officials with Russia, or maybe some generals, but I am sure that even 90% of the soldiers would rather be at home right now.

Obito

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We should expect something like that, it's not like the country with it's landmass is the one that aft kinv the cle i . I directed the othe tomak create tokens. Hopefully there's a card that can help me deal with those tokens to help me wipe them off the table. Hope that Ukraine will be able to defend in this perilous situation.

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Quote from: adaseb on February 25, 2022, 10:08:39 PM

I looked into this and this really doesn’t affect Russia as much as you think. Most of the shares are owned by people outside of Russia, typically Americans. So they are the ones taking the brunt of the loses and not Russian population.

The fact that they closed the markets and banned short selling you can see why it fell close to 50%. I think on CNN or Bloomberg they said this was the worst stock market crash in any nation ever since the creation of the stock markets. And it was mostly due to poor liquidity and massive panic.

I don't think that the majority of the shares are owned by foreigners. It is the Russian federal government which owns a majority of the shares in the largest companies (Gazprom, Rosneft, Russian Railways, Inter RAO, Sberbank, Transneft, Rosatom, Tatneft.etc). So in the end, it is the Russian government which will find itself in a difficult situation, if the share prices go down. Now coming to the stock index, it rose by around 30% during Friday after the record crash on Thursday. But the long term perspective looks bleak.

adaseb

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I looked into this and this really doesn’t affect Russia as much as you think. Most of the shares are owned by people outside of Russia, typically Americans. So they are the ones taking the brunt of the loses and not Russian population.

The fact that they closed the markets and banned short selling you can see why it fell close to 50%. I think on CNN or Bloomberg they said this was the worst stock market crash in any nation ever since the creation of the stock markets. And it was mostly due to poor liquidity and massive panic.

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Quote from: Fivestar4everMVP on February 24, 2022, 01:31:27 PM

My honest question is, what does it profit a country to rise up in war against another country?

It seems to me that russia wants the land adjacent the capathian mountain range as a natural defensive perimeter. That would appear to be one tangible gain they're targeting.

Whether their ambitions run beyond that, I cannot guess. Russia has threatened to invade nearby states like finland and sweden who are not members of NATO in the past.

Stock markets rise and fall. In this case, I do not think it will negatively affect russia's economy which carries low percentage national debt. Russia's GDP is greater than $2 trillion with a deficit of around $400 billion. Debt to GDP ratio is around 20%, which is far far lower than most major nations of the world. Russia appears to be well structured to handle sanctions, war, a stock market crash and whatever else is thrown at them.

By contrast nations like japan and china appear to be buying up large swathes of land in foreign countries. Rather than war, that could be a better approach to global expansionism. Although I think russia itself would be barred and banned from attempting something similar.

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Quote from: Leviathan.007 on February 24, 2022, 03:15:12 PM

Rising up in war against brothers is a good point actually, I leave the war started for nothing and none will get profit out of this between these two counties who are directing participating this war. Stock markets will fall during this time especially the centralized markets in these two countries while I heard many people are trying to take cash from the banks in Ukraine and leave this country as soon as they can, while the government ordered the banks to do not give any cash to people(a Ukrainian friend of mine told me that.) also the other problem in Ukraine is about finding gas stations. All these bad situations will affect these two countries in the long term while other countries like China are taking benefit from it.

This fight is like a brothers fight.Even in the home,brother use to fight.Elder of the family will solve the issue between the brothers fight.So the developed country should had their words towards the fight.The current scenerio is Swedan had raised their voice against the fight and supported the Ukraine.Russia had huge words and suport,only the small brother need the support from the people of the world.Canada,America should made their statement against this fight.

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Quote from: Fivestar4everMVP on February 24, 2022, 01:31:27 PM

The shot below is the current situation of Russia's stock market while the war against Ukraine is on.
My honest question is, what does it profit a country to rise up in war against another country?
To me, this and many other stuffs happening around confirms what the book of revelation says that during the end, brothers shall rise up in war against brothers, community against community, town against town, state against state and countries against countries.

Here is the shot I wish to share

Screenhshot Source: Telegram

All this is just temporary, Governments especially when it comes to war don't see Market outlook, they know markets work on the auto-correction mechanism, even if today they are slightly dumping once things settle it will definitely come back to normal, Governments are more concerned about economic outlook before declaring the war, the inflation in the economy, the growth rate that could be hampered, the loss of supply chains of essentials, etc. and dependency on the enemy country for trade, etc. These are the things that matter the more to the government. However, profitability, you are right is never the idea behind any war and can never be an idea behind the war.

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Quote from: Fivestar4everMVP on February 24, 2022, 01:31:27 PM

The shot below is the current situation of Russia's stock market while the war against Ukraine is on.
My honest question is, what does it profit a country to rise up in war against another country?

All the stock markets have been registering some losses as they adapt to the situation, however by far the one that was losing the most was the stock market of Russia as many sanctions are expected against banks, politicians and Russian companies, so it is natural that people are selling their stocks for very low prices and trying to get their money out of Russian banks as well, however most likely the Russian government knew about of this and think that despite all of this they can win something out of this war.

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Quote from: Fivestar4everMVP on February 24, 2022, 01:31:27 PM

The shot below is the current situation of Russia's stock market while the war against Ukraine is on.
My honest question is, what does it profit a country to rise up in war against another country?
To me, this and many other stuffs happening around confirms what the book of revelation says that during the end, brothers shall rise up in war against brothers, community against community, town against town, state against state and countries against countries.

Here is the shot I wish to share

Screenhshot Source: Telegram

There is a lot that official statistics and charts will not show when it comes to war profits. Long gone are the days of one country taking other countries' gold and jewels as spoils. Modern war profiteering is more in the nuances of weapon trading, commodities trading (oil, gas) that inevitably go up, military budgets that get increased, private security contracts, and future power balances that can, in the long run, make a profit. So there are still, unfortunately, a lot of economic reasons to go to war.

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Quote from: amishmanish on February 25, 2022, 11:16:04 AM

War is terrible for people but inevitable when egos clash and people cannot come to the negotiating table. They also happen when a single person or entity holds too much power. (Like Putin). Despite all this, you cannot just fault the Russians for this. Throughout the world, countries have been constantly at war for political gains and geopolitical control. Nobody has done this more than the West.

Quote from: Fivestar4everMVP on February 24, 2022, 01:31:27 PM

My honest question is, what does it profit a country to rise up in war against another country?

Its never country versus country but just old men versus old men. In this case, its Putin versus Zelinsky, the Ukrainian head who had been actively wooing NATO to the chagrin of Russia. Now that things have reached to this end, Putin will do everything to get rid of him and get Ukraine back into the fold, atleast ideologically and away from Western influence. So even though there aren't any direct profits, countries just go to war over disagreements turning into ego clashes.

Putin doesn't want Ukraine to be part of NATO, so somewhat for me, it is more on ego here. Let Ukraine lead their own government. But Putin feels that they own Ukraine, thus, waging a war. No one gains from this war. A lot of casualties, civilians and innocent people will lose their lives. But I don't think Putin will spare those lives as he has another agenda. Maybe, one last time, he wants to show what kind of power he has. As we know, the past wars that he had been, he all won.

Stock market in both countries will collapse. And their people will be the ones affected. Hunger and other sufferings will come next if this will continue.

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It's not good for us that we don't know exactly what the two countries are fighting for. We can only watch and hope it stops, no one knows how it will turn out until the stock market is carried away by the actions of both countries. This is a question of sovereignty and power that will never end if Ukraine and Russia continue to insist on taking the road of war. The path of peace was negotiated, but the young Ukrainian president was carried away mentally and always showed strength. Though the impact is on the people around the war zone. Not only that, the economy of the people living in the vicinity was also destroyed.

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Quote from: mk4 on February 24, 2022, 10:54:09 PM

I think it's pretty simple — a country goes to war against another country simply to gain access to one's resources, or simply to show power and authority.

As for Ukraine's stock market.. well I could say that I've never seen that much of a drop in one single day. Shouldn't really be a surprise though, the country's at war, and we don't even know when these businesses could start operating normally again.

Can you share the data on the Ukrainian stock market if you have it? Or did you mean Russia, but wrote Ukraine? The talks are about the crash of the Russian stock market, and it's bleeding hard amidst the Russian invasion. As for Ukrainian market, it wouldn't be a surprise if it's decreasing as well, but I can't see the info on it, and the only things I found were that it's basically closed ('cause, you know, there's a war going on), but I can't find the info with the charts.
Speaking of war and profit, we don't live in the right days for the wars that brought resources. In contemporary world, more and more people are moving into the industry of services and information. And countries with rich natural resources can remain poor. Putin's war is not for resources, I believe. The reasons are ideological, and the aim is to set up a comfy pro-Russian Ukraine that would join Russia's alliances and follow its policies.

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Quote from: Leviathan.007 on February 24, 2022, 03:15:12 PM

Rising up in war against brothers is a good point actually, I leave the war started for nothing and none will get profit out of this between these two counties who are directing participating this war. Stock markets will fall during this time especially the centralized markets in these two countries while I heard many people are trying to take cash from the banks in Ukraine and leave this country as soon as they can, while the government ordered the banks to do not give any cash to people(a Ukrainian friend of mine told me that.) also the other problem in Ukraine is about finding gas stations. All these bad situations will affect these two countries in the long term while other countries like China are taking benefit from it.

Of course, this will have a lasting effect on both economies, the chart should not come as a surprise, you don't engage in war and expect your economy to blossom, I guess once the mind is made up to engage in war all thoughts about the effects are kept aside.
The only thing that saddens me is the government's action towards banks not to give access to people to withdraw their funds, this is the control people detest, they should keep people stranded and unprotected. At times like this, people should be able to have access to cash to make quick and sudden decisions.

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That’s called as improvisation.

All the stock listed companies and their share holders might be selling the shares at alarming rate because they do not want to risk the assets and just want to have something in their hands before they can loose it all.

The stocks are not going up by the way. You mistyped in the OP I guess. It’s not up, it’s down.

These listed companies might be shutdown at this time due to war. There is also strong support from the peeps of Russia against the war and thus it could be mix action from both sides.

amishmanish

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War is terrible for people but inevitable when egos clash and people cannot come to the negotiating table. They also happen when a single person or entity holds too much power. (Like Putin). Despite all this, you cannot just fault the Russians for this. Throughout the world, countries have been constantly at war for political gains and geopolitical control. Nobody has done this more than the West.

Quote from: Fivestar4everMVP on February 24, 2022, 01:31:27 PM

My honest question is, what does it profit a country to rise up in war against another country?

Its never country versus country but just old men versus old men. In this case, its Putin versus Zelinsky, the Ukrainian head who had been actively wooing NATO to the chagrin of Russia. Now that things have reached to this end, Putin will do everything to get rid of him and get Ukraine back into the fold, atleast ideologically and away from Western influence. So even though there aren't any direct profits, countries just go to war over disagreements turning into ego clashes.

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Quote from: jackg on February 24, 2022, 01:54:17 PM

I think profit from wars and winning a war is a long debated topic.

No one really wins a war, there's tremendous loss of life on both sides, tremendous financial costs and not much to actually gain - it's why everywhere has been quite peaceful for so long.

Immediate profit for corrupt politicians, the providers of artillery and other necessities on wars does exist. On a bigger picture though; in the long run, the whole world gains nothing and instead loses a lot in an economical, infrastructural and natural resource aspect. Now for the countries, there can definitely be some gains depending on the reason why the war is being started and pushed. That is to say, if the leader is a smart individual who has devised a detailed plan beforehand and didn't just start a war because of personal reasons and ego.

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Quote from: Fivestar4everMVP on February 24, 2022, 01:31:27 PM

My honest question is, what does it profit a country to rise up in war against another country?

They tend to derive more benefit that favours them than not, but the main issue Russia has developed these kind threat on Ukraine is because of joining the EU NATO in which Russia believe Ukraine not to have done so while in doing so makes Russia feels more insecure as it may serves a point of entry to some of their secret since they both share the same boarder and that Ukraine could have soughted help from them other than NATO as they both share similarities in culture. It is obvious that Ukraine is worth nothing to be compared to Russia both in population, economy, and military power, Russia wanted to have Ukraine by all means in which Ukraine is not given to that.

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Going into a war is never a pleasant way to resolve a dispute, though some say it's the last option. The casualties of war are really not those who die from it but those who stay alive witnessing it, like JP Clarke pointed out in one of his poems. While I condemn the attack on Ukraine by Putin, I believe this war will help Bitcoin price surge (I guess we've already started witnessing that) as it will be used as a Safe Haven. In the past, it used to be CHF and gold but now Bitcoin is included.

Topic: Russia's Stock Market Amidst War Against Ukraine - page 2. (Read 463 times)