S3052 and Manipulation Techniques - page 3.

Jon

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No Gods; No Masters; Only You

Quote from: ?? on ??

Quote from: P4man on February 12, 2012, 02:33:42 PM

Quote from: ?? on ??

Quote from: P4man on February 12, 2012, 02:13:59 PM

Insider trading for stocks is a crime. Do you think it ought no to be?

Bitcoin is not a stock. Should Gavin be allowed to trade Bitcoins?

Edit: I picked the most "insider" person I could think of. Wink

If Gavin's actions or knowledge would have a significant impact on bitcoin's future exchange rate, then we have a far bigger problem then him doing insider trading. So yes, its absolutely fine if Gavin trades, he wouldnt or at least shouldnt have any private knowledge that will affect exchange rates.

So, where do you stand on the OP?

He knows what's best for Bitcoin and whoever disagrees is irrational.

Jon

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No Gods; No Masters; Only You

Quote from: P4man on February 12, 2012, 02:33:42 PM

Quote from: ?? on ??

Quote from: P4man on February 12, 2012, 02:13:59 PM

Insider trading for stocks is a crime. Do you think it ought no to be?

Bitcoin is not a stock. Should Gavin be allowed to trade Bitcoins?

Edit: I picked the most "insider" person I could think of. Wink

If Gavin's actions or knowledge would have a significant impact on bitcoin's future exchange rate, then we have a far bigger problem then him doing insider trading. So yes, its absolutely fine if Gavin trades, he wouldnt or at least shouldnt have any private knowledge that will affect exchange rates.

If Gavin's actions or knowledge would have a significant impact on Bitcoin, I imagine a network fork would inevitably happen and the original Bitcoin network going the way of SolidCoin.

We need to think in terms of results.

P4man

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Quote from: ?? on ??

Quote from: P4man on February 12, 2012, 02:13:59 PM

Insider trading for stocks is a crime. Do you think it ought no to be?

Bitcoin is not a stock. Should Gavin be allowed to trade Bitcoins?

Edit: I picked the most "insider" person I could think of. Wink

If Gavin's actions or knowledge would have a significant impact on bitcoin's future exchange rate, then we have a far bigger problem then him doing insider trading. So yes, its absolutely fine if Gavin trades, he wouldnt or at least shouldnt have any private knowledge that will affect exchange rates.

Jon

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No Gods; No Masters; Only You

Quote from: Elwar on February 12, 2012, 02:22:38 PM

Consider this scenario:

An oil well estimated to yield 10 billion gallons of oil is found off of the coast of Texas.

Oil traders hear about this and immediately start selling their shares of oil with the knowledge that the extra supply will lower the price of oil in the long term.

As they sell, the price of oil drops.

As the price of oil drops, gasoline prices drop.

You benefit by paying less at the pump for gas.

This, from not a drop of oil being extracted.

Would you forbid this type of speculation from happening?

As soon as I would restrict oil owners from trading and using their oil as they please. Do the oil traders own their oil or is it owned by a power higher than themselves? That's the true question.

As for your scenario, I don't see who is harmed involuntarily. Everybody who deals in oil accepts it as a volatile commodity; otherwise they won't be in business for long.

Elwar

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Consider this scenario:

An oil well estimated to yield 10 billion gallons of oil is found off of the coast of Texas.

Oil traders hear about this and immediately start selling their shares of oil with the knowledge that the extra supply will lower the price of oil in the long term.

As they sell, the price of oil drops.

As the price of oil drops, gasoline prices drop.

You benefit by paying less at the pump for gas.

This, from not a drop of oil being extracted.

Would you forbid this type of speculation from happening?

N12

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Quote from: P4man on February 12, 2012, 02:13:59 PM

Insider trading for stocks is a crime. Do you think it ought no to be?

This is Atlas, 17-year old who has an obsession over Ayn Rand. What do you expect, you communist? Grin

Atlas, you can go back to the Politics forum now and spare us your gibberish. It was much better without. Please.

Jon

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No Gods; No Masters; Only You

Quote from: P4man on February 12, 2012, 02:13:59 PM

Insider trading for stocks is a crime. Do you think it ought no to be?

It's a crime for ordinary men. Insider Trading laws only exist to allow powerful men to have a monopoly on insider information such as politicians and higher businessmen.

As far as I can see, it's only a crime if you can't get away with it.

In the future of crypto-currency and decentralized security exchanges, insider trading will be the norm, the standard. Nothing will be able to stop it.

It's a part of nature. Some people will always have access to information that others don't. Some kids are read to and recieve a grand education, others recieve less formal education and choose to specialize in other things. One is not neccessarily worse off but just has to take a different path. I see nothing bad about that.

P4man

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Insider trading for stocks is a crime. Do you think it ought no to be?

Jon

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No Gods; No Masters; Only You

The issue here is some people believe its a crime to value and trade commodities based on needs and wants other than their own. They believe it's irrational to want to use Bitcoins just to trade and play with when they just want to use them as currency. Supply-and-demand makes it more convenient for them to buy and sell from these people with conflicting missions. They don't like that.

They consider it a question of morality. They believe Bitcoins being only used for their needs and wants is a universal good.

I consider it only a matter of emotional preference.

Jon

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No Gods; No Masters; Only You

Quote from: N12 on February 12, 2012, 01:59:03 PM

Quote from: Jon on February 12, 2012, 01:55:10 PM

Might makes reality and Bitcoin is a very powerful tool. No authority besides the trading parties involved can unilaterally convey how Bitcoin should and should not be traded. If restrictions are instilled on the current marketplaces, new and freer ones will pop up in its place.

People are free to trade as they please in the Bitcoin world. We better start getting used to it.

All you can do is attempt to share your culture and what you feel should be done in hopes that others may agree.

Get out of my thread, Atlas. You should be contained to Politics & Society where your pseudo-philosophical babble belongs to.

Thanks.

I think you are mistaking me for somebody else.

N12

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Quote from: Jon on February 12, 2012, 01:55:10 PM

Might makes reality and Bitcoin is a very powerful tool. No authority besides the trading parties involved can unilaterally convey how Bitcoin should and should not be traded. If restrictions are instilled on the current marketplaces, new and freer ones will pop up in its place.

People are free to trade as they please in the Bitcoin world. We better start getting used to it.

All you can do is attempt to share your culture and what you feel should be done in hopes that others may agree.

Get out of my thread, Atlas. You should be contained to Politics & Society where your pseudo-philosophical babble belongs to.

Thanks.

Elwar

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If you feed the monster, it grows larger and is harder to move.

It jumped in June to $30 because there were a small amount of people throwing in some money.

Now it is harder to have such huge jumps because there are more people in the market throwing in their money.

The same market exists for gold. You can subscribe to newsletters telling you which way gold is headed. The only difference is that a lot of people own gold so the result is not so dramatic.

If you do not like the manipulation, encourage more people to come and manipulate for their own gain.

Jon

donator

Activity: 98

Merit: 12

No Gods; No Masters; Only You

Might makes reality and Bitcoin is a very powerful tool. No authority besides the trading parties involved can unilaterally convey how Bitcoin should and should not be traded. If restrictions are instilled on the current marketplaces, new and freer ones will pop up in its place.

People are free to trade as they please in the Bitcoin world. We better start getting used to it.

All you can do is attempt to share your culture and what you feel should be done in hopes that others may agree.

Sock Puppet

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Quote

I would remind you gentlemen that this is a free market.

And I would remind you that just because you can do a thing does not make it right.

This, like all the similar manipulations we see in stocks, creates big waves that are profitable to people who have the advantage, at the expense of everyone else.

If this was a casino, fine, have your fun.

I do not want to play in this stupid scam. I want to use BitCoin for things that aren't a zero-sum game of trying to screw the other guy just a little bit faster to make a profit at his expense.

I want to use BitCoin to CREATE VALUE, and until it's established well enough to resist this kind of manipulation, this insider trading scam is screwing it up for the rest of us.

Elwar

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Viva Ut Vivas

How do I sign up for this market predictor that rises and falls based upon the e-mail sent out?

Sounds like an e-mail a friend of mine was signed up for with stock advice. He would wait for the e-mail to say what stock would go up or down, then he would immediately buy or sell. Then everyone else who received the e-mail would do the same and he would buy or sell at a slight profit.

I like profit.

Please point me to this source of profit.

finway

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Free is good.

Sock Puppet

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Quote from: ?? on ??

This is indeed speculation, and isn't the entire goal of speculation to make money off the ups and downs of the market?

Yes, and I have no problem with him providing the best information to PREDICT the ups and downs.

I DO have a problem when he starts CAUSING the ups and downs.

Hexadecibel

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I still <3 u Satoshi

cunicula

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Quote from: N12 on February 12, 2012, 09:26:36 AM

If you share analysis to influence the public for your subscribers’ gains and make money off it, I see a huge moral issue.

That is all technical analysis is. In all cases, markets, etc. Ever. Period.

If you want to stop it, then the best method is to ridicule. Target the people who propound bullshit, belittle those who follow them.

I guarantee you hate triumphs over ignorance every time. We just need to muster the collective will.

It is not a science, does not claim to be a science, you cannot use scientific methods to disprove it. It is more of a religion.
Accordingly, the appropriate method for dealing with people who peddle or buy into the stuff is persecution.

Persecute the fuckers and drive them from here!!!

teflone

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You're fat, because you dont have any pics on FB

Quote from: S3052 on February 12, 2012, 12:00:00 PM

Every analysis we do, be it for subscribers only or for the public contains unbiased analysis based on technical analysis methods, and this can be verified by the charts we display. If anyone disagrees with our analysis, they are all free to post their alternative.

Your just the first lemming that starts running after you yell fire, then stops at the cliffs edge and take 5 coins for the "flight" down...

Im sure your not listening to all your own "advice"

Self fullfilling prophacy...

Topic: S3052 and Manipulation Techniques - page 3. (Read 10024 times)