Topic: SCAM ALERT: spendbitcoins.com / Jeremy West - page 3. (Read 9860 times)

Meh, I know people who have a shit ton of friends and still wrong other people.  The fact is that your opinion shouldn't matter here.. nor should mine.  The 3 people involved need to reach a consensus they ALL agree upon.  Doesn't matter how many million of Jeremey's friends think that he settled this well, unless the bidders involved are appeased, then the auction was borked.

On that note, I think it's rather clear that Inaba was trying to get the lowest price possible (who doesn't in an auction?), however Inaba you should be cautious to so willingly capitalize off other people's mistakes or oversight, as a predator is no more pleasant than a scammer/dishonest person.

Jeremy DOES have a lot of friends on this forum, because he always at least TRIES to do what is best for the customers he serves.  Maybe he did screw up - in my opinion he did not.  Regardless, he did what he thought was the best course of action based on the circumstances at the time.  I probably would have done the same thing he did.

The rules did not clarify that it wasn't an eBay-style auction, but no one else bid like it was an eBay-like auction.  In fact, I can't think of another time on this forum (or any forum that I frequent that allows auction threads) when the seller allowed an eBay-like bid.  That's why I'm so flabbergasted that Inaba is making such a big deal out of this.  It was assumed that it wouldn't be eBay-style bidding, because no one ever bids that way on a forum.

So, the fact that Inaba had a cheap bid (and everyone in that thread felt that way), the fact that the rules didn't state whether eBay-style bidding was allowed or not, the fact that eBay-style bidding was mixed with regular-style bidding (shouldn't everyone's bids be eBay style if anyone's bids are eBay style?), and the fact that posts were edited and original bid amounts could not be verified, all give good reason to have an extension of the auction via private message.  That way, the winner and amount is very clear and cannot be edited or ambiguous in any way.

Wow dude, I came here to let you know that you are right regarding the auction.  Looks like jeremey has a lot of friends on this forum and it's obvious by how blindly they back him up.  Now I'm not sure saying he was a "scammer" was completely accurate, perhaps shrewd businessman would have been a better title.  However the fact remains, there was an auction where rules where changed after the fact, and if that EVER happens, it better be something that all parties agree on.  Not just to maximize auction profit for the seller.


My humble analysis:

Jeremy you screwed up, you should be willing to shoulder some of the cost for not having set clear auction rules/environment.

Inaba this course of action will only win you more frustration.  While i appreciate the PSA, and will probably never participate in an auction here because of this, you should try and let it go.  Consider it a cheap lesson learned and never do business with the man again.

But I'm high as fuck so what the fuck do i know about anything  

This is completely and factually incorrect.  Both parties involved (Antares and myself) both agree on the sequence of events.  The editing of the bids is a side issue that has nothing to do with the problem at hand.  Antares publically admitted that my initial bid was higher than his prior to the close and that he edited his bid AFTER the close.  The editing of my bid was to clarify the bid, not to CHANGE THE BID.  Antares CHANGED HIS BID after the close.  My bid REMAINED THE EXACT SAME AMOUNT after I edited it.


This is patently ridiculous.  Because I didn't lose any BTC, someone is not a scammer?  A scam is a dishonest scheme or a fraud.  What do you call changing the rules of an auction AFTER the auction closes when you don't like the outcome?  That's called a scam.  The one perpetrating it is a SCAMMER.  What exactly do you call it?

I honestly can't believe you only classify someone as a scammer if they've SUCCESSFULLY scammed someone out of their money.  There are a number of labeled scammers on this board that would like their title changed back from SCAMMER then, since I and many others have fortunately caught them prior to them actually being able to scam someone out of their money.

So you're  effectively supporting scamming, so long as it's not successful, right?  That's the gist of what you're saying?  I know that's a ridiculous statement, but your statement basically says little else.


But this situation proves that he's not.  He offered the auction with a set of rules, which he changed after the fact.  He basically lied in the initial ground rules for all intents and purposes.  He may have been honest in the past and he may be honest in the future, but in this instance, he is very dishonest.

I'd like to point out that by his little scheme, he was able to more than triple the final price of the auction.  Pretty darned convenient!

I've done a LOT of transactions totaling more than a $1500 with Jeremy and he has been super honest, helpful and a pleasure to deal with.

Sorry your experience was no so great, but I assure you Jeremy is good for his word if you feel wronged it would have to be cluster fuck of a situation.

I have dealt with Jeremy many times and he has never even hinted at being a scammer. "Scamming" means you actually lost money to someone not you didnt get the deal you wanted and now you are stamping your foot. If this thread causes Jeremy to lose sales in fact it is YOU who are the scammer because you publically defamed an honest bitcoin business.

To be a crime there has to be a victim. The only victim I am seeing here is Jeremy and spendbitcoins by your baseless claims.

Now you need to make the victim whole Inaba.

Maybe you should re-title as "sore loser" alert.  I read the other thread and wouldn't come out with a scammer label like that.  You tried some tricks, and it wasn't appreciated by someone trying to run something sensible.  You didn't just piss off "Jeremy West" but probably all the other bidders and people who read the thread.  However, I than you for the warning not to deal with =Inaba.

Sometimes being a smart arse is just that, an arse. 

Depends on the type of bidding.  There are plenty of write-in auctions that end at a specified time.  Jeremy never stated that this was like an eBay auction, nor did anyone but YOU bid like it WAS an eBay auction.  So what makes you think that eBay bidding rules apply?

The whole reason Jeremy extended the auction was because of the editing of bids, nothing more.  With the bids being edited, he had no way of verifying the story on either side, so he had to extend it and make it a PM auction to be fair.  What is your suggestion?  That he allow you to keep your edited-in bid of 36?  Or that antanes (or whatever his name was) would win at 40BTC?  Or that you should win at 66 BTC?  What if antanes edited his post again to say 67 BTC?  Where would it end?  How could either of you prove your bids?

Yes, and at an auction house, I can make as many bids as I want in the time alotted.  The bids do not close at X time.  The bids keep going until there are no more bidders bidding.

This auction ended at X time, therefore it's nothing like an auction house auction.  It's like an eBay auction.  Have you ever been to eBay?  You bid your max bid and the top bid is X amount higher than the previous bid, not your max bid.  This auction, online, is far more like eBay than like an auction house.  


I would agree with you if it was and open ended bid.  It wasn't.  It was set to a maximum of 66 BTC.  So its' not whatever + 1. It's whatever + 1 so long as whatever is less than 66 BTC.  If someone wanted to outbid me, bid 66 BTC.

Read the whole thread, and agree that your bid off whatever + 1 isn't the same as an actual bid amount. Also the editing of bid posts should at any time in an auction thread like this should completely invalidate the bid. It certainly doesn't reflect at all well toward your scammer claim.

have you ever been to an auction house? when you put up your bid its how much you willing to pay. not the next highest bid + 1. Okay he should of stated that in the rules but he isnt a scammer stop complaining and stop being sour. you didnt lose anything except time.

So explain why it can't host an auction of such a type?  Does it affect the closing price?  Yes, I agree it does.  That does not automatically make it unfeasible.  In fact, if it has any effect at all, it is the opposite effect.  

I say my max bid is 66 BTC... all someone has to do is say 67 BTC and my previous bids are invalidated.  Knowing the maximum bid of someone is better for the seller than knowing the current bid, since you (the bidder) knows you have to bid X amount to win.  How is this any different than someone saying 66 BTC flat out?  All other bidders STILL have to bid more than that.  Knowing what you're up against as a bidder is always better than not knowing, so I fail to see how it's somehow unfair to anyone involved.

I'm calling him a scammer because he made a deal and then decided not to honor it.  It's not about the auction, it's about the principle.  Any deal I make with you or anyone else, even if I don't like the outcome, if I've made the deal, I will honor it.  I will not back out of it arbitrarily.  Worst case scenario I would contact you privately, explain the situation and try to come to a mutual accommodation.

Jeremy did not do this... he just decided to arbitrarily reopen it until he got the price he wanted without even contacting me in any way, shape or form.  I even tried to get him to do the right thing in his auction thread, but he essentially told me to take a hike (though not in so many words).  Hence, why we have this thread.

I can understand the frustration, but the same style of bidding on Ebay cannot work exactly the same way without effecting the closing price on a forum thread simply because of the fact that your highest bid amount is clearly visible for all the other bidders to view.

As much as you want to believe these bids to be exactly the same, they simply cannot be due to this. The reason is fairly obvious imo.

If the highest bid amount is visible to other bidders, everything changes. This forum is not able to accommodate bidding of this type as ebay or other auctions sites can. Closest thing to it would be to hold a silent auction accepting highest bids.

I had excellent business relations with Jeremy West. I believe that this guy is honest and dedicated to his customers.

Calling him a scammer because of a disagreement on an auction is, at the very least, excessive.

But there was.  If a normal bid was not valid, my high bid of 66 BTC would stand.  That is a clear, unambiguous winner, since the next highest bid was 35 BTC (or 40 BTC if you take the edited bid).  I've been out of school for awhile now, but I think that 66 is still greater than 40 in new AND old math.

He extended the auction because there was no unambiguous winner.

I trusted him to, until he showed that he does not honor his agreements. Glad I found out before I sent him BTC!

What would you call it, if not a scam.  Advertise an auction, but you don't like the outcome, so you change the rules after the fact and "reopen" the auction.  Sounds like the definition of a scam to me.

SCAM ALERT?  Oh please.  I'd trust Jeremy more than 99.9% of the people here.  He's done more in the way of customer service than most other Bitcoin "companies" can even hope for.

You're just mad that you couldn't win the auction cheaply with your cheapskate bidding method that no one else agreed upon or was using.

Yes, please read it.  Also please understand his "rules" were edited after the auction ended to include a clause of "bidnappers" (whatever that is) and was NOT part of the original auction, which I quoted above.