Should Muslims be aloud to impose Sharia law anywhere in the United States?

salinizm

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Quote from: eon89 on February 01, 2016, 11:37:09 AM

I have no idea what Sharia law is but sure, why not? Let's let muslims do whatever they want where ever they want it. Sure - what harm can come out of it? (said he quite worried, but still slightly amused)

if you knew what the sharia law is, you would run away from it as far as you can go...

Moloch

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Quote from: spazzdla on February 01, 2016, 03:17:51 PM

WHOEVER HAS THE GUNS WRITES THE LAWS

anyone who thinks differently is a complete moron.

Since when do banks and pharmaceutical companies need guns to write laws? Is this new?

America is an oligarchy (look it up if you need to)...

Rich people write the laws... like the Koch brothers... they don't spend $900,000,000 each year lobbying congress if they aren't making ROI on that investment... for every billion they spend, they save 2 billion in new tax loopholes...

Forget what you learned from School House Rock about, "How a bill becomes a law"... things have changed:
How a bill becomes a law - Saturday Night Live

spazzdla

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Quote from: Spendulus on February 01, 2016, 12:22:31 PM

Quote from: eon89 on February 01, 2016, 11:37:09 AM

I have no idea what Sharia law is but sure, why not? Let's let muslims do whatever they want where ever they want it. Sure - what harm can come out of it? (said he quite worried, but still slightly amused)

IF it's okay to "allow Sharia law..."

THEN isn't it okay to impose "NonSharia law..."

AND THEN isn't it okay for me to just impose my own law? "You give me your eldest daughters, half your savings, and your cat. That's my law. Either obey it or you are going to really, really regret it, buddy."

Your last line is why it's "okay" to impose American laws on Americans.

WHO
EVER
HAS
THE
GUNS
WRITES
THE
LAWS

anyone who thinks differently is a complete moron.

designerusa

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Quote from: Ernstew on January 27, 2016, 11:16:41 AM

Should Muslims be aloud to impose Sharia law anywhere in the United Sates? in a way that will affect non muslims

this will never happen.. because islam population is so low to make it happen .. as a usa citizen, i respect their religion but they must obey usa law not sharia law..

BADecker

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Quote from: Spendulus on February 01, 2016, 12:22:31 PM

Quote from: eon89 on February 01, 2016, 11:37:09 AM

I have no idea what Sharia law is but sure, why not? Let's let muslims do whatever they want where ever they want it. Sure - what harm can come out of it? (said he quite worried, but still slightly amused)

IF it's okay to "allow Sharia law..."

THEN isn't it okay to impose "NonSharia law..."

AND THEN isn't it okay for me to just impose my own law? "You give me your eldest daughters, half your savings, and your cat. That's my law. Either obey it or you are going to really, really regret it, buddy."

That's the point. You may impose your own law. And everyone else can do the same.

If you agree with the law of someone else when that other person's law is to kill you, then you die by your own law, not theirs. If they kill you without your agreement, then there is American law that the majority of us agree to that says to punish the murderer.

If we are going to have Sharia law in America, let it be done with people who understandingly volunteer to it... but no one else.

Spendulus

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Quote from: eon89 on February 01, 2016, 11:37:09 AM

I have no idea what Sharia law is but sure, why not? Let's let muslims do whatever they want where ever they want it. Sure - what harm can come out of it? (said he quite worried, but still slightly amused)

IF it's okay to "allow Sharia law..."

THEN isn't it okay to impose "NonSharia law..."

AND THEN isn't it okay for me to just impose my own law? "You give me your eldest daughters, half your savings, and your cat. That's my law. Either obey it or you are going to really, really regret it, buddy."

Moloch

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Quote from: eon89 on February 01, 2016, 11:37:09 AM

I have no idea what Sharia law is but sure, why not? Let's let muslims do whatever they want where ever they want it. Sure - what harm can come out of it? (said he quite worried, but still slightly amused)

Sharia law includes things like 'honor killings' and murdering an 'apostate' (A former Muslim who now rejects Islam)... these could never be legal in the US...

You can't impose "Sharia law" in the US because the Constitution prohibits the establishment of one religion above another (basically, no religious laws allowed)

well... except... there are a few states where a parent can choose to pray for their child's cancer instead of taking him to the hospital, without facing charges of murder/child endangerment/negligent homocide... Blows my mind, but mostly unrelated...

eon89

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I have no idea what Sharia law is but sure, why not? Let's let muslims do whatever they want where ever they want it. Sure - what harm can come out of it? (said he quite worried, but still slightly amused)

BADecker

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Muslims can be allowed to impose Sharia law anywhere they want in America. Why? Because it is religion, and they have freedom of religion in America, just like everyone else.

The catch for Muslims is what will happen to them if they apply certain aspects of Sharia law in America.

American law trumps Sharia law. If a Muslim in America harms another person or his property, just like anyone else, he can be taken to court, and if found guilty, punished for his actions. This includes if a Muslim actually threatens someone else with a real threat.

The really difficult question has to do with how much Muslims will take. When they find that American law is much more favorable to them than Sharia law, how long will it take them to convert away from Sharia? Or if they won't convert, how much punishment will it take via the American court system until they move out of America?

Ernstew

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Yes and must be destroyed...They have crazy laws in their country but now want to contamine whole world..no USA is free place for free people and who can not respect it or want to try to put their own laws go out

spazzdla

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Quote from: pinoycash on January 27, 2016, 11:17:54 AM

No, why? its not a muslim country, i respect muslims, but their laws should stay on their home country

Same reasons Mormons can't have 25 wives. You should not be able to rape a women in America because she is walking the streets alone.. Islam is a plague to this planet.

swogerino

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Sharia law is not the United States law. In no way should it ever be imposed. You do have rights, but they should be within a reasonable limit; the allowance of such strict procedures would not be acceptable at all.

TECSHARE

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Quote from: criptix on January 31, 2016, 05:40:15 PM

Quote from: TECSHARE on January 28, 2016, 02:54:42 AM

Quote from: The Sceptical Chymist on January 28, 2016, 12:49:43 AM

Quote from: pinoycash on January 27, 2016, 11:17:54 AM

No, why? its not a muslim country, i respect muslims, but their laws should stay on their home country

No no no no no no no no, a thousand times no. I agree, their laws should stay in their homeland. My personal view is that any religious law is silly and superstition-based and has no part in a modern society. So I would vigorously oppose Sharia law in the US.

Technically all law is based on religion. If you research the history of law it all goes back to religious texts, some of which are still in use word for word today in modern law. There is some debatable value to some of these laws as most people agree murder, theft, rape, and other forms of crime are in opposition to the foundation of a civil society even though the laws have a religious origin. Most people misunderstand the concept of separation of church and state. Many people assume that it means all concepts of faith and God should be removed from law and government. In reality it means that the government is not allowed to infringe on any individual's right to practice their religion as long as it does not bring direct harm to others. This was a direct reference to Britain's hybridization with the church, and meant to prohibit such an arrangement between any church and the US government.

i rather remember this:
https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Secular_state
https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Separation_of_church_and_state

Quote

Secular states do not have a state religion (established religion) or equivalent, although the absence of a state religion does not necessarily mean that a state is fully secular; however, a true secular state should steadfastly maintain national governance without influence from religious factions; i.e. Separation of church and state.[2]

Way to read.

Here is more stuff for you not to read.
http://www.forbes.com/sites/billflax/2011/07/09/the-true-meaning-of-separation-of-church-and-state/print/

criptix

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Quote from: TECSHARE on January 28, 2016, 02:54:42 AM

Quote from: The Sceptical Chymist on January 28, 2016, 12:49:43 AM

Quote from: pinoycash on January 27, 2016, 11:17:54 AM

No, why? its not a muslim country, i respect muslims, but their laws should stay on their home country

No no no no no no no no, a thousand times no. I agree, their laws should stay in their homeland. My personal view is that any religious law is silly and superstition-based and has no part in a modern society. So I would vigorously oppose Sharia law in the US.

Technically all law is based on religion. If you research the history of law it all goes back to religious texts, some of which are still in use word for word today in modern law. There is some debatable value to some of these laws as most people agree murder, theft, rape, and other forms of crime are in opposition to the foundation of a civil society even though the laws have a religious origin. Most people misunderstand the concept of separation of church and state. Many people assume that it means all concepts of faith and God should be removed from law and government. In reality it means that the government is not allowed to infringe on any individual's right to practice their religion as long as it does not bring direct harm to others. This was a direct reference to Britain's hybridization with the church, and meant to prohibit such an arrangement between any church and the US government.

i rather remember this:
https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Secular_state
https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Separation_of_church_and_state

Quote

Secular states do not have a state religion (established religion) or equivalent, although the absence of a state religion does not necessarily mean that a state is fully secular; however, a true secular state should steadfastly maintain national governance without influence from religious factions; i.e. Separation of church and state.[2]

protokol

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On topic, no of course Sharia Law (or what most people believe SHaria law is) shouldn't be imposed anywhere in the USA (or anywhere else for that matter). Any law based solely on religious texts is dangerous to civilization.

But, there's no reason to inherently deny certain parts of Islamic law if they are acceptable under the current laws of a state. One example of this would be Islamic financial laws, whereby interest is not allowed. For example, if someone wants to write up a loan with zero interest, based on Sharia law, then there's no reason why they shouldn't, as long as they are acceptable under state law.

There's also a lot of confusion over what exactly Sharia law is. From https://simple.wikipedia.org/wiki/Sharia_law:

Quote from: bryant.coleman on January 27, 2016, 10:45:16 PM

The Shakira law is spreading like cancer. In some of the Muslim majority European cities such as Brussels, Oldham and Burnley, the local laws are no longer in force. On the other hand, the Shakira law is having the ultimate authority. That said, I don't think that it will be easy to impose it in the United States. The Muslim population is quite low there, unlike that in Europe.

You're fucking talking bollocks again Bryant. Local laws are certainly in force in these cities. Are you implying that theives are getting their hands cut off in Brussels, or people are being beheaded in Oldham for adultery? You got any sources for this dangerous nonsense you keep spouting?

There may be specific laws that are allowed (such as the zero interest law I mentioned earlier), but they're not being imposed on everyone in the city because that would be against state law.

criptix

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Quote from: bryant.coleman on January 27, 2016, 10:45:16 PM

The Shakira law is spreading like cancer. In some of the Muslim majority European cities such as Brussels, Oldham and Burnley, the local laws are no longer in force. On the other hand, the Shakira law is having the ultimate authority. That said, I don't think that it will be easy to impose it in the United States. The Muslim population is quite low there, unlike that in Europe.

#hips dont lie

I really wish there would be more shakira law in germany Grin

Ernstew

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USA is a free country for free people and freedom is respected. If they want sharia law better to stay in Saudi Arabia, Afganistan...and they can enjoy their law..The main problem is they make their getos in USA cities, and secretly they practice that law..but not in public, other people avoid their quarts...

Lethn

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Quote from: croato on January 28, 2016, 01:51:55 AM

Of course not. USA is multi ethnic society so if every ethnic/religion group would impose their law there would be anarchy. If anyone dont like USA law, he can always go back where he belong.

As an Anarchist I resent that statement.

BADecker

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The real question is, should Muslims be aloud to be soloud? Cheesy

TECSHARE

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Quote from: Snail2 on January 28, 2016, 07:04:16 AM

Quote from: TECSHARE on January 28, 2016, 06:30:44 AM

Quote from: Snail2 on January 28, 2016, 06:00:28 AM

Quote from: TECSHARE on January 28, 2016, 02:54:42 AM

Technically all law is based on religion...

Indeed, but some law and religions have developed a lot, some other religions and law systems are still there were they were fifteen hundred years ago. Perpetuality and sticking to old traditions are nice things in many areas but not that great in law.

Way to ignore everything I just posted and fall to your previously held belief of "religion bad!"

I think you misunderstood what I wrote. I never said that "religion is bad" I said some religions are bad. I think Christianity, Buddhism Hinduism, and a lot of other religions never been "designed" to be oppressive and (originally) were not aimed for world domination. Of course nearly off of these religions were used as tools for oppression and domination by some ambitious people, but on their own these religions were targeting improvement of individuals and communities. On the other hand there are some other religions like Islam and mesoamerican religions what were especially "designed" for conquest, domination and enslaving others. These are what I consider bad for a multi-ethnic, multi-religion society.

None of this has anything to do with what I just explained about religion and government. This isn't a reply to my comment but a statement after it with no consideration for the premise whatsoever. Like I said, just bias bleeding out in the guise of a response.

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