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Topic: Should we kick more people off welfare? - page 2. (Read 2673 times)

legendary
Activity: 1288
Merit: 1043
:^)
August 31, 2015, 01:25:58 AM
#29
People is lazy by nature, you can't change that. Nobody likes to work, you may like what you do, but the borderline between work and a hobby is that by work it means you've to do it even when you're not up to it.
You may then only make people move by necessity, a way to do it pass beyond welfare is by using greed and wave them with a "better life", creating a fake necessity. But this will work only with some, for many and, in due time, for most, as long as you keep their basic needs supplied with welfare, they won't do anything else, never leaving poverty. But, heck! At least they don't need to wake up early morning.
exactly, why put forth the effort to find a job when you have a nice check that comes in the mail for you? there needs to be an incentive to push people to find work; welfare is meant to be a crutch for people that cant find a job, and it should be expected of them to find something within half a year the the very most. cutting people off after a certain period of time seems like a good first step, extensions would be called for in certain extreme cases, but those should be reviewed on a case by case basis.
legendary
Activity: 1218
Merit: 1000
August 31, 2015, 01:22:31 AM
#28
People is lazy by nature, you can't change that. Nobody likes to work, you may like what you do, but the borderline between work and a hobby is that by work it means you've to do it even when you're not up to it.
You may then only make people move by necessity, a way to do it pass beyond welfare is by using greed and wave them with a "better life", creating a fake necessity. But this will work only with some, for many and, in due time, for most, as long as you keep their basic needs supplied with welfare, they won't do anything else, never leaving poverty. But, heck! At least they don't need to wake up early morning.
sr. member
Activity: 448
Merit: 250
August 30, 2015, 11:49:40 PM
#27
Welfare programs are also a strong reason for Africans to immigrate to rich countries, which close their borders very precisely not to let foreigners gain access to welfare. Welfare and borders are the same thing: restrictions to freedom.

Welfare payments are the primary reason for people from the third world nations to immigrate to Western countries. For example, take the case of Afghan migrants. The richest country in the world (Qatar) is nearer to Afghanistan when compered to the European nations. Qatar is also culturally similar to Afghanistan. But still, Afghan migrants prefer Europe. The reason - welfare payments.

That's what I'm saying. Welfare systems are a magnet for migrants, and migrations have to be stopped for the sake of the welfare state. Imagine a world without any welfare. There would be much more freedom to travel and move, that's what I want.

Right! If you stop the gigantic welfare financial drain across the board (or even reduce it), you'll never get elected a second term. The only way left is to eliminate certain classes of people. Eliminate the ones whose vote is going to affect you the least when they go south (pun intended).

Smiley
Yes that's true. People don't want to do things that are boring or learn a productive skill but boy will they do a lot to get to a welfare state. If we were to stop foreigners from getting welfare cheques, or as previously mentioned find a job for them and force them to work. It sickens me to se so many lazy people in the world.
legendary
Activity: 3906
Merit: 1373
August 30, 2015, 08:37:31 PM
#26
Welfare programs are also a strong reason for Africans to immigrate to rich countries, which close their borders very precisely not to let foreigners gain access to welfare. Welfare and borders are the same thing: restrictions to freedom.

Welfare payments are the primary reason for people from the third world nations to immigrate to Western countries. For example, take the case of Afghan migrants. The richest country in the world (Qatar) is nearer to Afghanistan when compered to the European nations. Qatar is also culturally similar to Afghanistan. But still, Afghan migrants prefer Europe. The reason - welfare payments.

That's what I'm saying. Welfare systems are a magnet for migrants, and migrations have to be stopped for the sake of the welfare state. Imagine a world without any welfare. There would be much more freedom to travel and move, that's what I want.

Right! If you stop the gigantic welfare financial drain across the board (or even reduce it), you'll never get elected a second term. The only way left is to eliminate certain classes of people. Eliminate the ones whose vote is going to affect you the least when they go south (pun intended).

Smiley
legendary
Activity: 3066
Merit: 1047
Your country may be your worst enemy
August 30, 2015, 07:17:53 PM
#25
Welfare programs are also a strong reason for Africans to immigrate to rich countries, which close their borders very precisely not to let foreigners gain access to welfare. Welfare and borders are the same thing: restrictions to freedom.

Welfare payments are the primary reason for people from the third world nations to immigrate to Western countries. For example, take the case of Afghan migrants. The richest country in the world (Qatar) is nearer to Afghanistan when compered to the European nations. Qatar is also culturally similar to Afghanistan. But still, Afghan migrants prefer Europe. The reason - welfare payments.

That's what I'm saying. Welfare systems are a magnet for migrants, and migrations have to be stopped for the sake of the welfare state. Imagine a world without any welfare. There would be much more freedom to travel and move, that's what I want.
legendary
Activity: 3752
Merit: 1217
August 30, 2015, 12:31:30 PM
#24
Immigrants should work and if they loose their job they are kicked out again. Asylumseekers who are deemed legal are given some kind of welfare. Only when the situation is too dangerous and the refugee can't return only then an asylumseeker is allowed to request welfare.

You are talking about the state welfare system in the Netherlands, right? I was wondering why that country hasn't received the flood of Sub-Saharan Africans and Syrian Arabs, unlike some of the other European Union countries (United Kingdom, Italy, Germany.etc). And this might be one of the reasons. The PVV has achieved in the Netherlands what the UKIP has failed to achieve in the United Kingdom.
legendary
Activity: 3906
Merit: 1373
August 30, 2015, 12:27:18 PM
#23
Actually, we should get more people into the field of robotics and computers. We should develop robots that can handle every job without help from people. The robots should even be built to completely repair themselves, from raw materials all the way to finished products.

Then we all, worldwide, should go on welfare, collect a thousand times more than we would without the robots, travel the world, enjoy every pleasure that we can devise for ourselves, and live a life of ease.

Of course, if anybody wants to pursue an occupation as part of his/her enjoyment, room would be made amongst the robots.

What fun! Can't wait.

Smiley
newbie
Activity: 17
Merit: 0
August 30, 2015, 07:19:19 AM
#22
Welfare programs are also a strong reason for Africans to immigrate to rich countries, which close their borders very precisely not to let foreigners gain access to welfare. Welfare and borders are the same thing: restrictions to freedom.

Welfare payments are the primary reason for people from the third world nations to immigrate to Western countries. For example, take the case of Afghan migrants. The richest country in the world (Qatar) is nearer to Afghanistan when compered to the European nations. Qatar is also culturally similar to Afghanistan. But still, Afghan migrants prefer Europe. The reason - welfare payments.

Bismarck was no fascist. That was not invented yet.... And old age pension with 65 when most died before the age of 60 well, that's not expensive is it?
Not everyone is allowed to access welfare. Immigrants should work and if they loose their job they are kicked out again. Asylumseekers who are deemed legal are given some kind of welfare. Only when the situation is too dangerous and the refugee can't return only then an asylumseeker is allowed to request welfare.


legendary
Activity: 2352
Merit: 1267
In Memory of Zepher
August 30, 2015, 07:16:52 AM
#21
Welfare benefits are soon becoming the easy way to get out of working, which is wrong. Of course the elderly and completely disabled should get it, however those who claim they 'cannot find a job' should be found a job by the government and forced to do it properly for their pay or sent into military service. There is always a lack of manual labor in almost every country, forcing those who are too lazy to find a job into those spaces will both help the economy and increase the amount of manual labor done.
legendary
Activity: 3752
Merit: 1217
August 30, 2015, 07:02:51 AM
#20
Welfare programs are also a strong reason for Africans to immigrate to rich countries, which close their borders very precisely not to let foreigners gain access to welfare. Welfare and borders are the same thing: restrictions to freedom.

Welfare payments are the primary reason for people from the third world nations to immigrate to Western countries. For example, take the case of Afghan migrants. The richest country in the world (Qatar) is nearer to Afghanistan when compered to the European nations. Qatar is also culturally similar to Afghanistan. But still, Afghan migrants prefer Europe. The reason - welfare payments.
legendary
Activity: 3066
Merit: 1047
Your country may be your worst enemy
August 30, 2015, 06:09:31 AM
#19
Kicking people off welfare isn't enough. All welfare programs should be terminated. They were invented by Bismarck and later promoted by Mussolini. Both fascists looking for supporters. Welfare programs are the greatest inequalities in the world. Nigerians or Ethiopians do not have access to any kind of welfare, and yet they manage to survive. Better than that, their population is growing fast. Sorry to point it out but this proves that the average African is much smarter than the average first world guy on welfare.

Welfare programs are also a strong reason for Africans to immigrate to rich countries, which close their borders very precisely not to let foreigners gain access to welfare. Welfare and borders are the same thing: restrictions to freedom.
newbie
Activity: 17
Merit: 0
August 29, 2015, 05:23:34 PM
#18


In the Netherlands one gets around $ 1000 welfare if you are single and $ 1500 welfare if you have kids. As a plus you get around $ 90 for healthcare and a large chunk of your rent paid by the state. That does not mean one can sit on his or hers lazy arse. You have to proof that you look for a job and you have to do something back like cleaning the streets or help out at a school or retirement home.

In NED, what are the income qualifications or unemployment qualifications to receive the welfare? I'm curious where the country sets that bar.
[/quote]

Should you loose your job, you are liable to get 75% of your last pay from the state from a periode of 3 months to 2 years. Should you not have a job afterwards you get wellfare providing you have less than 5k on your bank, are willing to sell your house and proof that you are looking for a job. If you are under 27 than you are sent to school if you have no qualifications. Wellfare is organized by the state and by the towncouncil. Even beggars can get wellfare if they have a PO box.

legendary
Activity: 3752
Merit: 1217
August 29, 2015, 02:56:38 PM
#17
That does not mean one can sit on his or hers lazy arse. You have to proof that you look for a job and you have to do something back like cleaning the streets or help out at a school or retirement home.

This is exactly what should be done in countries such as Canada and the United States. But what happening there is that people collect all the welfare checks, and stay at home or drug joints to experiment with various synthetic drugs and prescription pills. If they are forced to do community service, then they will spend less time in using drugs.
sr. member
Activity: 434
Merit: 250
Loose lips sink sigs!
August 29, 2015, 02:16:11 PM
#16
There's a lot of research that shows that people on welfare will not look for or engage in work if the pay for that work doesn't exceed the welfare. We need to match the two...welfare should be paired back to not provide more than minimum wages or minimum wages should increase. The problem with minimum wages increasing is that it motivates prices (and the cost of living) to increase as well.

If welfare isn't linked specifically to the objective of getting people that can work back to work, it will never be successful.

Of course disabilities and addictions need to be handled differently but there should be much more surveillance over the appropriate use of government money...some rights should go away when one welfare.

In the Netherlands one gets around $ 1000 welfare if you are single and $ 1500 welfare if you have kids. As a plus you get around $ 90 for healthcare and a large chunk of your rent paid by the state. That does not mean one can sit on his or hers lazy arse. You have to proof that you look for a job and you have to do something back like cleaning the streets or help out at a school or retirement home.

In NED, what are the income qualifications or unemployment qualifications to receive the welfare? I'm curious where the country sets that bar.
newbie
Activity: 17
Merit: 0
August 29, 2015, 09:13:12 AM
#15

In the Netherlands one gets around $ 1000 welfare if you are single and $ 1500 welfare if you have kids. As a plus you get around $ 90 for healthcare and a large chunk of your rent paid by the state. That does not mean one can sit on his or hers lazy arse. You have to proof that you look for a job and you have to do something back like cleaning the streets or help out at a school or retirement home.

legendary
Activity: 1498
Merit: 1000
August 28, 2015, 04:04:04 PM
#14
Here where I live in Texas it has become a source of great income for some, you'll hear talk of people aspiring to "get a crazy check" meaning disability which then gives them a monthly check, free healthcare, and food stamps. After receiving disability, the person is then able to visit one of the many shady psychiatrists operating here providing this service as it has become big business - the "patient" will receive suboxone (@ 90) which they can sell for up to $20 apiece, adderall (@60-90) which will go for @ $10 apiece, and valium or xanax (@ 30-60) - the prescriptions are free to fill with Medicaid/Medicare so that alone is an extra $2500 (or about that amount) combined with their monthly government check. Commercials run constantly on television here for disability lawyers as it has become a big business, it is amazing how people have manipulated the system and are profiting from it yet some in actual need suffer.

Wow this blows my mind but i believe it... i know a lot of ppl on govt disability in US that shouldnt be
member
Activity: 70
Merit: 10
August 28, 2015, 03:53:05 PM
#13
Any kind of welfare seldom works as it should. I think the concept of healing it is wrong by itself. That´s obvious that nowadays the state has to keep
it´s subjects from rebelling somehow. Because of that the situation of masses of people begging and dying in the street isn´t acceptable socially(the fist goverment retirement program in Germany ruled by Bismarck had that objective). But let´s be honest with each other - there will always be people who´re going to want to parasite on the society without any reason to justify it. There´s nothing that could be done.
newbie
Activity: 6
Merit: 0
August 28, 2015, 03:22:10 PM
#12
the resident must be thinking more about drugs or alcohol.
thinking from where they get money.
necessary more important than drugs or alcohol. this will make country loses.
they money can to buy something to eat, and necessary like daily to take a bath, or education.
not use to not important things.
can distinguish what is important and not important.
legendary
Activity: 3752
Merit: 1217
August 28, 2015, 02:24:48 PM
#11
I would say about half of the pensioners work. In the building I live in though nobody works. They just do drugs and borrow money from others.

It is a shame if a 75-year old pensioner is working, as he can't cover his daily expenses from his pension alone, and at the same time a 25-year old is sitting at home and experimenting with drugs as he has nothing else to do. If the government can't give these guys job training, then it should be made mandatory for them to do some sort of community service or volunteering.
sr. member
Activity: 281
Merit: 250
August 28, 2015, 02:14:28 PM
#10
Here where I live in Texas it has become a source of great income for some, you'll hear talk of people aspiring to "get a crazy check" meaning disability which then gives them a monthly check, free healthcare, and food stamps. After receiving disability, the person is then able to visit one of the many shady psychiatrists operating here providing this service as it has become big business - the "patient" will receive suboxone (@ 90) which they can sell for up to $20 apiece, adderall (@60-90) which will go for @ $10 apiece, and valium or xanax (@ 30-60) - the prescriptions are free to fill with Medicaid/Medicare so that alone is an extra $2500 (or about that amount) combined with their monthly government check. Commercials run constantly on television here for disability lawyers as it has become a big business, it is amazing how people have manipulated the system and are profiting from it yet some in actual need suffer.
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