Tennis League All Thread - page 338.

Daniel91

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Quote from: aoluain on December 06, 2021, 04:50:58 PM

Totally @Daniel91 and it was great to see Croatia get to the final, like I said its
great to see other teams and players getting a taste of the limelight. Russia as
others mentioned were favourites from the start.

Cant believe Cilic cannot overcome his negative thoughts, surely he realises its
not all about hitting a ball?

Although he won two tournaments this year surely he would strive for more,
he has the skill surely he knows he needs to work on the mental side

In fact, it's a miracle that Croatia managed to reach the finals since Cilic lost almost all his matches, and all the time we seemed to be playing with a player less Grin

It's not clear to anyone what happened to Cilic, probably not to him either.
From a tennis player who wins GS titles and the Davis Cup he has become a player who can’t beat anyone and loses matches he should have objectively won, from much worse players.
I feel sorry for him because he had the potential and talent to achieve a lot more in tennis but something happened to him and he lost his confidence.
With Cilic from 7-8 years ago, Croatia would now probably be the Davis Cup winner.
Croatia did not achieve this fantastic result thanks to Cilic, but to Gojo, and that is a fact. Cilic really contributed almost nothing to Croatia's entry into the finals, he lost all his key matches.

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Quote from: aoluain on December 06, 2021, 04:50:58 PM

Cant believe Cilic cannot overcome his negative thoughts, surely he realises its
not all about hitting a ball?

Although he won two tournaments this year surely he would strive for more,
he has the skill surely he knows he needs to work on the mental side

Čilić is not a young player, he has 33 years. If he has not found his mental composure until now...well let's just say he does not have much time to do it

He is just a momentum player with great serve and strong ground strokes but there is no plan B to get him out on a day when those strikes are not hitting or when there is a player on the other side able to return his attacks few times in a row.

He had a great career with the peak coming on US Open 2014, not many players can say that they won the Grand Slam in the era of big four. I believe only he and Wawrinka can boast with the fact that they took Grand Slam in the times when Djoković, Nadal, Federer and Muray were all on top of their careers. He was also finalist in AO and Wimbeldon, RG is only grand slam where he did not get to the final. He also has a silver medal from Olympic games in doubles with Dodig and Davis cup title, so all in all very rounded and full career and I am sure I have missed something.

aoluain

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Totally @Daniel91 and it was great to see Croatia get to the final, like I said its
great to see other teams and players getting a taste of the limelight. Russia as
others mentioned were favourites from the start.

Cant believe Cilic cannot overcome his negative thoughts, surely he realises its
not all about hitting a ball?

Although he won two tournaments this year surely he would strive for more,
he has the skill surely he knows he needs to work on the mental side

Daniel91

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Quote from: aoluain on December 06, 2021, 02:29:45 AM

Yea it could have been different if Nadal was playing, if Tsitsipas hadnt to pull out,
if Zverev was playing but without those playing it gives a chance for other teams to
progress to the final.

And in yesterdays final and second game, I was really impressed with Cilic' first set,
he played such a great one to miss out on the tie break but he was nowhere in the
second set, maybe a combination of Medvedev adapting very quickly from the first and
Cilic not being able to counter.

Such a pity for Croatia and Mectic and Pavic not being able to have more of a say
in the competition especially being #1 and #2 in doubles.

Cilic has not played at his highest level for a long time and it is obvious that he has lost self-confidence and faith in himself.
He was very close in the first set, but when he lost it, I think it was clear to many Croatian fans what will happen next.
Cilic fell psychologically again and no longer played at the same level as at the start of the match.
We have seen this many times in his matches over the last few years, unfortunately.
In fact it seems to me that Gojo had a better chance of winning but he was unlucky.
Realistically, Russia was too strong this year and Croatia achieved a result above expectations.

Trofo

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Quote from: casperBGD on December 06, 2021, 03:54:49 AM

Quote from: cryptofrka on December 05, 2021, 05:33:32 PM

At the end, Gojo was closer to the 3rd set than Čilić. Marin really played a horrible tournament, I did not think at all that he can parry Medvedev.
Mektić and Pavić were big favorites in the doubles games, but so were both Medvedev and Rublev in singles and unfortunately we did not give our pair the chance to bring us the win.

All in all, a great Davis cup for Croatia and congratulations to the Russians. In a new system pairs carry much more weight than before and we'll be around the favorites next year as well.

congrats to Croatia as well, especially to Gojo, he won all his matches to the final, if I am not wrong
you always had that double point almost secured, and his wins were the fact that brought you into the final

Russians have two great single players, and that was enough to have a win, without having to rely on doubles match, congrats to them as well

we had Novak only, and that is simply not enough

Our pair was priced @1.6 to win best 8 tournament where all the strongest pairs from the world are playing. Then you have to factor in that all that other best pairs are not from the same country. So after Bryan brothers stopped playing we are enormous favorites against any double combination that any Country in the world can field.

Too bad our singles players are not on the same level, what Gojo did was really incredible. He started this tournament barely in top 300 and won points against guys from top 30. He earned more money this week than in his whole career. Enough said.
Čilić played like he always does against top opponents, starts very good and then falls apart as the match progresses.

Russia had 4 great singles players not just 2. I feel like Medvedev, Rublev, Khachanov and Karatsev should have gotten 2 points from single in any match up no matter who they choose to play that particular day, with the exception of Serbia and Djokovic of course.

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Quote from: cryptofrka on December 05, 2021, 05:33:32 PM

At the end, Gojo was closer to the 3rd set than Čilić. Marin really played a horrible tournament, I did not think at all that he can parry Medvedev.
Mektić and Pavić were big favorites in the doubles games, but so were both Medvedev and Rublev in singles and unfortunately we did not give our pair the chance to bring us the win.

All in all, a great Davis cup for Croatia and congratulations to the Russians. In a new system pairs carry much more weight than before and we'll be around the favorites next year as well.

congrats to Croatia as well, especially to Gojo, he won all his matches to the final, if I am not wrong
you always had that double point almost secured, and his wins were the fact that brought you into the final

Russians have two great single players, and that was enough to have a win, without having to rely on doubles match, congrats to them as well

we had Novak only, and that is simply not enough

aoluain

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Yea it could have been different if Nadal was playing, if Tsitsipas hadnt to pull out,
if Zverev was playing but without those playing it gives a chance for other teams to
progress to the final.

And in yesterdays final and second game, I was really impressed with Cilic' first set,
he played such a great one to miss out on the tie break but he was nowhere in the
second set, maybe a combination of Medvedev adapting very quickly from the first and
Cilic not being able to counter.

Such a pity for Croatia and Mectic and Pavic not being able to have more of a say
in the competition especially being #1 and #2 in doubles.

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Quote from: cryptofrka on December 05, 2021, 05:33:32 PM

At the end, Gojo was closer to the 3rd set than Čilić. Marin really played a horrible tournament, I did not think at all that he can parry Medvedev.
Mektić and Pavić were big favorites in the doubles games, but so were both Medvedev and Rublev in singles and unfortunately we did not give our pair the chance to bring us the win.

All in all, a great Davis cup for Croatia and congratulations to the Russians. In a new system pairs carry much more weight than before and we'll be around the favorites next year as well.

Davis cup this year was not that bad, but it totally lacked more competition, a lot of good players didn't play this year, Nadal and Zverev could have added a lot to their teams and to the whole tournament, Russia for sure deserved it since they have a set of good players and two of them are in top 5 of the ATP singles leader board, they were favorites before the tournament started so no surprises there.

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At the end, Gojo was closer to the 3rd set than Čilić. Marin really played a horrible tournament, I did not think at all that he can parry Medvedev.
Mektić and Pavić were big favorites in the doubles games, but so were both Medvedev and Rublev in singles and unfortunately we did not give our pair the chance to bring us the win.

All in all, a great Davis cup for Croatia and congratulations to the Russians. In a new system pairs carry much more weight than before and we'll be around the favorites next year as well.

Trofo

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Quote from: aoluain on December 05, 2021, 11:56:11 AM

Pressure is on now to Cilic while Medvedev has the comfort of knowing if he
looses they still have the doubles match. Very exciting really.

Don't agree with this. I see our doubles as slam dunk so the pressure is about equal. Medvedev knows if he looses they are probably done for. When you check the Russian team, good thing we don't play more singles matches. Russia still has Khachanov and Karatsev in the reserve, feels like they should win every single match in Davis cup.

aoluain

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Quote from: Trofo on December 05, 2021, 11:33:54 AM

Quote from: aoluain on December 05, 2021, 10:45:00 AM

First set to Russia ^Rublev 6-4

The moment of truth is now, second set is heading towards tie break and I feel like this is the time for Gojo to strike if ever. Rublev not showing any signs of breaking down so far. I am hoping for one unlucky point or something to throw him out of balance a bit.

I have some money riding on Medvedev -3.5 against Čilić and smaller bet on Croatia to win Davis cup. Will probably take our doubles team to win for high stake if I get the chance at anything over 1.4.

Ah in the end Rublev wind the first match, His service was excellent, winning 98% of
first serves. Gojo fought brilliantly and frustrated Rublev at times in that second set
to get it to a tie break but just more errors than Rublev.

Pressure is on now to Cilic while Medvedev has the comfort of knowing if he
looses they still have the doubles match. Very exciting really.

Trofo

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Quote from: aoluain on December 05, 2021, 10:45:00 AM

First set to Russia ^Rublev 6-4

The moment of truth is now, second set is heading towards tie break and I feel like this is the time for Gojo to strike if ever. Rublev not showing any signs of breaking down so far. I am hoping for one unlucky point or something to throw him out of balance a bit.

I have some money riding on Medvedev -3.5 against Čilić and smaller bet on Croatia to win Davis cup. Will probably take our doubles team to win for high stake if I get the chance at anything over 1.4.

aoluain

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We have a divided house here, I'm a big fan of Medvedev's while my wife would not,
so I have a small bet on Russia, herself is shouting for Croatia. yea if Croatia
win at least 1 singles match they have a superior chance of the in the doubles match.

First set to Russia ^Rublev 6-4

Daniel91

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So, the grand final between Russia and Croatia starts in 2 hours.
What are the expectations and predictions? Grin

It seems to me that Croatia has the advantage in doubles and the Russians in singles.
The formula for a possible surprising victory for Croatia against the favorites of Russia is that in addition to the expected victory in doubles, Cilic or Gojo must also win in singles, which will be very difficult.
However, this is the David Cup and all sorts of surprises are possible, as we already know from history Grin

aoluain

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Its not clear yet AFAIK who is playing first but I guess Its going to be Rublev v Gojo
and then Medvedev v Cilic. Should/Could Martic the Croatan captain choose to play
Cilic against Rublev and Gojo against Medvedev? Obviously Cilic would have a better
chance to win the first match against Rublev which would then bring the doubles into
play assuming Gojo canot beat Medvedev.

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Quote from: aoluain on December 04, 2021, 01:25:07 PM

It seems that the higher seeded player plays in the second match, Djokovic and Medvedev
for example played all their singles matches in the second one AFAIK.

I dont know if this is an automatic draw of the selection of the captains?

What is it with Medvedev and the Spanish audience? after his match today beating Struff
he seemed to be goading the audience who in turn were jeering him. He seems lately
to be getting on the wrong side of the audience.

Perhaps they don't like Medvedev that much? But I'm sure it's just the Spanish audience I reckon.

Medvedev is not known to have this players attitude so it's really quite surprising, maybe he is just playing with the crowd, that's it.

I think its not automatic draw but its boils down to the Captain's decision and it make sense because at least they will know where they are going to stand after the second match, it's either their top players can put them ahead for good or have a chance to recover and tie the score.

aoluain

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It seems that the higher seeded player plays in the second match, Djokovic and Medvedev
for example played all their singles matches in the second one AFAIK.

I dont know if this is an automatic draw of the selection of the captains?

What is it with Medvedev and the Spanish audience? after his match today beating Struff
he seemed to be goading the audience who in turn were jeering him. He seems lately
to be getting on the wrong side of the audience.

Trofo

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Quote from: Lucius on December 04, 2021, 07:10:24 AM

Quote from: Daniel91 on December 04, 2021, 06:42:49 AM

Even before the match between Croatia and Serbia, it was known that the first match between Gojo and Lajovic would be crucial for the victory.
It was already known in advance that the Serbs have little chance in doubles and that Cilic also has very little chance in the match against Djokovic.

If I'm not mistaken, the coaches decide who will play in which match - and then why didn't Dokovic play in the first match and secure the first point, and Cilic would probably lose to any Serbian player in this form - doubles would not matter. The Serbian underestimation of Borna Gojo and the tactics for Dokovic to beat Cilic and thus take Serbia to the finals hit them in the head just as they had not hoped.

Does not work like that. First player in one team plays first player in the other team always. No way to avoid Djokovic - Čilić match by that rules. I am not 100% sure but I think those first/second players position gets auto assigned after team nominates players for each match.

Even if Troicki could have chosen the other combination I am sure he would opt for Djoko - Čilić match every time. Čilić is actually not playing that bad, just has bad fortune that he has to play against players in top form and not important matches. Sinner and Djokovic are arguably top 5 of indoors tennis at the moment. Only Medvedev and Zverev can best them in these conditions on regular basis.

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Quote from: Jating on December 04, 2021, 05:59:54 AM

You are right mate, Gojo was the big surprise beating Lajovic in a come from behind fashion.

For those who watched him in a few matches before that, it was no surprise that he won - he is a very good player who is also in great shape.

Quote from: Daniel91 on December 04, 2021, 06:42:49 AM

Even before the match between Croatia and Serbia, it was known that the first match between Gojo and Lajovic would be crucial for the victory.
It was already known in advance that the Serbs have little chance in doubles and that Cilic also has very little chance in the match against Djokovic.

If I'm not mistaken, the coaches decide who will play in which match - and then why didn't Dokovic play in the first match and secure the first point, and Cilic would probably lose to any Serbian player in this form - doubles would not matter. The Serbian underestimation of Borna Gojo and the tactics for Dokovic to beat Cilic and thus take Serbia to the finals hit them in the head just as they had not hoped.

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Quote from: Jating on December 04, 2021, 05:59:54 AM

Quote from: Trofo on December 03, 2021, 05:40:03 AM

Quote from: aoluain on December 03, 2021, 04:06:00 AM

First of the semi's today Croatia v Serbia, second semi tomorrow Russia v Germany.

I think we all see this going to a Serbia v Russia final ...

I don't know what is the hype about Serbia. Yes they have a guaranteed point in Djoković but we also have a guaranteed point in doubles with Mektić/Pavić. Gojo is way down the ranking when compared to Krajinović but this is Davis cup and that is something different. Gojo already proved he is getting better and better as the stakes rise higher and he won both matches in Davis cup so far, one of them was against Sonego who is much better than Krajinović. Krajinović has lost all his Davis cup matches without getting a set. My bet is on Croatia @4.2 since I see this match as max 60:40 in favor of Serbia and that has lots of value for me.

Russia is my first favorite from the begging and I expect them to take the title.

You are right mate, Gojo was the big surprise beating Lajovic in a come from behind fashion.

And as expected, top-ranked Mate Pavic and Nikola Mektic beats Djokovic and partner Filip Krajinovic. First set was close, but the second? nah, forget about it.

So with this defeat, Djokovic closes his calendar not winning the Olympic gold and then the golden slam.

Yes but he bagged 4 Grand Slams this year and no doubt he will collect a few more
next year. I like the fact that he didnt win the Golden Slam or the Olympic Gold, I like
to see the younger generation coming up and a changing of the top 3 so they can
build their own history. The era of Nadal, Federer and Nadal is waning.

IMO 2022 promises so much with what I said above, Nadal and Federer should
be back and as eyes are on them a lot will be expected from the current top 10 or 5

Topic: Tennis League All Thread - page 338. (Read 203668 times)