Topic: The Blocksize Debate & Concerns - page 5. (Read 11181 times)

Interesting conclusion by Carlton that franky1 is either a superhuman or there's franky2. However, the thread went sideways. Time to get back to some relevant input.

This is correct for the majority of old people.

It is quite rare that older people are 'decent' with smartphones.

That is the case, especially for people who are not involved in IT. I'd say that modern computing has become very simplified for simple tasks and inexperienced users.

Maybe the design could be 'modernized', but aside from that I'd say that Bitcoin Core is a pretty simple wallet. Of course it has some advanced features, but regular users don't need to use those (the same applies for other wallets). If I were to recommend a wallet to someone that I know right now (who isn't tech-savy), I'd definitely take them on a route with SPV wallets first. Telling someone that they have to wait XX hours (for synchronization) and spend a lot of bandwidth and storage just to start using Bitcoin might turn them off.

lol

so if im in asia i have to speak asian?? or if im in australia i cant be a brit..

you are funny.

but its now become obvious you have run out of concerns about the blocksize debate. so have a nice day

now back to the topic at hand.

seeing as segwit needs 95% consensus. it might aswell be during this upgrade opportunity that the blocksize code is also added.. but as i said before having it only activate when safe to do so. EG when pools decide they can make such blocks and also when they are secure in the knowledge that there is enough users who have upgraded to 0.13 to ensure the blocks wont get rejected/orphaned.

Which means you've been posting since yesterday for ~19 hours straight!? hhhhmmmmmmmmmmmmm

Do you ever get any sleep? And if we are to believe your "different time zone right now" story, that puts you 9-10 hours ahead of GMT.... somewhere in South-East Asia?!?!? You speak South East Asian languages, then, huh Franky(s)? Come on, lie to me lol

Or are you an Australian posing as a Brit? Kiwi?

i know you have not left your basement in a while. but real people do this thing called "travel"..
you should try it.
you know go to different timezones, meet new people.
you might actually enjoy it..

... wait
you cant buy plane tickets with monero.. sorry i forgot.. i apologize for your lack of ability to travel due to the uselessness of your altcoin fascination.
but atleast i answered my own query about how you naively think people are stuck to a timezone they were born into.

but should you one day find a method to transfer your monero into a way to buy a plane ticket. i recommend going to a country with a bit of culture. it will help expand your mind beyond the small narrow experience you have currently had in that small corner of the world you live in.

as for my grammar, yea its called being an adult. some times i drink alcohol.
you will hopefully experience that in a couple years.

but nice try with your failed insults. its very much a shame that the only replies you can muster are not technical or logical or even factual.

but here is a smart idea.
how about address the topic properly. without a single insult. you might surprise yourself and actually have something valid to say for once.

anyway goodluck with your monero

Can you explain Franky2, er, I mean Franky1, how you managed to go to bed after 6:48am GMT, and then started posting again at 9:28 am GMT?


Did you get your full night's sleep, get up, do your 16 hour working day on a working day of the week (because you're just a regular English fella, remember?), then get on bitcointalk to post, all in less than 3 hours? hhhhhmmmmmmmmmmmmmmmmmmmmmm. hmmmmm.

Yep. It was you that attempting to suggest otherwise when you claimed ordinary users don't/can't use multi-sig: you've (that is, Franky 2, to be precise ) just spent another rambling paragraph explaining how your own rhetoric about LN being too complicated for normal users is BS. Ordinary users don't need to know how to use multi sig when the automated escrow takes care of it for them, huh?


I like your new, entirely different way of punctuating and arranging your sentences in posts, it's almost like you're a different "Franky". lol

seems that your over use of "payment channels" and "change amounts" goes to show you lack understanding of LN.

here is a simple lesson

2 nodes independently create a pub/priv keypair.
they then find each other to tell each other, only the public keys. they create a multisig address using them public keys and send that multisig address to each other to make sure they both calculated the keys to the same multisig properly.

then both users decide how much they want to "lock in" to the multisig by simply making an ONCHAIN transaction each to that multisig address.
this then becomes a combined pot of funds

then privately(offchain) they make a new transaction using the multisig funds to pay out what they owe eachother. once the values are agreed they both sign it and both keep a copy privately (not transmitted to the public blockchain)

which is why i laughed when you said "change amounts". because its not "change", its more the case of withdrawal, or just payment.

then on different occasions they can just renegotiate who owes what and make a new transaction to pay out what they owe eachother, once agreed its signed and the previously private held transaction is dropped and this new tx is held as the most current one.

in short if you take away all the buzzwords.. its simply automated escrow.

Why not ask gmaxwell yourself about plans to use Schnorr signatures, MAST scripts (and god knows how many other efforts he leads in crypto-coin research) to improve privacy and scalability even further? If Greg or Lukejr or Pieter Wuille or any of these other bete noires of yours are such bankster collborators, how come everything they're doing looks like cutting edge privacy work/carefully engineered network scaling to every other expert in the field? Even to Gavin Andresen? Oh no, that's right, pre-eminient world renowned cryptography and network software engineer Franky1 doesn't agree, because PwC funding?



Incidentally Franky, how does this happen, explain:

Franky1 Re: The Blocksize Debate & Concerns
Today at 06:48:17 AM



Franky1 Re: The Blocksize Debate & Concerns
Today at 09:22:36 AM




How come you're already up and out of bed? I thought you were "just an ordinary English bloke"? Let's be honest (or at least realistic), one of the other Frankys with access to the Franky1 account took the reins while the other Franky gets a little rest. Shall I call you Franky2? lol

LN handles all the payment channels without user intervention, to the lay user a transaction will look even simpler than today, as any change amounts or channel activity won't be directly exposed unless the user really wants to look, it's not going to make sense to an uninformed observer. Do you think that might be why you're so capable of understanding it, Franky? The uninformed part?

your words apply to you and your buddies. you are either well aware of it and trying to distract people from seeing it too with your bait and switch tactics.. or your too devoted to look beyond your blind faith of corporate dominance

please ask gmaxwell what are the terms and conditions of releasing the next tranche of FIAT funding

have a nice day

ROFLMAO Franky, you're now researching: me


You're just one such example of someone claiming to represent the "real" Bitcoin, Franky. But you're right of course: Core is the closest thing there is to official Bitcoin. In fact, IT IS THE OFFICAL BITCOIN YOU MORON. Remember, you and your buddies want that to change so the system is in permanent conflict?


Because there is only one set of consensus rules in the client, and you and your big banking buddies desperately want those rules to change, because your money system is in danger of losing alot of important markets (contraband, remittance, offshore banking etc). I mean, does anyone out there seriously expect the most well established and profitable form of gangsterism not to fight back against it's new competitor? Well, Franky and his friends (read: sockpuppets) are that fightback.

You trolling fuck, you know entirely well that I'm separating out PoW from economic forces as multiple mechnanisms exactly what you're describing when you say "indirect economic forces". Those are mechanisms too. And they're the same mechanisms that have stopped your 2MB2MB2MB bullshit.



You're the troll supreme: arguing that black is white, and simultaneously black. "PoW is the only mechanism....... uh, except all the other ones. It's the only one! As well as the others! IT'S THE ONLY MECHANISM! oh, but others exist too"

atleast your in agreement that LN wont be a big deal and that not everyone will need or have to use it, but if it was to be used widely then it needs to become simple.
after all it took 30 years for computers to become simplified down from needing a command prompt. to being just a swipe of a finger.

bitcoin is not yet in the same simplicity stage as swiping a screen. and that is why people will be relying on 3rd parties too much. because their GUI is better than the full desktop locally stored privkey/seed versions

Let's be honest, the old people will never jump 100% into new tech, it just doesnt work that way.

Only the young people have a chance to learn something completely new and use it in their lives.

I didnt seen any old people using smartphones, heck most of them dont even have phones.

Technology just progresses too fast for people to keep up with.

However the modern PC has been around for 30 years, so that should not be a very hard step to take.

---

The wallets are simple, they only have buttons, menus and texboxes, who is so dumb that cant figure that out?

You dont need the console, nor multisig for the average user. They just want to send and receive money.

Most of these smart contracts and advanced features will only be used by 1-2% of users, the rest of them will stay basic.

the challenge bitcoin "wallets" have is the "give it to your grandma and see if she calls you all hours of the day" test
now thats how simple bitcoin needs to be.

EG LN is coming soon. so making a multisig really does need to become like childsplay. or more precise, grannies 'bridge' play..
telling someone they need to log into a forum and ask a community for support. is not something that should be advertised as what makes bitcoin great.

bitcoin wallet providers (offline ones of course) need to up their game otherwise people wont waste a couple days searching forums. they would rather sign up to crap like exchanges to "manage" the funds... far before signing up to a forum

firstly that was the golden promise of december 2015.. but in recent months that has been backtracked. even carlton has shown that lukejr and core and blockstream are pretending it was never a guarantee.

anyway, those academics..

lol "2mb is bad" right??
but 2.8 good?
but 2.8 good?
but 2.7 good?
but 2.7 good?
but 2.8 good?

here ill give you some info..
people livestream their online gaming sessions while in a VOIP with their friends and also narrating to viewers of the livestream and i dont hear complaints from youtube or twitch or livestream that the internet isnt good enough for uploads

but here goes.. doomsday bottom of the line internet users..

0.5mbit upload = 37.5mBYTE per 10 minutes.
so even at a minimum. a low level node can have a couple connections without issue.
but we all know those who want to be full dedicated nodes will have better internet than the minimum.

as for the validation processing..
bitcoin works fine on a v1 raspberry Pi.. guess what raspberry Pi has evolved.. so even using raspberry Pi as a baseline benchmark, it can cope.
even with the stuff like libsecp256k1 makes the baseline rasberry Pi happy.
but if having the other stuff aswell as the blocklimit all combined into 0.13.. then its all good

What's the point?

When I first downloaded electrum ,i figured out to use it in 2 minutes, with no tutorial or any other documentation.

Maybe it's just because I have an IQ of 141, and with an IQ of 70 it's really hard to figure out how stuff works.

But i think its very very simple. I do know to code a little, and i am somewhat experienced with PC interface, but so do most people, especially younger folks.

Any person with half a brain can really learn it in max 1-2 days, even if they are totally new. There are tutorials, helpful people on this forum, and the official documentation if you want to dig deeper.

There is really no excuse for not learning it, its so basic, you dont need a diploma.

But I just see that there are many dumb people in the world that are as intelligent as a stone, but i hope that bitcoin and other decentralized projects will teach people to be more familiar with open source software and digital stuff.

Well if you put it like that, maybe. The main website does talk about block size limit increase, but to my knowledge its currently debated.

https://bitcoincore.org/en/2015/12/23/capacity-increases-faq/

Many engineers and academics have come out and said that blocksize increase is not feasable. But we need more research on this.

we understand the sentements and we would all love to get our relatives to use bitcoin locally instead of centrally. but its still not user friendly.
even things like microsoft office have a little tutorial. and bitcoin needs to be more user friendly and more intuitive than microsoft word.

EG not needing to use commands to dump privkey. probably even renaming it from "wallet" to "key ring". making it automatically taught that the most important thing is the private key/seed.

did you not get the memo.. for segwit to really succeed it requires pools to be using it, otherwise they wont add a segwit transaction to their block attempts.
yea once its in a block non-upgrades can look passed it. but to actually get segwit transactions into a block, requires pools to fully validate the transaction and accept it.
and thats why it is now become public that mining pools need to show 95% acceptance to upgrade. and ofcourse why blockstream is blackmailing them if they dont accept..
so while there is a 95% requirement for an upgrade and a X week time period for the other 5%.. you might aswell take that perfect opportunity to add the hard fork code..
after all fullnodes will want to be full nodes after an upgrade anyway.

and even better.. once the codebase has been upgraded. the actual USAGE(activation) of features such as segwit and a bump in the blocksize can actually be set for whenever they like. EG segwit 2 weeks and blocklimit 6 months.. knowing that it only require people to download 0.13 to get both, rather than 0.13 and later a re-run of consensus to get 0.14 going.. where your own argument begins again with 0.14.

its simple logic, and requires no blackmail. just put in the code but if afraid of it not being "secure" have the blocklimit bump delayed a bit longer.. but atleast have the code publicly available soon/now so there is no controversy. and lots of time to check it over

as i said and many others have said its only a controversy if its not available. make it available and the only thing left to cry about is the timing of activation.