Topic: The root causes of mental illness - page 4. (Read 4643 times)

I'm off for the evening.  I will gladly respond to all posts tomorrow

Really liked this post, especially the level 2 paragraph at the end.  Reminds of of Eckhart Tolle's "You are not your mind.  You are the observer behind your mind."  This was a good example, at least in the sense that I had an "Aha!" moment reading it

I'm still not seeing the point of all this.

One could say that a child feels pain when he tries to move his broken arm because of his desire to move the arm and that he could avoid pain by learning not to want to move his arm but that would be asinine.

The only thing blaming "desire" accomplishes is to obscure the cause and effect relationship between the infliction of trauma and the resulting dysfunction. It's a way of letting the perpetrators escape recognition for what they have done.

Good question.

To clarify, I'm not saying that desire itself is to blame, for each person has the choice of whether to follow that desire (and thus perpetuate it) or work to overcome that desire (and thus decrease the intensity and frequency with which it arises).

The nature of desire is that it can never be fulfilled.  Take sex or drugs for example.  The desire to use drugs (and then actually using them) tends to increase the desire to use drugs.  The desire to have sex (and then actually going out and trying to get or having it) tends to increase the desire to have sex.

Desire itself is intentional whether it is conscious or unconscious desire.  And, because it is intentional, it can be systematically increased or decreased by chasing after the object of desire or letting go of the object of desire respectively (attachment vs. detachment).

How is blaming "desire" for the problem not merely an avoidance mechanism to deprive the abuser of both agency and accountability?

Ok, but let's break down what you said.

1)  Why did the damage occur to the brain?  Was it the act of abuse alone that damaged the brain, independent of anything else?  Was there in fact something else that caused the damage?  Was it a combination of things?

Science and evidence also shows us that the beliefs and thoughts we have have indirect and direct changes on brain and body.  Indirectly, this can be through intention.  For example, the thought of wanting to smoke marijuana --> leads to intention and action of smoking marijuana -- > leads to effects on the brain which can be damaging over time.

Directly, thoughts can also have an impact on the brain/body.  The most obvious example would be thinking of moving your arm and then actually doing it.  Next, try focusing on a positive word like "love" or "happiness" for hours on end and you will feel the effects of more efficient dopamine transmission.  Studies have also shown that the muscles of those who mentally imagined themselves performing a workout routine received about 30% the amount of stimulation that they would have received had they actually physically performed the same workout routine.  This gives credence to the idea that if a person simply believes they have been damaged, then the damage can manifest itself physically.

2)  Also consider the event from the offenders point of view.  The offender commited said abuse through some combination of the 3 root causes I mentioned as well, especially desire.  Now, as I have already pointed out that nature-vs.-nurture is a false dichotomy, then his desire will have its consequences on the environment as well as himself.  In other words, the root causes of mental illness as manifested in one person can cause negative effects on the environment, including other people.  This is how community psychology functions, and there truly are such things as "sick" and "healing" communities.

That's one way to look at it or you could use science and evidence and actually see the damage done to the brain on an MRI. Now that we have the tools to see it we know a brain injury caused by repeated verbal abuse is just as real as a broken arm caused by physical abuse.

Actually, I think it's based primarily and fundamentally on root cause #3 that I listed (i.e. identifying with a false sense of concept), and that this one little/huge mistake leads to virtually everything else.  Although, I also think that this mistake is not entirely our 'fault' as it is something that also has been passed down as a 'predisposition' of sorts through countless generations.

Excellent question.  I would respond as follows:

First, I remember in my undergraduate psychology class a study we reviewed in class with our professor.  This study studied the effects of child abuse on children of various ages.  I truly need to find this study again as I've brought it up in many conversations, but the results of the study indicated that if the abuse occurred before a certain age (specifically, before the time of memory formation or concrete identity formation) then the negative effects of this abuse were minimized to some degree.  While the brain naturally and continually forms associations of the world, it can do so consciously or unconsciously.  As a result, while these early-abused children may still grow up with feelings and associations that the world is a more dangerous and stressful place relative to children who were not abused at all, there was less internalization of the abuse relative to children who were abused at later ages because a concrete concept of identity had not formed yet.  

Second, I contend there is a difference between pain and suffering.  For example, let's say you break your arm.  Obviously, this is painful and this pain can be experienced.  But, I contend that suffering comes from subsequent mental processes such as "now that I've broken my arm, I cannot do x, y, and z, in the future and so my future will be bad."  Relating this to child or sexual abuse, the actual event of abuse is temporary, and while this event can be extraordinarily painful, it is from the following mental processes that mental suffering occurs.  Please do not mistake me for being insensitive to those who have experienced this kind of trauma.  I am in no way saying that the negative associations formed from such an experience are easy to overcome; I am simply trying to provide a logical understanding of mental illnesses themselves.

Third, the preceding 2 paragraphs encompass elements of all 3 root causes that I listed.  For example, the person who has experienced child abuse likely desires that the abuse never happened.  This incorporates both the dissatisfaction associated with desire itself as well as wanting to control things that are beyond that person's control (i.e. to change a past event).  Finally, I would contend that the 3rd root cause, identifying with a false concept of identity, is also present.  Who was abused?  This can be analyzed on 2 levels:

Level 1:  Who was abused?  If you were the child that was being abused, are you still the child and are you still being abused?

Level 2:  If you are an observer, and you observe yourself as having the body of the child that was abused, then were you even abused?  (I.e. was the 'observer' abused?)  This is the hardest concept to grasp.  If I, the observer (the subject) can witness my body (an object), my thoughts (objects), or pain/discomfort (objects), then this implies that I am not any of these observed things.  In other words, I contend that I as an observer cannot possibly be my body, my pain, or my thoughts because I am observing them.  The things that I observe are "over there."

What about child abuse?

I have boiled down the root causes of mental illness to 3 things; feedback and comments/challenges are encouraged.

1)  Desire (I'll go with the Buddha on this one)
2)  Attempting to control things that are beyond one's control (an offshoot of desire)
3)  Identification with a false concept of identity.

Brief explanations:

1)  Desire:  Whenever a person has any type of desire, it implies that they are dissatisfied with what currently 'is.'  Dissatisfaction implies discontent and a lack of happiness.  If you want something that you don't currently have, this is a problem.

2)  Attempting to control things that are beyond one's control:  This is one of the leading causes of anxiety, anger, etc.  How often do we define our own happiness according to the actions of other people, communities, governments, girlfriends/boyfriends, husbands/wives, etc.?  How often do we become frustrated when our attempts to change these people, communities, governments, etc. fail?

3)  Identification with a false concept of identity:  Who are you?  How did you reach that conclusion?  According to all 11 definitions of identity in Webster's Dictionary, identity implies stability over time.  Yet, how often do we identity/define ourselves conditionally?  For example, let's say that someone says, "I am a teacher."  Ok, great.  Now, if your job is in jeopardy, then your identity is also in jeopardy!  Now, in contrast, how many would have answered this question by saying "I am an observer"?  For, as long as we live, we observe.

Note:  I would expect one of the most common challenges to these assertions would be, "Well, what about chemical imbalances?  What about genetic predispositions?"  To this, I would remind everyone that environment vs. genes (i.e. nature vs. nurture) is a false dichotomy.  It is known scientifically that interactions with our environment has effects on the genome which are then passed down and inherited generation by generation.  Thus, I would assert that any 'genetic predispositions' for a mental illness are the results of the 3 root causes that I listed to begin with, but in previous generations.