Unfair aspects of KYC. But KYP is here

Reid

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Quote from: dothebeats on March 04, 2020, 10:26:46 AM

KYP does not solve the issue of companies being careless with the data we provide them.

What consumers need is a transparent way of how companies treat our data, or eat least penalties severe enough for the companies in order for them to get scared should our data get leaked, sold or misused in any way or form. Provider details are usually seen on their whois, and could be followed-up on a trip to the government agencies responsible for registering them--that is if legal action is needed or whatnot.

Knowing the faces of those who run the show does not provide any guarantee that our data will not be compromised.

This explanations is like the shallow of all. Some are really deep that I could not understand it anymore.
Well, thank you for that.

First time I heard about KYP and I am still curious about how far it could go.
KYC though is something which is really scary for most of us users here specially if we are leaving our currencies in exchanges.
This is also why there are a lot of members here who always tell to not leave it for a long time in exchanges specially those who are registered to them with all the information.

Transparency and privacy. Could this two be married? I don't think so.
They cannot show how the privacy is being done. That is why it is private.
But if explained in a way that would only be understood by those who studied it like programming then not much people would care.
So how?

zasad@

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I constantly meet topics about KYC, the most useful thoughts and facts can be found in this thread

Why KYC is extremely dangerous – and useless
https://bitcointalksearch.org/topic/why-kyc-is-extremely-dangerous-and-useless-5221497

charlesmichel1

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I hate KYC. This is the thing that makes exchanges examples of banks for the cryptocurrency market. Crypto is about privacy, but KYC eliminates it.
It's sad that KYC verification becomes obligatory.

thesmallgod

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I am just wondering what the customers will request as KYP. Probably some of the things they have provided on the website or a kind of paper documentation and legal information. I understand quietly well in this evolving crypto space that providers are becoming smarter and this is the reason why many of them will tell you they are registered in one country on an island that is difficult to confirm on the internet. Just the way so many scam betting site will tell you they have their license from some shithole domicile

gabbie2010

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Quote from: gantez on March 04, 2020, 07:32:11 AM

Quote from: USBitcoinServices.Com on March 03, 2020, 01:50:16 PM

The crypto community is made of smart people (...most of them) and this challenge could be achieved easily if we really care about fairness, get organized and work together on this common goal. Crypto itself is already showing fairness with the use of blockchain.

This is simply the reasonable point. The crypto world is for smart people and asking people for identity information without providing theirs first isn't the best way about it. Cryptocurrency has provided decentralized measures already so if someone wants a personal information, should also provide theirs too. That shows fairness.

In fairness most of these KYC is necessitated because of some nefarious activities perpetuated by some bad elements hiding under cryptosphere, of course without any doubt decentralization is good however it is also necessary to get some sort of information of owners of huge amount of crypto assets transansacted to ascertain it purpose whether for good or bad particularly money launderers who disguise to sponsor terrorism.

FanEagle

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You do have a good idea, but you should as well understand that there are reasons why KYC is important to Businesses. Rightfully businesses should be transparent with their customers and make them understand that they should be trusted. I don’t take interest in any business that is not transparent and keeps hiding things from their customers.

As for businesses like exchanges , they should provide information on their page about their CEO, and other Executives, and also an information about their location. If they are going to be asking customers for KYC, then they should fulfil their own part by doing these that I have mentioned. That way we can know for sure that they can be trusted to a certain level.

bitbunnny

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There are good sides and bad sides of everything, so that applies to KYC too. But the idea and intention of KYC is good and it really helps to protect users from different kind of abuse and scam and honest users don't need to fear it.
Also, we don't need to fear that KYC is violating our privacy and abuse our personal data. Some incidents are always possible but then we know who is reliable and what are the responsibilities and how you can be legaly protected.

ecnalubma

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Privacy really depends on users wether they stay anonymous in crypto space or become fully compliant with the regulations. Providing this could be a win-win situation for both parties if it’s pushed in this type of industry, all projects should undergoe in this type of process to be legally accepted not just in the government but also in the society.

shield132

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Quote from: avikz on March 03, 2020, 01:59:02 PM

In crypto market, it makes sense! Otherwise, in real world, we usually know the service providers and obtain their KYP details easily! But in crypto market, the scope is usually much larger because crypto companies usually cater to the global client base.

Most importantly, it should be mandatory for all types of ICOs, ITOs or STOs because they get funded by common mass. So KYP is particularly useful in crypto market.

But in real world, such details are usually available in the public domain. So KYP would not bring much change there!

Not only in crypto market but overall, online websites that offer some services and ask you for KYC should be somehow verified. For example imagine I found casino "blabla" and register there, it asks me for KYC to withdraw money, there should be one legit website run by government or etc that should verify whether website is actually legit or not. But there are no such services while any website can freely ask you for KYC documents. We should implement something like this not only in crypto world but on every website that asks for KYC.
Also there must be pictures and basic informations about the owners of particular websites that request KYC from you. It's 100% legitimate to know whom you send your documents.

el kaka22

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I wouldn't actually mind if all the information of these companies are public and shared with everyone on some third party organization. Think about it, if we could get headquarters, offices, information about the owners and the teams, basically all we need to know about these companies that can be proved to us, that would actually make things a lot more trustworthy.

On top of that if these companies ever gets "hacked" or whatever they are and lose everyone's money, they should be held reliable and since everyone would know who they are and where they are from and all of the information regarding the ownership, we could sue them a lot easier with people who live on the same nation as those people could file a lawsuit as well. It would make things a lot safer if you ask me.

Xampeuu

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Quote from: Tylev on March 05, 2020, 12:22:56 AM

This problem really exists today. However, it should soon be resolved by further regulating the circulation of cryptocurrency by states. We do not need to request KYC from all participants in the cryptocurrency market. Legal entities working with cryptocurrency must be registered with the relevant state bodies, and, if necessary, obtain a license for this type of activity. This will drastically reduce the level of fraud in this market. Individuals will only need to undergo a KYC check if the amount of the transaction sent exceeds one thousand euros. This complies with the FATF recommendations of June 21 last year.

right, with regulations governed by the state, then narrowing down the space for fraudsters to carry out the action. if like now, many fraud projects because there are no legal sanctions for them, so they are free to move and worsen the image of cryptocurrency, especially for new investors who have not enough knowledge

Tylev

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This problem really exists today. However, it should soon be resolved by further regulating the circulation of cryptocurrency by states. We do not need to request KYC from all participants in the cryptocurrency market. Legal entities working with cryptocurrency must be registered with the relevant state bodies, and, if necessary, obtain a license for this type of activity. This will drastically reduce the level of fraud in this market. Individuals will only need to undergo a KYC check if the amount of the transaction sent exceeds one thousand euros. This complies with the FATF recommendations of June 21 last year.

fiulpro

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Very interesting aspect at the same time one should understand that , Companies use reviews as marketin , they feel if they are on the internet and been there for a long long time they do not need to provide anything for the consumers.

Just like it's written on every Bank's note * bank is responsible for paying the user and stuff like that * I think if the companies actually starts using it in the time being it would make people more confident in them .

wheelz1200

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Quote from: USBitcoinServices.Com on March 03, 2020, 01:50:16 PM

Should the whole crypto community vote and get organized in order to ask third parties also have their own version of KYC? in this case clients should ask for KYP (Know your providers). And please if you are going to comment that the third parties already did their part by registering legally with their authorities, please think twice before mentioning that, because they did that part but only to comply with government and not to benefit customers, so far that is not benefiting the clients.

On the customer side, this one has to comply with the government and additionally with these third parties via KYC. It is unfair that third parties asking for KYC are not providing customers in the same way with the same info they request.

The crypto community is made of smart people (...most of them) and this challenge could be achieved easily if we really care about fairness, get organized and work together on this common goal. Crypto itself is already showing fairness with the use of blockchain.

We know that many people don't like the KYC process, because it is unfair, thus why the existence of privacy cryptocurrencies which will play a great work very soon with the decentralization of trust, money, internet, decentralizing anything you can imagine.

You can already do that. If they dont provide you with enough information that you feel comfortable with then dont use their service, it's really that easy. The more access you have to them, the more access they will have to you. That is the risk reward tradeoff each person needs to decide for themselves.

Harlot

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Are people just acting like they are dumb right now? Or they don't really know what they are talking about? Projects and Organizations in the crypto industry may now have the same KYC version as us customers and investors but they do provide some of their baclground enough for us to know them well. What I'm talking about is the project's whitepaper, website , amd live events this is your only way to do background checks from them to see if the company is really legit or not baside from knowing their legal permits and documentation. So really it's up to you as a investor to do background checks on your own and get to know them well.

Linkkoin

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Quote from: Philipma1957cellphone on March 03, 2020, 02:52:38 PM

Kyc is here.to stay. It is one of.many tactics used by many governments to attack all coins

Not coins, but monitoring literally all the financial transactions - so then no tax is left unpaid, and no one has a potential for money laundering. And if you make it more Orwell/Brave New World-style, if authorities are able to track all your transaction, they can check whole your life (can be by AI systems). If you buy too much of alcohol with your card, they will classify you automatically as an alcoholic and send you automatically for rehab or take your children. Or if you buy too much fast food, you will be forced to pay twice as much for healthcare.

tvplus006

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Quote from: enhu on March 04, 2020, 10:39:54 AM

There is no escape to KYC anymore even if you have the KYP, our data are compromise already the moment you submit it to any exchange you have registered. At some point you will have to use an exchange or cash out your coins and banks are asking it. Its here to stay even for the DEX that we thought aren't going to ask KYC. Not all though so there's a little hope to stay anon.

I have long refused to pass the KIK on Binance, which must be passed in order to participate in the lottery held for IEO. Although I am not a supporter of KYC, I still decided to pass verification on the exchange. Such conditions are set by the exchange to its participants, fulfilling the requirements of the government. And it's not just Binance that makes These demands , so there's nowhere to go .

enhu

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There is no escape to KYC anymore even if you have the KYP, our data are compromise already the moment you submit it to any exchange you have registered. At some point you will have to use an exchange or cash out your coins and banks are asking it. Its here to stay even for the DEX that we thought aren't going to ask KYC. Not all though so there's a little hope to stay anon.

dothebeats

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KYP does not solve the issue of companies being careless with the data we provide them.

What consumers need is a transparent way of how companies treat our data, or eat least penalties severe enough for the companies in order for them to get scared should our data get leaked, sold or misused in any way or form. Provider details are usually seen on their whois, and could be followed-up on a trip to the government agencies responsible for registering them--that is if legal action is needed or whatnot.

Knowing the faces of those who run the show does not provide any guarantee that our data will not be compromised.

gantez

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Quote from: USBitcoinServices.Com on March 03, 2020, 01:50:16 PM

The crypto community is made of smart people (...most of them) and this challenge could be achieved easily if we really care about fairness, get organized and work together on this common goal. Crypto itself is already showing fairness with the use of blockchain.

This is simply the reasonable point. The crypto world is for smart people and asking people for identity information without providing theirs first isn't the best way about it. Cryptocurrency has provided decentralized measures already so if someone wants a personal information, should also provide theirs too. That shows fairness.

Topic: Unfair aspects of KYC. But KYP is here (Read 234 times)