URGENT: drop MTGOX class action lawyers! contact WSJ about their lies URGENT! - page 2.

borninvinsible

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Quote from: Nagle on April 30, 2014, 02:31:04 PM

Quote from: DrApricot on April 29, 2014, 02:15:09 PM

Actually, Sunlot's offer is not economically rational unless they have some kind of inside knowledge that the still missing 650,000 bitcoins are very likely to be soon recovered.

That's exactly it.

1. The Sunlot deal gives them 84% of any missing assets that turn up later.
2. They're in talks with Karpeles.
3. The original founders of Mt. Gox are involved.

So they probably do know where the missing assets are.

This deal needs to be put on hold until the bankruptcy trustee and the Tokyo police have had more time to find the money. The trustee has only had a week of being in charge at this point.

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https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=kWOSy30NxCQ

The truth will come out --- it always does....with experts involved I would think that unraveling what happened will be easy - time is on our side the cause is just..- theres no dark web --- if those expert black hats think they have somewhere to hide they dont ...

Bit_Happy

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A Great Time to Start Something!

Quote from: Nagle on April 30, 2014, 02:31:04 PM

Quote from: DrApricot on April 29, 2014, 02:15:09 PM

Actually, Sunlot's offer is not economically rational unless they have some kind of inside knowledge that the still missing 650,000 bitcoins are very likely to be soon recovered.

That's exactly it.

1. The Sunlot deal gives them 84% of any missing assets that turn up later.
2. They're in talks with Karpeles.
3. The original founders of Mt. Gox are involved.

So they probably do know where the missing assets are.

This deal needs to be put on hold until the bankruptcy trustee and the Tokyo police have had more time to find the money. The trustee has only had a week of being in charge at this point.

What am mess:
The modern court system is truly FUBAR, how does "the system" ever get radically better?

Nagle

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Quote from: DrApricot on April 29, 2014, 02:15:09 PM

Actually, Sunlot's offer is not economically rational unless they have some kind of inside knowledge that the still missing 650,000 bitcoins are very likely to be soon recovered.

That's exactly it.

1. The Sunlot deal gives them 84% of any missing assets that turn up later.
2. They're in talks with Karpeles.
3. The original founders of Mt. Gox are involved.

So they probably do know where the missing assets are.

This deal needs to be put on hold until the bankruptcy trustee and the Tokyo police have had more time to find the money. The trustee has only had a week of being in charge at this point.

V.Kodoff

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The Skin GURU/We all love the abused trust system

If any of you like to start case against MtGox in court (Japanese/European) feel free to contact us via pm.

borninvinsible

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This pattern of exchanges going under than finding a few coins its a convenient fraud. I am glad the good guys will investigate the exchange MTgox hopefully they will arrest some bad guys - gangsters criminals and peados/// . Sunlot infomation makes everyone much more aware of the background of these people. Its all there....Bitcoin brings only bad news....My trade is over I put in what I could lose - made a raise tried to cash out the best way without fraud and meeting more freaks...lets wait til 2015 ....I think those who were verified will get something back ...besides who cares if we dont....the story teaches us more about the world , security and who really the good guys are...

btcusury

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Quote from: Aquent on April 30, 2014, 11:35:49 AM

"After that, if the facts do not change, there is sufficient evidence to apply for an injunction ordering the US Government to release the seized property."

If gov seized the btc, where are they on the blockchain?

We have (apparently) found most of them on the blockchain, we just don't know who has the private keys (FBI, Karpeles, hackers, lost...).

Aquent

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"After that, if the facts do not change, there is sufficient evidence to apply for an injunction ordering the US Government to release the seized property."

If gov seized the btc, where are they on the blockchain?

DrApricot

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Quote from: superduh on April 30, 2014, 01:49:37 AM

and exactly how would either Jap or American gov agency get access to any of their bitcoins without Mark handing them over to them (legall or illegally to be seen)

MK never said the disappeared bitcoins had changed hands, but merely that they were inaccessible. If true, then that could mean a lot of things such as were he ever to touch those ones in the cold wallets, he'd be locked up or worse. Viewed from that angle, the 200,000 BTC found in the "old-format" wallet could be kind of a limited hangout.
_{(According to Wikipedia, that is a public relations or propaganda technique that involves the release of previously hidden information in order to prevent a greater exposure of more important details.)}

I agree with Bit_Happy that there are way too many unanswered questions. MK could be a secret agent man, or maybe just an innocent guy (patsy) with a tiger by the tail.

Bit_Happy

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A Great Time to Start Something!

Quote from: DrApricot on April 30, 2014, 01:27:00 AM

Quote

Quote from: Bit_Happy

> I think there is a chance it's a massive theft by a Gov agency, with Mark K as either an unlikely looking secret agent or patsy in grave danger.

I'd like to believe that NO government agency in the U.S. or Japan would ever stoop so low, yet until now the only charge they have been able to make stick to MK is that he is more or less of a bumbling idiot. After 9/11, that was the same excuse used for why they couldn't stop it before it happened, "we were incompetent".

However, a far simpler explanation than theft is merely that this is a cover-up to avoid having to take the blame for having collapsed Mt. Gox. That's more than enough reason to pass this hot potato.

There are way too many unanswered questions.

Quote from: superduh on April 30, 2014, 01:49:37 AM

and exactly how would either Jap or American gov agency get access to any of their bitcoins without Mark handing them over to them (legall or illegally to be seen)

An unlikely looking secret agent would complete his assignment and hand over the ~$1/2 Billion worth of BTC (with a future value much higher)
^^^
I didn't say I believe that, but it is possible.

superduh

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and exactly how would either Jap or American gov agency get access to any of their bitcoins without Mark handing them over to them (legall or illegally to be seen)

DrApricot

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Activity: 238

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Quote

Quote from: Bit_Happy

> I think there is a chance it's a massive theft by a Gov agency, with Mark K as either an unlikely looking secret agent or patsy in grave danger.

I'd like to believe that NO government agency in the U.S. or Japan would ever stoop so low, yet until now the only charge they have been able to make stick to MK is that he is more or less of a bumbling idiot. After 9/11, that was the same excuse used for why they couldn't stop it before it happened, "we were incompetent".

However, a far simpler explanation than theft is merely that this is a cover-up to avoid having to take the blame for having collapsed Mt. Gox. That's more than enough reason to pass this hot potato.

Bit_Happy

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A Great Time to Start Something!

Quote from: DrApricot on April 30, 2014, 12:46:16 AM

Quote

Quote from: DrApricot
I am not in a position to know how much fact is behind this rumour of seizure and gagging, yet the case Tuck lays out certainly sounds quite convincing and worthy of further consideration.

Quote from: Bit_Happy
> Why would they seize so many BTC, compared to what was actually used for Silk Road?

I am not really in any position to say, but suppose the plan was to make everyone identify themselves before having their BTC returned?

That's the sort of thing that usually happens in an asset seizure--you have to explain where you got the assets, prove that they are yours--and not part of some illicit activities.

The organization(s) behind the seizure may have completely underestimated the amount of political fallout of investor dissatisfaction from a seizure of this magnitude, and are now engaged in a CYA operation. That's my SWAG on it, but I'm sure there are other equally likely scenarios or even more so.

I think there is a chance it's a massive theft by a Gov agency, with Mark K as either an unlikely looking secret agent or patsy in grave danger.

DrApricot

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Quote

Quote from: DrApricot
I am not in a position to know how much fact is behind this rumour of seizure and gagging, yet the case Tuck lays out certainly sounds quite convincing and worthy of further consideration.

Quote from: Bit_Happy
> Why would they seize so many BTC, compared to what was actually used for Silk Road?

I am not really in any position to say, but suppose the plan was to make everyone identify themselves before having their BTC returned?

That's the sort of thing that usually happens in an asset seizure--you have to explain where you got the assets, prove that they are yours--and not part of some illicit activities.

The organization(s) behind the seizure may have completely underestimated the amount of political fallout of investor dissatisfaction from a seizure of this magnitude, and are now engaged in a CYA operation. That's my SWAG on it, but I'm sure there are other equally likely scenarios or even more so.

Bit_Happy

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A Great Time to Start Something!

Quote from: DrApricot on April 29, 2014, 11:35:07 PM

Quote

Quote from: DrApricot on April 29, 2014, 07:15:09 PM

>> much better offers can be made

Actually, Sunlot's offer is not economically rational unless they have some kind of inside knowledge that the still missing 650,000 bitcoins are very likely to be soon recovered.

Quote

Quote from: btcusury on April 29, 2014, 07:15:09

That's exactly what I think. Although not necessarily inside knowledge -- it could be just an understanding of a high probability of finding the missing BTC. If you assume Karpeles is an incompetent idiot rather than a fraudster, you can take his IRC statement seriously that the BTC are "not technically lost, just temporarily unavailable".

Actually, there is entirely another possibility that at least partly exonerates MK. There has been a persistent rumour that the Mt. Gox losses were not merely the result of malfeasance on the part of the operators of the exchange, but rather came from a bitcoin seizure and gag order by one or more government agencies. These could either be Japanese or American agencies, or both--working in tandem. This is possibly being done as part of a prosecution against a very few of Mt. Gox's customers who may be guilty of some crimes.

I refer you to an excellent report by Tuck Fheman

Gov Most Certainly Seized Gox’s Coins
http://tuckfheman.com/post/79681539135/report-gov-most-certainly-seized-goxs-coins

The report is dated March 15, 2014, and in it Tuck states his belief that the U.S. government is behind the seizure. Were this true, it seems equally likely that the Japanese authorities are somehow involved too, if not completely behind it. He calls for an "injunction ordering the US Government to release the seized property" by May 16.

I am not in a position to know how much fact is behind this rumour of seizure and gagging, yet the case Tuck lays out certainly sounds quite convincing and worthy of further consideration.

Why would they seize so many BTC, compared to what was actually used for Silk Road?

DrApricot

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Activity: 238

Merit: 100

Quote

Quote from: DrApricot on April 29, 2014, 07:15:09 PM

>> much better offers can be made

Actually, Sunlot's offer is not economically rational unless they have some kind of inside knowledge that the still missing 650,000 bitcoins are very likely to be soon recovered.

Quote

Quote from: btcusury on April 29, 2014, 07:15:09

That's exactly what I think. Although not necessarily inside knowledge -- it could be just an understanding of a high probability of finding the missing BTC. If you assume Karpeles is an incompetent idiot rather than a fraudster, you can take his IRC statement seriously that the BTC are "not technically lost, just temporarily unavailable".

Actually, there is entirely another possibility that at least partly exonerates MK. There has been a persistent rumour that the Mt. Gox losses were not merely the result of malfeasance on the part of the operators of the exchange, but rather came from a bitcoin seizure and gag order by one or more government agencies. These could either be Japanese or American agencies, or both--working in tandem. This is possibly being done as part of a prosecution against a very few of Mt. Gox's customers who may be guilty of some crimes.

I refer you to an excellent report by Tuck Fheman

Gov Most Certainly Seized Gox’s Coins
http://tuckfheman.com/post/79681539135/report-gov-most-certainly-seized-goxs-coins

The report is dated March 15, 2014, and in it Tuck states his belief that the U.S. government is behind the seizure. Were this true, it seems equally likely that the Japanese authorities are somehow involved too, if not completely behind it. He calls for an "injunction ordering the US Government to release the seized property" by May 16.

I am not in a position to know how much fact is behind this rumour of seizure and gagging, yet the case Tuck lays out certainly sounds quite convincing and worthy of further consideration.

btcusury

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Activity: 433

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Quote from: btcusury on April 29, 2014, 02:35:23 PM

Quote from: Bit_Happy on April 29, 2014, 02:30:55 PM

Quote from: btcusury on April 29, 2014, 02:25:26 PM

Quote from: Bit_Happy

8, & 9) Brock Pierce was part of a dot-com "company" that burned through $60 Million before going bankrupt. The parties were so wild that boys as young as 13 sued over charges of child rape.

Any evidence of fraud? Or just an entrepreneur trying to ride the dot-com bubble?

I'm honestly not sure how to define "fraud" when you are living in an expensive mansion (with two older partners) and inviting young boys to parties who show up because they are expecting to be movie stars.
The next morning they wake up with a hangover and an unusual pain in their ass.

Is that technically fraud?

Alright, any evidence of child abuse?

According to http://archive.wired.com/gaming/virtualworlds/magazine/16-12/ff_ige_pierce:

Quote

DEN [Digital Entertainment Network, the dot-com company co-founded at age 17 by Brock Pierce] fell apart in 1999, when senior co-founder Marc Collins-Rector, 40 years old at the time, settled a lawsuit that accused him of sexually molesting a 13-year-old male employee. Other young men then filed similar suits against Collins-Rector, naming Pierce and 25-year-old DEN co-founder Chad Shackley as peripheral defendants. None of the three DEN founders could be located, and default judgments totaling $4.5 million were handed down.

Pierce says, he had no knowledge of the suits at the time, and when he finally showed up to contest them two years later, the judgments against him were dismissed.

So yeah, innocent until proven guilty, case dismissed, therefore innocent. Unless you know of other evidence?

Also, I might note, his moral character and sexual tendencies, particularly at age 17-19, doesn't say much about his honesty and trustworthiness at age 34. He doesn't strike me as someone stuck in the past:

Quote

On the drive back up to his house in the Laurel Canyon hills, he kept talking, telling me about his current list of projects, entrepreneurial and otherwise. He had just sold a casino in the Phillippines. There was an oil deal in Kazakhstan. He was doing philanthropic work with the Clinton Global Initiative. He was working with the family of the president of El Salvador to make some worthy documentary or another. His list was delivered with an almost manic urgency. If I were to presume to have the slightest idea what really goes on inside Brock Pierce's head, I might suggest he was trying to establish by sheer force of talk the irrelevance of anything in his past to all the things he's doing today.

superduh

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Quote from: btcusury on April 29, 2014, 02:35:23 PM

Quote from: Bit_Happy on April 29, 2014, 02:30:55 PM

Quote from: btcusury on April 29, 2014, 02:25:26 PM

Quote from: Bit_Happy

8, & 9) Brock Pierce was part of a dot-com "company" that burned through $60 Million before going bankrupt. The parties were so wild that boys as young as 13 sued over charges of child rape.

Any evidence of fraud? Or just an entrepreneur trying to ride the dot-com bubble?

I'm honestly not sure how to define "fraud" when you are living in an expensive mansion (with two older partners) and inviting young boys to parties who show up because they are expecting to be movie stars.
The next morning they wake up with a hangover and an unusual pain in their ass.

Is that technically fraud?

Alright, any evidence of child abuse?

alright, can we have a different thread regarding any sort of child abuse accusation etc.

Phinnaeus Gage

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Bitcoin: An Idea Worth Spending

Quote from: btcusury on April 29, 2014, 02:35:23 PM

Alright, any evidence of child abuse?

This forum has a search feature. Insert (no pun intended) Brock Pierce.

Phinnaeus Gage

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Bitcoin: An Idea Worth Spending

Quote from: Bit_Happy on April 29, 2014, 02:30:55 PM

Quote from: btcusury on April 29, 2014, 02:25:26 PM

Quote from: Bit_Happy

8, & 9) Brock Pierce was part of a dot-com "company" that burned through $60 Million before going bankrupt. The parties were so wild that boys as young as 13 sued over charges of child rape.

Any evidence of fraud? Or just an entrepreneur trying to ride the dot-com bubble?

I'm honestly not sure how to define "fraud" when you are living in an expensive mansion (with two older partners) and inviting young boys to parties who show up because they are expecting to be movie stars.
The next morning they wake up with a hangover and an unusual pain in their ass.

Is that technically fraud?

Long Dong Johnson and Skropenis may dub it simply as mining.

btcusury

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Activity: 433

Merit: 260

Quote from: Bit_Happy on April 29, 2014, 02:30:55 PM

Quote from: btcusury on April 29, 2014, 02:25:26 PM

Quote from: Bit_Happy

8, & 9) Brock Pierce was part of a dot-com "company" that burned through $60 Million before going bankrupt. The parties were so wild that boys as young as 13 sued over charges of child rape.

Any evidence of fraud? Or just an entrepreneur trying to ride the dot-com bubble?

I'm honestly not sure how to define "fraud" when you are living in an expensive mansion (with two older partners) and inviting young boys to parties who show up because they are expecting to be movie stars.
The next morning they wake up with a hangover and an unusual pain in their ass.

Is that technically fraud?

Alright, any evidence of child abuse?

Topic: URGENT: drop MTGOX class action lawyers! contact WSJ about their lies URGENT! - page 2. (Read 4864 times)