wait, who owns the market? - page 6.

joniboini

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Quote from: XinXan on June 09, 2019, 05:32:22 PM

You only need around 20k bitcoins to create a massive crash, however that amount of money would be nothing for forex, the market wouldn't even move that much even if everything was sold at once.

Agree. Fiat or forex market liquidity is so high, however, in some cases, they can crash heavily such as what happened in Venezuela or any other countries which got massive inflation. So, politics and economics heavily influence the movement of fiat market, while the crypto market is still so immature and almost anything can move the price up or down. Too many emotional traders and those who want to get rich quickly in this market, and the exchange are way too many.

We should expect crypto to be more stable when the liquidity is high enough, or at least the close to the forex market.

Cuk0ng_bitc0in

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I will answer one of your questions. others you can search for from other references. whales, investors, active traders are crypto users who control the market. they create bearish and bullish.

XinXan

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Quote from: felicita on June 09, 2019, 04:17:30 PM

in the end the Bitcoin market is controlled from the btc whales .
Same on the fiat market the riches control the market Wink

regards

it is way harder to control the fiat market, almost impossible for a single person, even for a group of people since the liquidity of that market is insane compared to bitcoin. You only need around 20k bitcoins to create a massive crash, however that amount of money would be nothing for forex, the market wouldn't even move that much even if everything was sold at once.

cryptjh

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The bigger BTC wallet or fiat wallet you have, the more you can control the market.
Each day small retail investors are buying small fractions or even whole bitcoins, the numbers of people who own bitcoins are growing each day, this growing numbers of bitcoins owners will in the next many years grow into a large group that will buy up the whales bitcoins if they choose to dump their bitcoins into the market.
So hopefully, these whale dumping the market periods will in the future turn into whales not selling anything periods.

felicita

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in the end the Bitcoin market is controlled from the btc whales .
Same on the fiat market the riches control the market Wink

regards

hatshepsut93

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When you are saying "big money", can you name any specific names? Can you name the companies, the individuals, banks, governments that are in your opinion are moving to Bitcoin? Do you have any evidence that they do?

People here so often use words like "whales", "manipulators", "bankers" when they talk about some shadow powers that are supposedly controlling the market, but no one ever posts evidence and investigations how this actually happens, so I'm inclined to think that this is just a conspiracy theory.

Nadziratel

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Quote from: tiedcoin on June 09, 2019, 09:24:51 AM

Understand who controls the market you are investing or trading in, and you’ll have an advantage. Bitcoin is a free and open source market. Nobody owns it.

But does anyone control it?

Ask yourself this—

How are Bitcoins created?

Who is incentivised to create Bitcoin?

Between 2013 and the beginning of 2017, big money had been slowly moving in on Bitcoin. They saw its potential as a relatively rare asset and also the mechanism that made it work. Bitcoin is seen as having a value greater than the sum of its parts.

It's hard to ensure exactly who controls the market. I think the answer here would be all Bitcoin owners on the market, but unfortunately the system doesn't work like that.

Especially those who own a large number of Bitcoins have the power to influence the price. Of course, the effect I'm talking about is not 100%, but they can still be very effective. You know Craig Wright has a threat in this sense. I don't think he can, but he may affect the price a little.

Adriano2010

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Quote from: mk4 on June 09, 2019, 10:37:41 AM

Quote from: Adriano2010 on June 09, 2019, 09:31:07 AM

-snip-

No one has 100% control over the markets, but it can definitely be controlled to a certain extent. Whales, news sites(crypto and non-crypto), certain personalities(crypto and non-crypto), and even the government, can affect the markets one way or another.

Though as time goes and liquidity gets better, it gets harder and harder to manipulate BTC's price.

Indeed whales and some news and personalities talking about bitcoin (bad or good news) can affect the market, but if people who own it not sell when price is low then can be hard to affect it for long.

dothebeats

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No one owns the market in its entirety, but perhaps there are some forces who controls the majority of the market movement that everyone of us here follows. These are the whales, and we all know how this current trend started: a simultaneous buy of thousands of bitcoins across several exchanges that happened on the first of April, and up until now we can see the effects of that single pivotal move. Also, the previous huge sell in the market also saw us drooping down sub-$8000 ranges from a high of $8700 just a few weeks ago, and again it's just a single chunk from a single entity.

They don't own the market, but they sure as hell control it with their own hands.

Upgrade00

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Quote from: oseikuf44 on June 09, 2019, 01:50:36 PM

Either whales or pump, none can manipulate the market.

Wrong! The Bitcoin market can be manipulated, if you follow this thread closely you'd have gotten hint of how it is done. The Bitcoin network is decentralized, but there is need for centralized industries like exchanges, to make it mainstream.

Your reaction to market manipulation and ability to read and interpret charts would largely determine your success as a trader or investor.

oseikuf44

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The market can not be owned by a single or group of people in a conspiracy to control world finances. Never, as usual market is determined by supply and demand of the people participating in it. Either whales or pump, none can manipulate the market.

josephdd1

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Quote from: tiedcoin on June 09, 2019, 09:24:51 AM

Understand who controls the market you are investing or trading in, and you’ll have an advantage. Bitcoin is a free and open source market. Nobody owns it.

But does anyone control it?

Ask yourself this—

How are Bitcoins created?

Who is incentivised to create Bitcoin?

Between 2013 and the beginning of 2017, big money had been slowly moving in on Bitcoin. They saw its potential as a relatively rare asset and also the mechanism that made it work. Bitcoin is seen as having a value greater than the sum of its parts.

most wallets, nearly 80% of all btc wallets that is, hold less than $100 in btc worth
less than 1% of all people actually own most of the btc right now.

You can see the charts here : https://bitinfocharts.com/top-100-richest-bitcoin-addresses.html

Genemind

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No one owns the market but the occurrence of different things around the cryptocurrency world influence and affects the volatility of the market.
Events, supply and demand, whales, controversies, adoptions are some factors thar bring changes in the prices.

CryptoBry

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Quote from: Beerwizzard on June 09, 2019, 10:06:00 AM

Quote from: tiedcoin on June 09, 2019, 09:24:51 AM

Bitcoin is seen as having a value greater than the sum of its parts.

Please PM me. I would try to sell you 1 satoshi for $1k. I see you are a smart guy and see that 1 sat cost much more than its current value.

Market is controlled by whales. The more whales we have the less powerful the single one is and less influence on the market whales have. So right now we see that one whale can almost instantly crash the market by -5% so the market is more centralized than we want and it is controlled by whales.

I agree with this. While bitcoin itself can't be controlled because as cryptocurrency it is not owned by anybody or any group, it is the trading of bitcoin that is heavily influenced by those who have hoarded the most because any move they do will always have effects on the market. So what do you think are the solutions to lessen the impact of these whales?

Ailmand

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Quote

But does anyone control it?

Whales, news, FUD, personalities, and a lot of factors controls, influences and affects the the market. However, no one controls bitcoin since it is in an open market. Whales manipulate the price and it creates a chain reaction since some people panic whenever the prices drop to avoid losses.

mk4

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Quote from: Adriano2010 on June 09, 2019, 09:31:07 AM

I think bitcoin market is not controlled, bitcoin is hold by more people and market can't be controlled. Bitcoin is mined. Bitcoin should value more because there is limited supply and demand is high.

No one has 100% control over the markets, but it can definitely be controlled to a certain extent. Whales, news sites(crypto and non-crypto), certain personalities(crypto and non-crypto), and even the government, can affect the markets one way or another.

Though as time goes and liquidity gets better, it gets harder and harder to manipulate BTC's price.

XinXan

hero member

Activity: 1064

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Quote from: bitmover on June 09, 2019, 10:23:25 AM

Nobody owns bitcoin or the market. However the market is easily manipulated in bitcoin, due to lack of regulations.

Whales, exchanges.... they are manipulating. Don´t you remember Bcash drama in 2017, when bitcoin price was heavily manipulated?

I doubt bitcoin would stop being manipulated with regulations in place, regulations will never be able to stop manipulation, the same manipulation happens in classic assets too, even dollars or euros, the biggest difference, I believe, is the volume and liquidity of the other ones compared to bitcoin. It doesn't take a lot of bitcoins to be able to manipulate the market heavily, however it does take a lot of euros to ever crash the eur/dollar market for example.

bitmover

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Nobody owns bitcoin or the market. However the market is easily manipulated in bitcoin, due to lack of regulations.

Whales, exchanges.... they are manipulating. Don´t you remember Bcash drama in 2017, when bitcoin price was heavily manipulated?

Beerwizzard

full member

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Quote from: tiedcoin on June 09, 2019, 09:24:51 AM

Bitcoin is seen as having a value greater than the sum of its parts.

Please PM me. I would try to sell you 1 satoshi for $1k. I see you are a smart guy and see that 1 sat cost much more than its current value.

Market is controlled by whales. The more whales we have the less powerful the single one is and less influence on the market whales have. So right now we see that one whale can almost instantly crash the market by -5% so the market is more centralized than we want and it is controlled by whales.

Adriano2010

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Activity: 1414

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Quote from: tiedcoin on June 09, 2019, 09:24:51 AM

Understand who controls the market you are investing or trading in, and you’ll have an advantage. Bitcoin is a free and open source market. Nobody owns it.

But does anyone control it?

Ask yourself this—

How are Bitcoins created?

Who is incentivised to create Bitcoin?

Between 2013 and the beginning of 2017, big money had been slowly moving in on Bitcoin. They saw its potential as a relatively rare asset and also the mechanism that made it work. Bitcoin is seen as having a value greater than the sum of its parts.

I think bitcoin market is not controlled, bitcoin is hold by more people and market can't be controlled. Bitcoin is mined. Bitcoin should value more because there is limited supply and demand is high.

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