Wall Observer BTC/USD - Bitcoin price movement tracking & discussion - page 13568.

jbreher

legendary

Activity: 3080

Merit: 1688

lose: unfind ... loose: untight

Quote from: bitserve on June 28, 2018, 05:00:14 PM

Quote from: jbreher on June 28, 2018, 04:54:01 PM

Quote from: Torque on June 28, 2018, 11:11:10 AM

Quote from: Ibian on June 28, 2018, 11:02:55 AM

For the current leg, and I repeat myself yet again, why was segwit better than simply doubling the blocksize? Nobody seems willing to explain that bit, for whatever reason.

Answer why doubling the block size is even needed at this point in time. With actual logic and facts to back your argument.

Because using LN requires opening channels on chain. To do this in a decentralized fashion, LN can onboard no more than several hunnert thousand peeps per day.

Several hundred thousand peeps opening/closing LN channels per day seems a bit overkill currently, don't you think?

Currently? Yes.

But I thought LN was supposed to be a scalability solution. And eliminate the benefit of bigger blocks.

cAPSLOCK

legendary

Activity: 3766

Merit: 5146

Note the unconventional cAPITALIZATION!

Quote from: jbreher on June 28, 2018, 05:20:24 PM

Quote from: infofront on June 28, 2018, 02:22:28 PM

Quote from: Ibian on June 28, 2018, 01:36:39 PM

Welp. We know how high level money and power works. When it's financially worthwhile to do so, someone will get together the required processing power and buy off the proper authorities and make an honest attempt to steal segwit coins. Whether it succeeds or fails, it will be a big blow to the faith people have in the system (bitcoin in all its forms, authorities, moneyed people (us, even if simply by association)).

Just the first line in your post sold it for me. What in the actual fuck.

I feel dumb. I've been a segwit cheerleader without knowing all the facts. I see now that some of it is tribalism, as you mentioned earlier.

Anyway, it's what we've got now, and I still support Bitcoin. I won't be keeping my cold storage coins in a segwit address though.

Fair enough. I'm just glad the scales have fallen from your eyes, allowing you to make an objective evaluation based upon actual fact.

If Segwit is the death of corn, then it's already dead.

gembitz

hero member

Activity: 1848

Merit: 640

*Brute force will solve any Bitcoin problem*

Quote from: jbreher on June 28, 2018, 05:10:24 PM

Quote from: Ibian on June 28, 2018, 01:36:39 PM

Quote from: infofront on June 28, 2018, 01:30:37 PM

- Non-segwit transactions require 51% of the hashpower and a private key to steal. Segwit transactions just require 51% of the hashpower.

Just the first line in your post sold it for me. What in the actual fuck.

Hmm. Where have I heard that before?

jbearer hour?>_> stap flooding da chat! :-D haha

jbreher

legendary

Activity: 3080

Merit: 1688

lose: unfind ... loose: untight

Quote from: mymenace on June 28, 2018, 04:02:22 PM

Why is bitcoin being attacked?

Willie Sutton knows.

fluidjax

hero member

Activity: 750

Merit: 601

Quote from: jbreher on June 28, 2018, 05:21:23 PM

Quote from: fluidjax on June 28, 2018, 03:12:49 PM

Quote from: Ibian on June 28, 2018, 02:53:44 PM

Quote from: infofront on June 28, 2018, 02:22:28 PM

Quote from: Ibian on June 28, 2018, 01:36:39 PM

Welp. We know how high level money and power works. When it's financially worthwhile to do so, someone will get together the required processing power and buy off the proper authorities and make an honest attempt to steal segwit coins. Whether it succeeds or fails, it will be a big blow to the faith people have in the system (bitcoin in all its forms, authorities, moneyed people (us, even if simply by association)).

Just the first line in your post sold it for me. What in the actual fuck.

I feel dumb. I've been a segwit cheerleader without knowing all the facts. I see now that some of it is tribalism, as you mentioned earlier.

Anyway, it's what we've got now, and I still support Bitcoin. I won't be keeping my cold storage coins in a segwit address though.

Group identity is a powerful thing. What's important now is what to do going forward.

I didn't even know why it might be bad, I just had a funny feeling due to the lack of open discussion of its pros and cons. When only one side is being talked about, it's time to be careful.

Welcome to ignore

None so blind as those who refuse to see...

It’s not what he says, I listen to you being wrong, but don’t enjoy being trolled.

jbreher

legendary

Activity: 3080

Merit: 1688

lose: unfind ... loose: untight

Quote from: fluidjax on June 28, 2018, 03:12:49 PM

Quote from: Ibian on June 28, 2018, 02:53:44 PM

Quote from: infofront on June 28, 2018, 02:22:28 PM

Quote from: Ibian on June 28, 2018, 01:36:39 PM

Welp. We know how high level money and power works. When it's financially worthwhile to do so, someone will get together the required processing power and buy off the proper authorities and make an honest attempt to steal segwit coins. Whether it succeeds or fails, it will be a big blow to the faith people have in the system (bitcoin in all its forms, authorities, moneyed people (us, even if simply by association)).

Just the first line in your post sold it for me. What in the actual fuck.

I feel dumb. I've been a segwit cheerleader without knowing all the facts. I see now that some of it is tribalism, as you mentioned earlier.

Anyway, it's what we've got now, and I still support Bitcoin. I won't be keeping my cold storage coins in a segwit address though.

Group identity is a powerful thing. What's important now is what to do going forward.

I didn't even know why it might be bad, I just had a funny feeling due to the lack of open discussion of its pros and cons. When only one side is being talked about, it's time to be careful.

Welcome to ignore

None so blind as those who refuse to see...

jbreher

legendary

Activity: 3080

Merit: 1688

lose: unfind ... loose: untight

Quote from: infofront on June 28, 2018, 02:22:28 PM

Quote from: Ibian on June 28, 2018, 01:36:39 PM

Welp. We know how high level money and power works. When it's financially worthwhile to do so, someone will get together the required processing power and buy off the proper authorities and make an honest attempt to steal segwit coins. Whether it succeeds or fails, it will be a big blow to the faith people have in the system (bitcoin in all its forms, authorities, moneyed people (us, even if simply by association)).

Just the first line in your post sold it for me. What in the actual fuck.

I feel dumb. I've been a segwit cheerleader without knowing all the facts. I see now that some of it is tribalism, as you mentioned earlier.

Anyway, it's what we've got now, and I still support Bitcoin. I won't be keeping my cold storage coins in a segwit address though.

Fair enough. I'm just glad the scales have fallen from your eyes, allowing you to make an objective evaluation based upon actual fact.

jbreher

legendary

Activity: 3080

Merit: 1688

lose: unfind ... loose: untight

Quote from: Ibian on June 28, 2018, 05:11:42 PM

Might wanna fix your quotes there Yogi.

Sorry. Reworked it. We good now?

Thanks, BTW.

fluidjax

hero member

Activity: 750

Merit: 601

Quote from: jbreher on June 28, 2018, 05:10:24 PM

Quote from: Ibian on June 28, 2018, 01:36:39 PM

Quote from: infofront on June 28, 2018, 01:30:37 PM

- Non-segwit transactions require 51% of the hashpower and a private key to steal. Segwit transactions just require 51% of the hashpower.
Just the first line in your post sold it for me. What in the actual fuck.

Hmm. Where have I heard that before?

51% attacks require nothing more, and they can do anything....ANYTHING.
They can make every bitcoin address contain an mp3. The whole discussion about Segwit is bollox.

Of course if you are running a full node you wouldn’t accept the mp3 invested junk, but then, non segwit people don’t run nodes, they rely on miners.

jbreher

legendary

Activity: 3080

Merit: 1688

lose: unfind ... loose: untight

Quote from: Elwar on June 28, 2018, 01:55:32 PM

The hard fork should be left for huge emergencies like finding a bug that makes Bitcoin vulnerable to collapse (as was done in the past). Upgrades should be done via soft fork if possible.

The choice of using the so-called 'soft fork' kluge was what introduced the gaping security hole into The Segwit Omnibus Changeset. If it would have been a hard fork, they would not have overloaded anyonecanspend, but rather just made a simple segregated witness upgrade free of side effects.

IOW, you may wish to rethink your position.

Ibian

legendary

Activity: 2268

Merit: 1278

Might wanna fix your quotes there Yogi.

jbreher

legendary

Activity: 3080

Merit: 1688

lose: unfind ... loose: untight

Quote from: Ibian on June 28, 2018, 01:36:39 PM

Quote from: infofront on June 28, 2018, 01:30:37 PM

- Non-segwit transactions require 51% of the hashpower and a private key to steal. Segwit transactions just require 51% of the hashpower.

Just the first line in your post sold it for me. What in the actual fuck.

Hmm. Where have I heard that before?

mymenace

legendary

Activity: 1596

Merit: 1061

Smile

Quote from: Anon136 on June 28, 2018, 05:07:02 PM

Quote from: mymenace on June 28, 2018, 05:06:29 PM

Quote from: Anon136 on June 28, 2018, 05:03:56 PM

Quote from: mymenace on June 28, 2018, 04:25:36 PM

Quote from: Anon136 on June 28, 2018, 04:08:54 PM

Quote from: mymenace on June 28, 2018, 04:06:17 PM

Give me enough money and I have no care for your bitcoin blockchain
I will own all the nodes
"Referencing Rothschild on the banking system and government"

You can own all of the nodes if you want but that wont help you to attack the network. The moment you begin doing nefarious things users will open channels with someone who is not doing nefarious things and the network will very quickly self heal from your attack.

Whats to attack
I have just turned the blockchain into a central bank, all transactions run through my nodes
cheap or expensive

Rofl what no. Havn't you been paying attention? It's a permissionless system. If you make it expensive people will use someone elses node. You understand that there isn't some limited number of slots to fill up where you get life time ownership of that slot right? You don't seem like you understand at all how the technology works. You remind me of a commenter from zerohedge not bitcointalk.

I like how your responses are exactly like mainstream media and omit certain truths

I like how your response sounds like it could have been written by a computer algorithm.

thanks for the compliment satoshi would be proud

and yes i am a russian bot Grin

Ibian

legendary

Activity: 2268

Merit: 1278

Quote from: winsumbtc123 on June 28, 2018, 05:07:18 PM

Do you guys think Bitcoin will rebound? Or is it a true bubble pop?

Sell everything immediately.

Ibian

legendary

Activity: 2268

Merit: 1278

Quote from: jbreher on June 28, 2018, 05:04:02 PM

Quote from: cAPSLOCK on June 28, 2018, 12:55:52 PM

The base layer has to stay VERY comfortably within Moore's law.

If one is to use Moore's law as the metric, computing power has increased by a factor of 64 in the time of Bitcoin's existence.

Lessee.... what's 1MB times 64? Humm....

Nope. Actual use of computers over that time says nope. It's not a fucking universal principle, it was a trend until it wasn't, and now it isn't.

winsumbtc123

jr. member

Activity: 42

Merit: 15

Do you guys think Bitcoin will rebound? Or is it a true bubble pop?

Anon136

legendary

Activity: 1722

Merit: 1217

Quote from: mymenace on June 28, 2018, 05:06:29 PM

Quote from: Anon136 on June 28, 2018, 05:03:56 PM

Quote from: mymenace on June 28, 2018, 04:25:36 PM

Quote from: Anon136 on June 28, 2018, 04:08:54 PM

Quote from: mymenace on June 28, 2018, 04:06:17 PM

Give me enough money and I have no care for your bitcoin blockchain
I will own all the nodes
"Referencing Rothschild on the banking system and government"

You can own all of the nodes if you want but that wont help you to attack the network. The moment you begin doing nefarious things users will open channels with someone who is not doing nefarious things and the network will very quickly self heal from your attack.

Whats to attack
I have just turned the blockchain into a central bank, all transactions run through my nodes
cheap or expensive

Rofl what no. Havn't you been paying attention? It's a permissionless system. If you make it expensive people will use someone elses node. You understand that there isn't some limited number of slots to fill up where you get life time ownership of that slot right? You don't seem like you understand at all how the technology works. You remind me of a commenter from zerohedge not bitcointalk.

I like how your responses are exactly like mainstream media and omit certain truths

I like how your response sounds like it could have been written by a computer algorithm.

Anon136

legendary

Activity: 1722

Merit: 1217

Quote from: Ibian on June 28, 2018, 04:59:02 PM

So what you are saying is that you are useless. Please convince me otherwise, there are too many of you lately.

If my answering your question makes me useless than perhaps you should ask more useful questions.

mymenace

legendary

Activity: 1596

Merit: 1061

Smile

Quote from: Anon136 on June 28, 2018, 05:03:56 PM

Quote from: mymenace on June 28, 2018, 04:25:36 PM

Quote from: Anon136 on June 28, 2018, 04:08:54 PM

Quote from: mymenace on June 28, 2018, 04:06:17 PM

Give me enough money and I have no care for your bitcoin blockchain
I will own all the nodes
"Referencing Rothschild on the banking system and government"

You can own all of the nodes if you want but that wont help you to attack the network. The moment you begin doing nefarious things users will open channels with someone who is not doing nefarious things and the network will very quickly self heal from your attack.

Whats to attack
I have just turned the blockchain into a central bank, all transactions run through my nodes
cheap or expensive

Rofl what no. Havn't you been paying attention? It's a permissionless system. If you make it expensive people will use someone elses node. You understand that there isn't some limited number of slots to fill up where you get life time ownership of that slot right? You don't seem like you understand at all how the technology works. You remind me of a commenter from zerohedge not bitcointalk.

I like how your responses are exactly like mainstream media and omit certain truths

bitserve

legendary

Activity: 1932

Merit: 1610

Self made HODLER ✓

Quote from: jbreher on June 28, 2018, 04:56:59 PM

Quote from: Gab0 on June 28, 2018, 12:04:46 PM

Quote from: infofront on June 28, 2018, 11:28:17 AM

I've been reading anonymint's writings for the past week or so, which also prompted me to dive into some other rabbit holes.

I'm more convinced now of the dangers of segwit. Don't mistake that for being a promotion of bcash.

Could you provide me with a link where I can read about that? I remember anonymint's post, but I did not pay enough attention and now I can not find it.

Geeze, guys. We've been discussing these very same aspects of segwit since years. Have you had your fingers in your ears and blinders on up 'til now?

Agreed. It's unbelievable how people are coming NOW with points that were debated for years and were (even if slightly) a concern until a few months ago. And now that those are completely debunked they act as if they just discovered em.... Or maybe infofront is just trolling us all. That would make more sense.

Topic: Wall Observer BTC/USD - Bitcoin price movement tracking & discussion - page 13568. (Read 26716992 times)